Sick Stallion HELP please

[Eagle]

Thanks everyone for your ideas. Hopefully vet is coming today so I will show him what you have all said. Fingers and toes crossed.

 

[RagwortExpert]

Hi Eagle. I am so sorry to hear your little boy is not well. I shall keep the good thought for him.

Reading your post, the very first thing which came to mind was liver disease. Not being a Vet, I have no ideas about the numbers you posted, but to me anyway, he has some of the classic symptoms of liver disease. This in horses, mostly comes from toxins or poisons. More often than not, the poison has come from eating toxic plants. This might be from poisonous plants in pasture or having been cut and bundled in purchased hay.

A friend of mine, imported a horse from England to the US. The mare was very ill and symptoms sounded much like your little fellow. After exhaustive tests, the vets were still at a loss to know what the problem was. I read my English newspapers each day and had just read an article about so many British pastures, hedgerows and roadside grassy areas, being inundated with Ragwort. Sometimes called Tansy Ragwort. The problem was so bad, that they passed a law in the UK, that anyone found with Ragwort in their fields, could be fined.

This is incorrect. The law in the UK does not work like that. Ragowrt is poisonous and you do need to be aware of it, but poisoning is really really rare. Some people with a financial interest are distributing unscientific material and scaring people.

It often gets into the newspapers but that doesn't make it true.

See these sites for more information

Ragwort Facts

and

Ragwort The sense and the nonsense.

 

[Lizzie]

As I said in my original post, I only threw Ragwort poisoning out, as a 'possible' problem with her sick horse.

A few years back, we had an extensive conversation on another equine forum to which I belonged, regarding this weed. This only after several members in the UK, had lost their horses and the cause had thought to be Ragwort. I know at least one of them, had spoken to the Plant Inspector regarding the problem. I believe at the time, it was thought that between 500 and maybe 1500 horses a year, had died in the UK due to the ingestion of the weed. Unfortunately, many who lose their horses, do not have a necropsy performed, so the figure quite well might be more than was suggested.

I am fairly sure I got my information from BBC Kent at the time. While it was not illegal to have the plant on one's property, it was apparently not allowed to be in the flower or seeding stage. I do remember at the time, certain agencies were clearing roadside verges of the pest. Others were against it, saying that it was habitat for the caterpillars of the (I believe) Cinnebar Moth.

Certainly, horses and other livestock will not eat it, unless the pasture is depleated of forage, but unfortunately good pasture management is not often well implemented.

I tried to find the original BBC report which I had read, when my friend had imported the very sick mare from the UK. Unfortunately I couldn't find that, but did come up with a few other BBC reports.

http://search.bbc.co.uk/search?q=ragwort&uri=%2Fkent%2Fhave_your_say%2Fcommunity%2Fromany_voices.shtml

As an expert, I suspect you might or might not, agree with some or all of them. But regardless, and I am by no means an expert, I do think we should all be aware of this and other poisonous plants, in and around our pastures, wherever in the world we might live.

Lizzie

 

[Eagle]

The vet came today and has finally realised the severity of my little man. I told him again about his breathing problems and his bloated belly and he agreed. He took x rays and will return to do a scan. He fears that he has liquid in his abdomen. he took blood and will get back to me with the results. He seems weak and is going down hill fast so I hope the vet comes up with something quick.

 

[wendyluvsminis]

Sending prayers to your sweet little boy, and for the vet to figure this out!

 

[Marty]

Eagle I'm so sorry your little one is not doing well. I hope the vet will have results for you soon. I can only imagine what you are going through.

Could you possibly post recent pictures of him?

 

[Eagle]

Here is my man Eagle's Sandokan of Asschatt, son of Dent Painted Eagle.



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Uploaded with ImageShack.us

As you can see he looks rough. I didn't sleep at all last night, I am so worried that he has a tumour.

 

[REO]

{{{{Hugs}}}} I hope he gets better and the vets can help him.

 

[MountainMeadows]

Eagle

I sent your conditions to my vet who is a a degree in Internal Medicine - here is her reply:

Stacy,

Sounds like a tough case. From the info you have I would not be concerned about the low creatinine, it is a reflection of the decreased muscle mass and not pathologic. The elevated globulins (not albumin, correct) would suggest a chronic inflammatory process (i.e. site of infection, neoplasia, etc). As a single point in time the low WBC and lymphocyte count can be tough to interpret.

