Can't make myself….

[jandjmc]

Hi all;

A couple of months ago, I asked about neck sweating and got lukewarm responses, which I totally understand. You see, I really want to show but I REALLY don't want to put my horses through all the uncomfortable practices that are required. So after I washed my sweats, wrote down the advice about the best way to use them, the sweats have been laying in my utility room for a month now. I can't make myself put them on my horses. What else can't I make my self do? Bathe my horses in cold weather (even though I put in a warm water system), stand out to dry for hours with thick coats in cold weather, so that I can clip off all their hair. Then, though I have sheets and blankets for all of them, try to figure out if they are too hot, too cold or just right. Clip all the hair out of their ears, which they hate, razor their noses, separate them from their turn-out buddies for the night so they will stay clean and the sheets will stay on, take them off their regular forage based diet so that they won't have hay tummies, weight their feet, sandpaper their hooves, put them in draw reins to get their noses tucked in the last 1/4 of an inch needed and the list goes on…….

I have good horses, I like good horses, I like practicing..hunter, driving, obstacle, even showmanship ( believe it or not) but I just can't make myself……do these uncomfortable things to them in the name of showing.

Anyone else with these issues? How do you deal with them? What do you think is an "OK discomfort" for the horse? What isn't "OK"?

 

[poniesrule]

Interested in the responses here..... Good post. (Good luck, I'm no help as I have the same questions!)

 

[targetsmom]

I hear you!! There are plenty of things on your list that I won't do, and a few not on your list such as sending one to a trainer. I really don't think neck sweats are so bad and I have one that wears hers year around. The sweats are designed so the sweat is pulled away from the layer next to the neck so other that having something around the neck (that they really don't seem to mind) I can't see a big problem with them. Most - but not all - of our show horses are on dry lot but that is partly because our major show horse is insulin resistant and can't have grass. So why not let her buddies keep her company? They all get hay 4 times a day and I do measure/weigh it. They get worked 4-5 X/week. I figure it is like any diet and exercise program and most of ours ENJOY showing. If they hated showing, then I wouldn't do it. I once had a QH trainer (but still showing as an ammy) tell me that I had to shave the hair on the inside of my big horses ears. I checked the rule book and it was NOT a rule so I didn't do it. And guess what, at the next Pinto breed show I beat her under one judge in showmanship! Always check the rule book before you decide not to do something!!

I do not razor, I have not body clipped anyone yet, but I will do so right before the show. I use warm water, work the horses first so they are warm, and then towel dry and cover them immediately after bathing. My big horse was not stalled the night before the show, but was washed, covered and put in a small turnout. Some of our minis are the same. I braid and bag white tails on mares. If I saw any of the horse that looked like they were getting ulcers or being stressed (e.g. eating bedding, camping out, looking "off") I would not do this. But as long as they look and act happy, and I practice, practice, practice, I hope I have a chance. If it isn't fun for ME, I won't do it either. I do try to stall them the night before a show but all our "show" horses are used to being stalled.

When my big horse had his second colic surgery that removed a total of half his small intestines I promised him I would never show him again. But then I realized he LOVED to show, so I made some decisions about what I felt was safe and what I wouldn't do. It worked for me and he finished his Amateur Pinto Championship 2 years after that second surgery.

For performance horses, I train driving horses for carriage driving - no leg weights, tight checks, etc. and only on one did we need side reins very briefly.

Pick your shows carefully and go out and have fun!

 

[Field-of-Dreams]

I so agree! I hate what some poor horses have to go through. Most of it is innocent, like the sweats, and I have used side reins on my old man to "remind" him where his head needs to be, but some things I just can't do, like the no-hay bit. My guys LIKE hay, and get enough to satisfy their chew time. Otherwise, I KNOW my boys will eat things to fix that craving- like the fence or the barn! We have one "beaver" here (not mine!) and he's already made several holes in the barn....he's one that gets cubes but no loose hay.

Clipping doesn't bother me (I leave the inside ear hair if possible) especially since it does get boiling here. Just clipped my guy, he was pretty intensely fuzzy and it was in the 80s all last week. But he'll need clothes tonight, down to the 40s.

