Do you have equine insurance?

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Royal Crescent

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This topic came up on the thread for Marble, the brindle filly. It got me to thinking about the insurance. How many of you have insurance on some or all your horses? I know I have had insurance on mine when I have been in the process of purchasing them. I would like to keep on with it, but can't always afford it. Obviously, it is a good idea to have, as medical care can get expensive fast. If you have a lot of minis, do you pay to insure them all? When do you insure the foals? When are you allowed to insure foals? What are you paying per horse, on the average? Do you insure all for colic surgery? Do you carry liability?

Your thoughts are appreciated!

Barb
 
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We use Connaway Equine Insurance. Recommended to us by LKF when we purchased our Buckeroo son. He's the only one I have insured at the moment but will be insuring another stallion shortly since he's put his first foal crop on the ground this year.

The premium is based on purchase price. You can only insure them for what their purchase price is (from my understanding). You can over insure them but if mortality strikes - you have to provide a bill of sale proving what you paid and that's all you'll be reimbursed (mortality/death benefit).

However, you can increase the amount of coverage once they become proven stallions, win titles, etc. I'll be uping his coverage soon as his foals hit the ground next spring. You would just provide all that documentation along with the original purchase bill of sale for the totals.

For us, the biggest payout is the insurance coverage for illness and injury - the deductibles are cheap and for each occurance - meaning the vet can come multiple times for one issue and you only pay the deductible once for the one issue (no matter how many times the vet comes back and treats the same issue). Luckily - knock on wood - we have never had to use it and we're up for renewal next month already (the year has flown by).

I too had taken out the policy mainly for the shipping risks from Indiana to Maryland (by way of a short stay in Delaware first) but decided it was well worth keeping. Pay for the whole year and there's a discount if I remember correctly. I haven't checked if there is a discount to insure a herd or multiple discounts - maybe something I should look into.

They are great to work with and you can do everything via email and fax. Check them out at:

http://connaway.net/

As far as liability - I have that through home insurance and umbrella policies for maximum coverages. Farm policy basically through homeowners. I hadn't looked into that with them but I think they do policies for that as well. Browse their website for info.

There are lots of providers out there - depends on what you need I guess. So far they work great for us and affordable.

Oh, you asked what folks pay per horse...... I think ours is 364 or 384 per year for one stallion. The lesser your purchase price, the lesser your premium. I'm not sure how they value what is foaled on your property - what you didn't buy from someone else. I hadn't gotten that far yet but your post makes me think I should get cracking on some of that stuff! LOL
 
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I insure and you have to rememeber that mortality will not pay if you opt not to have colic surgery and the vet feels your horse was a candidate for surgery.

We have mortality and surgical I feel that works better for me value wise then to also add major medical /surgical.

You can insure foals- even under 30 days old - they are a bit pricey to insure but of course worth it if you feel you have a foal who is just not easy to replace aged horses are not insurable however.

If you feel you have a horse who is either emotiontally or financially (or both) not easily replaceable then insuring is very much worth the cost

you can insure for more then a purchase price providing you fill out a form substantiating the value of the horse. If you got a great deal on a horse with National titles or a lot of training you can insure for more you just need to fill out that form. I have never had a problem raising the limits on horses as their show record or breeding records dictate.

I just increased the value of a gelding who is now driving and it was very simple faxed them the form and that was that :)

I use Equisport agency found them to be the easiest to work with and very fair on their prices.
 
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I dont have equine insurance but have looked into it before. As of right now I cant afford it but they are atleast covered under my home owners insurance incase which I think is covered if they where to get out and hit by a car or shot by a hunter or any natural death like by lightning, animal attacks, tree falls on them or intangled in fence somehow and die from resaults.
 
How does one go about insuring a filly that one has no idea is worth?

I was planning on insuring Marbles when she was old enough.(I was told 6 months before she could be insured, otherwise the cost is astronomical) But, since she was born on my farm, how do I put a price on her that they will accept and insure her for? Now that she has had colic surgery, I am sure they will not insure her for a while.

If one runs their farm as a business, it is hard to justify to the IRS that one is paying out $15,000 to $20,000 per year just in insurance for the horses. I know, I have been audited twice in the last 4 years. Passed both times, but still, if I was paying that kind of insurance out, I probably would not have passed.

So one needs to decide who to insure and who not to. When they are born on the farm, it is hard to justify (to the insurance companies) insuring them for a large amount of money. One of my stallions has just started producing. His foal crop of 3 last year are all in the show ring this year winning Grand and Reserve Grand Championships at all of the shows they have been to. His 3 foals this year are even nicer than the 3 last year How do I price him

Then there is the problem of finances. In these hard times, money is very tight for many people. How can I pay for insurance on all of my horses when I do not even have medical insurance for myself? Since I have had a shoulder replacement, I do not qualify for regular insurance in my state and special insurance is way out of my means.

My horses come first, but feeding them and having Carl out once a year for their teeth and all of the proper vet care is more important to me. So I have to gamble that nothing will happen to one of my horses or to myself until the economy gets better.

I am sure there are many others in the same boat right now.
 
I have insurance on two of my three horses. I pay about $500/yr for the two of them, and only one is insured for major medical/surgical. If I was insuring a bunch of horses I'd do what most big businesses do and "self insure". Instead of paying someone else a large premium every six months, I'd pay myself, then take money as needed for crisises. Liability insurance however needs to be in place REGARDLESS whether or not the horses are insured, and in my case is covered by my renter's policy which has an agriculture endorsement.
 
well say for a $5000.00 horse the company I go with charges $300.00 a year for both mortality and surgical mortality only for up to I think it was $5000 was $150 a year when I last checked it is not hard to justify the value of a foal based on the value of the parents. It is done in the large horse world all the time. the value can then be increased or decreased as you see fit as the foal matures. You do not have to purchase a foal to insure it
 
I HAD Insurance for years, then got to where I could only afford it on my stallion so I kept that. When I sold him this Spring is when I learned a lot of new rules had been put in place.

No ins. for a horse whose premium would be less than 1,000....yup I double checked it. I paid 250.00 per year and had the renewal for the new year on my desk. But the new owner could not get it for that price through Gencorp, who I used for years, Nor any of the other 2 we tried. All 3 were no less than $1,000.
 
I had that issue with Gencorp as well however my current company does not have that company policy
 
I have both Destiny and DunIT insured for both mortality and major medical with GenCorp since 2005. When I initially insured them, Destiny was a yearling and DunIT was just 30 days old
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We have liability insurance for the farm, as I consider that a necessity. My philosophy about insurance is that it is for the things you could not possible afford to cover if you didn't have it (like major medical on yourself and homeowners in case your home burns down). I considered insurance for my big horse Target when I bought him in 1994 (after just losing a horse to colic) and decided then that if he ever needed colic surgery, I would just make sure he got it. TWO colic surgeries and 15 years later he is still here. He is the reason we got into minis and who the farm is named after. I do not insure the minis either, because I feel that with 8 minis, I pretty much "self-insure". And beyond a certain age (like about when you would need the insurance!) you can't insure then anyway.

And no, I don't regret that I didn't have insurance to pay for Target's surgery, but am very thankful that I was able to cover the cost both times. The main thing is that despite a grim prognosis when they removed 24 feet of small intestine (after the 6 feet they took out the first time), Target is alive and well at age 23.
 
The main thing is that despite a grim prognosis when they removed 24 feet of small intestine (after the 6 feet they took out the first time), Target is alive and well at age 23.
Wow, I am so glad he made it and is living to a ripe old age.

I self insure too (and yes I have Liability insurance, would not go without it). Just sometimes it seems like when it rains it pours and the pool of money runs out.

Why is it bad things always come in 3's, but good things never do?
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When we have had a horse with a trainer, we've insured the horse for mortality and surgery with Conaway and Assoc.

No, we do not insure our herd for health. It would be cost prohibitive. We do however have farm insurance that covers liability.
 
I don't have surgical/mortality insurance on our horses--with so many it would be cost prohibitive. I could never pick and choose just a few to insure, and even if I did, sure as anything I'd pick the wrong ones & if I did have one with a serious colic or something it would be one that wasn't insured. There's no point. I don't sell horses very often, so am not raising and selling horses for large dollar amounts--and therefore the horses are not even supplementing the cost of their upkeep and care--it's all on me. If we do have a serious issue and are faced with a large vet bill, we just have to deal with it--our horses, our problem, which is as it should be.

We do have farm insurance, which includes liability coverage and also some insurance on the horses--they are covered for things like theft, lightning, trailering accidents, wild animal or dog attack, entrapment, electrocution, things like that.
 
This topic came up on the thread for Marble, the brindle filly. It got me to thinking about the insurance. How many of you have insurance on some or all your horses? I know I have had insurance on mine when I have been in the process of purchasing them. I would like to keep on with it, but can't always afford it. Obviously, it is a good idea to have, as medical care can get expensive fast. If you have a lot of minis, do you pay to insure them all? When do you insure the foals? When are you allowed to insure foals? What are you paying per horse, on the average? Do you insure all for colic surgery? Do you carry liability?Your thoughts are appreciated!

