PLEASE share opinions

[Jill]

I am working on getting my nerves in a knot because it won't be too long now really before some of my Erica boys will be on their way "home". I know Erica will do everything right because she is pretty much perfect I do think, but it is so scary now talking to haulers, who I do not know at all, and thinking of putting some of these precious and irreplacable animals in their hands

 

[capall beag]

WHAT A MESS INDEED!

Now I have said it already but these are nice people on both side but just VERY different opinions on how things should be done. The hauler is standing firm that he messed up by not calling in advance and never being specific about a pick up date BUT when he arrived and there was someone available to load the horses that they should have been loaded. He said He takes the risk if he picks them up without all paperwork in order and that it could have been faxed to him while on the road. HE said this SHOULD not be a deal breaker and he said This detail of getting paperwork in order should not be left til the last minute?

The seller feels that he goofed and therefore she was not willing to let him take the horses. However, once I heard, I pleaded with the hauler to go back and get them as I could not afford to loose the money I ahd prepaid for the transport. He said he ahd the contract with me and they were now legally mine as I had paid for them in full. He turned back and returned to get them as per my request BUT the seller said NO!! She said I will just bring them to you if I have to. But it is not like it is down the road it was over 800 miles!!!!!!

However, I think at one point the transporter said he would refund my money to the seller because he 'came early'???

Anyway it seems after everyone had time to think they changed their minds and I was left with no horses, but a prepaid transport bill and prepaid for horses!!!!!

I am sick to my stomach about it!!!!

I have made endless calls and emails since reading your replies as I feel more confident about "What should have been done!"

I am hoping for a fair and reasonable outcome for all involved!!

THANKS FOR YOUR INPUT, it was VERY helpful!!

It is hard to know what to expect when you are in a situation for the first time!!!!!

Lesson learned!

DISCUSS EVERYTHING BEFORE YOU SIGN THE DOTTED LINE and then get everything in writing!!!!!!

 

[wdancer777]

In my opinion the seller was way out of line, if they are paid in full, they are YOUR horses, if you decide to have them picked up by the hauler it's your right, they are YOURS!

 

[Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis]

I have been thinking about this one all day i cant even imagine how frustrated you must be.- bottom line you paid for them they were your horses to have the hauler pick up or not pick up or come early or come late you paid for them in full and unless the contract or bill of sale clearly stated that seller had the right to not put the horse on any transport she deemed unsafe, or unreliable of whatever... it wasnt her right to do so PERIOD

The hauler went back and tried to let the seller make right wasting his tme and admitting his wrong... believe me not all haulers would have gone back a 2nd time - no matter if they were 20 miles away or 50 miles away or 2 miles away. I will say that I have faxed paperwork to a hauler while they were on the road due to a quick sale and the buyers transport being here earlier then planned.

 

[kaykay]

something just doesnt add up here and i think its something with the seller. I doubt the health papers and coggins were done at all. When my vet comes the coggins is mailed straight to my house and the health paper is left with me the same day he does it. This just doesnt make sense!! And frankly a reputable shipper will NEVER take horses without health papers. I mean really that is almost scarey thinking he would pick them up without health papers. What if he was picking up other horses and put them at danger of being exsposed to something??

I think your best bet is to ask for an IMMEDIATE refund from the seller and ask the hauler to give you a credit for a future haul. Theres a reason why she wouldnt let the horses load and it wasnt because they were dirty. I would really question what is wrong with these horses.

It may be a blessing in disguise that they didnt load. I feel so dang bad for you!!!

Kay

 

[MInx]

What an unfortunate incident! And it must have taken ALL the joy out of the excitement of buying and looking forward to geting these horses!

We drove 750 miles to pick ours up, and it was hard for me in my state, but seriously have thought of having horse hauled if we add any more..now I'm not so sure..

Good luck, Maxine

 

[capall beag]

The icing on the cake!!!!!!!!!

Now the seller cannot afford to pay out to refund me my money and to pay partial payment to hauler to settle this once and for all.

Now, I will be getting the horses and I think she will have to pay almost full price again to have to get them shipped!

Nobody is winning here, really!

What a mess!

I, too, like many have suggested have wondered Why the seller refused to send them.

I had concluded it was not meant to be BUT alas! I guess it is!!!!!

I will update when this saga is finally concluded!!!!!!!

ADVICE Just get it in writing and cover ALL the bases!!!!!!!!!

Thanks for ALL the feedback this has been REALLY helpful!!

Wonderful resource this forum

THANK YOU!!!!!

 

[Amy]

WE always make 2 trips-- one to inspect the horse & another to pick them up when the paper work & health papers are ready. We have only ever bought 2 horses sight unseen -- one from FWF and the other from Lowell Boone-- not too much chance of going wrong there-- both agreed even though the paper work was done-- if we did NOT like the horse, we didn't have to take them

Needless to say -- there was NOTHING wrong with either horse.

 

[Robin1]

There is something seriously not right with this breeder!!! I can't believe that someone would refuse to send a horse because it was dirty and needed a trim.

I like for my horses to leave with a fresh clip and bath but life happens and if the hauler gets here early and the new owner wants them to go "as is" they will be loaded. The new owner will get my apologies for them not being freshly bathed but they will get their horses.

I think there is more to this story.

Robin

 

[yankee_minis]

Holy COW!!! Fiona, you have bad luck getting horses to your place!!

Not that this is always the first choice, but I would seriously consider filing a small claims court case. It is the seller's fault, not the transporter's.

The seller owes you the lost shipping fee. However, if the transporter would give you a credit, that would be awesome. For you (not necessarily for him).

I am very suspicious of the seller. I hope the seller follows through. Otherwise you have an excellent case for court, based on what you've said here.

A letter from a lawyer would certainly help too. The first visit to a lawyer is free...

If someone would buy a horse from me, I would deliver it and pick up yours... he he he Right now, for 800 miles it would cost me more than I would be comfortable charging you! (Like you need more losses at this point!)

What state are the horses located in?

 

[lilhorseladie]

Grrrr...I share part of your grief...hauler left Georgia on Wednesday....waiting for him to pick up, haven't heard from either him, or the buyer since then...Change of minds???? So... sit around and wait, and wait some more. Just a phone call people....

 

[minimule]

Ouch! I certainly hope all this gets straightened out.

I'm with Dazzler. I always pick up any horse I buy, no matter how far away they are. I am also willing to deliver a horse I sell if needed. I can usually deliver cheaper than a hauler.

 

[Laura]

The hauler was sorry but said when hauling horses it is very hard to stay on schedule! The seller had the coggins and the health records were at the vet BUT the hauler said he would take them w/o the helath papers, he said the risk would fall on him and he was willing to take the risk in order to follow threw with getting the horses to me as promised.

The seller claimed the horses were "dirty and needed a trim", the hauler said this was NOT a reason to refuse to let them ship! I was called and said I just wanted him to take the horses "as is" because I could NOT afford to loose the money but the seller refused. She had said she would pay the difference but I think she feels it is the haulers fault and he blames her for a complete wasted trip and a lose of income. I can see both sides and neither one is willing to give BUT I am totally stuck in the middle. Both parties are nice people just cannot see eye to eye on this and I am the one with no horse and a hauling bill!!!!!!!!!!

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Dirty and needing a trim would NOT stop me from shipping horses if the hauler could NOT wait the few minutes it would take to do it. However, I would NEVER release horses to a hauler that said he would haul them without health papers!!! All of my contracts state VERY clearly that I have the right to refuse to release horses to unsuitable transport. THAT answer from him would put him WAY into the category of unsuitable!!!

 

[capall beag]

You know Laura, Thanks for your input, this thread has been fascinating to me.

I wrote the thread to vent but I see the responses are all very different. The seller felt how you do, but it was not in a contract. But many responses have completely sided with the hauler!

I feel stuck in the middle, quite honestly, would I prefer horses with all papers in order, clean and trimmed, definately YES but I am not willing or able to forfeit a large haul bill for this! The hauler said he does not like to travel without papers BUT he has other horses to deliver and he can not wait around for papers, he said they could be faxed to him on the road.

It is a complicated situaton, I have a contract with the seller and one with the hauler but they have no contract. However, I feel that once I requested the hauler to turn around to pick up the horses the seller should have backed down. When you sell a horse it is no longer yours, even though it is still on your property. As the owner I asked the hauler to go back and get them when the seller refused to let them go I think she became responsible for any additional charges that will be incurred if the hauler is to return to pick them up!!

If nothing else perhaps people will learn a good lesson from this thread because it is a very messy situation for all involved!

 

[lyn_j]

[SIZE=14pt]Fiona check your PMs[/SIZE]

Lyn

 

[Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis]

I PERSONALLY never put that much stock in health papers anway - they sure dont mean the horse is in any way healthy. Now if the papers hadnt been done or blood now drawn that is a different story but if the papers were still at the vets casue seller didnt go get them... it isnt uncommon for them to be faxed on the road

either way bottomline is you got the raw end of the deal and for that I am sorry

 

[minisaremighty]

However, I feel that once I requested the hauler to turn around to pick up the horses the seller should have backed down. When you sell a horse it is no longer yours, even though it is still on your property. As the owner I asked the hauler to go back and get them when the seller refused to let them go I think she became responsible for any additional charges that will be incurred if the hauler is to return to pick them up!!

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That right there says it all. I am NOT a fan of shipping (there is ONLY one shipper I would use and they know who they are

). However, in this case, I really don't feel the shipper was much at fault. True he was early. Hmmm, that seems much better than days late or worse yet, never showing up as the many horror stories we've seen posted here. As far as the papers go, it was stated that they were at the vets and YES they could have been faxed on the road to save time. It wasn't as if he was going to haul with NO papers at all, he was going to get them on the road.

That seller was just that when the shippers arrived. They were no longer the owner, they were just the seller and when the OWNER sent the shipper back AND the shipper was kind enough to do it (he didn't have to, and MANY shippers we've heard about would NOT) and they refused the horses to go with an excuse like they were dirty and not clipped was TOTALLY wrong.

If those horses do not end up in your possession, I think you have a legal case against this seller. Seems to me they had NO legal right to refuse the horses to leave with the shipper.

Good luck and please do keep us updated.