Stallion problems...

[Eohippus]

This subject is ironic! I just discussed with my Vet yesterday. I have a three year old colt, that was an angel until he dropped, now mind you we have four stallions all of them where young when purchase or home bred, they know how to behave, this three year old pushes all my buttons. He is not stallion materal and will be gelded next month. He has great conformation and good color, but not stallion attitude. they say a good stallion makes a good gelding, and he is not a good stallion so I am hopeing he makes a descent gelding. I would go with the others and get him cut ASAP. This perticular colt I would throw out with some boss mares, but I don't want them bred, so he has got to be cut.

I've always heard a good stallion makes a great gelding and a great stallion makes a phenomenal gelding. My mom's mustang was purchased from BLM as a stallion. He was horrible! Very aggressive and ill mannered. He was gelded as soon as we could do so and after a little "adjustment" time he became a totally different horse. He's got great manners now. I think if you geld your colt gelded you'll see a similar change

 

[MindyLee]

I say geld too BUT if she decides not to geld the stud then the most responsible thing to do is seperate them and keep them seperated.

 

[AnnaC]

I agree with all that has been said here but would just like to add that your friend may now have a young mare who has been pretty traumatised by an agressive male. She is very young yet and may well be difficult to cover due to her experiences. I would certainly NOT try to cover her with this stud, however 'restrained' you could get him, she needs a 'quiet' experiened stallion with a great deal of patience! Would even suggest that she forgets breeding her this year and tries again next year when she is a bit more mature, some mares are not mentally mature enough until they are 4 or even 5 to have their thoughts turn to having foals.

Anna

 

[disneyhorse]

I agree with all that has been said here but would just like to add that your friend may now have a young mare who has been pretty traumatised by an agressive male. She is very young yet and may well be difficult to cover due to her experiences. I would certainly NOT try to cover her with this stud, however 'restrained' you could get him, she needs a 'quiet' experiened stallion with a great deal of patience! Would even suggest that she forgets breeding her this year and tries again next year when she is a bit more mature, some mares are not mentally mature enough until they are 4 or even 5 to have their thoughts turn to having foals.

Anna

Good advice from Anna here. The poor mare's behavior should be considered, too... she has likely been traumatized and there is nothing worse than trying to breed a fearful mare, even with a properly mannered stallion, because the stallion can be injured from a kick from a protective mare. I'd also give the mare a rest for the year and re-try with a gentle stallion next year.

It's hard to say about the stallion's behavior without seeing in person and knowing his history and handling, but he probably should have been hand bred BEFORE he was turned out and allowed to learn that he can be aggressive. Because this is VERY dangerous behavior, I'd probably also be in the "geld him for sure" side.

Andrea

 

[supaspot]

I agree with all that has been said here but would just like to add that your friend may now have a young mare who has been pretty traumatised by an agressive male. She is very young yet and may well be difficult to cover due to her experiences. I would certainly NOT try to cover her with this stud, however 'restrained' you could get him, she needs a 'quiet' experiened stallion with a great deal of patience! Would even suggest that she forgets breeding her this year and tries again next year when she is a bit more mature, some mares are not mentally mature enough until they are 4 or even 5 to have their thoughts turn to having foals.

Anna

Good advice from Anna here. The poor mare's behavior should be considered, too... she has likely been traumatized and there is nothing worse than trying to breed a fearful mare, even with a properly mannered stallion, because the stallion can be injured from a kick from a protective mare. I'd also give the mare a rest for the year and re-try with a gentle stallion next year.

It's hard to say about the stallion's behavior without seeing in person and knowing his history and handling, but he probably should have been hand bred BEFORE he was turned out and allowed to learn that he can be aggressive. Because this is VERY dangerous behavior, I'd probably also be in the "geld him for sure" side.

Andrea

:yes

 

[rabbitsfizz]

Sorry but he sounds like a pretty normal teenager to me!

Nothing aggressive about his behaviour, he is just being a stroppy young colt.

Same thing with the mare, even my most dominant, lead mare, mare is a big pool of simpering hair when she is in season, and would not more kick except in self defence, than she would take wing and fly.

I can never understand people suggesting that, in order to sort out the crass bad manners of a young colt acting as a young colt, we should subject a bunch of well mannered mares to him.

So, this colt needs to be gelded not because he is an ill mannered lout (which he in all probablity is) but simply because your friend does not need a stallion and that little mare does not need that ill mannered lout bouncing the heck out of her every time she comes into season (no guarantee she will get in foal) and every time he feels like it in between!

Just geld him and tell her you will help her find a nice stallion actually standing at stud, when she is ready!

