Free-Feeding Alfalfa and/or Grass Hay

[AngC]

[SIZE=medium]I thought quite a while before writing this. There are some proponents of free-feeding on this forum whose opinions I respect. And I have no wish to offend them.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]Jan 2014, we took Baby (our little filly, born end of May 2012) to the vet hospital for laminitis. Prior to her vet visit, we’d been free-feeding all 3 orchard grass hay and alfalfa hay. I got the idea on this forum. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]It was satisfying. We received lots of horse appreciation. It was fun to toss the flakes of alfalfa over the fence and watch them toss it around. It was great to have them follow us around looking for the ‘good stuff.’ It made me feel good that we were making our horses happy. Nicky (our stallion) has a governor on his food intake machine; he would save some for later. Coco, our mare, also regulated herself. Baby had no “off switch.” [/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]At one point (several points actually) I told my husband, “geez, dude, Baby’s looking like a blimp; maybe we should back off.” And we did a little. But somehow we didn’t see. Until, Baby got sore, screwed-up feet.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]I think/I hope we got lucky. ...as in, not doing damage to Baby’s feet.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]Perhaps some people, in some parts of the country, are able to free-feed alfalfa or grass hay. I just can’t see a way we could do that right now. I get the part, that if you limit their food, they’ll gorge when they get a whack at it. I’ve been working a balancing act on that.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]Anyway, the most heart-breaking thing was Baby trying to walk, trying to follow me, like she always does, and she couldn’t. She is the sweetest little thing; she never deserved that from me.[/SIZE]

 

[BSharpRanch]

So sorry this happened to your little one. I've seen this happen to a lot of people. So much this past year that I did some sketches a while back of obesity in horses and donkeys. I feed alfalfa to all my horses, however would never feed it free choice to any animal except a steer being finished.

I hope others can learn from your mistake, however I am afraid that untill they have it happen to them, most won't.

Again, so sorry that this happened to you baby.

 

So sorry this happened to your little one, and glad you were able to discover her problem and get is resolved.

 

[candycar]

I have heard from a number of vets and farriers that this year was a bad year for laminitis . They have seen a lot of cases. Must have been the bad winter we had last year.

I feel for you and your filly, as you know it happened to me too. At least now we know what to look for and can hopefully prevent future episodes.

 

[chandab]

I'm so sorry your little Baby had such a rough go of it, she's young so should make a full recovery.

 

[shorthorsemom]

You will get very different opinions as to what and how to feed hay depending on if that person has been touched by founder and laminitis, and those who have been lucky to have skipped it.

Founder has visited me twice in 40 years of horses. I feed very cautiously and do not free graze my horses. I buy nice very fine grass hay. I monitor their weights with a tape measure, take digital pulses and I feed quiescence for my one boy who is insulin resistant and tends to blimp up easily.

I have a dry lot. I feed hay in small amounts frequently during the day.

this has worked for me.

My one boy gets crazy on hay with alfalfa in it. It makes him feed possessive and he changes personality and he hoovers it up like a vacuum cleaner. I never buy alfalfa or even alfalfa mixed hay. It doesn't work for me here.

Geldings with limited exercise do not need the calories in alfalfa.

Horses getting exercise or mares who need extra calories during lactation or babies growing might benefit from alfalfa so I am not saying it is bad, but for my situation here, I don't feed it.

sorry you experienced laminitis. takes time to get those feet back in shape. I think my one boy took a year for the hoof to recover.

Don't beat yourself. Founder happens. I know how heartbreaking it can be. It can be difficult feeding horses with different nutritional needs together.

thanks for bringing your story to the forum.

 

[Ryan Johnson]

I also had to deal with laminitis last year, seeing your little mare try and walk , its so hard........ My little mare was so sore I had to wait 5 weeks till I could get her trimmed and she spent two months in a stable.

I agree that alfalfa (or Lucerne as its called down under) is great to soothe the stomach and great for condition. BUT some will handle it better than others. I only feed alfalfa in hay form to my minis and its usually in a blend or mixed with grass hay. My thoroughbred is fed it in a chaff and hay form. Only one of my biggies can have it as it makes the other one go from a 14yo back to a 2yo colt. So it does differ from one to another.

