O So had his surgery!

[O So]

Well, I a back from my 2 week vacation and today I took O So to be gelded! The Dr. called to let me know how things went!

The good news! He was able to geld him with no problem (remember, he was partially cryptoid (sp)! )! He said that he was able to do the procedure the normal way and he got everything!!

Bad news! The Dr. told me that when they took vital signs before the procedure O So's heart was fine. He then told me that they gave him an average dose of sedative and such for his size. The Dr. said that it knocked him out cold! Meaning O So is a light weight and needs a lighter dose. When they did the vital signs after the procedure (when O So was waking up) he developed an arrhythmia (sp). The Dr. said he is going to keep an eye on him and will keep checking his heart as O So wakes up more and more. He really believes it was a drug induced arrhythmia and thinks O So will be fine once he is fully awake and the drugs are out of his system. If not, we will be talking some more!

I am hoping he is right and O So goes back to normal! On another note, O So has been weighed via a scale finally! He weighs 150 lbs. He is 28 inches tall. The Dr. talked to me about a better feeding program. He says O So is to fat for his size. He feels a lot of fat on him. He wants me to cut him down to grass hay only. He told me to go ahead and finish my Strategy grain and as it starts to get low, wean O So off of it all together. He wants him to have 1 to 1 and a half pounds of grass hay only! He say's that O So is a smaller then average horse and that he should only be weighing about 120 lbs as a healthy horse with a fully grown horse weight around 150 lbs. He say's O So will still be growing for a bit more, and when he stops growing his healthy weight should be 150 lbs.

Now I have to agree with him as far as how small O So is for size wise. I did explain to him that mini's have a tendency to get a POT belly for not having enough protein. He told me that yes that is true, but he doesn't believe O So's is a POT belly. He say's it is more of a hay belly, and again said he had a pretty good layer of fat on him! Oh, I also told the Dr. that O So was really bony when I first got him and had the pot belly then too! He still say's he needs to go on a diet! LOL

With that said, I have to say I have now had 3 different people tell me to cut back on his food. The first vet, the farrier, and now this vet (who I like very much for a vet)! I am going to do as he say's ( gradually of course), but I think I will still give him the Strategy, but in smaller amounts. I was giving O So 2 cups twice a day, I think it equals about 2 pounds a day. I think I will cut him down to a pound a day and eventually only feed him the pound and a half of grass hay a day! I'll see how that works out. My plan is to keep feeding him his normal amount and gradually cut back to have his new diet in full force once spring is here. I don't want to cut back to much right now with winter coming on strong. I think I would be able to better tell how he is doing when he is in a summer coat instead of this fluffy winter coat!!

What are your guy's opinion on what the vet said? Do you think that sounds about right for a horse that is only supposed to weigh 150 lbs. Do you think a horse at 28 inches tall kind of petite in over all size, should only weigh 150? What are your guy's smaller guy's weighing in at?

Ok, wish O So a great recovery for me!!

 

[Horse-A-Holic]

Hi!

I have been wondering about O So and his gelding appointment.....

Good to hear the Vet was able to get "everything".

 

You both have my best wishes and thoughts for a full recovery from the arrhythmia!

Please do keep us updated on his improvement.

 

[chandab]

Congrats on getting the deed done. I have one that is a light weight when it comes to sedatives, too; his first teeth floating he was sedated and he was in la-la land for longer than normal. He is very sensitive to it, but luckily, he's a good boy and doesn't need the sedative for routine floats. [i'll have to remember in the spring to tell the vet about his sensitivity when he goes in for gelding.]

These pics are a couple years old, but here are a couple pics of my 31" stallion

Ok, I can't figure out how to link pics on my new computer, but here's a link to his page on my website:

http://hcminis.webs.com/papermache.htm

He weighs about 175# (I do have a scale, but its old and was bought at an auction, it has been calibrated, and seems to come pretty close to what the formulas calculate).