 

[Michelle@wescofarms]

What that boy needs is manners from a dominant older mare or two. He's aggressive as he has no manners and doesn't respect the mare, and she's obviously not dominant enough to put him in his place. His behavior though, while aggressive, isn't abnormal horse behavior.

I would find it unacceptable, as my boys are all better behaved than some of my mares!

If there's no reason to keep him intact, geld, but that won't change bad manners. As for the mare, three is still to young to breed IMHO, I'm more in favor of 4-6 years of age, the mare is grown, adult and not silly, so many 2-3 yr olds are like teen girls. Silly, flirty and not ready for being a mom yet. First time being bred they need a stallion that knows the ropes and romances them, not scares them.

I know I had my time to be a first time breeder, but I really wish people wouldn't 'start' new people to breeding without understanding the full implications of what is involved with keeping a stallion, foaling out, etc.

 

[suen]

I really appreciate all the input here. I have visited with her and given her the opinions from here on LB. She is not willing to geld him yet, wants to try to work with him and see if that helps. He does seem to be a really nice little guy except for this. The mare unfortunately is somewhat timid and I hope this doesn't traumatize her for future breeding.

 

[Minimor]

There are some stallions that simply do not do well when turned out with mares. You won't train them out of it, and even a group of older, more aggressive mares won't cure them of their bad behavior. I know of one stallion that kicks--if a mare were to turn and start kicking to put him in his place, he would also turn & start kicking--and it probably wouldn't end until one or the other got hurt. He has to be used for hand breeding only and otherwise is kept away from the mares. I can't say if this stallion is one of those kind, but the possibility is there. It is possible, too, that he's just being a young boy that hasn't learned his manners yet--and in that case he may settle down and behave once he's bred a few mares--that can happen, but I wouldn't count on it. He is likely to always get aggressive with the mares from time to time.

 

[Reble]

I really appreciate all the input here. I have visited with her and given her the opinions from here on LB. She is not willing to geld him yet, wants to try to work with him and see if that helps. He does seem to be a really nice little guy except for this. The mare unfortunately is somewhat timid and I hope this doesn't traumatize her for future breeding.

Than hand breeding is best for her to try.

Hope she reads up on how to train for manners.

Maybe some can give some advice on training manners, I have read a lot on here, have used clicker training.

Hope some will post to help her and this young stallion. Good Luck

Have to let us know how he turns out.

 

[Marty]

I couldn't stand by and watch my mare treated like that.

Your friend's mare can end up seriously hurt, get ulcers over it if she doesn't have them already or colic.

 

[suen]

Rebie.... thank you for the information. I have tuned her in to the many sites on teh internet for 'Stallion Training and Breeding' and hope she will find some useful information. BUT.... anyone who would like to give information or opinions on how to work with him I would be happy to sendthe information on to her. I can't stress enough that he really is a quiet, nice mannered little guy up until this mare came in heat and since then she hasn't been able to put them back together. I think he's just a really frustrated young stallion trying to breed a very timid maiden mare and between the two of them they don't have a clue how this all works,

Thank you all for your concerns....

Than hand breeding is best for her to try.

Hope she reads up on how to train for manners.

Maybe some can give some advice on training manners, I have read a lot on here, have used clicker training.

Hope some will post to help her and this young stallion. Good Luck

Have to let us know how he turns out.

 

[Jean_B]

First of all, any stallion that does not have manners needs to be taught them from the get-go. And if she intends to keep this boy intact, she must either separate them and strictly hand-breed.....or teach him some manners that an ornery old brood mare would teach him.

It may sound harsh, but this HAS worked. I had a DUMB youngster that thought he should tear into the mare, ripping on her neck, withers, legg - anything he could sink his teeth into. So I got out my wiffle bat and knocked the crap out of him every time he opened his mouth. It didn't hurt him but the sound sure got his attention. Of course, it took another hour or two before he considered looking at the mare again....and if he tried to savage her, he got thumped. I always use the 2 second rule - if you thump a horse more than 2 seconds after the event, he won't have a clue what he did wrong. Eventually he realized he had to be a good boy to get the girl.

But then there was old Vegas - he had run on the prairie with his herd in a huge pasture for the better part of 14 years before I got him, where they functioned almost like a wild band...where the stallion MUST use his feet and teeth to keep his band together and safe from predators. A little hard to train that many years out of him. So for his entire life with me, he was kept in a paddock by himself and only hand-bred. But I understood that from the beginning and didn't try to change his behavior, only control it.

Which brings up the point - horse owners need to walk (learn horse psychology) before they run.....and working with a stallion (in my opinion) requires quite a bit of walking before running.