Someone who understands AMHA stuff, please

[Little Wee Horse Farm]

Ok, first of all, I'll admit, I'm really HOT about this one. I argued with myself about posting this, but I can't stand it.....

Here's the back story: I didn't belong to AMHA for years. Did all my stuff AMHR. Then I got a double registered stud, and a couple double registered mares. I already had just ONE AMHA mare.

Update to this fall. Realized I hadn't sent in stallion report & had better get those babies registered. Rejoined AMHA so I could, of course, get their member rates. Still outrageous, but way better than non-member rates.

Waiting for registrations to come back. Called AMHA. They said the babies couldn't be registered unless they are DNA'd, also parents to be DNA'd. Ok, with the stud. No problem, I'll do that. I should have known better, but hadn't been a member for years. And one of the 2 mares involved was already DNA'd.

BUT BUT BUT -- why would the foals have to each be DNA'd because I sent the stallion report in late? They are still the same mares & stud. Just because the report was sent in late doesn't mean they aren't the right foals! I had paid the fee of $25 for a late stallion report plus $10 for each mare. NOW I have to DNA the foals? WHY WOULD THIS BE? Because report is late, it doesn't change ANYTHING genetically. To boot, the mare they want DNA'd is going to soon be TWENTY YEARS OLD!! She's is exempt I thot from the DNA thing. Why would I DNA a 20 year old mare when she's been AMHA since she was born in 1987???!!! She has produced MANY AMHA registered foals! Good grief.

Well, AMHA has managed to make it so that it will cost me almost $500 in the end to get all this straightened out. I haven't dealt with them for years & trust me, this is one of the big reasons why. I'm sorry. I don't want the magazine...........I've been in minis for 20 years & there's NO MAGAZINE on earth I would pay $75 for if someone called & asked if I wanted it. And I want something besides ads for $75/year.

Sorry.............I'm really cookin' here. Despite my insanity, would someone who understands AMHA reasoning on the DNA foal thing & the 20-year old mare DNA PLEASE PLEASE explain it to me..............I'm not so swift at times, but now I feel I'm being made a fool. Sorry, everyone who loves AMHA. This is nothing against you or your horses. I give you all the credit in the world and more power to you.

I just can't stand this nickel & dime stuff- - especially when it makes no sense I can see, despite how I try. And this isn't just nickel & dime. We're talking only 2 adult horses involved plus 2 foals and now it'll be almost one-half of a thousand dollars to straighten this in the end.

My apologies to any who take offense. It isn't meant that way. I can almost hear someone saying if you get into minis (or any horses), you should be prepared for expenses. Well, ok, I've been doing that for 20 years. But this doesn't make any sense to me. And makes me pretty mad. Can someone explain? :new_2gunsfiring_v1: My thanks to anyone who does.

 

[Nathan Luszcz]

If you want to be in the club, you have to play by their rules... DNAing is pretty universal now in most registries, including foals from DNA'd parents. Same thing with AQHA. Hence why I play with minis for fun and am not a member of anything

The big boy needs to play by the rules, but the little one makes his own rules.

 

[Little Wee Horse Farm]

Oh please Nathan - If you don't have a real answer for this one, just skip it, ok? I haven't been this mad since maybe 1988. If you know WHY these foals have to be DNA'd just because the stallion report was late, then please answer. I DID play by what I thot were the rules by paying for late stallion report & the mare fees on it. What was THAT money for then? Hmmmm? Trust me, you guys have never seen me this mad.

 

[Becky]

Unfortunately for you, AMHA rule 180C states that any foal born prior to a stallion report being submitted, must be DNA tested/bloodtyped along with it's sire and dam. Plus all late fees to be paid before the foal can be registered.

I'm sure the reasoning behind this is to eliminate the possibility of any fraudulent registrations.

 

[Little Wee Horse Farm]

No, Nathan, that's not the case. I saw your answer as an slur which I felt was inappropriate. I hope I am not "snippy" with any others who choose to answer. In fact, I won't respond to you any more on this, because I am, as I said before, really hot about this one. Let's end our "altercation" there, please.

Yes, I am very angry with AMHA. I have talked to other AMHA members who said they didn't have to DNA their newborn foals. My question is: JUST BECAUSE THE STALLION REPORT IS LATE, why would that necessitate the DNAing of those foals??? I have tried but I see no logic.

