Gelding Kevin

[Carly Rae]

Hi,

So I really need to geld my 2 year old colt Kevin. He has been very 'studdish' and I am not experienced enough to handle a studdish horse. He is very strong and could become dangerous as I experienced today. He is normally very laid back and easygoing, now he isn't.

I just wanted to know that after gelding, will he go back to himself over time, could he stay the same as he is now, would he need a lot of training to get him back the same?

Is there anything I should know?

Thanks very much. Id really appreciate any advice!

 

[paintponylvr]

Kevin is the one whom you had asked questions about in the past, isn't he? If so, part of his issue is training. That was a lengthy thread with lots of solid, good advice on how to proceed with his training as well as many recommendations to get him castrated/gelded.

The training is the same.

Since he's now woken up to his hormone factory too, it may take a bit of time for him to "come back" to his previous self. Also understand - even at two - he is still very much a baby and is learning/coming into his personality. Gelding takes the hormones out of the equation, but doesn't mean he's going to become an angel overnight. And in between GREAT sessions of handling, he's probably going to still have some "bad boy" tantrums and fits. That's where your training/handling come in - to teach him that that isn't acceptable and to show him what is and how to do it.

While acting "studdish", if he's figured out that he can get away with things and not pay attention to you (say dragging you on the lead line while he checks out the girls, pawing/striking or rearing when tied), gelding him isn't going to fix that, even once his interest sexually isn't in the girls anymore. He will find something else to pay attention to, until you establish that while "working" you are the one he needs his attention on.

As to personality - for most - it does quiet them. IF he's nipping/biting or pawing at you - it will reduce some of that. BUT the rest is all training/teaching as stated above. Being young, and hopefully not having actually bred the mares, he will soon have that gone completely and it should be easier to get and hold his attention. He will still need his training sessions to learn what you expect of him as a horse and to learn how to behave.

He should return to being friendly - if he was before.

Were there other specifics that you wanted to know? About the procedure? About after care?

We are going to be taking one, possibly 2, horses to a "gelding party" in September.

One is a mature stallion who has been breeding and who is more than a little bit of an idiot whom I've struggled with since he returned here in February. Besides being "studdish" (GREAT TERM, btw), he had developed a lot of bad (rather nasty) habits. He has been difficult for me to deal with and it hasn't been enjoyable at all and has made me sad. Our farrier, on Friday, was REALLY surprised. She saw him, once again, being the idiot and she wondered where the rifle was herself... She's concerned that he'll never be what he could have been. She was his farrier before I sold him and she had her own affectionate term for him then and he was never like he is now. Before we could do his hooves, I spent a lot of time correcting him and working him a bit - then he "remembered" his training, and stood perfectly fine (which was good, because I was ready to literally pass out from the exertion in the heat). I honestly believe that gelding him will help, and then he'll settle into his training - become fully harness trained and get saddle work (though probably not ridden - don't have any small riders around advanced enough yet. They said he'd become good at bucking and in Mexico he'd be a little bronc pony for kids at the Mexican rodeos. He is certainly nothing like his sire in regards to handling! I also don't remember his full brothers being like this, but they were each gelded early and then went to horse owners - 1 whom sent theirs to a trainer for training they couldn't do and the other who trained her own and did great with him. They are both good driving and family ponies. His full sister is a lesson pony and has lots of kids ride and handle her every summer during the farm's summer camps, drives, swims w/ the kids and goes trail camping in the mountains).

The other is Riddler - who will be just 2 weeks short of his 1st Birthday and has not become "studdy" yet (though he had figured out how to mount mares w/ a full erection - he isn't acting "studdy" when handled and we still have his attention when he's on the line - not the mares). Because they will be castrated by students at a Vet School, they will probably each have a different student do each testicle as has happened in the past. The whole thing is a class for the students - the instructor actually is right there with each one when they are doing them, a crowd of people are around.

I have pics of the last 2 "parties" we've attended and if you'd like I can send some your way if you want to see what is done. I was told I could use the pics that way - but could not post them for general public view on line... So if I do share them here, I will ask the same. I would either share them here or send them directly to you... We took 4 ponies (1 was ours, 2 I'd previously owned & hauled for their current O's, 1 was my boarder's) the first time and 1 (not ours but sired by one of mine before I sold the stallion to the colts' owner) the 2nd time.