 

[Maple Hollow Farm]

I agree that there are lots of things that I really dont care for in the show world. I am going to a show tomorrow and while I clipped my mare, she will NOT be getting bathed, I didnt clip her close, I sure as heck am not razoring her, and I never sand my horses' hooves! BTW this mare is mostly WHITE, if she has any really dirty spots I will use Miracle Groom or some other wash free cleaner. Only time my horses get razored is at Nationals and I really dont even like to have it done there. Neck wraps dont seem to bother any of mine at all so I dont have problems with that, I rarely use the plain neoprene sweats though. I also do not use any artificial enhancement for action as I want my horses natural, they cant reproduce that enhancement so why make them move unnaturally? Half our horses are clipped, bathed (when warm enough), and taken to the show, no special diet, just pulled from their pens and off to the shows! My biggest pet peeve is taking hay away, they are under stress in a new environment so why stress them more or change their diets.....Anyways enough rambling ....all just my honest opinions. The list goes on but point is that I definitely agree that there are lines we must draw if we want to keep our horses happy and healthy, really most of the time all that extra stuff isnt even necessary and most will do fine without it.

 

[Max's Mom]

My daughter and I only show at local shows "for fun" in performance classes and do not engage in any of these practices. In fact, we are the only people who don't body clip, and I admit that it does feel a bit like we are odd ducks. I don't have a problem with clipping in the right weather, we just don't bother. He gets a bath when warm enough, trimmed fetlocks and bridle path and a little cleaning up of stray long hairs, but we keep his whiskers and inner ear hair. I don't think it affects our placing much, if at all, because it is based on performance, and they are small shows.

I guess it depends on what your goals are and how competitive you want to be.

 

[disneyhorse]

Well... I have a couple comfy throat wraps from RaDon that I use sparingly. I'm looking to place in halter but never really motivated for the grands.

As for clipping, I clip my horses soaking wet and don't have any trouble... In fact it keeps the blades really cool. You need strong clippers to do this and as a benefit, clipping the wet horse leaves less tracks and itchy hair doesn't fly around.

I don't think clipping out the ears is really a big deal... My pony doesn't care at all when I do it and then I just use a good fly lotion in them to keep gnats out.

Good quality, well-fitting blankets aren't a big deal and if you layer them you can keep your horse warm or cool accordingly.

My horses have all gotten lots of hay based diets and no "hay bellies"... The key is enough protein and exercise so it is balanced.

Our horses are stalled year-round because I live in the city, but are turned out with buddies to play and be free lunged for exercise. It makes exercise more social and fun and they actually get more intense workouts with friends.

My pony wears weighted shoes (he is a Modern shetland) from the first of the year through show season, but they aren't extreme enough that he can't be turned out to play and be crazy without hurting himself or tearing his shoes off. A good farrier makes ALL the difference in balance and motion. And all I do is shoe him... No chains or weights or bungees otherwise and he's still got plenty of motion.

Draw reins or side reins are only as harsh as the person applying them and they aren't bad if the horse is allowed to acclimate to them and muscle up accordingly. And, if you don't like to rely on training tools, you can do it the classical dressage way which takes more time but is just as effective if not more so.

It's easy to just throw up your hands and say "it's all so cruel" but anything can be done with common sense and compassion and maintain a horse's happiness.

My horses are shown with moderation. Selecting naturally fit, athletic horses in the first place is truly the biggest secret of them all though. If your horse is bred to have a trim barrel and neck you won't have an uphill battle. If your horse has conformation to tuck its head and pick its knees up to its chest it will come along much quicker. I'm lazy about training and fitting and I know a good horse will make up for a lot of slack.

 

[little lady]

Many great points made. I used to show Paint Horses and when things started getting too extreme for my taste I didn't do them. Yes, it hurt my placing's(I would ask the judges after classes reason for placing's) so bottom line is you have to do what you are comfortable with, what makes you and your horses happy. Maybe try Local shows(heck some of the fair shows pay back pretty good), or try a breed show and do "your" thing. Best of luck in whatever you may chose to do!

 

[wingnut]

I bought "wicking" blankets for my horses a couple of years ago. I found a way to run warm water out of my basement to the area where I bath them. Once bathed, they were immediately blanketed in these "wicking" blankets, stalled in a clean and deeply bedded with straw stall and give a lot of hay to much on. They dried faster than you might think and were none the worse for wear.

This year, I took the advice of a friend who is a professional groomer. I bought heavy duty "cow clippers" that will allow me to get the bulk of their hair off without bathing first. We'll be doing our big clip and first baths on April 19th.

Trust me when I say I wouldn't do anything to put my girls in jeopardy, but I've found ways to show and still get them clean and ready to show well by the first show in May. I've come to believe these guys are a lot tougher than we sometimes give them credit for.

 

[jandjmc]

Thanks for the replies! It is nice to know that there are others out there who are really giving thought to what they will and won't put their animals through.

I was very frustrated trying to get things ready for a show this weekend, (we had really cold and windy weather) when I realized that I could just wait for a show on my list for May. Novel approach-just do the shows I want to do! So I made up my list, 8-9 events I would like to go to and and I'm going to check other things going on in my life, then select the ones that fit best.