 

[HGFarm2]

Umm, even if it did involve live cover it still has to be DNA'd.

Sorry about all your hassles but I can't help you. I will be having to deal with all that soon enough on my A/R mare.

 

[Little Wee Horse Farm]

Ok, Becky, that might be the reasoning, but it still doesn't make any sense. Maybe it doesn't make any sense to me because I'd NEVER do anything like that.. It would not even occur to me.........that's the other thing about the AMHA that drove me nuts.......you're guilty until proven innocent. Sorry, but that's the way I see so many of their strict EXPENSIVE rules. I know they have to "protect" the membership, but when you price the "protection" so high, no thank you. Over the years, I've actually met VERY VERY few dishonest sellers. But I guess they are out there.

Thank you tho. I appreciate it. I'll let you know what's going on. Again, I apologize for my feelings to all those AMHA members who love their registry. You have every right to. But, this is one "new" old member who again walks out the door. I'm sure they won't miss me.

 

[Nathan Luszcz]

Umm, even if it did involve live cover it still has to be DNA'd.

Sorry about all your hassles but I can't help you. I will be having to deal with all that soon enough on my A/R mare.

I know, I was comparing to the AQHA, which isn't exactly a parallel, but at least a similar situation with similar rules.

 

[HGFarm]

Hey Little Wee, (sorry Nathan, but I took your reply in the same manner.)

I believe the rule is to hopefully prevent those dishonest folks from buying a foal at a sale somewhere and then saying 'oh yeah, this was from my stallion, but I didnt file any paperwork and now I want it registered'. It is just to keep the honest honest and the dishonest, well, hopefully from not applying at all.

Unfortunately I am sure there have been instances in the past that have warranted this action and they have had to make it a rule.

Sort of like the Morgan breeder long ago who wanted more action in his horses, so he crossed them with another breed noted for that.... and after there were many generations of winning Morgans out there, the truth came out that they were not purebred at ALL, and they went back to the beginning and yanked all the horses papers, and some had championship titles - that had that studs name on them!!!

I guess it is just a safety precaution for those that try to put something over one someone. Unfortunately, we all have to pay!!

Little Wee, it is over and you have paid now... dont let it ruin your future babies who can now be double registered. It was expensive, but I think you will be happy with the future results of foals that are double registered.

 

[lvponies]

The rule book states that the registered owner of the foals must submit for DNA testing at their expense before the foal can be registered.

I'm really sorry this has turned out to be such a major expense and frustrating ordeal for you!! {{{HUGS}}}

 

[kaykay]

well i can go ya one better so believe me i feel your pain sister. This is the first year I have not yet signed to be a member of amha. Im not going to go in the long drug out story of my situation but I am seriously considering not updating any of the amha papers i currently have. I wont throw them away but Im not sure i will continue anything with them

My friend and i have a joke that anythign you send to amha will be sent back at least once with a note that you have to send in more money LOL.

 

[HGFarm]

Oh dear!!! I have not had anything sent back asking for more money, but do agree that some of the fees are just outragious for things

 

[Little Wee Horse Farm]

So, with that knowledge, I guess this gorgeous, correct, near perfect quite small little boy will sell with only his AMHR registration, which he already has. At the price I'm asking, (which is WAY LOWER than I have him on my website - haven't been able to update) it doesn't make any sense for me to put any more into paperwork.

Anyone interested in a really sweet guy who will make, in my estimate, a nice future stud? And could win in the showring? Ah, but he's just AMHR you say? SO WHAT!!! He's still the same horse.And he's the son of that near 20 year old mare,(who I won't pay to DNA) which makes him the 1/2 brother to a national reserve champion and reserve world champion. Yep, I think that's what I'll do.

Too too bad. I always believed a horse's heritage should go with him. Well, it's the same heritage, just not AMHA. I've never done such a thing before. Oh well.............sad. Wonder if I can get my money back from AMHA? Anyone ever tried?

 

[Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis]

I can see it from both sides i can see why if filing a late report one would need to PQ since you can pick up a horse anywhere and then try and file a late stallion report..