After care - we generally follow the instructions given by the vet. It may be different for the mature guy over the youngster - due to size of testicles. I will braid up their tails and use Vaseline on the insides of their hind legs to prevent scalding (the proteins in the blood that drains can cause them to lose hair/blister if they have a lot of drainage.) We cold hose the genital area - usually after 10 - 30 minutes of trot work. Our water pressure here isn't anywhere near as powerful as have had elsewhere, but we make it work. Both the trotting and the cold hosing reduce any swelling and make them realize that they "can move" (some think they can't, LOL). I know that during the 2 week healing time, I will utilize "hard" to work with Toro, the mature fellow. It will help him with reduction of drainage/swelling AND get him working. He will be worked 2x daily except for the days I'm at work, those 2 days/wk he'll be worked once. I'm hoping that this heat wave breaks before the castration arrives (should). Castration, for us, is pretty routine and I don't expect there to be any problems or issues. May even get Riddler started with ground driving during this 2 weeks as well (didn't do that with the previous fellow that got castrated)...

 

[7fluffyfriends]

Hello Carly Rae,

Paula has shared a lot of good experience and advice. My only modest addition is that I had a similar experience many years ago with a colt, Stormy, who developed, rather quickly I thought, into a difficult, unpleasant, monster.. umm, pony! I came into minnies with many years of experience and education and was caught off guard anyway. We are always learning!

Stormy was gelded around the age of 2 years and, as Paula stated, training was a big key along with lavish amounts of time for him to continue to grow up. The training is a given, which you already know! You and your other youth member peers are always motivated, goal oriented, energetic and in short, 'bright young things'!

Oh to be a young again!

If I sound like your grandmother, please forgive me, but I am a grandmother!!

Training was also frustrating during a large part of that time because you are dealing with a variety of things and you may feel like 'throwing in the towel', along with the grooming brushes, rake, shovel, halter, feed scoop, buckets, and anything else not bolted to the barn.

If I were asked 'how long' it all takes, I would tentatively throw out a full year of pretty consistent work. It took about that long for Stormy to settle into a consistent attitude. (By the way, he also had copious amounts of turn- out time, spending very little time in a stall.)

Patience, patience, patience.................. and chocolate..........lots of it!

 

[Marsha Cassada]

I think Kevin will still be a boy of personality, but it will be channeled differently. You are going to really enjoy the horse he will become!

Have you started him on some simple tricks, like shaking hands or standing on a pedestal? If you can find a good video on Showmanship, that would also be a great training aid for the two of you.

 

[Magic Marker Minis]

The sooner you get him gelded the better. He is only getting bigger and smarter. He has found your weaknesses (along with Texas) and is using them to their advantages. We had two nabies this year and have only dealt with nipping and occasionally kicking. We nipped that behavior quickly. Our colt (who he sadly lost last week to a twisted intestine after colicing) loved to cjase us around when he was younger. We always made sure he didn't run right as us. Once the older baby started playing with him, he stopped.

Our yearling colts main bad habit is still occasionally nipping. The biggest is getting his feet done. He's a butthole and he has had his geet handled from birth. He has a lot of tied time out after the rodeo. Back feet worse than front.

Our five year old stud started really figuring out he had testicles this year. Unlike last year, he hasn't turned off and now challenges the two older stallions. We turned him out with the bred mares and two geldings. They whipped him into shape without any major injuries. He is now by himself due to losing weight. All weight is back on.

If you don't get the upper hand on both Kevin and Texas, (especially Kevin) you are going to get seriously hurt.

.

 

[Carly Rae]

Toby was the one I was having troubles with in the past but he has settled down a bit over time. Kevin now is beginning get harder for me to handle, can't get him to walk settled on the lead, constantly pulling and pulling. Then when I stop him he rears up and gets very annoyed. Kevin has never bred a mare.

Marsha- I haven't really done much lately with tricks. When he was younger I had him doing a few simple voice commands like "Lift up" which made him lift the foot I was standing at so I could pick it out. We did start shaking hands after, but then after a while I stopped, not sure why I did stop actually.

I do want to geld him asap, but right now we are a little tight of money, and I still don't have a job which Is why I started Volunteer work as all jobs are asking for experience.

So by training, I know there is lots of different training, but thats what gets me. After he is gelded, I dont know where to start. Also, in the time he is not gelded, should I be doing anything? Such as handling him in a pen? He is normally fine and easy to handle if Willow and Toby are close, but when I take him out his mind is on everything BUT me. . Also, If he does paw, rear, or try bite (Hasnt bitten, but has pawed and reared on lead) How do I tell him its not ok?

