It past time for horse slaughter to end

[Gypsyheart]

The best way I see currently to reduce the inhumane treatment and a huge aid in shutting down bad farms feedlots etc...is to join in the push for the NAIS ....if we could get the nation ID system in full force it would help the USDA and other officials in being able to track down chronic offenders....people who consistently produce sickly neglected stock of all types......if the system is then also carried all the way to pet animals such as dogs and cats it will help eliminate illegal puppymills and catteries.....

How about getting your 9.5 million supporters and having each of them buy 1 horse out of this system? that would take care of all the horses going to slaughter for the next 5-6 years if there are no horses to buy for slaughter then there is no need for slaughter plants now is there

:

Runamuck I understand from my auction buddies that many times killer buyers are given first choice at the at the horses even before an auction starts. They get first go at well trained quarterhorses and great riding horses..! There will always be a strong market for a great riding horse Also did you know that Canadian horses are transported here so that the killers can meet their quotas?This industry is not about unwanted horses. There is a horse farm here in Texas that breeds horses JUST for slaughter. The same man takes hundreds of horses to the plants seach year. There is a man who advertises nationally that he will come and get your horse ...good or bad. he is a killer buyer. These people are the ones that are fighting to spread the unwanted horse myth. If you have a car for sale there will be a waiting period before it is sold,but it will sell !!!It is not unwanted ..it is just for sale. The same may be said for a horse you have for sale. Those horses in the feedlot were NOT unwanted. They were unlucky and in the wrong place at the wrong time. I'll bet most of the owners were not even aware a killer had purchased them. Killers do not have to identify themselves. Thank you for your comments and your thoughts. Ramona

Did you know the numbers you are being given are outright lies? Big loads of hooey.....usda and other agencies track all meat sales and slaughter in this country and the numbers of horses these proponents of stop slaughter keep proclaiming have not been anywhere close to the actual numbers since say the 60's when horsemeat was still available at the meat counter in almost every grocer in america? In fact one month ago there were zero sales of horsemeat for a two week period this included donkeys and mules and the only actual export was for live breeding stock to mexico and to canada...total of maybe 20 horses.............

99% of horses sold to slaughter are CULLS from breeding operations......it takes alot of tries to get that one champion and in this country horses are riding a fine line between pet and food..........you see breeding sheep, cows, pigs, chickens, rabbits, is easy as it is acceptable to eat the culls but horses have gained this "pet" stigma in this country slowly over the last 30 years so suddenly it isn't ok to eat them although other countries still rely on horsemeat as a substantial part of the diet or as a specialty cuisine..........even when I was a kid it was common to see horsemeat in the meat dept or at the butchers ...yep people ate horse......my grandparents lived up the hill above the feedlot/slaughterhouse in pendleton oregon.....never once did I hear all the screaming and carrying on that you claim happens at the slaughterhouse......I also lived in stanwood washington that until about 15 yr's ago had a slaughter facility where horses were slaughtered and again I never found this facility to be the house of horrors you describe.....

Post all the propaganda you want I still prefer to find the facts which keep getting harder and harder to find as the propaganda machine continues to take over......and the facts I have have found show the numbers of equines slaughtered in this country are minimal....

Again I say look to the NAIS as this program will in and of its intentions slowly weed out the slimy animal breeders who do not take responsibility for their animals ..................

I knew a guy who raised thoroughbreds for meat ....finally he was killed by one of his bulls in a pen.....poetic justice if you ask me..............

Runamuk ......agree to disagree.. ? This post of yours was pretty heavy -handed with insults don't you think ? Gypsy

 

[Gypsyheart]

What I see are some opinions that are being supported by misinformation and naive emotions. There are plenty of laws already in existence to prevent the perceived problems now were they enforced. Creating new laws is not going to alter the fate of these animals one way or the other. Personal attacks on forum members is not going to further a cause or create support where little exists. One of the causes I used to support financially no longer receives support from me since they adopted radical ideas. Let them find support from people who voice opinions but have little to contribute. Just my .02 cents worth.

