When is it time?

[babygoose]

My old QH mare has taken a turn for the worse lately. She is 24. This August she bowed a tendon playing. She was already retired at the time so I just wanted her to remain pasture sound. She healed probably about 90%. Still a bit of a limp but got around fine. Then just within the last few weeks she has started limping on the non-bowed leg. I know she was starting to get some arthritis and I guess she has been working that leg harder compensating for the bow. So at this point she still can get up and down okay, I don't see her lying down alot. She can get around, but it is getting harder. She seems to have the most trouble getting into motion, but once started she can walk okay. She can't trot or canter anymore. She is on bute. I know the time is coming very quickly. I visited with my vet about adequan etc, but I wonder if she is past that helping.

So for those who have been here, at what point did you say enough is enough. When they have to be on bute all the time? When they can't trot around anymore? When they have trouble getting up and down? My biggest fear is waiting too long. But it is hard when she is still eating good, interested in food, etc. I know she isn't going to get better, so maybe now is the best time before it gets obviously time.

 

[crponies]

This is something that only you can really decide. What is her outlook like? Is she upbeat and interested in life? Or does she seem depressed and/or in pain? If she is still enjoying life I would say enjoy it with her.

 

[hobbyhorse23]

That's a tough situation to be in and you have my sympathy. You don't mention if she's on any kind of medication besides Bute?

My almost-30 Arab bowed a tendon a few years ago, has arthritis in all four legs, no teeth, ringbone in the front pasterns, and seems to have snapped a large tendon or muscle in his left hindquarters so there's a big hollow spot there and he walks funny now. Without his arthitis meds I'm sure he would have been put to sleep years ago as I doubt he'd be able to move. His old arthritis meds weren't enough anymore so last year I moved him to glucosamine, chondrotin sulfates, manganese, etc. all in one supplement (Equinyl CM) and that was helping, but I put him on the Equinyl CM with Hyaluronic Acid and he's like a new horse. It does pretty much the same thing as the Adequan shots which we used to give, but no more nasty needles and now he sometimes canters to the gate to see me. :aktion033: The limp from the bowed tendon and the hindquarters won't go away of course, but he doesn't seem to be in pain now.

If your old girl isn't on arthritis meds I'd give it a try before letting her go. The Bute masks the pain but doesn't address the problem- the arthritis meds do.

Just my .02

Leia

 

[minih]

I would not even try to tell someone else what they need to do, but what I would do maybe, is have a good talk with my vet. Find out if there are any medications that could help, what do they think the pain level is, etc.... Then when I have tried everything and it doesn't seem to be working, look into their eyes, sometimes they can tell you. We have not ever had to put a horse to sleep before, but we have had to help 2 dogs and a cat. It is always extremely hard to make that decision. For me I just have to know I have tried everything I could.

 

[Crossbuck Farms]

My QH is 21 I think and 1986 model with many problems. She has full blown navicular and the coffin bone has rotated but She get s around fine.

 

[babygoose]

I realize that the decision is ultimately up to me. I wouldn't expect anybody to make that decision for me over a bulliten board. What I am looking for is what others have done in a similar situation. It is helpful to "talk" things out with people who have been in the same boat.

She isn't on any arthritis meds yet (except MSM). I visited with my vet about it last week. Currently I am out of town for the holidays, but will get back with my vet on Wednesday and we will look at adequan etc. I do want to look into that aspect before I make a fianl decision.

 

[momtotwo]

Does your vet seem to feel that she is reaching the point where this is something you need to consider? How uncomfortable is she? I have two geriatric QHs who will stove up a bit if allowed to loaf around in their stalls. After they start wandering around again they are ok. I thought I was going to have to have my gelding put down not too long ago as he suddenly became terribly lame. Turned out he had thrush from dumping his beet pulp out and standing in it (now I make sure it's soaked up nearly all the water and I feed him over a plastic table cloth). It sounds like your horse may just need some extra care at this time as you said that she seems to be ok once she gets going. Stiffness is often a part of old age. The supplements often make a dramatic improvement in horses with arthritis. There are also options for treatment of musculature problems. I would recommend a long discussion with your vet, find out exactly what is causing the problem, take a little time to weigh the options, and then make a decision. Your horse can tell you when she's ready, if you are willing to listen to her. Good luck and hugs for the journey, whichever road it may take.

 

[Marty]

When they have to be on bute all the time? When they can't trot around anymore? When they have trouble getting up and down? My biggest fear is waiting too long. But it is hard when she is still eating good, interested in food, etc.

These are very valid points you are making.

Re-read this list you have made.

What quality of life do you think your horse has at the moment?

I once had a horse that was dying and he was still laying on the ground eating from his bucket as we prepared to put him down.........

and yes, I have had a horse live on bute every day for a long time.

Only you and your vet can answer these questions. Your vet needs to be the one to evaluate your horse and lay it all out for you and give you your options and then you will have to decide.

As for adequan, I swear by it. I have used it three different occasions and it does work miracles atleast it did for me. But it is not cheap, nor is is easy. It is a series of injections. A vet has to give it, or should give it.....because you cannot make a mistake at the target area.

I hope you find your answers.

Best wishes.

 

[babygoose]

Thanks guys,

I have done adequan before with my TB gelding. The vet injected his hock joint and I gave him the series of shots myself since adequan is IM. Legend is IV.

I will be getting back with my vet tomorrow. We briefly talked about adequan before I left for the holidays, and she seemed to think it was an option. But I will be talking with her to see what she thinks about how effective it might be in this case.

I am not afraid to let her go. I love her dearly but I'm not the type of person to keep her around for my sake. I am much more afraid of letting it go too long.

 

[Bess Kelly]

Personally, I'd try the Equinyl CM. Easy to use and I've heard many say they had used with great results. It's something that's easier to use, also.

You know, there are mornings when I feel "sluggish & stiff" :lol: then moving helps loosen me up! It's part of aging, unfortunately. But, I keep myself on good vitamins/supplements and have gotta say that I often work circles around many that are 1/2 my age!

See if a change in oral meds won't help this fine lady feel snappy enough to happy a few more years. Like you, I wouldn't want her to be in pain!!!! But, if you can help her feel better, it just doesn't SOUND like she's ready to go anywhere else.

: Call Bonnie -- have her ask.

:

 

[SunQuest]

His old arthritis meds weren't enough anymore so last year I moved him to glucosamine, chondrotin sulfates, manganese, etc. all in one supplement (Equinyl CM) and that was helping, but I put him on the Equinyl CM with Hyaluronic Acid and he's like a new horse. It does pretty much the same thing as the Adequan shots which we used to give, but no more nasty needles and now he sometimes canters to the gate to see me. :aktion033:

I so agree with trying this. I use HA (Hyaluronic Acid) for my dog, and my mom uses it on her's, and my sister on her's and I believe her 28 year old gelding Appy gets it as well, and there is VERY OBVIOUS improvement in all the seniors. My mom's dog suffers from arthritus as well, and she is actually trying to run and play in the snow. My dog has a bad defective hip joint and he has been pretty much off of pain medicines since putting him on HA.

I use a product called "Conquer" and it was originally made and tested on race horses. It is amazing!

Someone her at work told me "Hyaline is a type of cartilage tissue so that may be what it is impacting." when I told her that it may help her dog who is also showing pain issues related to age. I am not sure if this is acurate, but sounds reasonable to me!

You can buy it straight from the manufacturer at http://www.kinetictech.net/equine-products...re-conquer.html and they also have a formula with the glucosamine and chondrotin in it as well. (I buy it from them and it is costly for shipping to just try one tube or container of it, but now that I know it works, I buy it in a 6 month supply for the same shipping costs.)

As far as knowing when the time is right, you will know. You will know because you have tried everything to make your QH comfortable and when she is no longer feeling good she will tell you. In the mean time, charish your days together. Never easy, and sorry I can't help you more. It is only something that you and your vet can decide as right. (Hugs)

 

[Ashley]

Well it is up to you, but you said she can not trot anymore, that right there would signal to me its time.