As for Texas, I have been ready in case she rears so I can stop her. She sometimes follows me, and begins to run a bit with her ears back, but I swing around and tell her no and she instantly stops. She still does it occasionally but I'm still working on it.

I really do appreciate all your help as always!

 

[Magic Marker Minis]

When Kevi or Toby rear on lead, start making them back up. Horses hate to back up, so forcing them gets them thinking about something else.

Also, you might want to get rope halters for the boys. Our rope halter has knots that lay on either side of the nose. When you give pressure, over the sensitive nose, they respond better. My riding stallion, who has bred mares, is very responsive to a rope halter. No stud chain at all. He starts acting stupid, tap hard and ask to back, and he turns his attention to me.

The younger senior stallion was becoming a handful during breeding season. All our stallions are hand bred, so the rope halter was put on. After about five minutes of acting stupid and being forced to back away from the mare; he started listening. Once he was listening to me, not his nuts, I allowed him to approach the mare. This was his first stupid year. Trust me, they get stupider as the get older. Especially if not handled, with halter and lead, every day.

 

[Marsha Cassada]

I think there is a lot to know about using a rope halter. I, personally, do not believe they should be used by handlers who do not understand about the pressure points and correct fit. Used correctly they can be a great tool. Just my two cents.

Backing them up when they rear is great! Make yourself as big as a bear and plow into him. I always do my bear roar at the same time. Won't take but a couple of times.

Continue to enjoy your horses and all the things they will teach you.

 

[MajorClementine]

Only commenting to say I love his name!!! Kevin. So simple and so wonderful

 

[Carly Rae]

Thank you all!

I like the idea Magic Marker, but I wont use the rope halters as Marsha said, because I dont know anything about pressure points.. at all lol.

But, today I decided to have another go with Kevin now that I had advice. As I expected he began to rear up, so I forced him back. I don't think he was really expecting it at all, it took about 3 goes to get him to stop rearing when I tried to come to a stop with him (Thats when he gets mad, when I want him to stop walking and stand.)

But when we did stop after that, he looked like he wanted to rear, he held his head low when I tried to slow down and swung his head as if trying to put his nose to the ground, but no rear. But I'm still prepared to repeat it all again tomorrow.

Thank you MajorClementine!!!! That just made my day

I got to choose his name when we got him Last year. I got 4 un-handled crazy minis that I took in for free, none had names, took us well over 4 hours to load 4 tiny minis into a float, we had about 6 people. I got 2 of the stallions quiet over time, I trained them to lead and pretty much just gave them bucket loads of love and they became the most beautiful horses.

Kevin's mum I gave away, she was Way, Way, Way beyond my help and experience. I was in with the horses and she came up to me looking really friendly, then she swung around and kicked and busted my knuckles. I tried to catch her one day and she just bolted head first directly at our fence and bent it and mangled it, she would also do the same thing to you.. So I gave her to more experienced people before one of us got hurt.

Anyway. Kevin was only 8 months old, I think? We sold the other 2 Stallions, Steve and Elliot as Steve was literally going to brutally kill Toby. Steve is Texas' Dad. I couldn't bring myself to sell Kevin. And I dont think I ever will.

 

[MiniNHF]

My stallion who is usually very quiet and mellow turned 5 this year and has decided anything without testicles needs to be bred and has been a pain in my butt especially at shows.

He also now paces the stall when a certain stallion comes in and wont stop; sometimes they have to tie him off in his stall during the day because he is keeping himself fit. He is also charging the stall front when a male goes by stallion or gelding doesn't matter. Now I discipline him if he did that when my gelding walked by with me to break that mind set and it started to work and he calmed down at least when I walked by with a horse.

He hasn't gotten "mean" because he isn't that type of personality horse he is just a hand full and I always have to keep an eye on him. Even if my eye is off for a second while i'm holding him he is trying to jump on another horse. He doesn't have the concept in his brain that he cant breed whenever and what ever he wants even though he has not been used for breeding before.

He has always been a screamer and had an interest in mares and geldings but never acted on it just screamed or talked to the other horses. Now that he realizes he is a full blown stallion the mare in heat season is a fun time for all of us (not).

The only reason I can handle him is because I am use to hard to handle bigger horses, mares and geldings, (especially thoroughbreds from the track) so handling a stallion comes naturally to me in not letting them get away with anything or walk all over me.