Its a long road back to good health with their feet but as she is young im sure she will make a great recovery

P.s I cut up some foam (bit like a meditating/yoga mat) and taped it to the bottom of her front feet. That helped

 

[Minimor]

I do free feed, but must say that there has to be a certain amount of common sense that comes into play. Hay is not created equal. Neither are horses. There is certain hay that cannot be free fed; there is mixed hay that I can feed free choice, and there is some that I would not try. My horses all do fine in straight grass hay. Most do okay on mixed hay if it isn't too rich. I have a couple that cannot have any alfalfa at all.

When you notice a horse is becoming a blimp...then it it is time to make a change. Reduce the hay, change to a hay that is less rich, or perhaps both of those for certain horses. Correction--make the change BEFORE the horse is anywhere near blimp proportions.

Common sense tells me to monitor the horses, all of them, and to take notice if anyone is gaining...or losing...weight.

 

[HGFarm]

I have fed alfalfa for decades but would never free feed it... sorry you had trouble! Alfalfa is very 'rich' and yes, a little goes a long way.

 

I have fed alfalfa as free feed, but here in Florida, my horses were only on dry lots, with not a blade of grass to nibble or munch. Total sand everywhere! So alfalfa hay was distributed around the pastures so they had to move and could "graze" the hay -- not just stand there and eat it. Some exercise was required to eat and in the heat of the day (100+ degrees) even the alfalfa wasn't always enough to get them moving -- they enjoyed hanging out in the shade or in the barn under the fans/misters. Maybe that kept them from trouble, but never had one case of laminitis in all my decades of horse breeding....big and little ones.

Common sense rules, but I also never had a colic using alfalfa (except in a mare sent here for breeding and she pulled through), and all youngsters (weanlings and yearlings) were creep-fed with their grain and free choice alfalfa. Some adults were not fed totally "free", but with nothing but sand, (and I believe all horses need to munch especially over night) generally, it was pretty much free feeding most of the time, and everyone had plenty of alfalfa to munch on overnight.

I also used alfalfa cubes -- which took a little more effort on their parts -- when I couldn't get the hay, or pellets mixed with their grain ration.

So glad your little one is better. And I guess I'll just count myself lucky.

 

[AngC]

Thank you for the sympathy. It's all done (hopefully) (and Baby's looking pretty darn trim; I love to look at her new slimness, and her hooves are looking pretty good too.)

But the reason I raised the topic was... I had just finished reading some recommendations to new people that included alfalfa and free-feeding in the same sentence. Of course, one should apply common sense. I didn't. I should have known better. I should have known better to the point of--before this happened--my husband, who knows nothing about horses--told me to stay the heck off the internet.

It may have been a "bad" year for laminitis, but our case was due to obesity. Baby had the initial bout, which was very mild. Then I had the bright idea to have her shots and dental done. I asked the vet, several times. Vet said--no problem. So Baby had all the vaccinations plus the sedatives to have her teeth filed. The first day, both Baby and her dam were listless. The second day, Coco was fine. Baby was not fine. By the next day (and we had her on stall rest at the time) Baby was scaring me because she wouldn't eat.

We did the foam (insulation) as Ryan mentioned; plus the farrier worked with the vet and Baby had dental implant material inserted in her front hooves. One thing I noticed is that when 1 thing goes downhill, it all rolls down. We had never had a thrush problem, but after all that, Baby had stinky hooves for about a month.

 

I'm glad you raised the topic. And it's probably my fault about the "free-feeding" as I guess I have been fortunate in feeding alfalfa over the years and never had problems. But, everyone is different, and their experiences are different. I'll know next time to be better at explaining what I mean when I respond, and appreciate you started the topic.

 

[shorthorsemom]

I typically skip vaccination at the same time as dentals and I also split up the vaccinations on my horses and do not do all at the same time. Not that this caused your problem but I have noticed that taxing the immune system with vaccines can often bring on a bout of laminitis and the dental combined with anesthesia could tax her immune system even more, especially since you say she did not feel better afterward, she might have even had a little vaccine reaction and maybe a little fever. Not sure if there is scientific evidence to support that but I feel compelled to bring it up here on the forum for consideration.

