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Matt you are correct for anyone else to decide who is sinful and going to H E L L makes no sense to me but no matter I have been told many a time I am going to H E L L right here on this very forum. Due to the type of parent I am and the type of dogs I owned and who knows what else
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(and I am straight lol) but no worries I have my handbasket decorated and ready to go
You're not going to heck because lets face it...anyone with half a brain cell truely knows that there's no such thing. I mean truely...1000 years ago I can see uneducated people buying into that c**P but in this day and age...when every single major event of the bible has been proven to be wrong,,,'bout time people crawled out from under their "fear" and opened their eyes. The world is an AWESOME place. This is it..THIS is all there is - so take care of it, take care of everyone (EVERYONE) in it because when you're gone...you're gone.

and why would anyone raise their kids "gods way" . He did such a tick poor job of parenting he had to drown all of his kids LOL.
 
miniwhinny said:
You're not going to heck because lets face it...anyone with half a brain cell truely knows that there's no such thing. I mean truely...1000 years ago I can see uneducated people buying into that c**P but in this day and age...when every single major event of the bible has been proven to be wrong,,,'bout time people crawled out from under their "fear" and opened their eyes. The world is an AWESOME place. This is it..THIS is all there is - so take care of it, take care of everyone (EVERYONE) in it because when you're gone...you're gone.
and why would anyone raise their kids "gods way" . He did such a tick poor job of parenting he had to drown all of his kids LOL.
Miniwhinny --

While I agree that neither Matt nor Lisa are H E L L bound, I would venture to say that I've got more than half a brain. I believe there is more to us than just this particular physical existence. If you choose to feel that people who believe in a higher power have only half a brain, that's up to you. I feel sorry for the fact that you don't know that our souls go on, and that you want to bait those who are peaceful with their own beliefs.

Jill
 
Yeah, a bit harsh Miniwhinny
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The fact is none of us knows what (if anything) comes after this life; we'll find out when we leave this world. I have my beliefs and strong suspicions, but to belittle anyone's beliefs is, well, disrespectful.
 
You don't have to be a christian to be religious. I happen to be buddhist so I don't believe in heaven or heck or any of the hatred I feel is in the bible....women aren't allowed to talk in church...or teach male children...homosexuality is evil...people who work on sundays should be stoned to death...it's okay to own slaves...kill unruley children- the list goes on and on and on. I believe that everyone has the right to live their lives in peace and happiness and just won't support a religion who's one book prescripes living this way. 99% of the people I know who really really dislike homosexuals dislike them because their holy book tells them to. Sad...they're people just like everyone else. I'm straight but I'd welcome any gay person as a friend or relative just the same way I'd welcome someone short, tall, black, white, yellow, red, fat, thin, able bodied, disabled etc. People are people.
 
You don't have to be a christian to be religious. I happen to be buddhist so I don't believe in heaven or heck or any of the hatred I feel is in the bible....women aren't allowed to talk in church...or teach male children...homosexuality is evil...people who work on sundays should be stoned to death...it's okay to own slaves...kill unruley children- the list goes on and on and on. I believe that everyone has the right to live their lives in peace and happiness and just won't support a religion who's one book prescripes living this way. 99% of the people I know who really really dislike homosexuals dislike them because their holy book tells them to. Sad...they're people just like everyone else. I'm straight but I'd welcome any gay person as a friend or relative just the same way I'd welcome someone short, tall, black, white, yellow, red, fat, thin, able bodied, disabled etc. People are people.
It's actually hard for me to even understand or make much sense of what you have just said, and what you said prior was marginally easier for me to follow. There must be more to what you are trying to tell us than what you have posted.

I never knew women couldn't speak in church or shouldn't teach boys. The last place you'll find me is actually in a church, but I have to say I don't think many of my church going friends have wanted to stone anyone because they worked on Sunday and none of them own slaves. I'm fairly sure none of them have killed unruly children, either.

To me, it sounds like you don't like religious hypocrites who use what they feel the read in(to) the bible to justify their own hateful feelings. I don't like that type of person, either. However, most of the Christians I know are not at all those types of people.
 
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I never knew women couldn't speak in church or shouldn't teach boys. The last place you'll find me is actually in a church, but I have to say I don't think many of my church going friends have wanted to stone anyone because they worked on Sunday and none of them own slaves. I'm fairly sure none of them have killed unruly children, either.
To me, it sounds like you don't like religious hypocrites who use what they feel the read in(to) the bible to justify their own hateful feelings. I don't like that type of person, either. However, most of the Christians I know are not at all those types of people.
re: women..it's in there kiddo...not hard to find.

Yes Jill...you re exactly right on how I feel about hypocrites. If you're going to have faith and follow something you can't pick and choose what parts you want to believe in. Don't stone your kids...but do think gay is a sin ?

I have dozens of Christian friend and I respect their faith BUT ...look at this...

I was born on December 25th

A star in the East stopped over the place where I was born.

The star was followed by Three Kings (solar deities).

Three shepherds witnessed my birth.

My mother was a virgin.

An angel told her she would bear the son of god.

My mothers name was Meri-Isis, my fathers name was Josept

I was a child teacher at age 12.

Nothing much was written about me until I turned 30.

When I was 30 I was baptized.

My baptizer was beheaded.

I had 12 disciples.

I walked on water, raised Elazarus from the dead, calmed the seas, healed the sick, performed miracles.

I was known as the "fisher of men, the alpha and the omega, the son of god, the light of the world, the one true god"

I was crucified between two thieves

Burried in a tomb

After three days I rose from the dead to join my father in heaven.

Women witnessed my resurrection.

I will return to fight for goodness over darkness one last time at which time all of the souls will rise and join me at my fathers side in heaven and have eternal life.

Now I've asked my friends about this and they all say..thats Jesus...well yes it is but THIS was written and very well documented thousands of years BEFORE it was used for the life of Jesus. THIS is the life of HORUS the Egyptian Sun god. Word for word, event for event the same.

Most people go to church and are only taught what the church wants to teach them. Not ONE , not one of my Christian friends have looked beyond what they are taught and actually researched into their faith. If you do this...and then still want to follow the dictrines I say go for it. But go forward with eyes open.

I find it hard when people pick and choose what they want to take from the bible to suit themselves - like you said very correctly Jill---no one is killing people who work on Sundays but they are happy to stop a gay person getting their rights like the rest of us.

and P.S. how many people have really calculated how long it would take a South American Three Toed Tree Sloth to get from South AMerican to Noah's arc in the middle east...it would take , based on how fast a tree sloth moves...84 years providing they NEVER stopped to eat or sleep and at least 42 of those years would be spent swimming across the Atlantic (without food or sleep) It just couldn't happen.
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Miniwhinny, I don't think you and I understand each other very well. But to be clear, I'm not going to join you in belittling anyone else's religion even if it's not my own. It doesn't make me feel more right to try and make others look more wrong when it comes to spirituality. I am comfortable with my beliefs and my God -- and I am also comfortable in letting people be themselves, be they Christian, Jewish, Buddhist, black, white, gay, etc., etc., etc.... (and in any kind of combination so long as they don't harm others).

When it comes to Christianity and the Bible, I personally am not picking and choosing any parts to believe or not believe. It's not really a part of my spirituality nor my upbringing. However, I'm not about to make fun of those who hold it dear based on the fact that a fraction of those who say they are Christian use parts of the bible to find justification for the hate they unfortunately feel.

PS at 40, I don't feel you probably should be calling me "kiddo". On the other hand, maybe it's an omen that I'll get carded at Outback this weekend -- I always tip bigger when that happens
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PS at 40, I don't feel you probably should be calling me "kiddo". On the other hand, maybe it's an omen that I'll get carded at Outback this weekend -- I always tip bigger when that happens
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'Kiddo" is an expression used by Brits and Ozzie and doesn't refer to one's age but a more familiar term than calling someone by name or "mr" or "mrs" etc.

I have no problem with peoples faith and wouldn't never put someones faith down. In my house we have an athiest, and nontheist a catholic and a very devout christian and we all support each other. My 15 year old son - the christian - goes to a very expensive private christian school which I enchourage because it supports his faith. I just feel - as Bubba himself once said - do not believe anything, not matter what it is or who said it, even if I said it, unless you believe in your heart that it is right (that's not word for word - but the jist) Like I said - but just have other things to do now today than keep repeating myself - I have found very few(okay..."no") people who follow certain religious doctrines who have actually used their given gray matter to research any deeper into that faith than what they are told or led to believe by others. If you believe homosexuality is a sin based on the christian bible...fair enough...but then surely you should be following the rest of the rules too. Otherwise you're really not following your doctrines. I have a mormon friend who believes black people are evil...I can't stand that either
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Because I don't believe black people descended from the "evil son" I believe skin color has to do with the amount of melanin in the skin.
 
I think someone's been watching Religulous!

Miniwhinny, you've kind of gone off on a tangent. This thread is about gay marriage, not religion. If you want to start one about religion please do so, because I don't think this thread's the right place for it.
 
I think someone's been watching Religulous!
Never seen it. Just have an inquiring mind and try to learn about many things
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As for religion..fair enough..it's just hard to seperate that fact that most opposed to gay marriage are opposed not from the humanity/legal/whatever side but from religious opinions.
 
That is true, but please remember two things:

1. Hate will not conquer hate.

2. They aren't all like that.

I attended a counter-rally of the "Still Standing in the Middle for Marriage" meet on Sunday. It was led by a group called California Faith for Equality.

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This is Rabbi Denise Eger, leading the group in prayer.

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And a big shot of our little group.

I'm agnostic myself, but the people who gathered together on Sunday to stand across from 'the opposition' and show support for equality ran the gamut. I stood as an agnostic with Rabbi Denise on one side of me, holding hands with an atheist I've never met before (and Christians and Jews and a sweet guy who's father was a Southern Baptist minister), and we all stood together and prayed and supported each other and held signs and blew bubbles and sang songs. It was a beautiful day.
 
I very much agree that this isn't the place to religion bashing.

EVERYONE has a right to their own view. If you expect Christians, and everyone else, to respect your opinion and beliefs, then you need to respect theirs.

I do not agree with a lot of views of various faiths, but I still respect those people and their right to freedom of religion.

Just because we don't always agree with everyone else, doesn't mean they don't have a right to those beliefs.
 
Once more (and last time lol ) I have total respect for peoples religions otherwise I wouldn't be paying for my christian son to go to christian school and wouldn't be in total support of his faith. Every single one of my friends are people of faith...Christians and Mormons and I respect them all.

One of my very best friends, a very faithful Mormon told me that she would disown her son and throw him out of the house if he ever told her he was gay. I asked her "why" and she said because the bible said homosexuality is a sin - but all the other "rules" are ingored...I dunno - just call it frustration.

But I thought we weren't talking about religion here anymore
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Well, I got lazy and took a nap (but woke up at 3am). When I got up, there was Dick Cheney on the news speaking about his support of gay marriage and reminding me to check in on this thread
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:BigGrin
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I could be wrong as I personally don't gravitate to any organized religion, but I think there are more Christians who have a live and let live philosophy vs. those that want to thump the bible and bash gays
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:yes
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Right now, I really do not know "a lot" of gay people but I know enough of them to know that's just how they are, just like straight is just how I am. I also am old enough to know that love is love and people who find it together are lucky
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:)
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Well, I got lazy and took a nap (but woke up at 3am). When I got up, there was Dick Cheney on the news speaking about his support of gay marriage and reminding me to check in on this thread
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:BigGrin
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I could be wrong as I personally don't gravitate to any organized religion, but I think there are more Christians who have a live and let live philosophy vs. those that want to thump the bible and bash gays
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:yes
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Right now, I really do not know "a lot" of gay people but I know enough of them to know that's just how they are, just like straight is just how I am. I also am old enough to know that love is love and people who find it together are lucky
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:)
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Keeping religion out of the equation...and talking about BASIC rights...would you deny me these rights (these are just a few)? WHY?

Right to make health care decision for partner

Right to visit partner in hospital

Right to sue for wrongful death

Right to consent or refuse autopsy of partner's body

Right to be buried in cemetery plot with partner

Right to make funeral arrangements for partner

Right to inherit deceased partner's estate

Right to visit in long-term care facility

Automatic "authorized driver" on partner's car rental

Right to coverage on partner's insurance plan

Protection of home in the case of partner's bankruptcy

Private conversations are protected in court

Right to access partner's death certificate

Right to personal effects from deceased partner's body
 
Right to make health care decision for partner Right to visit partner in hospital

Right to sue for wrongful death

Right to consent or refuse autopsy of partner's body

Right to be buried in cemetery plot with partner

Right to make funeral arrangements for partner

Right to inherit deceased partner's estate

Right to visit in long-term care facility

Automatic "authorized driver" on partner's car rental

Right to coverage on partner's insurance plan

Protection of home in the case of partner's bankruptcy

Private conversations are protected in court

Right to access partner's death certificate

Right to personal effects from deceased partner's body
I wouldn't. I'm straight and as far as I know I don't know any homosexuals (yup...small redneck town we retired to!) BUT I would never deny any human being the SAME basic rights that others get...that's just wrong, period. To me it's as backwards and WRONG as making someone who has different colored skin use a different bathroom or ride a different bus.
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miniwhinny

TripleDstables...
THANK DOG !!!!!!!!!!! At last a thinking human YAHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOoooo BRAVO for EVERYTHING you just said

"what another human brave enough to admit that you really DON'T hear voices in your head other than your own mind thinking"
lol. Thank you miniwhinny.
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I also see that a lot of religious people are against gay marriage, and I guess thats why I went off a little. Even at 16, I have a good sense of... what makes sense.
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Having a problem with something that doesn't effect me... well that just doesn't make sense... who am I to tell them it isn't right? Go for it. Whatever makes you happy.
 

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