Cosmetic Surgery - Really?

[SweetOpal]

This is an interesting thread, when I look at the magazines I do not see horses that MUST have been altered to have hooky necks. Most of the pics you see that have hocky necks are ones that have been photographed by professional photographers, trust me they do anything they can to get that horse to give thier neck, it takes a ton of creativity to get those shots. They use a number of things to get the horse interested in that. I personally look for horses that have long necks, now having said that, i can never get the same hook out of every horse. I believe alot of it has to do with conformation. A short necked horse or stockier built horse might have a harder time getting that hook due to the fact thier neck is short. I guess there may be people who do these surgical treatments but I have not met any nor have I truly seen a horse that looks like it has a neck that I would think has had some kind of surgery. Perhaps I feel this way because my horse has a very hooky neck! I will tell you no he doesn't walk around with a hook in his neck all day, but if he sees something that intrests him or intrigues him and it could be a wall or the trailer door, he hooks that neck and snorts! Now this is not because he has had surgery but because he is a fruit loop! My fruitloop, and I wouldn't change him for the world.

:

as for acupuncture and liposuction, now that is just scary, however if I wouldn't do it to myself then why the heck would you do it to your horse! I hate giving shots, can't imagine acupuncture!!! To me all I am hearing is needles...YIKES!!! :new_2gunsfiring_v1:

 

[MiLo Minis]

While I can understand someone having the surgery to prevent cribbing on a performance horse that would otherwise end up unusable to do that type of surgery on a perfectly healthy normal horse is abhorrent! Likewise surgery to correct clubbed feet or an overbite could be considered a kindness to the horse as it enhances their life. Would this cribbing surgery not leave visible scars that would make it unlikely to be shown at halter anyway? I would then suspect that it would be only done on horses that are kept at home and used for breeding purposes alone which again is abhorrent as it is totally deceitful. Michelle, where would one look for this scar if it was visible? I know horses can heal remarkably well with little scarring but surely there would be something?

 

[Stacy Score]

This is my stallion "Prince" - who has a naturally long & hooky neck - this photo is "au natural" - more and more horses like this are being bred - a true credit to the dedication of many of us in this breed.

 

[Sun Runner Stables]

Acupuncture by itself is a Miracle! It's changed the lives of Several of my horses, and saved the life of my foundered mare, So Please Do Not write All acupuncture off as scary! Most all of my horses have had it done, But Not to alter, to help them. And it's made a Huge difference!

I have a filly who's mother had an crazy long neck, almost obscene, and her daughter has the same neck. The mare is 11, the sire 5 *I think*, and this filly's neck is unreal, and almost too long.

Have I done anything to her? Nope, she's sitting in my barn until I have the time to show her. Heck I agree with whoever said if I had the money I would get it for myself! (I'd Find something for those of you who know me!

: Maybe an augmentation down words!!)

Having been on a larger professional working training farm, I can tell you that alot of what you are seeing is just good working and sweating, starting off from a great basin of horses! REO said it the best, often those photos are taken on that horses good day, and we only pick the Best photo of all the good photos, so of course what you are going to see is the extreme great side of the horse!

I have not personally been aware of any horses who have had any of the things mentioned here done, asides hocks being injected. I believe someone already pointed out that That is Not cosmetic, but instead a way of helping our big horses who preform at such a high level they can start to become damaged.

Since I work mainly with the big guys I can tell you that there is most likely not One horse out a WEF right now asides young stock, who has Not had that done or something similar. It's considered "maintenance" and Not something to cosmetically change your horse!

 

[StarRidgeAcres]

This is my stallion "Prince" - who has a naturally long & hooky neck - this photo is "au natural" - more and more horses like this are being bred - a true credit to the dedication of many of us in this breed.

He's beautiful!!!

 

[Tammie-C_Spots]

This is Justin in his natural condition just tooling around his paddock. I know that if he sees something new and interesting he can tighten up his neck muscles and really arch that neck like in photos and he hasn't had any kind of "sweat" on him in his life. I'm more for natural. Not to say if I was to show him for example that I wouldn't clean him up and get him into show shape

Tammie

 

[Dream]

Lori,

I have never personally seen this anti-cribbing surgery done or even seen a horse that has had it done. I think for the most part vets don't like to do it (kind of like debarking surgeries in dogs). Therefore I am not sure where the scar would be. I have seen horses that have had the strap muscles cut to prevent them from flipping their palate while racing. These just have the appearance of being not quite as they should be in the neck...no advantage there.