I personally have nothing against body clipping and razoring, when it's warm, I'm sure the horses appreciate it.

And the point about training practices only being as harsh as the person employing them is also very true.

I, too, really enjoy so many things about the show ring. One of the most important being the friendship of others who love our little fuzzy equines.

 

[disneyhorse]

As to razoring... I show a Shetland now and we can't razor... But I never personally liked the look and don't do it myself. But I do razor myself in various areas and it doesn't hurt or bother me so I don't care if others do it.

Someday I'll get my judges card and I know it doesn't matter to ME if a horse is razored if I placed them but another person might. This is why trainers and serious showmen try every trick in the book "just in case" it matters.

 

[rabbitsfizz]

A lot of these things do not HAVE to be done, there are ways round them. You can stall a horse next to the stalled one, for example, and you can trim inside the ears and then just put some gloop (sparingly) in and flatten all the remaining hair down so it does not notice. Loads of little things can be done to attain a "look" without actually doing the things you dislike,

 

[MiniNHF]

I used the full neck sweat when I work my boy which around 20-30 mins and then he gets just the throat latch one for a few hours in his stall and he does not seem to mind it at all.

As far as for razoring I have not done that and I dont think I will. Now I do however do the full body clip (before his hair comes out naturally) because my boy does get very irritable and tired if he is sweating and has a ton of hair while working; if its still cold out I do a performance clip (as they do to the big horses) and did his hair grow back in lighter in those areas yes but since then I have started to do his full clip and you cannot see that difference as many worry about.

 

[Marty]

One of my horses was body shaved with a #30, razored and sweated a few years ago. Not by me. I didn't know it and I hated it.

#1 You could not pay me to put sweats on my horses. Sorry but if their neck isn't good enough as is, then that's just too bad. We'll take our chances.

#2 Razoring is the most ridiculous, stupid thing some bozo ever invented. I think its downright nasty and looks disgusting

#3 Body shaving with a #30 is plain all get out crazy and unnecessary.

#4.Bathing on a cool day in a cold hose outside? Heck to the no. Warm water bathing, inside with no drafts ok, then blanket

What i will do

#1. Will body shave with a #10. enhance with # 15 and 30 in certain areas. Ears clipped absolutely with mustache clippers from the dollar store. They fit right on in there nice and neat, relatively quiet and do nicely.

#2 Blanket or sheet my horse and stall it all night, of course! With friends there for company absolutely.

#3.Remove their hay? Never. That's the basis of my feed program and without eating their hay that leaves them wide open for ulcers., not to mention i don't want to have a bunch of unhappy miserable horses just for the sake of a ten cent ribbon.

Shows are supposed to be about the horse and having fun with the horse which means the horse needs to be a happy participant.

 

[Danielleee]

While I don't razor because i only do local shows, i dont think theres anything wrong with it as long as you make sure their skin is protected from the sun! I dont understand it but theres a lot of things in the horse world that are a mystery lol. But thank you Marty for saying about the mustache clippers for the ears!!! such a good idea cause most horses hate big clippers by their ears and I dont blame them!

 

[BSharpRanch]

As to razoring, I would like to share a story from the recent mini show here. My daughter (horse person) and her fiance' (non horse person) came to help me as I was showing my four-up. We were walking around looking at the horses and such when a razored halter horse walked by. It also had gobs of greasey goop on it's nose too.

The fiance' looked strangely at the horse and then turned to me. "is that horse part cow? What is wrong with it's nose?"

Daughter and I looked at each other and giggled, then explained.

But now since.he.mentioned it, their noses do look like cow noses! No offence ment, just an observation.

 

[Margo_C-T]

Marty, as usual, you have the gift of going right to the point and saying just what needs to be said!! I couldn't agree more!!

 

[jandjmc]

Yeap, you're right, shows are supposed to be fun with your horse. Not fun at you're horse's expense…..

I had an interesting insight the other evening. It occurred to me that I had the same feeling of rebellion when I was a teenager and felt that I couldn't (and wouldn't) compromise myself-I wasn't size 4, preoccupied with nails, hair and accessories, waiting for a boy to call. I wanted to be myself, size 10+, interested in books, animals, outdoors and not an out-going cheerleader type. Anyway, it was the same kind of feeling……not willing to compromise myself or my equine friends…Does that make sense?

 

[Gone_Riding]

I totally understand. I desperately want to get into showing, but if it means doing all the shaving, sweats, and keeping them locked in a stall all the time, I just won't do it. I know with big horses, I believe they should be knocked if they have an artificial tail or coloring. If the horse isn't good enough without it, then the horse isn't good enough. Yes, it can make some horses look better, but the ones that are naturally that way are the ones we are looking for and should be breeding for. Isn't it?