Pleasant Yet Unpleasant Suprise

[Trinity_Acres]

I went out today to check on the horses and noticed my one mare acting "weird" She kept laying down and trying to roll. I assumed she was colic so we began walking her. However, she only worsened. My husband asked me if she could be in labor. And although we had bred her in May and June, she never showed any signs. She looked a little overweight but nothing that would say she was preggers. Besides, she wouldn't foal until April or May if she were, but again she simply wasn't anywhere big enough to be preggers. Well, I was wrong. After several hours she gave birth to her first foal. My husband and I stayed with her all thru her labor. We're first timers. I called our vet and told her it had been nearly an hour since her water broke, but that we were beginning to see a shiny bulge when she would start pushing. I went into the house real quick to get my carharts on. I was SO EXCITED!!! This day had taken a turn for the best. By the time I was heading back to the barn my son came flying up to the house... HURRY! By the time I got there the foal was out. No heartbeat, not breathing. I tried to resuscitate but my hubby told me he came out breech and was lifeless. I'm so devistated. I was SO thrilled what a great unexpected suprise and then BAM... It's been almost 2 hours and the mare still has not delivered the placenta. She's up and eating and acting as if nothing happened. I'm not sure but that my vet didn't give me wrong information. After her water broke shouldn't the foal have appeared within a half an hour? Now since the placenta is not coming she told me to grasp ahold of it and lift it while pulling. Is that right???? I'm feeling more and more like this foal could have been saved. The foal appeared to be full term with the exception of his hooves they were the consistancy of a soft boiled egg and looked like little rosebuds. He's all black. I'll post pictures in a bit. But for now...should I do anything about the placenta? or do I need to call a different vet?? Thanks for the input.

thanks!!

Janine

 

[kaykay]

wow i feel so bad for you!!! Definately if a mare is pushing over 15 to 20 mins and you dont see the white bubble something is WRONG and you need a vet asap. Please do not pull the placenta!! The vet needs to come and give her a shot to make her contract and expell the placenta. Mares that go over 2 hrs without passing the placenta can founder. Can you call a different vet? Im so sorry!

 

[Chamomile]

Oh Janine how sad! I'm sorry to hear about this. It's so devastating to loose a baby anytime, but a total surprise baby... so sad... I hope your mare does okay! Kay gave you wonderful advise, I would call a different vet.

 

[ThreeCFarm]

Oh Janine, I'm so sorry, but please do call a different vet!!!!

Kaykay is right!!

 

[Miniv]

God D*MN IT == I hate cow vets! (Sounds like that's what you have, sorry) . Yes, your gut instincts are all correct. Always go with them.

Once the water has broken, if things are normal they will happen very rapidly.....like in 5 to 10 minutes max.

No, do NOT pull the placenta......No...no...no.....You risk tearing it and leaving a part of it inside.

If your mare has not passed the placenta in over 4 hours you should have your vet give her a shot of oxitocin (spelling?). We've had a couple of episodes where we had to give the shot several times over 24 hours before the placenta finally came out. Hate to say this, but any GOOD KNOWLEDGABLE vet knows to NEVER PULL the placenta!!!!

I am so sorry, Janine. What a sad loss. Your little one sounds full term. The soft hooves you described were probably what are called "milk toes" and are normal for a newborn when they first come out. They wear them off within the first few hours of birth just by standing and moving around.

Janine, if your vet does not want to come out to give the shot, call another vet. Hopefully by morning the placenta will be passed. If not, I'd be VERY worried.

MA

 

[MeadowRidge Farm]

Janine, I am so sorry to hear you lost your baby. DONOT try to pull the placenta, your vet need to be out there and give this mare a shot. I am surprised to hear he told you to pull it out. Is there another vet in your area you can call? Ma, I have no use for cow vets either, when it comes to horses! Corinne

 

[runaway ranch]

OMG I am so sorry. All the comments you've heard are right. The bubble should have appeared much sooner and you never pull the placenta. Please fine a new vet, and know that it is NOT your fault. Best wishes that your mare recovers quickly.

 

[Karma Creek Minis]

I am so sorry for your loss

 

[Scoopiedoo]

You have received good advice, pulling the placenta IS NOT the thing to do. I am so incredibly sorry for your loss, that's so sad. I am heartbroken for you. I hope that your heart heals and that your mare will be okay.

Jodi

 

[Beccy]

I am so sorry that the baby could not be revived. Hope the mare delivers the placenta ok.

