Wormers-Do's and Don'ts?

[minie812]

Does anyone remember an article about wormers you are not to use on minis. I believe it was Quest? I have a new vet and when he was getting ready to worm a mini I had given to my neighbors I asked him not to. When I first started with minis 10 yrs ago I was told never give Quest to Minis but you can Ivermectin and Panacur or Safeguard. I cannot remember the reason and he would like to know too.

 

[targetsmom]

Yes, don't use Quest on minis. I am not sure why. The others are fine. I think it may have to do with there not being much latitude in a safe dose, but I really don't know.

 

[chandab]

Its the low over-dose threshold (many people over-estimate how much a mini weighs, and thus overdose) and something to do with how moxidectin (active ingredient in Quest) is absorbed by the body (I want to say its to do with the body fat ratio, but not certain).

 

[Jean_B]

Yes - Quest has an extremely low 'over-dose threshold". Most wormers are save even if you give them 10 to 15 times the recommended dosage, even for PG mares. Quest can be deadly if over-dosed. The problem is not the product....the problem is with the plunger not holding at the desired amount and people accidentally give an entire tube when wanting to does for just 250 or 300 pounds. I have had Ivermectin, or Panacur, or Strongid, etc. 'slip' and give an entire tube but I never worried about them. I will never use Quest for that reason.

 

[Carolyn R]

Zimectrin gold and, whichever brand eludes my mind at the moment, that is the equivalent is also safe.

 

[Marsha Cassada]

IMO, it is better to do a fecal count twice a year and determine if one's horse requires deworming.

Wormers work by affecting the nervous system of the parasite, causing the parasite to release its attachment to the host. It is then expelled, and, hopefully dies. Enough toxin to affect the parasite and not enough toxin to harm the host animal is the fine line for wormers.

Ivermection is suspected in the onset of glaucoma. Yes, we need to keep our animals healthy, but indiscriminate dosing of wormers, overuse of antibiotics, and even vaccinations can have long range negative effects. American horses are the most dosed animals in the world--but that does not mean they are the healthiest. It means pharmaceutical companies are making a lot of money off us.

Off my soapbox now!

 

[Shes My Style]

While fecal counts are great - one also has to keep in mind that not all types of worms will show up on fecals. So its a good way to reduce the number of dewormings, but please still give a good dewormer at least once a year for encysted strongyles and tape worms.

 

[rabbitsfizz]

Encysteds and Tapeworms do not show on a faecal test......

The low overdose is not the reason not to use Quest, although it is a pretty good one!

The main problem is the way it is stored for the 13 weeks it is active, which is in the body fat of the horse. So....you can weigh on a set of scales, two horses, one a porky little filed pet that weighs 120kgs and one a slightly taller fit, show horse that weighs the same, and give these two horses the same amount of Moxidectin (Quest). With the fat pony the wormer will be stored in the fat adequately and released over 13 weeks with probably no problems- thsi is why you get people saying they have used it since it first came out and never had any worries. The fit, fat free show horse, however, has no body fat to store the chemical in adequately, and so dumps it into the digestive system and thence into the blood of the horse, overdosing it by around ten times, which is enough to kill it.

THAT is the problem with Moxidectin!!!

 

[Reignmaker Miniatures]

Very good explanation rabbitsfizz. Thanks for that.

 

[SugaryCharm]

While we're on the subject of encysted strongyles and tapeworms...I read somewhere that there is a season (don't remember which one) when you do NOT want to worm for encysteds because if you do, too many will release at once and could make the horse ill? I hadn't heard that before but was wondering if any of you had.

 

[Marsha Cassada]

I don't think about tapeworms in horses much. How do they acquire them? I have seen photos of equine tapeworms and they are horrible looking.

Dapper Dan got a 3-way this spring, since his counts had been low for 18 months and I had not wormed him; he got the wormer with tape in it this spring , per vet recommendation. I think he has enough fat to absorb any surplus, but I was careful with the doseage!

 

[rabbitsfizz]

Only Moxidectin is stored in the fat, all other wormers go into the digestive system, that is why they do not last as long.

If your worm count is done by a Vet and you are told your horse is worm free I would change the way you do your worm count as NO horse is worm free, and they should not be either as there is a certain amount of symbiosis going on in the digestive tract as the horse is such a poor digestor. If you are told the worm count or the basic level of infestation, that is fine and what you need to be told.