Inform me: Horse Slaughter

[manyhorses]

I dont care about the cows in Hindu, lucky them they get a long and happy life, I am talking about the horses in America.  

I have to agree with Coco - how many people do you see ridden there cows in shows? Or driving there pigs in carts? Or taking there chicken for a walk?

Horses carried man threw history, they deserve more then to be torchered on the way to a slaughter house, ripped apart and used for food.

Is this the same forum that was all upset because some one stuffed there mini horse foal? Might I ask the difference in sending that foal to a slaughter house to be used as food or to keep her body in the corner of the living room? I remember every one of you thought it was sick, wrong, nasty and the filly should have been laid in the ground and burried - but you mean to tell me it would have been better for her to be torn apart? Im missing something here. Wheres the difference? I think you all change your minds like underwear and just go with the flow on different things for lack of conflict

Any how, dead horses, yes go ahead and slaughter them if you wish, but why go to a action and buy a perfectly healthy horse who could be used for ridding and change some ones life - why kill it? If any one hasnt noticed America isnt exactly lacking on food, in fact 90% of the americans could stand a little less meat and a diet.

OK and even if it were ok to kill a horse, which there is a great over population some do need to go, your all ok with the fact that some slaughter houses dont KILL the animal before hanging it upsidown and pulling it apart? Might I add that is after a long trip pack together like a sandwich, not fed for days and days, half of them die on the way there.

Pretty said your all in a up roar that some one stuffed there foal but its ok for healthy horses to be torn apart before they are dead all for food that we dont need.

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Oh My, Young One.. That is not at ALL meant to be condesending... IF we could save them all, WHERE in the world would you put them all???? 65-70,000 horses per year, just here in the USA, (we won't count the one's that cross the border)....times by what??? lets's just say 10 years....700,000 WHO wil pay for their care and upkeep?? Medical bills as they get older?? What do YOU do with the carcasses, when they are put donw humanely?? many states, and towns now have laws against the burial of animals in anywhere but landfills, or incineration...do you see what I'm getting at?? It's not just about "save the horses from slaughter"...but what do WE do with all of them?? and who foots the cost?? and what about all the people that HAVE good intentions on saving these animals, but don't know how to care for them?? so they end up starved, abused, the list goes on, and on....we would all like to see a solution to this..but it's not just cut and dried. A slaughter house and a rendering plant are NOT the same thing, A rendering plant can use the same method (captive bolt) but I would dare say that because the horse is in a less stressful situation the captive bolt does it's job the first time....not 3-4 like you see in the slaughter house video's (and to whom it may concern there IS more then one video of this, but the major one was helped to be produced by a Dr. at MSU) problem with some horse owner's is that the rendering plants are far and few between. So that leaves them with slim options to dispose of the horse, if it must be put down. Some of us are fourtunate still to live in areas where we CAN have our horses euthanised at home, and buried in the backyard (I Have 4 in mine

)... but what are the rest of the horse people to do that don't have the option....do you see the larger picture here?? You can check my other posts..I have been trying to come up with options and submit them to the proper people...there is a group with the AAEP (american association equine practitioners) that are trying to come up with more viable ways to end the slaughter/suffering of horses. There are several groups like that..."Canter" is another one worth checking out...

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PS controversial subjects are ALWAYS very heated...get used to it... you have strong opinions, and my guess is, the back bone to say what is on your mind. I'd venture to say that you probably always will...just be prepared for the back lash of opponents, and start thinking before speaking. It will come with maturity, as you get better at this!

 

[manyhorses]

  Well said, and excellent ideas for SOLUTION(S) to the issue.  Clearly, you know of what you speak and have given it much consideration. 
If you have a moment, could you PM your contract verbiage regarding right of first refusal and horses entrusted to potential owners.

Thank you.

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Why thank you! I remember my outrage when I first saw the video of the slaughter, and the many nights like tonight sitting here doing research on it....I will PM you the verbiage on my contracts...just don't sue me if ya get burnt...lol, it was made up from me, and of course learning lessons the hard way...will get it too you tommorrow! It really has come in "handy" and most honest horse people will abide by it, for if they REALLY care for the horse, they do what is in the best interest of it.

Keri C

 

[manyhorses]

Maybe, just maybe.......this thread will have some people thinking twice about what they breed, how MANY they breed and the overall well-being of any animal they put on the ground from here on.  Maybe your next horse/dog/cat will come from a rescue or sanctuary.  Do people really need to have a herd of 300 horses. Or 80?  Why?  Do each get individualized care in order to be a good equine citizen? Do each get a daily once-over? Worming? Vaccinations? Fecal samples? And what about socialization.
You can bash PETA, the Horse Protection Network, savethehorses.org but it doesn't change the FACTS.  This is a problem that humans created and it's up to humans to find a solution that doesn't benefit humans........but the animals.

You don't like the laws.......friggin' change them.  That's what we're trying to do.  If you want to make a difference........stop breeding.  Ya want your kid to experience the miracle of birth?  Make darn sure they see the horror of a death for an animal not as lucky as yours.  How many of you know where all the horses/dogs/cats you bred are?  You know where your kids are.....

You want to stop backyard abuse........TURN THEM IN. 

The buck should stop with each and every one of us.  It's not about animal activism.........it's about animal welfare.

While some of the posters may be young I am sooooooo grateful to them. 

  They are the future.  They are the ones who won't allow happen what we oldies have let happen.

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heck...I know people that DO NOT know where thier kids are let alone thier animals..lol (well, NOT really lol)

 

[manyhorses]

You don't like the laws.......friggin' change them. That's what we're trying to do. If you want to make a difference........stop breeding. Ya want your kid to experience the miracle of birth? Make darn sure they see the horror of a death for an animal not as lucky as yours. How many of you know where all the horses/dogs/cats you bred are? You know where your kids are.....

I agree change the laws but change them to benefit the animals not animal activists.......the animal ID legislation is actually one step in the right direction yet people are having fits because the governement will know where those animals came from and "horrors" might know how many animals you have........

I don't breed anything I wont eat........

My kids help with lambing and they know darn well how meat gets to the table they also know about the need to end suffering in an animal and they have butchered birds and cleaned fish they also appreciate and have respect for the animals in nature and in their care......

I personally have never produced a single litter of puppies or kittens...as a child I did get to witness a litter produced by a neighbor being shot .......yep I know right where my kids are one is watching cartoons eating lunch and the other is off hunting ducks with his dad and his dog

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Good for you with your kids! I once watched my nephews, aged 9,8 and 4. Took them across the street to the local cattle farm, and explained to them that this farmer raised cattle for beef, to be processed into steaks, hamburgers ...etc (trying to explain THE REAL world..) The eldest looked at me and said why don't you just buy the beef at krogers like my mom does?? (ah youth) he just could not wrap his mind around the fact that the meat at krogers, came from the exact type of animal he was looking at...

 

[manyhorses]

No, when i brought up the pasture idea i dont mean "make sure every horse has 2 scoops of feed, a nice little bed and 2 blocks of hay every night and a kiss goodnight".  That is not where i was coming from.  Just pasture them.  As much as im sure you guys think that im a niave teen, i have much more sense then most adults that i know.  I really dont like being descriminated agianst because i am a young person.  Every time i try to post something adult like, i get practically prosicuted because im 17!.
When i described a nice big pasture for horses w/ a pond i ment it to be a nice natural inviroment where they can live there life on pasture, have colts, breed, eat (grass) drink water (pond) and live like the wild mustang's in the west.  I mean there is allot of land out west.  Die of Natural causes and a bullet to the head isnt natural.  I do understand that sometimes, you cant help it.  If a horse is in so much pain that it wishes it was dead, shoot it in the head then.  Dont put it in a dirty trailer where it will get stomped to death and then a blow to head.

I would even settle for horse slaughter if i knew for sure that they were transported in a healthy fassion, fed, calmed down, not hit, beaten ext.  If there ending there life to end there pain, then why cause just more.  I mean it takes alllot of force for a leg to come off ..?

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You do realize that the "wild Horses" are in danger as well...from over population, they round up many of them yearly, hold auctions, and just Recently (although it is now on hold...to be further investigated) President Bush passed a law that stated, the ones that passed through the auction 3 times without sale, or that were 10 years or older were sold to ANY high bidder and that several of them were indeed slaughtered? To house 70,000 horses to "live" off the land would take at least 140,000 acres, (at approx 3,000 an acre is $500,000.00, again times that by 10 years, do not forget to add in inflation, cuz you are going to need more land EVERY year....and let's just say that out of the 70,000 horses 35,000 of them are mares, that become pregnant that's an additional 35,000 horses every year to add to the 70,000.. already coming in from surplus..in two years you would be out of land to support these animals... not to mention you are talking about horses that have never fended for themselves, probably have VERY tender feet, cuz they have been someone's show horse...so now they are lame, can't get to the food for the winter... and they starve to death...range land out west is not suited to, your typical thoroughbred, QH, mini, the wild horses were born that way from a long line of wild horses adapted to range living... and what would you do about the kids that shoot these wild horses for grins n giggles?? (Yes it does happen..sorry) then they leave them to die in pain with broken legs, wounds, etc... I would love nothing more then to see something like you have set forth...we just need to look harder at the realities, and keep tossing out suggestions...

 

[manyhorses]

I beleive the needle would be so much better then getting popped in the head, but i guess thats not up to me.

Okay - let's get graphic. I have been present when many horses have been euthanized... and if you think it is always pretty and the sweet pony just shuts its eyes and goes to sleep - well, that is not always the case. I saw a mare throw herself over backwards as she started to go down - she hit her head on the ground hard - and that caused her to go into violent convulsions... it was a major struggle to get the rest of the drugs into her...

Another old gelding went into seizures... and it took approx. 5 times the normal dose to ease his terror and his pain....

