Dwarfism question

[Candice]

Is dwarfism always apparent at birth? Can a foal be born very seemingly normal and develop "abnormalities" over time or are the abnomalites present at birth? Is the bite "off" at birth or does it take time to malalign? How about limb "deformities", the same question. I understand there are different degrees of severity but exactly how does one determine if a foal is in fact a dwarf foal? I understand there is a gene that is responsible for this, is there a test?

 

[Mona]

The bite can be "on" at birth, and go off, and get worse with age. As for the legs, I would think there would be some sign of leg problems right from birth. I think the most often "overlooked" dwarfs at birth, or as foals, are the ones that end up maturing very long bodied and short legged. They often look normal other than the leg proportions. These ones will appear more normal at birth, but as they age it starts to become more and more apparent that the limbs are shorter than they should be. If you know what to look for, you can often see the upper limb shortness not long after birth, but to an untrained eye, it can often be overlooked.

 

[Marty]

Is dwarfism always apparent at birth? Can a foal be born very seemingly normal and develop "abnormalities" over time or are the abnomalites present at birth?

These are such very good questions!

My answer would be yes and no.

I say this because when my first foal was born, he was so screwy looking that I was convince something was very, very wrong with him. He stood up, but not on his feet; on his pasterns. And he appeared to have no neck either and an incredibly goofy head. I scoured the websites to compare other foal pictures and no one seemed to have a newborn look nearly as strange as mine.

Well come to find out, he only had a selinium deficiency and with some minerals and a hoof trim, he was out bouncing around right away on his feet. Then he also grew a heck of a gorgeous neck. For some reason, my foals just don't look as "mature" as others do that I have seen born here on the forum.

I would say to you, to post a picture and let the experts here advise you.

Here is a picture of my ugly duckling, now a two year old knock out!

This is my Timmy

 

[horsehug]

Marty,

Timmy is absolutely gorgeous!!!! ))

Susan O.

 

[Marty]

Thank you Susan, he's wonderful!

But getting back to the question at hand, Timmy was so "out there" I was convinced he was a dwarf, actually for days........I was calling EVERYONE! Because actually, I was babysitting two dwarfs at the time that were actually "dumped here" by the owners who no longer would care for them and they were near death and frankly, I was besides myself.

So Candice, I'd say to you not to jump to conclusions like I did.

Maybe you can post a picture because there are dwarf experts aboard such as Mona that would have a correct answer for you.

 

[sfmini]

There is most likely more than one gene involved and there are a couple different types of dwarfism. No, the genes have not yet been isolated, but John Eberth is working on that study now. It will take a good bit of time before he even can isolate the one gene, and that takes money, and also donations of samples for study.

If you ever have the opportunity to attend a presentation by John on Dwarfism, I strongly suggest you try to attend. It is very interesting and informative.

 

[Mona]

Haha Marty...I am NO dwarf expert by any means.

 

[susanminiponygirl]

We have two dwarfs, and while they had minimal abnormalities at birth, as they matured we could see more dwarf characteristics. On my colt, at birth, the genitals were very large, off bite, noisy breathing, extreme dish face, nostrils a little high on the nose. He is a yearling now, and I notice his shoulders turn out more, one front leg is beginning to turn in some, classic pot belly. The filly had turned in back legs and a slight off bite. We really weren't sure she was a dwarf. Both very small. He and the filly have more of a "bulldog" build now. We are in Brooksville Fl, you are welcome to visit and see them. I think we talked at the Ocala auction. Susan [email protected]

 

[Candice]

Hi Susan, yes we did meet and talk at the auction. How far is Brooksville from Lake Placid? We might just take you up on your offer one of these weekends.

I have dial up and at present it takes me almost 3 hrs. to upload a photo into photobucket. Would someone with high speed mind posting a photo for me if I emailed it. I have a program that will compress the files for email but I don't know how to shrink them for photobucket. I can post a picture of him at birth.

If someone could help me out with the picture let me know.

Thankyou.

This is Ruckus at birth and he looks nothing like this now. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v496/cef/100_2462.jpg

 

[Margo_C-T]

It is fairly common, I believe, for 'some' dwarves to appear fairly normal at birth, at least to most people. It is common for the dwarf characteristics to become more apparent and more 'pronounced' as the foal gets older. There is no 'test' at this time;hopefully, in future. If Mendelian models are followed, though, the presumption is that it takes a 'contribution' from EACH parent to produce (at least, certain types of) dwarves, in miniature horses. I believe that the achrondoplasia type of miniature horse dwarf is often harder to recognize at birth, mainly because the major 'appearance' manifestation is the short upper limbs, along with the 'overbent' rear limbs-and these are often hard to recognize at birth. A long torso on short legs, and appearing to be built 'uphill' (withers noticably higher than croup), often seeming to be 'sitting on' its hocks, is also a common appearance as this type of dwarf matures. I am not a professional researcher, just a longtime owner, former breeder, and close observer--all of this is my opinion, which I am confident in offering.

Are you seeking opinions on the photo you posted?

Margo

 

[lyn_j]

Achondroplasia is the most comon form for minis because many of them were used in breeding programs lears ago to reduce size. As Marty said, crooked legs alone dont make a dwarf. Short upper limbs, short thickish neck, bulging forehead and monkey jaw (this nay or may not be present it is an undershot bite) are characteristics that make a young foal cute but as they get older the dwarfism becomes more apparent. The legs wont gropw much and the body will often get longer almost normal size. The neck will remain shorter. Some people have confused the dwarf bulge for a dishy head and they are not the same. The picture you presented is at a bad angle which could change the impression of the upper limbs but that foal does suggest dwarf possibilities.At least in my opinion .

Lyn

 

[Candice]

That is the only photo that I can post of him right now as it is the only one I have uploaded back from when he foaled. That photo was taken at around 20 min old. I'm working on getting a more current one of him up.

 

[susanminiponygirl]

He doesn't look quite "unfolded" yet in that picture so it is a little hard to tell. Especially when they are so small to begin with. Would need to see a recent photo. I'm sorry I can't help you there, I'm very dysfunctional when it comes to posting pictures!

Brooksville is between Tampa and Ocala, off SR 50. Probably an hour and a half maybe from Lake Placid? If you want to e-mail me, I will send pics you of my dwarfs. Susan

 

[Sheryl]

I can easily post a picture here if you email it to me. I will need you to provide the "heading" or phot explanation. my email is [email protected]

 

[xxs]

Here is our little Crystal at birth.

: She was just a few hours old here. You can see that she looks pretty normal, but her nostrils were not quite right, and her bite was WAY off . And, she was a noisy breather. Legs,feet,head..all good..and neck not too short at this point. Even the vet thought she was normal..just small, and the vet students wanted to take her home.

But, she was still alot smaller than what I was expecting from a 35.5" mare and a 36" stallion...she is still only about 26" but VERY potbellied and short necked...but soooooo adorable. Her height and length are still proportionate . She is five years old now