If this were my case I would be recommending the following to the owner to try and localize the source of the problem so they can initiate more specific treatment (don't know how much of this can be done in Italy, i.e. they may need a referral hospital and that could be a major haul).

Repeat full bloodwork and add triglycerides, if possible

Belly tap

Abdominal ultrasound - would be concerned that the "bloat" is related to excessive abdominal fluid

Treat supportively until a more specific diagnosis is reached

Too bad he is not over here - I love working on these type of cases.

Best of luck!

Wendy

Good luck with your fellow - I hope that the condition can be isolated so that he can begin his recovery

Stacy

 

[ljc]

I have a thread going about my mini, Ollie, who lost his battle against colitis on Monday. He presented with many of the symptoms you've described and despite 11 days of intensive hospital treatment, his colon and secum were too damaged. Maybe I'm ultra paranoid having been through this so recently, but I, too, would suggest many of the things a poster's vet friend recommended - the abdominal ultrasound (which showed Ollie had increasing amounts of fluid in his intestines as the 11 days went on), getting the horse on IVs for hydration (Ollie became severely dehydrated in less than 24 hours), xraying lungs to make sure no fluid is filling them (by the end, Ollie's lungs were filling), lots of bloodwork to monitor the numbers, banamine for pain and fever, etc.

Salmonella was mentioned by another poster and while we haven't yet gotten the results of that particular test yet for Ollie, the symptoms fit right in.

I took Ollie to the hospital within hours of noticing the symptoms. He was eating breakfast Thursday morning, stopped eating and walked away, and I had him in the hospital by 4 pm. when his fever reached 104 and his respiration was so rapid. He remained lethargic that whole day, leading me to really worry.

In other words, I'd get your horse to a hospital asap.

Best of luck and let me know if I can offer any assistance.

 

[Eagle]

Eagle

Repeat full bloodwork and add triglycerides, if possible

Belly tap

Abdominal ultrasound - would be concerned that the "bloat" is related to excessive abdominal fluid

Treat supportively until a more specific diagnosis is reached.

Thanks very much for this help. As your vet advised we took blood again, I am waiting for the results this morning.

The vet will then come back and do an Abdominal ultrasound.

I am praying that I will soon have an answer.

Thanks again

 

[Eagle]

I got Eagles blood tests back and he seems a bit better. We still need to do an abdominal scan but today he seemed like a different horse. He followed me round whilst I poo picked and he chatted away with his babies. When I opened the gate he charged through in a full gallop. He ate his dinner like there is no tomorrow and he was even a bit grumpy with me when I asked him to move over (never been grumpy in 4 years). I am not sure if all this is a good sign. I was glad to se him eat so well though as he has been picky for months.

The vet is talking about Cushings but I am not convinced. Only time will tell I suppose.

Thanks for hearing me out. OH is not horsey and doesn't understand what I feel for my little friends. Plus he is still p... off for the €4000 bill we had last month for a mare with severe colic.

 

[MountainMeadows]

Good to hear Eagle -- you know you might try a week or two of Sand Clear to help clear out any "crud" that may be pooling in his intestines - you just never know what goes into their mouths and maybe he has a load of sand in there that is contributing to the problem. I seriously doubt if the Sand Clear would cause any further issues with him and it might just help!

Keep us posted!

Stacy

 

[ljc]

I'm so glad for you! I've been worried. Hope he continues to feel better.

 

[AppyLover2]

I'm very glad to hear you're seeing improvement. Here's hoping he continues to improve.

 

[Eagle]

Good to hear Eagle -- you know you might try a week or two of Sand Clear to help clear out any "crud" that may be pooling in his intestines - you just never know what goes into their mouths and maybe he has a load of sand in there that is contributing to the problem. I seriously doubt if the Sand Clear would cause any further issues with him and it might just help!

Keep us posted!

Stacy

Thanks but we have no sand here what so ever. I live in the mountains and my hay is local.

Keep the good ideas going though.

My man was very lively again this morning, he was happy to go out and wouldn't stand still for me to change rugs. It seems so weird as he has always been very easy to handle. He has been handled daily before getting sick by my 2 year old son and I have never had any problems. I don't think that is the case at the moment.

I tried to take his temperature last night and he kept shooting the thermometer out.

 

[REO]

I'm SO glad to hear he's doing better!!!