 

[tagalong]

A BIG thank you to those who have pointed out that breeding and presentation produces those nice necks (the two pictures I posted were NOT those two horses at their most showy - and hooky!) ... and that not every pic of a horse like that needs to be held in suspicion and have the Surgery! label bandied about.. That is how harmful rumours and accusations get started - that eventually become "fact". And that bothers me...

And as I said in my earlier post - OF COURSE you see more refined necks now compared to years ago - or, as Stacy put it...

- more and more horses like this are being bred - a true credit to the dedication of many of us in this breed.

And Prince in person is just as you see him in that photo. Not retouched. No surgery...

IMHO only a very very few horses will have had that type of surgery done - and no, that is not being naive...

 

[PrestigeMiniHorses]

I agree about the cutting tendon thing now since I did some research. It does help alot as alot of you all have said to allow a horse to live a normal life. And yes Cathy up here people do, some crazy things. I wouldn't dpubt someone finding a vet that would perform such a surgery. Very crazy but its true.

 

[hhpminis]

I am not going to be naive and say this doesn't happen as I have seen and heard things that shock me. However, these are not practiced by the majority. In fact, if it is, it is the small minority that do. Most of us get it the hard way with consistent hard work, conditioning and training.

I for one am a little tired of having to defend the fact that I work my @ss off day in and day out to get a horse that is deserving of a national title. The most artificial thing my horses see is a neck sweat. Anyone who has seen me work with and show my horses knows that the respect works both ways and my horses give me all they have when I ask for it and sometimes a little bit more, not because they fear me but because I ask them. I dont ask them for anymore than they can give and in turn they give all they have.

Case in point, 10 yr old gelding. I use him for my youth that work for me to show. Nothing artificial about him. In fact he doesn't even wear a sweat except for when we go to shows. This is just standing for a picture, no props, no skunks on sticks.

Yes Virginia, sometimes it is just good old genes.

 

[wildoak]

a trainer she took her horse to wanted her to "deaden" her mare's tail and inject her hocks.

Both very common in the QH world. Nothing wrong with injecting hocks, many many performance horses from dressage to cutting to western pleasure horses have hocks injected to increase their comfort and their useful "working" life. I have one in my pasture who was injected while she was showing and will be done to stand in the pasture if she ever needs it. Fixing tails is illegal but done all the time - I owned a couple of horses whose tails had been done previously and I was told they would need it again, but I declined. NOT my favorite thing.

I didn't think cribbing surgery was done much anymore - have been told by vets that it is a bloody messy surgery with so so results. Cribbing is a nasty habit but the thinking now is that it is not so detrimental to the horse as once believed.

Lots of good comments on here - I agree that the idea of purely cosmetic surgery on horses is abhorrent. But I do believe that most of the extreme horses we see are the result of good breeding programs and a lot of hard work. Imagine there are horses showing who have been altered, but I believe they are the exceptions. Electric acupuncture is probably more widespread than any other technique. As someone pointed out, acupuncture can do a world of good when used therapeutically - cosmetically it's probably not painful or "cruel" to the horse, but it is dishonest when the horse is presented without disclosure.

The quality of photos has already been discussed - just want to agree with the fact that a good professional photo can make an ordinary neck look hooky, and an old pasture plug look amazing. Think "Glamour Shots" LOL.

Jan

 

[StarRidgeAcres]

Annette, He's beautiful!

:

 

[Ronnie]

and she talked about how a tendon or muscle or something could be cut in the neck to give more of an arch.

- -- don't know if this is true or not but it does make one wonder. I've wondered often lately where all of a sudden all of these horses came from with such archy necks. We've had mini's since 86 & you just did not see that many. In the last few years they seem to be poping up everywhere - why so many so quickly. I don't think all of it has to do with breeding either - just look at some of the pictures in the MHW & on websites - don't look natural do they?...... My opinon - - dishonesty, deception, greed & thievery on the horse owners part!

A lot can be done with digital photo programs. There are some enhanced horses out there but there is a lot more enhanced photos.

 

[Wee Mite Miniatures]

Over 15 years ago we had bought a real nice colt in hopes to use him for a stallion. When he was 4 1/2 and still had not dropped both we decided to geld him and look for another stallion.

