Dormosedan... orally?

[disneyhorse]

I thought I read somewhere on this Forum that someone gave their horse Dormosedan orally.

I would LOVE that, if it were true, and will talk to my vet about getting some. But if you can't, I don't want to sound dumb to my vet

Anyone know?

Andrea

 

[SilverDollar]

Based on the Pfizer website regarding Dormosedan, it looks like it's only available for IM or IV administration. Pfizer Animal Health - Dormosedan

 

[Jill]

Yes, it can be given orally, Andrea. I friend of mine who is a vet recently told me it is nearly 100% absorbed when given orally which was good news to me

:yes

Rompum (sp?) also can be from what she told me

 

[Leeana]

Yes it can be given orally but i wonder if it kicks in as fast / lasts as long ?

 

[minimomNC]

It takes about the same time to kick in as if given IM, maybe five minutes longer and it lasts as long. I usually give just a bit more orally.

 

[kaykay]

I am really conflicted on giving IM meds orally. I used to do it with injectable banamine and was told by a different vet that that is a huge no no. He said number one it tastes horrible so they will try to spit it out and that it can cause mouth ulcers etc. This vet was just adamant that people give IM meds IM only.

I really dont know but just throwing out what I was told

 

[txminipinto]

Dormosedan and Rompun can be given orally as well as banamine.

On the subject of banamine, while it is labeled for I.M. administration I strongly suggest that you stick with IV (if you are skilled in that route) or orally. I have personally seen I.M. Banamine react with soft tissue causing abscess......even going as far as thrombosing the jugular when it was administered outside the vein. The jugular had to be removed. Banamine reacting with soft tissues has been documented and I would not be surprised if we see a label change in the future.

 

[~Lisa~]

Kay I have heard somewhat the same thing I asked UC Davis about it and they said that if it is given only once or twice in the course of treatment it is more then fine to give orally. If giving it more then that consistently for whatever reason then it could have some issues. The amount they get is pretty small orally and I have never had one spit it out but yes I can attest to the fact that it does taste pretty bitter

 

[Jill]

My vets have cautioned ALL their clients NOT to give injectable banamine via injection, but to give it orally only. This is because of the tendency to cause abscess when it's injected.

Not long ago when one of the vets was out helping me, her next call was to look at a horse who had abscessed from banamine injection and she told me "I wish people knew not to give it that way anymore." I used to give it via injection, but it's been years now since I was told better (here and by my vets...). I will never give liquid banamine any way other than orally (and I mean the clear bottle labeled for IM injection -- much cheaper than the paste).

Obviously, Carin is a lot more informed than I am in these matters but what my vets long ago explained to me echos what good advice she has given here.

 

[Nathan Luszcz]

Banamine tastes horrible, and causes abcesses if injected. I only use it IV.

Detomadine is VERY expensive ($100 for 5ml container, or $30/ml if bought seperately from a large container), so to use enough to be effective orally is pricy. (When injected, .1-.5 is all that is used).

Xylazine is usually plenty enough, and its far cheaper ($25 for 50ml).

 

[Minimor]

I've taken to giving banamine orally. I've always given it IM up until this year & have never had a problem--and our vets here do not suggest giving it orally, they seem to see nothing wrong with giving it IM--but this spring I had a horse get colic & all I had on hand was some expired banamine. I thought it had just expired & I'd forgotten to pick up a new bottle, so had to go with nothing or give the stuff I had. There was no way I was giving it IM when it was expired (as it turned out it had expired earlier than I'd thought it did

) so I gave it orally. It worked just fine, and really just as quickly as it would have given IM, so I am a convert now. I have my new bottle on hand, but will continue giving it orally if necessary. I actually had a rash of colics this spring--each one followed the horses' spring vaccines--vet says vaccines won't cause colic, but this was an awfully big coincidence this year, especially when you consider that we very rarely have colic in our horses. It's just weird that suddenly we have 5 horses colic, each one within a couple hours (or less) of being vaccinated.