No where did i witness the leg coming off.  It is from an article in a newpaper i found on the internet.

Uh huh. So one regrettable incident (which I am not in any way condoning) - probably as a result of one of those darn cattleliners having a wreck... and NOT "many times where reporters have went in the truck w/ the people who drive the horse trucks and found horse legs, hooves, tails ext laying in about 1 foot of horse manure and urine." as you said earlier. I know it is hard - but you have to lead with your HEAD and not your HEART at times... ((HUG))

And shminifancier... the wording in those bills is... well... there are gaps you could drive a loaded horse trailer through... and the potential for interpretations that could go very wrong.... very wrong indeed...

As far as PETA goes... I question the thought processes involved at times. A group of PETA-ites near here snuck onto a mink farm one night... and released thousands of mink to "free" them. FREE them?? They did not know how to hunt. Those few that managed to grasp the concept annihilated local songbird nests and small animals.... but most of them were shredded by dogs... coyotes... cats... or squashed into a slimy mess on the road that ran past that fur farm. Any who escaped those assorted fates and found somewhere to hide starved to death... only a few hundred were rounded up - and most of them had gone back to their cages....

How nice that they did not want those mink to "suffer"....

I do not like fur coats - never have - but what kind of a ridiculous solution was that???

ETA:

These people on the web know how to find the one or two isolated cases of something terrible happening and show them to you over and over so it hits you in the heart.

Voodoo speaks words of wisdom.... people may mean well - but often the facts get lost in the anxiety and desire to help at any cost. Just as I explained earlier about the photo of the dead chestnut horse - that has been used over and over again to illustrate a number of "abuses"... depending on what subject the person who put that website together was concerned about.

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awww tagalong,

I'm sorry you had bad experience in putting down your horses...I don't know if this will ease your mind or not...but I will share this...I worked at an equine clinic for some time, and saw one mare have an allergic reaction to rompun...she did the same thing, flipped over and smacked her head on the cement, then went into convultions. It was very bad to watch..she did pull through, but as I said not very pretty. I learned a very valuable lesson working there and that is, some veterinarians do not have the expirence needed to put a horse easily on the ground, there is an art to it, as I have seen bad things just putting a horse under general anesthetic...it's much the same thing, just the euthanasia solution is much stronger. When my vet did my horses (same Dr. I worked for) he gave a mild tranq, then half the dose, assisted them going down with ropes, and once they were down gave the rest of the dose.. Not dissin your Dr., just giving you some insider "tips". I had one horse put down by a Dr. I didn't really know (emergency) and it went quite like your mare....that horse was like a son to me...

 

[tagalong]

When my vet did my horses (same Dr. I worked for) he gave a mild tranq, then half the dose, assisted them going down with ropes, and once they were down gave the rest of the dose.. Not dissin your Dr., just giving you some insider "tips". I had one horse put down by a Dr. I didn't really know (emergency) and it went quite like your mare....that horse was like a son to me...

None of the horses whose demise I mentioned were mine

... I just worked with them... and in both cases the vets involved were excellent - and the horses were eased down using the mild tranq - then half the dose etc. Both of the horses involved simply had a very violent reaction to the tranqs - I know the mare had Rompun... I only brought them up by way of pointing out that things do not always come to a peaceful, fairy-tale end... it is always hard to see a friend on their way... even if they do go peacefully...

 

[justaboutgeese]

You can bash PETA, the Horse Protection Network, savethehorses.org but it doesn't change the FACTS. This is a problem that humans created and it's up to humans to find a solution that doesn't benefit humans........but the animals. Quote........................................................................................................... If you allow the fringe animal rights groups to work on solving this problem or encourage them by way of donation or support do not be surprised when you find out your minis, TB, QH or whatever horses you happen to be fond of are there next target.

 

[shminifancier]

California HAS passed a STATE law that makes it Illegal to sell, transport, or purchase a horse from THAT state for the intention of slaughter.

Yes that is true and the wording is done correctly BUT the main thing that should bother Every Horse person is the way the Bill Reads ...

`""(8) the movement, showing, exhibition, or sale of sore horses in intrastate commerce, and the shipping, transporting, moving, delivering, receiving, possessing, purchasing, selling, [SIZE=14pt]OR[/SIZE] donation in intrastate commerce of horses and other equines to be slaughtered""

`""(B) any horse or other equine which the Secretary has probable cause to believe is being shipped, transported, moved, delivered, received, possessed, purchased, sold, or donated in violation of section 5(8).'.""

And anything in front of that OR can and will be used by the Extreme Animal Rights People~! And this would effect each and ever horse owner Large or small...In fact one person said I had better put tinted windows on my Suburban so nobody could see I was Hauling a horse in there... I even had a person look at that wording that was at once in Quarter Horses but also sell franchises and knows legal wording and phrases and is also a carded judge for many breeds...And Yes even that person said You Bet they can use Any Part of that phrase and or words to use against us......That is what most of us are Against We are Against Badly written laws..A bad Law IS Bad Law.