Barb
I do insure my show animals. Cost 3.2% of insured value, $6,000 minimum value through Wilkins. My policy comes with a colic rider, however, I will go back to having major medical as well at my next renewal. You do not get the option of saying "no" to colic surgery for example (because surgery and after care are estimated in excess of your $,6000 "free" colic surgery rider), and then get to collect on your mortality policy, unless the vet concurred that surgery would be futile, or not recommended. If surgery is an option, better to have either deep pockets (because you will be paying the expense of the colic surgery up front, and get reimbursed by the insurance company) or major medical, as my friend recently had $15,000 into a colic surgery and follow up care at the vet clinic (horse never came home) before ultimately having to have him put down when he coliced a second time due to adhesions that formed after surgery. She came out nearly whole though, as she was about $4,000 short of having everything covered by her insurance (she under insured). Unfortunately, she's still making payments for the purchase price of that dead horse on top of the insurance shortfall.

When I first started insuring I was generally just thinking about the freak broken leg when on turnout, etc. where I wouldn't have the "luxury" of doing surgery. My only option would have been to put them down, and the insurance would at least allow me to purchase another horse. The reality anymore though seems to be that people need to be very honest with themselves about the realities of "self insuring," or foregoing major medical.

More often than not, folks find themselves trotting that phrase out, thinking about the odd need for stitches, etc., things that they can readily afford without the need to make those really "tough" choices that a lack of financial resources might mean as to whether their animals get to live or die based on affordable veterinary care. Your horse comes down with EPM...at least that's what the vet "thinks," and we're not going to really know because the test is invasive, and most often the recommended course of action is to treat the animal with MARQUIS, if it gets better, they had EPM, if they don't it was something else, lol.

The problem with this picture is that the drug alone runs around $800, not to mention the vet clinic costs, etc. I'm sorry to say it, but this is where a lot of folks that are kidding themselves about being self insured are going to have to opt for "wait and see," or other supportive therapy because they simply cannot afford the treatment that is needed. I use this example because it's one of those calls that you could very well be wasting $800+ on a wild goose chase, only to need to spend more money if the animal didn't have epm after all. If you know in your heart of hearts that you couldn't, or wouldn't be able to justify spending this kind of money for for what could be speculative treatment, then self insurance is really NO insurance.

I know many have always said, "I have a credit card" for these kind of emergencies, and that's great...but you have to make the payments some time. This topic is one that animal owner's need to think about when they aren't in the emotional upheaval of needing to make a life and death choice. How much CAN you spend? Realize that you might be going down several courses of treatment, how much will you spend "trying" before you have to say that you're tapped out?
 
This topic is one that animal owner's need to think about when they aren't in the emotional upheaval of needing to make a life and death choice. How much CAN you spend? Realize that you might be going down several courses of treatment, how much will you spend "trying" before you have to say that you're tapped out?
This hits the nail right on the head - you need to make these decisions before you are faced with a sick or injured horse. I am reminded of this each time we vacation (which is rare) and I leave instructions for the vet. I have made the hard decision that Target - the 23 year old that has had 2 colic surgeries - doesn't get another one. Other than that, the minis or Target are to get any treatment they need.
 
This hits the nail right on the head - you need to make these decisions before you are faced with a sick or injured horse. I am reminded of this each time we vacation (which is rare) and I leave instructions for the vet. I have made the hard decision that Target - the 23 year old that has had 2 colic surgeries - doesn't get another one. Other than that, the minis or Target are to get any treatment they need.

I know exactly where you are coming from regarding your old horse. I had the unfortunate experience of having just made that choice on a 28 yo mare 2 weeks ago. Good health, but found sweaty with elevated respiration at morning feeding. Vet thought due to good gut sounds on both sides, and the ease to which her discomfort was relieved with banamine, that she had an impaction colic, he didn't want to palpate at that time. Tubed her with a couple gallons of electrolytes, fluid, and oil, and said to administer more banamine if she showed signs of discomfort. She passed VERY little manure, like 4-5 balls only through the night, so had vet back out. This time he did palpate, had a torsion 10-12" inside, so we had no other alternative. The decision was made as soon as the vet was called out the first time, that despite her otherwise good health, she was not a good surgical candidate at her advanced age, which really stinks. Even though she was 28, it was still hard to wrap my mind around the concept that this animal, that looked so healthy, and was in such great condition, grazing comfortably just hours before had just been handed a death sentence.
 
Mnmini I am very sorry for your loss. It is always tough to lose a horse but seems extra hard when it is a horse we have spent so many years with
 
Lisa,

Thanks. We had her for 24 of her 28 years. A nice long run to get to know and love one.
 

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