However I have been on the other side as well and did attempt the PQ on a horse I bought..(due to stallion report being filed late) his sire came back as his sire his dam not his dam. Now I had pics from the seller (ya i know lesson learned there eligible means NOTHING other then owner not keeping up with there own paperwork) of this foal nursing this dam.. but in order to get the foal AMHA reg i would have had to DNA and PQ all the other 20+ mares on the stallion report to try and find the dam. Mind you they were all over the country none owned by me.. needless to say the foal is AMHR only and is a happy youth gelding now

but like I said it was a hard lesson learned for me

 

[Reble]

I realize the cost is getting up their like the other breed of horses, but with our Paso finos where alot more.........if you did not send in the Stallion report there was a fine of $500.00 to be paid before they could be registered........

As of January 2007 Pictures are to be included for AMHR so DNA, I would expect to be around the corner. :new_shocked:

If you do not care about keeping him for a stallion which people would want sometimes both registry, what about gelding how much too register might be more reasonable.

Yes Money Money Money..............

:

 

[Loess Hills]

As my Dad used to say......."Don't cut off your nose to spite your face". A registry has rules which all members have to follow. Give it a day or two and think what would be best for your foals, you've got a great looking guy who would benefit from being double registered.

Yes, there are always fees and requirements for each registry, and it gets expensive. Best wishes in whatever decision you make!

 

[ChrystalPaths]

Well, I'll jump on your band wagon! I haven't been an AMHA member for a long time now. Last year I sent in DNA for Thera, new pics, yadda yadda yadda...I have yet to have her A peprs back. Why don't I fight...why bother now. I don't know who is running things now. Wanda always fixed things for me or tried or explained things in kind human terms. I do think it is $$$. I don't know about Karen but I wouldn't have that much cash just laying around. WE all screw up sometimes, a late report isn't the end of the world. Karen has a pristine reputation. I will agree, blood tells. That is the prettiest colt and anyone who would "not" buy him because he is R only :no: . My A&R girls are only R. I wonder, in 2007 will I have to go thru the DNA procedure on horse already R permanent? I don't mind the pics but I wonder if I will, guess I better find out. Take a breathe my friend. I so empathize. I'll say it again...VERY handsome colt! PS if you request it the AMHA should refund your $$. They haven't even processed anything yet. Speaking of which I should request my $41 back! :no:

 

[Relic]

You didn't say how old the stallion was. And even if the mare is near 20 her foals still need to be typed meaning she also has to be. Anyway all foals born after Dec.31 1995 must be DNA tested or blood typed prior to registration of their offspring. And any horse born after 2005 that is DNA tested shall be parent qualified if both parents have been DNA tested. And l recall if late stallion reports are sent in everyone has to be typed no matter what. And your right it does get nerve wrecking and costly.

l forgot to add with all the late fees plus the kits for 3 it should come no where near the 500 you mentioned.

Take a breath and go over the costs again.

 

[Meavey]

I think it´s very normal, here in Holland breeding rapports have to be send in before oct 31, after that DNA.

If you are to late it´s your fault, and yes here we also had trouble with wrong parentiges in the past, so stallions are not allowed to breed without them beeing DNA tested fist, and it´s much cheaper in the USA, here is 50 euro´s per horse.

I know of stories where the predigrees didn´t match the horses, mares where bred to the wrong stallions, there where big fights and law-suits, and trust me you don´t want that.

So I say HURRAH for DNA!

I wouldn´t want a horse without it anymore actually.

:

 

[Mijke]

I think it´s very normal, here in Holland breeding rapports have to be send in before oct 31, after that DNA.

If you are to late it´s your fault, and yes here we also had trouble with wrong parentiges in the past, so stallions are not allowed to breed without them beeing DNA tested fist, and it´s much cheaper in the USA, here is 50 euro´s per horse.

I know of stories where the predigrees didn´t match the horses, mares where bred to the wrong stallions, there where big fights and law-suits, and trust me you don´t want that.

So I say HURRAH for DNA!

I wouldn´t want a horse without it anymore actually.

:

: Ditto!

Due to the problems here in Europe with 'false' pedigrees I just go for DNA!

for your post:

I think fees are something that can be discussed at other more effective places in a constructive way (with AMHA itself perhaps?

: ) if you feel that strongly about it. If you don't agree let at least the AMHA know itself. Your reports are your own responsabillity, sending them in time or to late also. So the consequences will be there for your own actions....is that something to be mad about? Maybe....but I think you should be mad at yourself, not the AMHA....at least I would be....

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