A question for those of you who show

[Minimor]

By showing only the most "refined" horses aren't we (guess since I don't show, I should say you) perpetuating the trend and keeping some darned good looking stockier horses out of the ring? If the judges see more QH type minis in the ring it just might cause them to consider "best" horse rather than most "refined" horse.

For starters, the above is rather poorly worded. It conveys the impression (at least it did to me) that the OP believes that refinement is a bad thing, and therefore a stocky type horse is automatically better than a refined type of horse.
In actual fact there are some (many) very nice QH types that are showing and winning. I can name several judges that are known to appreciate the stock horse type, and that's in my very limited Miniature show experience. However, that doesn't mean that these same judges want to see "stockier horses" as such. They are still looking for refinement in those horses--because as the others have already pointed out, refinement doesn't mean (as I think some are taking it to mean) spindly horses that look like they will blow over in a strong wind.

People do tend to use "QH horse type or stock horse type" as a polite alternative to "coarse pony type with poor conformation" in many cases, and I think that 'politeness' conveys the wrong impression to many people. Stock horse type is one thing, just plain "thick set" is quite another. But if someone posts a photo of their horse for critique & asks "will this horse do well in halter" I can just about guarantee that the person who comes on & says no, that horse is much too dumpy and thick set to do well at halter is going to get blasted big time for being rude and mean. So instead people say the horse is rather too much stock type to be what the judges like, and that perpetuates the belief some people have that stock type horses cannot do well at halter...sigh.

Generally I don't think it's even a case of the judges preferring stock horse type or Arab type or Shetland type--because while Minis do sort of have characteristics of those types, they are still "different" in that they are Minis and none are exactly like any of those big horse breed types. From what I've seen, most judges want to see horses that have some substance to them--good conformation, longer legs, clean neck, length of hip with good muscling--they want to see the topline nicely rounded, but they do not want to see FAT. Most judges probably don't want to see a horse that is built like a brick sh--house, with a chest that's as wide as the horse is tall and a rear end that is two ax handles wide....there may be a few that like that look, but I have yet to observe any that go for that conformation. There are a few judges that actually want to see the horses looking anorexic as opposed to well rounded with a good strong hip, but I believe there are more judges who do not want to see anorexic (my word for those horses whose owners believe thin = refined and therefore they keep their horses scrawny to make them look finer) nor do they want to see horses that are naturally very, very slight with a weak croup and/or very narrow chest...those few that do look as if a strong wind would blow them away! To me those horses are not "refined"--I would say they "lack substance". Likewise my "good substance" does not = short legged &/or thick bodied/thick necked. In my view the ideal show horse has both substance and refinement--the two do not contradict each other.

I hope I've managed to convey my point & am not just rambling!

I know what I'm meaning, but am not sure I've managed to SAY it just right!

 

[dreaminmini]

Nicely said, Holly

 

[AppyLover2]

OK folks.....I asked a question I evidently shouldn't have asked.....I worded it badly.....and I don't understand all the negativity. I'll delete the original post and hope it just disappears.

 

[Scoopiedoo]

I, for one, am sorry that you've been treated this way for asking a question that you obviously wanted a simple answer to and instead got pretty much jumped on for trying to learn.....sorry.

Jodi

 

[dreaminmini]

Don't worry about it

You have every right to ask a question just some get more heated answers than others.

We are all passionate about minis that is why this forum is here. I've learned a lot on here! Don't regret asking a question, you never know who else may have been wanting to ask the same thing and was too shy to. And we never know what we can learn until questions are asked.

 

[maestoso]

This thread has gone from scolding to meowing to arrogance and everything in between, very entertaining, all for a simple question.

I didn't consider it a whine either. However, AppyLover, I am not sure how often you post, but anytime your brave enough to ask a question or pose an idea that can in anyway be interpreted as even slightly controversial, OR, if you are asking a question that leaves leeway for someone to parade around their never ending knowledge here, you better come prepared with your flame suit, because their are plenty here, as you can see, ready to pounce, like a cat

Meow . . . .

Here's my take on your question. Horse showing is exactly that, a show. There will always be politics involved, there will always be trends, etc. Like any other "show" be it a dog show or human beauty pageant, if you are not prepared to follow the trends you are likely setting yourself up for failure. Unless you truly do have the best specimen to represent the breed, "trend-setting" won't get you anywhere except a free walk to the gait.

Personally, I'd prefer to show in my flip flops. They are much more comfortable, and my feet get chlostrophobic

But I'm not about to go and see how that works out for me. Who decided that dress shoes and boots are what's appropriate? I really don't know, but that's the way it is, and you do it.

Though it was presented rather harshly, I think the Call Me Sir example was a good one. He is a "thicker" horse but maintains balance and overall appeal. While "refined" is not in the breed standard description, "balance" is, and the courser the horse is in proportion to it's body size, it will throw off the over all balance.

 

[lilstars]

well said matt

 

[ruffian]

"Personally, I'd prefer to show in my flip flops. They are much more comfortable, and my feet get chlostrophobic "

Hear Hear!!! I'm all for that! I like to go to barrel racing events - the horses are in their natural state, fuzzy, occasionally dirty, riders in jeans and t-shirts. I'm for that too!