What do you consider a "red bag"?

[Field-of-Dreams]

What do you consider a red bag birth? Full showing on the outside or any bit of red showing? Showing inside when you part the vulva lips?

We had a colt last night, as the mare lay down I could see the placenta inside but it had not ruptured. I did break it with my fingers and foal appeared immediately and proceeded to have a normal birth with minor assistance. Placenta was not delivered with him and was passed within half an hour. He was on his feet in 15 minutes and bouncing around in an hour.

So, am I jumping the gun here? I am just so concerned the foal may be compromised. I would be devastated if I lost a foal for doing nothing...

(will post baby pix later in a new thread!)

 

[iowa]

I would think that if the placenta was not delivered with the foal, it was probably not a red bag. In a red bag delivery, the placenta preceeds the foal because it is already detached from the uterine wall. That's the way I've always understood it anyway.

 

[Kelsey - Vandy's Farm]

Doesn't sound like a red bag. The placenta comes first.

 

[a mini dream come true]

Congrats on your foal!

Sounds like a regular delivery to me. Wonderful he is doing so good. Can't wait to see the pics

 

[AnnaC]

As I understand it the placenta should 'part' as the foal enters the birth canal. Therefore if you part the lips of the vulva you should see the 'white' bubble coming not the red of the placenta. It is possible to have a partial seperation of the placenta where it does travel out with the foal as the foal first appears, but then breaks open at the breaking point (the 'star') literally as it appears through the vulva, the foal is then born normally and the placenta follows a short while later - this might be what happened in your case?

A full blown red bag is when it doesn't break at the 'star' as it has completely seperated internally. In this case you will get a shiney, smooth looking red 'bubble' being delivered from the mare. In either case (partial or full) you need to break the red bag and get the foal out asap.

May I also suggest that a careful use of words should be used when typing. When you have a red bag foaling the foal is born WITH the bag (normally) not "the red bag comes FIRST/BEFORE/PRECEEDS the foal -- any new commers/inexperienced owners might think that the placenta comes first completely and then the foal is born after. Of course we all understand what we mean, but...........

Many congratulations on your new foal and well done for taking prompt action!

Anna

 

[weerunner]

I see it this way. I'm not going to sit around and wait until that red sack makes it out 6 inches or so before I decide, yup this is a red bag because at that point the foal has compromised oxygen (the placenta is detached from the mares uterus to a least a certain degree). I have been told by an expert that has seen thousands of deliveries, that if your mare is pushing strongly and you do not have water breaking and no white sack, you have the makings of a red bag and you should be proactive and look for the red bag. It's what I have done many times and have not been sorry of it yet as have always had healthy, active foals after such deliveries. Sure the placenta may tear after a bit more pushing on the mares part but why should we put her through the extra stress of trying to pass an entire placenta and fetus when as soon as you break the placental tissue the amniotic sack appears and the feet show up right away. Everyone has their own way of foaling, but me; I choose to act rather than wait and see. It's worked up til now and I'll continue to do it as long as that is true.

 

[Field-of-Dreams]

I see it this way. I'm not going to sit around and wait until that red sack makes it out 6 inches or so before I decide, yup this is a red bag because at that point the foal has compromised oxygen (the placenta is detached from the mares uterus to a least a certain degree). I have been told by an expert that has seen thousands of deliveries, that if your mare is pushing strongly and you do not have water breaking and no white sack, you have the makings of a red bag and you should be proactive and look for the red bag. It's what I have done many times and have not been sorry of it yet as have always had healthy, active foals after such deliveries. Sure the placenta may tear after a bit more pushing on the mares part but why should we put her through the extra stress of trying to pass an entire placenta and fetus when as soon as you break the placental tissue the amniotic sack appears and the feet show up right away. Everyone has their own way of foaling, but me; I choose to act rather than wait and see. It's worked up til now and I'll continue to do it as long as that is true.

^^^^ This exactly! This is how I feel.

Thanks!

Lucy

 

[Nathan Luszcz]

Sounds like an aborted red bag to me. Without intervention, chances are it would have become a red bag. A red bag is whenever the placenta detaches and precedes the foal out, that sounds exactly like what happened here.

That said, you minimized your risk by intervening and getting the foal out fast. That's exactly correct. I wouldn't worry unless I see signs of trouble.

 

[Field-of-Dreams]

Sounds like an aborted red bag to me. Without intervention, chances are it would have become a red bag. A red bag is whenever the placenta detaches and precedes the foal out, that sounds exactly like what happened here.

That said, you minimized your risk by intervening and getting the foal out fast. That's exactly correct. I wouldn't worry unless I see signs of trouble.

Thank you. I greatly respect you and your knowledge. I feel better now!