Perhaps a ration balancer would be a better fit for O So, as it would have even fewer calories than Strategy; but provide the protein,vitamins and minerals that might be lacking in grass hay. [i feed everyone here a ration balancer, the little 31" stud gets 1/4# daily, which amounts to 1/3 cup 2x daily (that's kitchen cup). My ration balancer is from Progressive Nutrition, but Purina makes a couple, I think its the Nature's Essentials Enrich 32 that they recommend to go with grass hay. If I remember correctly O So is just a yearling (maybe 2 year old, but a youngster), so would probably need a little higher level for the next year or so.]

 

[JMS Miniatures]

Yeah your boy is a little on the chunky side. I have a 2 year old thats almost 32" tall and weighs 180 on a good day.

 

[rabbitsfizz]

I had to convert to Kgs as I do not do pounds anymore....68kgs??

Are you kidding me?

If I had a horse that was this light I would be having hysterics!

The lightest I have ever had Rabbit, who is the same height and type as your lad, was 90 kgs and I soon got a bit of weight back on him.

Honestly, your Vet needs to learn a bit about Minis, your lad is not too fat, if anything he is too thin....have we not been through all this?

I am glad he came through OK, I never doubted that he would, most believed to be crypts are not, at all, they are just a wee bit shy!!

 

[StarRidgeAcres]

Oh so (pun intended

) glad the gelding went well! I agree with the dr that the heart thing will probably clear up here shortly. It is not unheard of for that to happen as part of a surgery or illness. Then the heart gets back to a normal rhythm.

As for his weight, I'm waffling on this. It's almost impossible to say without personally laying my hands on him - all over. It's so hard to tell by looking, but I'm sure your vet felt on him and just didn't make up his mind on looking at him alone. As for what he should weigh, that also is so hard to say as there are so many different factors - just like in humans. Refined vs thicker boned for example.

I have a 28" mare that when in top show shape (no belly whatsoever) with good muscle tone from being worked regularly 4 times per week weighs in at 165. I tend to believe that muscle weighs more than fat so take that into consideration. Here is a pic of her right at 165lbs.

So for comparison, she is right at 28" and at 165lbs.

 

[bluerogue]

I'm glad O So's surgery went well. It doesn't sound to me like he's so fat he needs to be taken off grain... maybe cut back, but not taken off it entirely. It's hard to decide what is too fat... some vets take a hard line, and some are ok with more fluff. I prefer (esp going into winter) to be more fluffy. We do get cold here, so having some fat is a good thing. If you want to see some truly fat horses, feel free to give me a call or pm and you can come meet my mares. They are on hay only... and are still heavy. Some more than others, but still. It might be a good thing for you to see more horses you can put your hands on to feel the difference (and see it, too). My former stallion is now on a grain only diet... his new owner feeds him no hay at all, he only gets elk grove milling stable pellets (a complete pelleted feed). It might be worth looking into. You are welcome to come out and speak with her (she's a retired big horse trainer), and me, if you want. And meet my minis, of course!

 

[Songcatcher]

I have a 28" mare that when in top show shape (no belly whatsoever) with good muscle tone from being worked regularly 4 times per week weighs in at 165. I tend to believe that muscle weighs more than fat so take that into consideration. Here is a pic of her right at 165lbs.

So for comparison, she is right at 28" and at 165lbs.

 

[ohmt]

Glad O SO had his surgery and hope he recovers quickly!

Now, if you switch him to hay only, please give him a protein supplement. I'm still pretty sure that's a big part of his pot belly problem. If your vet says he's a little chunky, i'd trust him, but definitely don't feed anything less than 2% of his body weight. There is definitely no way he is 30 lbs overweight like your vet says...I bet he's used to the biggies. 30 lbs is a HUGE difference. Imagine a 150 lb person losing or gaining 30 lbs...it's a lot!

Always love hearing about your sweet little guy, thank you for posting!

 

[shorthorsemom]

I recently was given a mini boy... 32 inches that was being fed like he was fat. He came to me with a huge pot belly, but his neck was slat thin, looked like a board sticking out on his pointy shoulders and he was a bit light over his topline. I posted my concern about him being fat because his belly was HUGE, (no worms), and the forum all said he was thin and needed protein.