There was a good size well known farm that had a stallion I really liked. I called her up hoping she might have a son of his for sale. We got to talking. Seems she was also well know with the Quarter Horses. When I mentioned we had had our colt gelded because he had olny dropped one, her response was " Why didn't you have the vet insert a fake testicle?" HUH? she shocked me. She said it was done all the time so a stallion could be shown as a senior stallion at QH shows. She was sure I could have found one in mini size.

When I was telling someone else about it, she seemed surprised I did not know about the fake ones. She said they do have mini size and yes there is a well known stallion with one.

 

[StarRidgeAcres]

Over 15 years ago we had bought a real nice colt in hopes to use him for a stallion. When he was 4 1/2 and still had not dropped both we decided to geld him and look for another stallion.

There was a good size well known farm that had a stallion I really liked. I called her up hoping she might have a son of his for sale. We got to talking. Seems she was also well know with the Quarter Horses. When I mentioned we had had our colt gelded because he had olny dropped one, her response was " Why didn't you have the vet insert a fake testicle?" HUH? she shocked me. She said it was done all the time so a stallion could be shown as a senior stallion at QH shows. She was sure I could have found one in mini size.

When I was telling someone else about it, she seemed surprised I did not know about the fake ones. She said they do have mini size and yes there is a well known stallion with one.

They're called Neuticles. Their website is www.neuticles.com Unbelievable!!!

 

[andi]

Not trying to change the subject by if you haven't went to that website you need too see it. It is soo funny. Go to the "Merchandise" page. Do people actually buy shirts, hats and aprons to promote fake animal body parts?!? And the Keychains and Necklaces!! Definitely high fashion. :lol: :lol: I have my order in already! LOL

Heres a link

http://www.neuticles.com/shop/merchandisemart.shtml

 

[REO]

Thanks alot James! I spewed diet Dr Pepper on my key board! :lol:

Too funny!!!

 

[~Karen~]

I have always been for the all natural in the shows, no matter what the animal. It is just not right to win a show otherwise when a show is suppose to be for the betterment of the breed. It should be illegal for that sort of practice to be done. How does hurting, oh... 'altering' an animal to win shows a betterment of the breed?

I never heard of cutting tendons and the like, but I do remember when taking my Foxtrotter to some gaited shows, there was a vet on duty to check the hooves to make sure there was no burning stuff (forgot now what people would try to use) but it would make the horse snap up their feet quickly, thus giving major lift for high stepping seen in the Tennessee Walkers, along with very weighted shoes that would later cause leg damage that would cause their back ends to tuck in and their fronts to step high. There were many tricks that the gaited class would use or try to use that was or could be potentially harmful. For me, it was a very sad thing to see. I wound up staying away from even watching gaited shows and just enjoying my trail rides for that very reason.

~Karen

 

[Mercysmom]

They're called Neuticles. Their website is www.neuticles.com Unbelievable!!!

:risa_suelos: :risa_suelos:

Oh my - I knew they had Neuticles out there but the website is funny to read...my neutered male animals all got over it just fine...the only one who was angry about it was our 2001 colt Biscuit. When I brought him home from Cornell after having "his pants shortened", he roared and attacked our then stallion, Anakin. Before the gelding, they got along fine! Anakin was gelded shortly thereafter and he almost seemed relieved!

Cosmetic surgery...no thanks unless it is for me to lose some pudge...I am not one to wrap myself in a sweat and go running behind an ATV or Gator!

:

On photo retouching, "naughty" magazines :new_shocked: and fashion magazines have been doing it for years on people. I was amazed when we sat in front of a rock star and his supermodel wife and she was built like a normal lady.

:aktion033: :aktion033: to those selectively breeding great mini stock!

Denise

Silversong Farm

 

[kenna]

Not trying to change the subject by if you haven't went to that website you need too see it. It is soo funny. Go to the "Merchandise" page. Do people actually buy shirts, hats and aprons to promote fake animal body parts?!? And the Keychains and Necklaces!! Definitely high fashion. :lol: :lol: I have my order in already! LOL

Heres a link

http://www.neuticles.com/shop/merchandisemart.shtml

:risa_suelos: :risa_suelos:

Cosmetic surgery...no thanks unless it is for me to lose some pudge...I am not one to wrap myself in a sweat and go running behind an ATV or Gator!

:

Denise

Silversong Farm

:lol: :lol: :new_shocked: