Help with pawing, please

[Marsha Cassada]

The horse I am boarding has some bad habits. He is rather spoiled. The habit I'm working with right now is impatient pawing. Whenever he doesn't want to wait for anything, no matter what it is, he paws agressively. If he gets left behind in the pen, he paws. If he's tied, he paws. If he is waiting in the trailer, he paws.

I've tried smacking his legs with the whip with an authoritative "no", and that didn't work. So I'm not going on with that. I've never had a horse that a smart smack didn't deter him from pawing before.

The next thing I'm going to try is longing him everytime he paws. I can do this while he is learning to stand tied. I have to alot a block of time for this as soon as the weather is more moderate.

This horse is 5 years old. He belonged to a woman who thought it was cute that he "made music" on his feed dish when she didn't get there fast enough with the food. I've had him about 6 weeks.

I am open to ideas. It is a very annoying habit, not to mention being destructive.

 

[Miniv]

Have you tried backing him as a corrective measure? It means right there to do it, though.

 

[disneyhorse]

I hate to say it but I've known a few horses that did this as a habit and it never could be broken. One was a draft horse... Really destructive!

What I've seen work a couple times is a piece of hose or chain attatched around the fetlock so the horse self-corrects the instant they paw so it is uncomfortable. Otherwise, they do it for attention, even if its negative attention. I've tried tying for hours and it doesn't work either.

Good luck.

 

[newtominis]

My mini did this when I first got him- he still will do it occasionally but a smack on the leg and a loud NO has decreased it drastically!

 

[Marsha Cassada]

I hate to say it but I've known a few horses that did this as a habit and it never could be broken. One was a draft horse... Really destructive!

What I've seen work a couple times is a piece of hose or chain attatched around the fetlock so the horse self-corrects the instant they paw so it is uncomfortable. Otherwise, they do it for attention, even if its negative attention. I've tried tying for hours and it doesn't work either.

Good luck.

If the longing thing doesn't work, I'm going to try this. I have some velcro restraints made for people. (Amazing, the kinds of things one can get in an auction box!) I was planning to use them to put bells on for the horses' feet, but I think they will work for this. I will try this when I have someone experienced around to help me.

Yes, I've tried backing. It has not helped. That works for lots of things, but pawing doesn't seem to be one of them. I think he actually LIKES backing.

 

[ruffian]

The problem with the restraints is that he will probably continue to do it when you don't have them on. Some horses paw. Some don't. My Thumper paws while he eats. Some of his offspring do, and some don't. I don't see it as a huge problem if he's doing it while he's by himself.

 

[sparklingjewelacres]

Well I certainly don't know a lot about horses and how to correct horse behavior. I have done well with other animals in ending unwanted behaviors. Our little silver bay has been doing this at the gate when I go to get her feed. She obviously has been corrected for this before as she will stop when I scold her... then do it again when I turn my back to go back into feed shed. I am trying to do instant correction(verbally) and catch her in the thot before the action and I think with a lot of time, it can be corrected before it gets to the habitual state. It will take a lot of work to keep at it tho.

 

[Marsha Cassada]

Sounds like the concensus is that this is a habit I won't be able to correct. I'm not sure, then, how I will deal with it because holes dug and dents in my trailer are not desireable.

Luckily, he is not mine and can go home in a few months.

Is it likely that this habit could have been corrected when he was young? Or, is it in his genes?

If it could have been corrected, I hope other owners will take this as a head's up on their young ones with this tendancy!

 

[muffntuf]

I think it is debatable whether it is habitual or genetic. I have several ponies who paw when they eat. I have several who have learned that if they want attention - they paw, but I don't pay attention to them, it stops after a bit. I have mats down in the stalls - so pawing doesn't cause a lot of damage.

One pony who did paw her stall - is on equittum and she has stopped pawing - she pawed a hole in her stall.

So try seeing if there is a underlying ulcer = that might help.

I have another pony who attacked walls and messed up his feed bin every feeding time - same issue - he had an ulcer. Just recently - he has stopped with everything except one learned habit of tapping his front teeth on his wall. Even the killing his feed bin - which has just been the last week or so.

Some younger animals - they just need time out in an arena to play to get some of the boredom out.

 

[rabbitsfizz]

It is irrelevant (though very interesting) as to whether it is inherited behaviour, or not (in this case)

Please do not try restraining him- he will become frantic and may well hurt himself, and he will not learn anything. Even if you could get him to accept the restraints it will do nothing to actually teach him to stop. One thing an old horse man I knew tried was tying a small tennis ball with elastic onto the leg the horse paws most with- I think he ha limited success!

Try standing him on a good strong rubber mat whenever you tie him up- at least that way he gets no feed back.

Smacking him will not work as he is doing it for attention and smacking him is attention, The only thing that will work, long term, is completely ignoring him.....but it takes more patience than I have, I can tell you!!

 

[muffntuf]

I don't think she was thinking of 'restraining' her. I think what is suggested is that the restraints are put around each individual foot with a piece of hose on it so that when they paw- the hose hits their foot. Not what I think you guys think is being suggested - just mho.

 

[rabbitsfizz]

Ah, I see! Thanks for clearing that up. It might work better with a ball?

 

[muffntuf]

No hose works really well.

 

[Lil Eowyn]

My filly Éowyn does it ever since I (regretingly) taught her to shake my hand. Now she does it constantly--like she never stops! I'm trying to fix it but shes so stubborn

 

[JMS Miniatures]

Really the best solution is just let them do it. They need to learn patience and the only way they will learn is to leave them tied up for long periods of time. Work him and then tie him up and just ignore the pawing. Just keep a rubber mat underneath so he won't dig in holes. It may never go away but it can get better.

 

[Rockysticksfeatherfarm]

I am still learning too... Is there a difference between impatient pawing (like what ours does when he is tied close and wants loose) and playing with something? Stoney plays with a big exercise ball and paws at it as part of playing. Today I wanted to start teaching him to stand on a tarp, I wanted to start smal so I used a chicken feed bag. This quickly turned into a toy (he was off halter) he pawed relentlessly and picked it up and tossed it into the air. I know we don't want him doing this to a tarp for halter training. .... Not to get off subject but is it a bad idea to let him play with the bag? I don't see how he could hurt himself, he really can't tear it ( its made of woven plastic)

 

[Marsha Cassada]

Shaking hands has nothing to do with pawing. The horse I'm working with is learning to shake hands; it is not connected in any way with the pawing. Shaking hands is done with a cue. No cue, no shake hands.

If one is teaching a horse to stand on a tarp, I would not let him paw it. Work is work. If one wants to give it to him to play with, that is something seperate.

I think the longeing is having limited success--too soon to tell for sure. I'm coming to believe the pawing is a bratty bid for attention. Pawing brought his owner, so pawing was good. Now pawing brings work. Not so good.

 

[JMS Miniatures]

Play is play, no biggie. But continuous pawing being tied up is not good behavior. Learning to stand on a object and pawing at the object is not a bad thing if they are studying the object, making noise or even picking it up. They are figuring out what the object is.

If you are wanting him to learn how to walk or stand over a tarp it's very simple just bring a tarp out and start out small with it completely folded up, make them walk around it and then over it willingly and not nervous about it, and just unfold the tarp a little bit and make it bigger and just make them walk across it and once they aren't nervous make it even bigger. Pretty soon the tarp will be completely unfolded and they can walk or stand on it. Reward them for standing on it quietly. If he is pawing at it don't reprimand him for it let him study it and then ask him to back up off of it. Then bring him back on it again. If he is really just playing with the tarp and not wanting to stand on it relaxed then take him off the tarp and lounge him away from the tarp and then take him back to the tarp and let him relax. If he does it again then rework him but maybe you will have to really get his feet moving with all sorts of exercises. The important thing to remember is let him be calm and relax while he is walking or standing still on the tarp.

This can also work with tying them up with a horse with a pawing problem. If he is continuing to paw work the heck out of him and then take him back and tie him up and let him relax if he doesn't and continues to paw do it again. But IMO the best thing to do is work them first, tie them up and ignore the pawing. If you tie them up every time after you work them the better they get every time. At least most of them.

 

[Rockysticksfeatherfarm]

My dog has the pawing problem because of her learning to shake hands and give fives she is doing it for attention she will paw you and actually hurt doing it. So far ignoring and walking away when she does it is working maybe it could apply to a horse? Like the pp said ignoring it. Like actually walk away when they do it instead of any kind of attention. They will think " when I do this it makes my owner (food person) leave with me tied up" no matter how much I push my dog away or squeeze her paws she keeps at it even turning into a batting contest. But if I walk away she gets the point.

 

[Marty]

Marsha if you find a cure for this you shall be a millionaire. I've been trying for many many decades and ain't dun found an answer yet. You'd go nuts in my barn at feed time!