They were right. He still has a bit of a belly, but he has decent neck now and is filled out over his topline. I have to watch now that he doesn't go the other direction. I added a bit of triple crown 30% to his diet of grass hay and it is helping him lose his "fat" look.

IMO120 lb would be light for a horse. I had a german shepherd that weighed 120 and he was not fat. I think vets aren't used to minis. Listen to the forum, post some photos. Glad your gelding went ok. Scary when they go deep like that. Hope you have a great recovery!

 

[rubyviewminis]

Kim, my other little gelding was a partial cryporchid too and they had the same problem with sedating him, and he came out fine. Its true, the vets here all want my minis to be on the skinny side, and don't quite get the protein vs pot belly thing with minis. I also have two scales to weigh each new bale of hay flakes, and grains. My Safechoice = Strategy and other pelleted feeds weigh in at 3 cups = 1 pound. So four cups would equal an estimated 1 1/3 pound which is still not too much if O SO is a yearling, I don't know his age. My two year old filly started losing topline and got a haybelly when I followed the vet's advice to cut out the alfalfa she was used to when I bought her, so I started her on it again. She weighs 187 at 30.25 inches and is refined, she is on Karbo Combo 1/2 oz daily, ProAdd Ulitmate (I couldn't get the ration balancer) 1.5oz daily and 1 pound alfalfa, grass hay with the herd. She looks good and is regaining her topline.

My yearling gelding is 28 inches,and he weighs 172, he gets the same with a little more alfalfa, and still weaning him off of the Safechoice (he was getting 1 1/2 pound daily) to the concentrated Ultimate and Karbo Combo. He also gets grass hay free choice and he is a lazy boy, but still needs all this. He stays trim and in good form, not fat.

The herd gets about 5 to 6 pounds of grass hay, if they look like they need more they get it especially with winter fast approaching. This little herd is 3 and 1/2 horses lol, foal is about 85 lbs. and her dam is 33 inches and 260 lbs They all look great, no fat tummies, and being on one month of Karbo Combo and Ultimate from Progressive, they absolutely look the best ever. I monitor their weight and appearance daily and adjust or seek advice if I need it. That is averaged out to almost 1.7 % of their body weight, but then there is growing, lactating, energetic, lazy, cold weather, warm weather etc. etc to consider.

All these posters gave such good advice and I always look at what I am doing and reevaluate my program from reading on here.

 

[O So]

Thanks for all the well wishes! O So is home and doing fine! His arrhythmia is gone and was a drug induced one! Only thing that kind of sucks is, it decided to rain this weekend! So now me and O So have to get wet while we are exercising! LOL Least it is only 15 minutes twice a day!

When I was checking out his incision, he lifted his leg. That was a pretty ugly site to see! I knew they left it open (not sewn up like a dog would be) but I wasn't expecting to see a big ole hole!! I was amazed on how clean it looked though, so I guess that is a good thing, but it sure wasn't something I was expecting!

As far as the advice on feeding. I know I have asked several times for advice, but I just kind of wanted opinions on what the vet had to say. Specially on what he thought O So's weight should be for his size! Being new to mini's I wasn't sure how big he should be for his size! Thanks to you all and your pics, I see he is just about right!!

As far as changing his feed, I don't plan on taking away the grain! I am going to cut him down to 2 cups a day. I kind of agree with the vet on his fat ( not the belly part). I tried to feel O So's ribs a while back ago and I can't feel anything at all! So I think he is kind of putting on the lbs, but I do think he still needs the extra protein for his belly to go down. Course, he is getting his winter coat in, full force, so that could contribute to how he feels too! It's pretty thick! I can't wait till spring when I can see his body better again!!

On another note, I do feel that part of his belly is hay belly right now! Hubby took care of O So for 2 weeks while I was gone. I think he fed him a bit more hay then I would have. That and O So had no forced exercise while I was gone! So I can even see his belly is a bit larger then when I left! LOL He was just starting to loose it too, before I left! Oh well, I am home now and he will now get the exercise he needs!!

Thanks again for all the well wishes. Keep him in your thought for the next few weeks!! I am pretty optimistic though, that he will be just fine! He seems to be quite the champ!! He acts as if there is nothing wrong! It's amazing!!