UC Davis paperwork is back on Mo

[mini horse mania]

Got the paperwork from the breeder when we picked Mo up---He is a maximum white sabino- here are the results of what he was tested for..

sire- Black white pinto Dam- Buckskin overo pinto

Tobiano- nT

Sabino1-nSb1

Red/Black factor- Ee

so what color do you think he could be -or produce under all that whit???

 

[Kelsey - Vandy's Farm]

Got the paperwork from the breeder when we picked Mo up---He is a maximum white sabino- here are the results of what he was tested for..

sire- Black white pinto Dam- Buckskin overo pinto

Tobiano- nT

Sabino1-nSb1

Red/Black factor- Ee

so what color do you think he could be -or produce under all that whit???

If I'm correct, he is a black based tobiano+sabino. He will throw sabino 50% of the time, tobiano 50% of the time...if neither are thrown he will produce solid. If sabino is thrown it could have overo markings or just have facial markings and/or socks. He could throw red or black based foals depending on the mare. Because the mare is a buckskin he could carry a cream gene but would need to be tested. If the parents haven't been tested for LWO, he definitely needs to be tested for that before bred because he could be a frame carrier as well. He could have a multitude of colors. Any combination of black based or red based foal with - tobiano, sabino or solid. Since he is not homozygous for anything there are many possibilities and depending on the mare....you could get pretty much anything haha.

 

[Double T]

Would depend on what he's bred to. From the results you posted. He'd have a 50/50 chance of passing on a red or black gene, a sabino gene, and a Tobiano gene. His tested color (not counting the bay or brown agouti, becuase you didn't specify that one) is a black tobiano/sabino. (sorry not up to date a whole lot on the pinto gene terms, lol). But base from the results is black. IF he carries a bay or brown agouti, that would change to either bay or brown. If he jsut carries a black agouti, he's just black. With a buckskin momma, he could very well of inherited a bay or brown agouti from her, or if she was a true Buckskin, the option would be there to pass it on. Only agouti he'd get from his sire would be a black one, since his sire was black.

Got any mares in mind? That may help narrow it down some. LOL

 

[Double T]

Oh and forgot about adding the cream gene in there also, as Kelsey stated, he would also have the option to carry the cream, since his dam was a buckskin too.

 

[mini horse mania]

His mom is LWO positive- dad is not... I have black tobiano mares (all tested homozygous tobiano and black), a silver bucksKin, a buckskin, a black with stockings mare.(she is homozygous black). I may send off to get him tested for more, just to see. Until I saw the paperwork-I was thinking he may have been a cremello...

 

[ohmt]

Definitely have him tested for frame before you cross him with any of your mares. He could also carry cream as someone else has said. Even though he tested heterozygous for sabino, that is only one of the many types. I have a stallion that is obviously sabino and has never produced a foal without sabino characteristics-he tested negative.

He could also carry agouti which would make him bay instead of black and effect the color of his future foals. Sounds like you will have a good color producer though-you'll get a variety of colors and patterns

 

[ohmt]

Wanted to add that he technically COULD be a double dilute if his sire carries cream.

 

[mini horse mania]

I am still racking my brain on him....thanks everyone...I have used the horse color calculator to try to produce him based on what I know....his sire is supposed to be black tobiano... homozygous tobiano...not for black based in the foals I have seen from him..everything in his pedigree is Black tobiano.and mo's dam is a buckskin frame overo. Probably LWO positive as her sire is CSF Kenny Rogers.he is listed as black pinto...but is a Smokey black frame. her dam was a sorrel...the only way I can reproduce anything close to him is if his dam were frame/tobiano/sabino and his sire is tobiano/frame/sabino...I have done this cross and.come Out with cremello...LETHAL...cremello tobiano...perlino tobiano and so forth. I have summed up he cannot be a cremello as his sire hasn't to my knowledge passed a dilute gene. He cannot be a lethal white as its not possible....so I guess he HAS to be a Max white sabino.??

 

[Becky]

From the test results, he's also tobiano.

Here's my maximum white girl, Redrock Just Magic. She is tobiano and probably both splash and sabino. Just Magic is solid white with no color except for a few black hairs in her tail. She is a black pinto.

This isn't letting me add a picture for some reason, but you can see her on my website on the Mares page.

 

[Lewella]

I am still racking my brain on him....thanks everyone...I have used the horse color calculator to try to produce him based on what I know....

You don't need any other genetics to make Mo white - tobiano and Sb1 combined can do that all by themselves if highly expressed. What the color calculators can't tell you is what expression level you'll get of a pinto pattern. Your Mo tests to be heterozygous Sb1 - a heterozygous Sb1 can be nearly completely white with just some color left on the topline. Mo also tests to be heterozygous tobiano and in its highest expression tobiano only leaves color on the head. Okay, so now you have two patters that can put a great deal of white on a horse and you've combined them together. The tobiano wants to take the color off the topline, Sb1 wants to leave it on - in this case tobiano won the lottery and got to take the color off the topline. Tobiano wants to leave the color on the head, Sb1 wants to take it off - in this case Sb1 won the lottery and got to make the head completely white. Throw in the chance of Frame (OLW+) and you have another pattern wanting white in different places and maybe it has won the lottery too. In no time flat all those patterns have given you exactly what you have - a black pinto who is covered by one great big all encompassing white spot to the point he has become a white horse.

 

[minifreishorsefarm]

Got the paperwork from the breeder when we picked Mo up---He is a maximum white sabino- here are the results of what he was tested for..

sire- Black white pinto Dam- Buckskin overo pinto

Tobiano- nT

Sabino1-nSb1

Red/Black factor- Ee

so what color do you think he could be -or produce under all that whit???

I thought maximum white sabino has to be homozygous for sabino? Maybe with the two different pinto genes, thats making him white? I dont know what the horse looks like, but I thought I was told to be max white sabino, they havet o be homozygous for it. I would test him for cream because the sire could very easily be smokey black making him a perlino? I dunno, just thinking out loud here.

Marsha

 

[chandab]

You don't need any other genetics to make Mo white - tobiano and Sb1 combined can do that all by themselves if highly expressed. What the color calculators can't tell you is what expression level you'll get of a pinto pattern. Your Mo tests to be heterozygous Sb1 - a heterozygous Sb1 can be nearly completely white with just some color left on the topline. Mo also tests to be heterozygous tobiano and in its highest expression tobiano only leaves color on the head. Okay, so now you have two patters that can put a great deal of white on a horse and you've combined them together. The tobiano wants to take the color off the topline, Sb1 wants to leave it on - in this case tobiano won the lottery and got to take the color off the topline. Tobiano wants to leave the color on the head, Sb1 wants to take it off - in this case Sb1 won the lottery and got to make the head completely white. Throw in the chance of Frame (OLW+) and you have another pattern wanting white in different places and maybe it has won the lottery too. In no time flat all those patterns have given you exactly what you have - a black pinto who is covered by one great big all encompassing white spot to the point he has become a white horse.

Wow, that's a great way to explain it, thanks.

 

[mini horse mania]

Thanks Lewella!!! I think I got it now!!! Wow.there was a battle for color going on there.....