Bull question

[Marsha Cassada]

A farmer I know has a Charolais bull. He has produced some nice calves since the farmer has owned him. Lately he has been doing something new. When the farmer takes the bale out to feed, the bull began to round up the cows and calves, just like a herding dog. He would butt the bale hard before it was dropped from the spear. Last night, he only rounded up the calves but waited till the bale was on the ground to start butting it. The cows seem to watch him closely to stay out of his way. The farmer is thinking it may be time for him to go to the sale. Has anyone had a herding bull before? What would this behavior mean?

 

[chandab]

Never heard of that one before.

 

[amysue]

My galloway bull does this. He rubs all over the cornstalk bales and rolls them around the yard like a toy. After he finishes showing off, he starts "herding" all of the cows. The old brood cows will have nothing to do with it, and quickly put him in his place. The heifers however, go wherever he pushes them. I thought at first he was just playing, as he did not seem to be getting aggressive, but the last few times I went in the yard to tend to a calf, he tried to tell me where I could and couldn't go. Never got aggressive, and I always carry a bat incase, but he paid more interest to me than I wanted him to. If the behavior does not escalate with this bull, I wouldn't worry too much, as they do like to frolic and play. But, if he starts chasing cows, not just to breed, but chasing them from food and actually bulldozing them, he should take a ride on the burger buss.

 

[chandab]

I've seen our bulls bunt their head into bales and push them around, but never the herding of cows and calves. And, if any take too much interest in a person, they too go on the burger bus.

 

[Marsha Cassada]

I had a great uncle who was killed by his pet dairy bull. The bull had the man on the ground stomping and butting him; his sons had to drive a pickup over the top of him to get the bull off. And a couple of years ago a pet bull killed his owner near us. I know my dad always carried a baseball bat in the back of his pickup when feeding and would not tolerate an aggressive bull. He would never let us children get out of the vehicle when a bull was with the herd.

This farmer's bull has been getting a little more aggressive with the cows, actually did "bulldoze" one. Probably he will go to the sale soon. I wonder if this herding behavior would stop if he were in another herd? He is too good a bull for the burger bus.

Interesting that other folks have seen this herding thing.

 

[amysue]

I asked a family member of mine who is real cow savvy about this. He said it is much the same as herd behavior in horses. The bull sees those cows as "his" and wants to keep them under his watch and control. Some are more uneasy than others and if startled or even agitated they may do it he says. Mine only does it at night feeding when we use the loader to feed corn and when the scraper is in the yard to clean the alleys in the barn. He must get agitated by my presence, the equipmwnt and the cows all hollering to be fed, and feel the need to defend his herd. I NEVER turn my back on them, even the steers. They are unpredictable and I have heard that more people are killed by cows than guns in this country (don't know if it's true). He may stop if he is moved or the herd dynamic changes maybe take him down a peg, or it may make it worse. Some bulls (ususlly is the nicest looking one) don't make out well in a pasture setting, ours always got way too aggressive and posessive. We started keeping them in a bull pen and brought the open cows to them. Felt safer than letting them out in the big pasture. I run the Galloway with the open cows and heifers then once they're all bred, he goes in a cement yard with a bunk by himself, it has really curbed his behavior. When my husband was a kid, his father had a red holstein bull named "Herbie" that would chase away and attack cows not in season away from the herd, then he started getting like that with people. Hubby would go yo bring the girls in and Herbie would chase him down. He got loose one day, terrorized the neighborhood and trashed a neighbor's car, so they loaded him up and off to the sale they went.

 

[Ashley]

no bull is too nice for the hamburger truck.

 

[FurstPlaceMiniatures]

If he were 'too nice' for the Golden Arches in the sky, one of the stud companies would have him. I have a zero tolerance with Bulls. If they do much as watch me too much they go.

I'd never put up with that.

 

[Marsha Cassada]

The bull is going.

 

[amysue]

It is always better safe than sorry. I do believe that many of their personality traits carry on into their offspring too. I have a VERY docile bull who always seems to produce very quiet and laid back calves. I think many breeding companies select studs based on muscling or marbling or in holsteins i's all about milk production and often temperament gets overlooked.

 

[Jean_B]

Most herd bulls don't last more than age 4 or 5 before they become WAY too aggressive in a herd setting. We had Holsteins and never let them loose in the herd - they were never allowed any where near the cows until the one in heat was brought in, and even though milk production is the ultimate determining value factor....if they got too aggressive, they were gone. In later years we did nothing but A.I.

 

[chandab]

Our Red Angus bulls last a bit longer, but I've heard Holsteins can be quite cantankerous.

 

[amysue]

Yes, holsteins are aggressive, jerseys are the worst! My beef bulls have lasted longer, maybe because we run them in a cement yard, rather than big open pasture? A relative has been keeping a belted galloway bull here for quite some time, he is very docile, and now wants him home to pasture breed. I fear that he may get aggressive out with all of those cows and have to leave. He is coming up on 6 years old...I fear that may be pushing it.

 

[chandab]

Just depends on the bull, some take it in stride and are just good; others you are ready to kill in just a couple years. We had a home raised Gelbvieh X Red Angus bull that was rather docile, especially considering his size, Shayne called him Frank, he froze his assets one winter, so we had to sell him, he was over 7-8 I think.

 

[Marsha Cassada]

How do they keep their assets from freezing in the northern areas? I grew up in SD, but being a kid I don't think the bulls' assets were discussed. Sometimes my dad had his own bull, but I know he rented one frequently. One of my jobs every day was fetching in the two milk cows; maybe he didn't feel a herd bull would be a good idea with us kids roaming the pastures. I wish he were still around so I could ask him.

In his later life, I know he kept a herd bull; he carried a baseball bat in the back of the pickup for any trouble at feeding time.

 

[chandab]

How do they keep their assets from freezing in the northern areas? I grew up in SD, but being a kid I don't think the bulls' assets were discussed. Sometimes my dad had his own bull, but I know he rented one frequently. One of my jobs every day was fetching in the two milk cows; maybe he didn't feel a herd bull would be a good idea with us kids roaming the pastures. I wish he were still around so I could ask him.

In his later life, I know he kept a herd bull; he carried a baseball bat in the back of the pickup for any trouble at feeding time.

We put out straw for them to bed down on, but some are too stupid to use it, and the frozen ground can be tough on them.

A mature bull can typically service 25-30 cows live cover (less for a yearling), so a bull for two cows would be a big headache (borrowing or renting is a much better idea, and today, there's AI). My hubby carries an ax handle for the same reason when working with cattle; rarely needs it, but good to know it's there.

 

[Marsha Cassada]

He raised herefords. The milk cows were just in the pasture with the herd. My job was to fetch those two in for milking at night. I think he kept the girls in the lot at night because I never fetched them in the morning.

 

[Marsha Cassada]

When I had to go fetch the milk cows, I was a little bare foot girl. I took an old bridle and got my horse, Dusty, first. Usually he would lower his head and let me climb up on his neck to get on his back. Sometimes he wouldn't. I'd have to lead him to a dip in the ground and try to shimmy up. Once the milk cows were standing in the middle of the pond and wouldn't come out. So Dusty just waded right in and herded them out; he knew we were after milk cows. I think I remember he even nipped one to get her motivated. Sometimes Dusty wouldn't let me catch him at all and I had to drive the girls home on foot. Those were the days, pre-4 Wheeler!