I had a pony given to me once. A vet strongly suggested full series of vaccinations right after the pony arrived... When I questioned how many shots were to be given all together plus rabies and dental and anesthesia she told me she did it all the time. Against my better wishes we did all that and followed up with repeat vaccinations a few weeks later and they were given all together. That pony foundered badly not long after, and we had to put the pony down because the rotation was so bad. I will always question my decision to go against my gut instinct and in doing all that stuff on our pony all at once. There is probably no evidence out there that supports my fears, but I will forever do dentals alone... vaccinations split up in groups and I never do rabies vaccination in combination with any other shots. I have heard other posters mention bouts of laminitis following vaccination.

Just some thoughts that spring from my head in memory of dear Shadow. best wishes and so glad you are on the mend with baby.

 

[JanBKS]

I used to give shots together too, but a few years ago all were given shots plus rabies and one of my geldings (my very first Mini) came down with the start of founder a few days after the shots, thank goodness my blacksmith is only a few miles away, to this day he is sensitive to rabies so he is the only one that don't get that shot we can not give him a full dose of tranq either he reacts to that also, each horse is different for sure.

 

[Margot]

We feed hay free choice but it is a mixed grass hay and not high in protein. We switched to round bales this year, we make our own hay, because my husband has shoulder problems that made handling small bales difficult. We have bales out in the pasture now since it is pretty much chewed down and have a feeder built in the barn where horses can help themselves. we have never had a problem but feeding alfalfa that way is dangerous. I know many people love alfalfa but we cannot grow it here and I do not think most horses need such a "hot" hay, it is great for cows. We put our horses out in the Spring when there is not much grass and by the time it really starts growing they are used to it and have never had foot problems.

 

[lkblazin]

When you say a group of shots do you mean as entirely separate syringes with the shots? Or do you mean the combos like the three way that is one injection?

I have been doing the three way injection for about 9 years maybe more. Since doing this type I haven't hit any bumps in the road. I have one mare that is sensitive to vaccines and since doing this she does t have a reaction. I never do teeth and shots on the same day. But has anyone ever done the combos and had a reaction?

 

[shorthorsemom]

On separating shots... I split it up as best I can. Not in different syringes but separated by type of shot.... One month might be rabies... a couple months later might be EWT or WNV but not together. I do not like to do shots with gelding or dental procedures that require anesthesia.

I have had reactions from combination shots. My vet just splits the shots up. I do not show and we only have 2 horses. I do not vaccinate yearly.

To keep in line with the thread. I do feed much more grass hay during winter, pretty much free feed, but I also buy very bland "busy hay" that is clean but not rich to mix in with my greener grass hay. I deliver it frequently during the day rather than all at once and have them gobble it all up and then get bored.

 

[lkblazin]

Thank you shorthorsemom for you response. Very helpful for future reference, if I ever get more horses I will follow that routine. The five that I have now are good with the three way, so I do not feel I should burden them with a bunch of needles if not nessasary. And i only do killed viruses, when possible. Thank you again

 

[AngC]

This thread has wandered but I appreciate the comments regarding shots; I think I'll start a new topic.

Regarding hay...

This year we bought a ton of orchard grass/alfalfa mix which was pretty nice last year. (This year, we got a bale, split it open, and then raced back to get the rest.) But now that we're feeding it, I'm noticing that instead of about a 5/95 mix of alfalfa to orchard grass, this stuff is more like 35/65 alfalfa/orchard grass. I've been shaking out all the alfalfa but I think it's still too rich... not to mention the waste. So I'm scrambling to find some crummy hay.

Definitely no free-feeding this stuff.

 

[jandjmc]

I have fed alfalfa for years but never free choice. I consider alfalfa almost a "concentrate", such as grains or formulated pellets. My minis do very well on half grass/half alfalfa. It is very important not to get 1st cutting, which can be up to 23-26% protein, and way too rich for horses. If you are going to feed alfalfa consider being conservative with total amounts and the amount/type of concentrate you feed.

Reasons I use alfalfa: palatable, cost effective (in my area alfalfa is less expensive than grass hay), good buffering for stomach, added protein and it is a wonderful feed for young horses-calories and protein.

Reasons I would not use alfalfa: if it was cost prohibitive, if a horse had difficulty with it, if I couldn't get 2nd cutting or later, if I needed to free feed, if it made my horse too hot-several of my high spirited "goers"have needed their alfalfa reduced to make them manageble, if I needed to feed a high grain/concentrate diet.

And if bears repeating, never feed alfalfa free choice!