As for the bad taste--I fill an extra syringe with some molasses flavored vitamin supplement I've got here--the horses really like the taste of that stuff, so I give them the dose of banamine and follow it right away with the dose of vitamin supplement--if the horses were making faces after being given the banamine (and at least 2 of them did) they quit making that face as soon as they got the mouthful of vitamin, so I have to think that it made everything taste better for them. The vitamin didn't interfere with the action of the banamine, so it works for me.

 

[disneyhorse]

Thank you for the information! I personally can't give injections due to a needle phobia... but I have always wanted sedation options. I don't normally twitch, so just looking for options for the rare ear-clipping-before-a-show.

I trust my vet on most all subjects, so will have a chat with him. I just like to be halfway educated before I come to him with a question. And then I go from my vets advice (not that I don't trust people on an Internet forum, but I always go with my vet as the final answer.)

Thanks guys!

Andrea

 

[Little Bits]

I have also had luck using Dexamethazone for allergys and hives. It works really well and was recomended by the vet. I give 10cc to a full size horse and 2-3 cc to a mini. It really helps with hives. As far as banamine I think it could be tough on the stomach, but they do make the oral paste and I am curious if it is manufactured the same way.

 

[kaykay]

Okay I just have to ask. If you all are giving it orally why not just buy banamine paste?? Its meant to be given orally.

 

[Jill]

Okay I just have to ask. If you all are giving it orally why not just buy banamine paste?? Its meant to be given orally.

Kay, for me, I don't buy the paste because my vets have told me to give the liquid orally and have pointed out it's a fraction of the cost of the paste (but I'd have done that math on my own)

:yes

I'd never do it if I didn't know it was safe per vet advice. While I understand it tastes bad, some of the meds I take also taste bad but it's worth it to feel better. I give mine a "chaser" of something that tastes nice after the banamine liquid

 

[kaykay]

Here a tube of banamine paste is about 18.00 so not a bad price here

The problem with it tasting bad is they try to not swallow it so in turn its hard to know how much they actually got

It drives me crazy sometimes how vets all give different opinions. Like I said my vet in Illinois said it was not a problem. Then when I moved to Ohio my new vet really jumped my butt about giving it orally unless it was paste.

For sure though the most effective way is to give it IV and I am really lucky that my neighbor will come give IV shots for me

 

[minimomNC]

Just from a quick look online,

Banamine paste is roughly $34 a tube which is 5 - 200 lb doses.

Banamine liquid is roughly $30 a 100 cc bottle which is 50 - 200lb doses

Both can be found at different prices of course, this is just online. My wonderful vets, both have been taking care of miniature horses for 20 years or more, have both said orally is fine with Banamine and Dormosedan. Otherwise I wouldn't do it either.

 

[Jill]

Karen -- That's pretty much how I figured the mathematics, too

Kay -- With making sure they get it all when it's liquid, I have not ever had a problem getting it all in and down. It's such a small amount and I put the syringe in pretty far. It all goes down w/o any extra on my part... and from an admistration stand point, it is a lot easier to do it orally vs. IM or the trickier IV (which I can do if I have to, but it's not swift)

Same benefits, but lower price and also really a lot easier to dose for a mini's weight by drawing it into a syringe vs. trying to fool with those increment dials on tube products

Not to turn it into a debate or anything, but it is an opportunity for people to save a decent amount of money and also learn the danger potential when this product is admistered IM (big no-no now per many vets, including my own... it's not just that you can give it orally, it's that you should give it orally)

 

[txminipinto]

I think there's a misconception that banamine or other injectables that can be given orally have to be swallowed. They don't. They are actually rather rapidly ABSORBED into the soft tissues of the oral cavity. There's been more than one occasion I've had to squirt a sedative into the open mouth of a hissing cat in order to handle it. I promise they never swallowed!

 

[Jill]

Carin --

I never knew that!!! That is very good information.

When this thread is "done", I hope it can be moved to the "Best Of" board. Very good information here, and I know I personally just asked a vet w/in the past month or so if dormosedan and rumpom could be given orally. So it's not something I knew for long, (unlike about the banamine).

Jill