 

[Trinity_Acres]

I took Kay's advice. I called a vet who is about an hour from here.

MA, you're absolutely right. She's primarily a cattle vet. I'm just sick!

If I had called this other vet instead, that foal might be alive. He is on his way

to give her a shot. I'm sitting here in tears wishing I could do it all over again.

I feel like I screwed up big time.

If this vet wasn't familiar with equine deliveries

why didn't she just tell me? Thanks for the advice everyone and all your kind words

I just can't believe this happened. I'm just sick. :no:

Janine

 

[ShawneeCreek]

So sorry for the loss of your much wanted foal. I know you did everything you could do to save him. Kay is right, don't pull on the placenta.

 

[Trish]

:no: I am so sorry for your loss. I do hope the mare will be ok. God Bless.

 

[Meshale]

I'm so sorry....i know you feel awful.....but you did the right thing..called the vet....and wanted expert advice and she failed you!.....you didn't fail here..... she did!.....and i hope this new vet helps your mare along.....so sorry.......Michelle :no:

 

[Levonsa]

I am so sorry for you. Talking to another vet was the right thing to do. We have gotten to know several vets in our area that can assist when there are problems. This way if one is unavailable, we just call the next. It is amazing how they are all busy at once. I hope the mare will be ok, and your next foaling brings the foal of your dreams.

 

[Mona]

I am so sorry for your loss.

 

[Dream]

Don't beat yourself up about this. There is a very good chance the foal would not have survived even if you got it out sooner. Although it looked mature it probably wasn't. The dystocia and the retained placenta happened for a reason. You have nothing to gain by blaming yourself.

There are some big differences between cows and horses. Cows can go hours after the water breaks without a problem and you can pull the placenta out of a cow. A vet can apply some traction to the a mare's placenta but you should not. You are still in the safe zone for a retained placenta. Even 6 hours can be Ok. Hopefully the vet you have coming out will help resolve it for you.

I'm very sorry for your loss.

 

[pepperhill]

It sounds like maybe your vet wasn't the greatest under the circumstances. But please keep in mind that those breech deliveries can be really difficult for both momma and baby and they don't have the highest success rate. Even if the vet had been an expert in horses, and even if she had been called the second the mare started to push, she might not have been in time. After getting stuck like that, it is likely the foal wouldn't have made it no matter what you did. Please, please don't beat yourself up over it. Your vet that is coming now will help your mare recover and will probably give a shot of oxytocin every half hour or so until she cleans. That is exactly what my vet was recommending last night when our mare didn't clean for about an hour and a half. We were just getting ready to give the first shot when she cleaned.

I went through a similar situation last year and my heart is just breaking for you. I am so, so, sorry for your loss!

 

[hhpminis]

I am so sorry.

Everybody has given you good advice and you have taken it. All except beating yourself up, stop it you did the best you could and it sounds like your mare will be fine now.

Again I am very sorry. Breeding is not for the faint of heart and it can be the greatest and the worst experience you've ever had. Unfortunately, especially with the minis you are working with tough odds. It never makes us feel better when we lose to the odds but you did what you should have in calling the vet and she let you down with some bad advice. Also, a breech is extremely hard for even the experienced breeder or vet to deliver alive. Our time is just so limited for the birthing process.

Let us know how your mare is after the vet leaves and please dont kick yourself so hard.

Big Hugs to you!

 

[Trinity_Acres]

Thanks everyone. The vet just left. He was able to help her and got the placenta out. Even after the shot, she did nothing. He manually assisted her. He flushed her with an antibiotic and gave her an additional shot. I have antibiotics to begin giving her tomorrow. He did mention the possiblity of her foundering. He was taking every precaution to make sure there are no complications. So, I be keeping a very close eye on her and watch her temperature. Ironically, he's coming out Wednesday to geld our donkeys. He did say even if I had called him right away, because he lives almost an hour from here, that it would have been too late. Scarey thing is (and he confirmed it) he's the only equine vet in this area and we're about as far as he is able to travel. This day has been a very interesting day to say the least. I've learned quite a bit that's for sure. Funny, but I took this week off for vacation so I could get all our critters up to date on shots, hoof trims, and make contacts to schedule our petting farm for the spring and summer. I'm very thankful that God had his hand on this day, and although I'm very sad about losing Cracker Jack, atleast I still have Peanut and hopefully she'll be okay. Thanks again for everything. Once again this forum has been a blessing to me.