I respectfully dissagree, to me radical is dumping horses at slaughter plants and loose horses at auction.Some people do this again & again because it is convenient.. Are you aware that the abuse and neglect rate DROPPED very significantly when horse slaughter in California became illegal ? Horse theft dropped as much as 34% . Gypsy

 

[mininik]

Sigh! Exactly WHAT is the purpose of hashing this topic out here to the point of personal attacks? It's silly, there is no point and it's not helping anything. Gypsy, you came here with a message--that's great--now leave it at that. Everyone has had their say and it's obvious that you're not educating anyone here, just preaching to the choir. From the sound of it you have some 9.5 million supporters out there to rally for your cause and that would be doing a heck of a lot more for slaughter bound horses than you sitting here arguing with a handful of members of this very insignificant to the real issue Miniature Horse forum.

 

[Gypsyheart]

Sigh! Exactly WHAT is the purpose of hashing this topic out here to the point of personal attacks? It's silly, there is no point and it's not helping anything. Gypsy, you came here with a message--that's great--now leave it at that. Everyone has had their say and it's obvious that you're not educating anyone here, just preaching to the choir. From the sound of it you have some 9.5 million supporters out there to rally for your cause and that would be doing a heck of a lot more for slaughter bound horses than you sitting here arguing with a handful of members of this very insignificant to the real issue Miniature Horse forum.

Envy, this thread has been viewed 1177 times. More than twice that of any other thread on the back porch. Gypsy

 

[mininik]

And? What's your point? My thread on water fasting a few weeks ago got about that many views...

: no wait, it got more! LOL Almost 2000!

 

[tagalong]

So you think that you know more going around ONE AREA with ONE VET about premarin mares than organizations that are trying to do something to stop cruelty???? Wow!

Rude to the max. Geeeez. Listen up. The inspections are set up by the PMU industry - they all work the same way across the board. Each farm MUST pass said inspections - which are done by independent vets who are not affiliated with the industry. They report back to the government agencies. The "AREA" I referred to was about 75-100 miles on the side of a square... minimum. We are talking western Canada here where things are much farther apart than in Ireland.... so YES - I do know more about it than someone sitting at their computer without a clue... I have walked the walk. Some only talk the talk - and much of that talk - is wrong and based on myths.

I have seen the farms. You have not. And yet you know so much more about them... I never saw ANY cruelty of any kind on those ranches... do you not read what others post before you snap off a reply?? THIS is what happens on these threads... those who do not have any first hand experience find fault and point.... and do not care to deal with eye witness accounts that do not fall in line with what they are told is going on.... and do not bother to deal with actual facts and figures. I pointed out earlier that the garbage about 30,000 PMU babies being slaughtered a year was crap.... as there are (at most) only 7,000 mares in the industry at the moment... but 30,000 sounds much more sensational... so ignore the truth and run with the lies...

runamuk - facts and actual numbers do not matter to some... but I appreciate your trying to seperate fact from fiction... and there is a whole lot of fiction in this thread...

 

[Watcheye]

Im in the middle of class and dont have much time to work on this now but I want to keep it up there so I can find it again and do something about it. To say it makes me sick is a rediculous understatement. This is something I cry and lose sleep over.

 

[user 488]

Sigh! Exactly WHAT is the purpose of hashing this topic out here to the point of personal attacks? It's silly, there is no point and it's not helping anything. Gypsy, you came here with a message--that's great--now leave it at that. Everyone has had their say and it's obvious that you're not educating anyone here, just preaching to the choir. From the sound of it you have some 9.5 million supporters out there to rally for your cause and that would be doing a heck of a lot more for slaughter bound horses than you sitting here arguing with a handful of members of this very insignificant to the real issue Miniature Horse forum.

What good advice!

runamuk - facts and actual numbers do not matter to some... but I appreciate your trying to seperate fact from fiction... and there is a whole lot of fiction in this thread...

Fact and fiction never seem to matter! :lol: Some people's fiction is fact to others. So I go back and read Envy's post. This topic has be beat to death and will never change anyones mind. It's right up there with politics and religion.

And whoever is in favor of no slaughter.......I suggest you get off the key board and start rescuing these horses. Sitting around talking about it......well that gun just went off again.

 

[ClickMini]

been out of town this weekend but once again the topic is on my mind. The rescue that I assisted getting Justice and Prince from the feedlot was at the trade fair with a bunch of good horses that were now safe.

For those who say I would never send my horse to slaughter or auction or whatever, or in other words I personally don't believe in slaughtering my own but believe slaughter to be a necessary evil...HAVE YOU EVER HELPED A HORSE IN NEED???

I have taken personal responsiblity and yes I have quite a few on my place (big and small) that were rescues. They are all great horses.

The bottom line is slaughter auction is a convenient place to dump a horse. Much quicker and easier than placing an ad in the nickel paper, showing the horse to prospective buyers, etc. Your horse ends up at the auction on the wrong night and he's off to the feedlot to let the wormers and shots clear his system.

Feedlots aren't necessarily nice places for those who think they are. There is a lot of naivete on both sides of this argument.

I should stay out of these topics though because all it does is cause me to make a mental list of people I don't like.

However ya'll did your job well, I won't be breeding my little expensive and well-bred beauties any time in the near future. I don't want to send any out, no matter how nice/expensive/well-bred they are, into a world where this is considered a nessecary evil. Because you never know when they'll end up at the auction on the wrong night...

Thank you to Marty who sure wrote a beautiful poem for us idealistic souls. (((((HUGS)))))

 

[Relic]

And whoever is in favor of no slaughter.......I suggest you get off the key board and start rescuing these horses. Sitting around talking about it......well that gun just went off again.

Now at last there's something on this thread l agree with.

 

[user 488]

However ya'll did your job well, I won't be breeding my little expensive and well-bred beauties any time in the near future. I don't want to send any out, no matter how nice/expensive/well-bred they are, into a world where this is considered a nessecary evil. Because you never know when they'll end up at the auction on the wrong night...

Well, good for you! I commend your decision and wish more people would follow your plan. Because that is where these problems start. :aktion033:

But it's kind of sad that you would judge a person by one thing they believe in. You never know how many other things you might have in common. Don't shut yourself off to people because of one difference of opinion. Well, ofcourse you can do what you want.......who am I to tell you anything..........but it is food for thought. This is a heated subject and sometimes we just have to sit back and re-group.

Carol

 

[rabbitsfizz]

Yes, of course I have helped- I used to have an arrangement with the local "Meat Man" and many times have come down to find he had dropped something off in the barn I was not expecting. Sometimes a very nice animal, sometimes a HUGE headache!! A Fjord mare so thin I could not dare turn her out for fear I get reported, plus her two month old colt.

Took a long time and a lot of money to get them right.

Most of the ponies I trained and sold on in the late sixties came from the knacker, so PLEASE do not assume we have not done our bit or even that we are not still doing it.

I have also held my horses whilst the knacker dispatched them- I have never allowed anyone else to hold them and I have never allowed them to go alive, but I have had them pout down and I will continue to support slaughter as a means of handling the problem that we, as horse owners and breeders, have all allowed to get out of hand.

As I KEEP asking, as others KEEP asking...what other solution is there??

And I would like to know, please- are you a member of Peta???????

 

[ClickMini]

Jane, WHY would it matter if I were a member of PETA? Am I doing the right thing? That is what is important.

The options for slaughter in Europe are very different than they are here.

That being said, I believe that euthanasia is the alternative for a horse that is too ill or unmanageable to save. What you were talking about, is a form of euthanasia, in my opinion. Your animal was dispatched in a controlled situation where you were personally involved. YOU TOOK PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY. You didn't dump your animal off for who knows what fate. The options that you had or have are different than what we have here.

The judgements I make about people is based on tone. Telling someone that cares and is trying to do the right thing that the gun just went off again ISN'T VERY NICE. :nono: That is just one example.

 

[tagalong]

Feedlots aren't necessarily nice places for those who think they are. There is a lot of naivete on both sides of this argument.

And a lot of foolish labelling as well....

Where did anyone ever say feedlots were "nice places"?? The one I visited - FREQUENTLY - which of course no one else here ever did - and thus have no clue about it (not that that stops anyone in this thread

: ) ... was "nice". As "nice" as such a facility could be. Horses sorted according to size, age, mare with foals etc. Excellent hay. Clean water. Safe fencing. People encouraged to "shop"... and we did just that - many times.

PETA goes off the deep end about such things. They are more about PR than the actual cases. The more sensational the approach can be - the better... and they are infamous for perceiving some myths as fact. They would also have you not ride - or drive. All horsies should run free in the wild, happy and healthy, with daisies braided in their manes - which was pretty much what an indignant PETA lady once told me...

 

[ClickMini]

The one I visited - FREQUENTLY - which of course no one else here ever did - and thus have no clue about it (not that that stops anyone in this thread )

That's where you're making assumptions and you are wrong.

 

[user 488]

Well, Amy, telling me I don't care because I have my own opinion is NOT VERY NICE either! :nono: But I am not going to judge you on this. That is my point. I am sure you are a very nice person. As I am.

Amy, trust me.....I care. I am just not going to sit here every time time this thread come up and hash it all up........another point I was trying to make. It's pointless. But if you want to judge me by my TONE......which you can't hear unless you have some superpower........well go right ahead. It's just a lot of BLA, BLA, BLA. And I even agreed with you and commended you on your decision. And you pick the one negative thing to YOU and judge ME from that! LOL.....too sad.

:

Well, I took such a nice break from painting.........sitting down and enjoying all this fine company!

Back to work.

 

[nootka]

Carol said something very eloquent, here:

"But it's kind of sad that you would judge a person by one thing they believe in. You never know how many other things you might have in common. Don't shut yourself off to people because of one difference of opinion. "

This happens over and over on this board, and everywhere, matter of fact.

I have a lot of friends/acquaintances/familly that if I chose to shut off from them because we don't agree on certain things (that have nothing really to do with our relationships), I would be a lonely person, indeed.

The sad fact about slaughter is that it is a byproduct of humans' desires to surround themselves with loving, beautiful animals which are possessions to them. Another sad fact about it is that many humans would like to believe it does not exist (slaughter) because of anything they did, or didn't do (spay and neuter, etc.).

I don't know if the answer exists with responsible people as in yeah, we could all stop breeding our nice animals which are worthy of improving the breed and have something to contribute, and yet we would sit back and watch those that don't really care one way or the other sit back and enjoy a surge in sales.

I wish slaughter was unnecessary, however, if it does have to exist, I wish it could be humane and without trauma. I know I would far rather have a vet to my place for euthanasia than send away one of my little beloveds on a trip that I didn't even know the outcome, let alone the dangers of the trip itself. I can't say that my horses would never end up there, beyond my control, but I do try to stay in touch with buyers and make sure they know I will either be active in helping to resell a purchase they made from me, or even take them back myself. I know it's not a perfect answer but it works for me (i.e. helps me sleep at night).

I wish I could offer more and I do hope to someday be able to rescue one or two nice horses. It's just not possible right now.

Liz M.

 

[rabbitsfizz]

Amy, I was not asking you if you were a member of Peta I was asking Gypsy- we know nothing about her, there is NO information in her profile at all, she comes on here and starts ranting on about stopping the slaughter- it sounded so like a Peta activist I just wondered- and I STILL have received no answer!!!

 

[mininik]

PETA member or not, who really cares? Gypsy is either going to go do something to stop slaughter or she's going to keep trolling on here, doing nothing.

 

[Theresa Messick]

Let me start by saying that I have been to a slaughter plant as an invited guest. I wasn't trying to do espionage or anything like that. My friend's father worked at one and he extended the invitation. I had no secret agenda. I grew up in the business, my parents raised horses, I showed, trained, gave lessons, apprenticed with some of the best trainers in my particular breed and always felt like I had a good handle on the industry. I now have children of my own and while we aren't as involved as I was growing up, we still have horses. Having said that, I must say that it is difficult for me to believe that anyone is a true horseman if they allow the slaughter to continue. I've heard and read all the stuff that's been quoted from the Bible and people comparing equine slaughter to human slaughter or dog slaughter, but you guys are missing the point. It is inhumane, what those videos show you isn't half as bad as seeing it live and in person. I owe my education to horses, I attended college on rodeo scholarships, and quite frankly I am eager to give back. My daddy always told me "they take care of you, you take care of them" and that is what I do. I've taken back horses I've sold many times and had to re sell them because someone's situation changed. I've bought horses from auctions and rehabbed them and gotten them to good homes. I work a second job to help pay for the vet bills and feed bills and whatever else comes along. I feel like I owe them that much. I feel sorry for those of you who don't.