anesthetic for gelding

[Marsha Cassada]

I was driving past the vet's over the weekend, and saw he had a miniature out in his "gelding spot". I had to stop, of course, because I couldn't pass up a chance to meet other mini people!

The colt was a 2 year old. When I got there, he had been given the dose for his weight (they took him inside and weighed him on the dog scale--230#). The colt showed no signs of going down. The vet gave him another dose and we stood watching him. We watched him graze, nibble on the vet helper, wander, neigh at other horses, and generally show no signs of going down. Everyone discussed it, and the vet decided to try one more dose. Nothing. He dropped briefly, then sucked it back up and continued grazing, nibbling, and neighing.

The vet decided to send off to the university equine center for a different anesthetic and did not geld that day. He said the colt was metabolizing the drug faster than it could take effect. The vet's comment was, the colt obviously had a very healthy liver.

One of my horses, we have learned, responds to HALF of a dose for his weight. What does that say about his metabolism?

 

[kaykay]

I often wondered this myself. We had a very bad experience a couple years ago gelding one of the smallest colts we have ever bred. The vet dosed him and thought he was out and as soon as he started cutting the colt jumped up screaming in pain. Gave him another dose and got half way thru and he was awake again. It was horrible. The vet was just mystified how 2 doses did not put out such a small colt. This is the only bad experience I have had but it still sticks with me. That poor colt wasnt the same for weeks after that.

 

[txminipinto]

It says nothing about metabolism. We all react differently to anesthetics. In one of my research projects here at Texas A&M, we've noticed a co-relation of cat color/markings to reaction to anesthetics. Nothing official, just something we've noticed. The vet was smart to send the colt off after the 3rd dose. That particular drug cocktail (whatever he was using) just didn't work on that particular horse. I have horses that take half dose of Rompun (xylazine) or a dose and half for adequate sedation.

Livers just don't work that fast!

Kay, your vet should have used a local anesthetic to complete the castration. It would have helped with that colt.

 

[djskid]

When my boy was gelded the vet had to give him the second dose and even then he was back on his feet so much sooner than any of the standardbreds that we have had gelded--> we basically got the gelding procedure done with very little time to spare!! The vet was astonished and said that overall, she had given him what she'd normally use to on 500 pound cattle to knock them right out!

 

[River Wood]

I have no idea what my vet used or how much of it, but I do know that he had to give him about 3-4 doses of it and had to help my colt down to get the job done. I didn't like that!

 

[Minimor]

I had one that didn't respond well to the drugs--he got his rompun, then the ketamine. He started to go down, then suddenly got back on his feet and went absolutely wild. He was just frantic, in a blind panic. The vet wanted to give him more rompun, but I said no, we were done. At the time I had no idea what had gone wrong. I put him in a dark stall and left him there until he calmed down and stopped looking like he was hallucinating.

Apparently horses do sometimes have a reaction like that to rompun. The vet just didn't know why the ketamine didn't take affect--she said perhaps he just doesn't respond well to the drug. in thinking it over afterward, I believe that she missed the vein with the ketamine--the first bit went in properly, then she lost the vein and the rest missed.

It probably would have worked to give this colt another dose, but I've known other horses that didn't respond to the first dose, or even the second, and then when the third took effect the horse's heart stopped...and I was not going to risk overdosing my boy.

I later took him to a different clinic. The vet there said that if he had to he would put in an IV and use a different drug to put him out. However, he didn't feel it was necessary--he gave him the usual combo of rompun and ketamine and the colt went down properly after the initial dose--not a large dose either.

 

[txminipinto]

Sometimes, Rompun (Xylazine) can cause a reverse reaction in horses causing excitement or aggression instead of sedation. I've seen it a few times; 2-3 here at A&M and once at my own house when I was clipping a horse. Every time it has occured it did turn into a dangerous situation.

 

[Becky]

Every time it has occured it did turn into a dangerous situation.

Hence the reason tranquilizers and sedatives belong in the hands of those licensed to use them! They are dangerous drugs and given incorrectly (or even correctly sometimes) can cause reactions unexpected and dangerous to both horses and humans alike. In all of my years of owning, showing and training horses, I've never used tranquilizers or sedatives here. The only time they are used is when a vet is here to administer them.

 

[txminipinto]

Every time it has occured it did turn into a dangerous situation.

Hence the reason tranquilizers and sedatives belong in the hands of those licensed to use them! They are dangerous drugs and given incorrectly (or even correctly sometimes) can cause reactions unexpected and dangerous to both horses and humans alike. In all of my years of owning, showing and training horses, I've never used tranquilizers or sedatives here. The only time they are used is when a vet is here to administer them.

I couldn't agree with you more Becky! One of the reasons why I pursued a career in veterinary medicine.

 

[wildoak]

We had two young stallions gelded on the same day a couple of years ago - one a 35" screaming stallion went down like a wet noodle with the first dose, stayed under and was gelded uneventfully. The second, a 2 yr old 28" stallion took two full doses and even then fought it as long as he could before finally dropping off. She barely got the job done before he was coming to again.

Both healed, if memory serves, without any complications.

Everyone reacts differently to sedation, people included.

Jan

 

[disneyhorse]

My vet always records the amount of sedative/tranq given to each horse so he can refer to it again if needed to see what worked or how much he needs to dose to get the right effect.

Andrea

 

[White Socks Miniature]

I trailer mine into the vet where they give a full general anesthetic (he only does this for minis). He has been in practice for MANY years and finds that minis are much more unpredictable when it comes to sedation, doses, reactions ect. Hence the general anesthetic. This way it is assured that the horse is in NO pain what- so- ever, they are fully anesthetized during the procedure at an appropriate plane of anesthesia, and they watch the horses recovery to ensure that the animal is ok. I may pay a little more, but to me it is well worth it!

ETA: EVERY vet should record the drugs, amount given and route in thier records! If they dont well...

I honestly dont know how they are still in practice. Excellent record keeping is essential!