 

[Warpony]

On november 29th I had to ask myself the same question, and my sweet boy finally told me loud and clear that it was time.

For me, it was the following things:

Can they get up and down and around without help?

Are they still eating well and with their usual enjoyment?

Do they still seem to enjoy interacting with their surroundings?

If they can't get up and down on their own or move around without being pushed they are clearly in so much pain that is seriously decreasing their quality of life. If they stop eating or drinking they are giving up, and if they just seem dull and unaware they are also giving up. For me, any two of these things going bad and knowing I can't fix them tells me it is time (well, the first one can be enough on it's own, too). For my boy he stopped eating and he fell and couldn't get up without help. His pain meds weren't working any more. It was time.

From the sounds of it, though, with your horse I would try some other things first before i made that choice.

 

[ChrystalPaths]

I use the HA for myself, it is wonderful stuff and very inexpensive at Walmart.

 

[babygoose]

Well the weather here has taken a turn for the worse. I came home yesterday and my mare seemed okay, not good, but okay. She is not getting around any better. Her non bowed leg seems a little worse. She tends to bring it foreward without bending the knee. After a windy rainy morning, she didn't want to eat the senior feed and bute this morning. I had given her a double dose of bute last night. She picked at her hay. When I looked out later she was standing and kept lifting up one front leg than another. Finally she layed down.

So I called the vet and made the appointment to have her put down this afternoon. This is so hard! I feel like I might be making the call too soon. But she is not going to get better and I don't want her to get worse. I can't stand the thought of her standing out in the wet and cold. This morning she was standing in the run in and one side of her was soaked and the other dry. All she had to do was move over a little and she would have stayed dry.

I guess I can forgive myself if I am doing this too soon, but I know I would hate myself if I waited to long.

Thanks for all your support guys. You are great.

Now I just have to wait. Once she gets up from her nap, I'll go out and clean her up and give her a bunch of carrots.

 

[Warpony]

(((hug)))

having just gone through this myself, I feel my heart breaking for you. It does sound like she is telling you the time has come to say goodbye.

My grandmother always said, "In the end we have to make the hard choices for them, and in doing so we take their pain and make it our own so that they can have peace." YOU are going to hurt now, but SHE won't. She is very blessed to have a human love her who loves her enough to say goodbye and not hang on and let her suffer.

I'm so sorry you are having to go through this, especially so close to the holidays.

 

[FoRebel]

HUGS!!!! I know it's hard for you but it'll take the pain away from her. Just be with her... She knows how much you truely love her! My condolences to you!

 

[ChrystalPaths]

I respect your decision greatly. Having had to put my Treasure down recently was the hardest thing I have ever experienced but her pain was great and winter was coming. Talk to her let her know what you plan and she will understand. Winter is only going to get worse andwhat greater gift to give her now than warm sunny fields forever. My heart wil be there and I am so sorry.

 

[SunQuest]

I will be thinking of you and her today. Sounds like it is time. Yes, Warpony and Dimimore have it right. It is the hardest thing to do, and well, you are not acting too soon. Sounds like she is telling you it is time. Trust your heart... It is right.

Give her a hug from all of us and know that you are not alone today as you do this. Many people will have their thoughts with you as we have been in the position you are now.

(((((Hugs)))))

 

[Danielle_E.]

I feel for you as well having to make such a difficult decision BUT please don't second guess your choice.. I truly believe that with everything you have written here that you have made the correct decision at the correct time. I have a soon to be 30 year old arabian, will be 30 in 3 days, and I have asked myself that question almost on a weekly basis. The only problem with my mare at the moment is trying to keep her weight up. She is very mobile, can kick the barn wall down, and recently saw her go off in a canter... , just as I was watching and asking myself the question. They will tell you when they are ready and I believe that your sweet one has told you exactly that. It doesn't make the decision any easier no matter what, big hug to you :no: