Rising Costs

[Marsha Cassada]

Do the Amish use anesthetics?

I never heard of such a stupid mentality not to geld because something is so little. I guess that vet does not do teacup poodles???

I am thinking our vets may keep their prices low because it is in the best interest of the industry to castrate.

If one is going to have a miniature for a pet, what in the world would he want to keep a stallion for?

 

[targetsmom]

My vet actually gave me that same reason for not gelding Clyde last fall as a weanling - that his testicles were "too small". I had never heard that before and couldn't understand the logic behind it, as long as both testicles were "normal" size and descended.

 

[FurstPlaceMiniatures]

I am so thankful for my vet now. For a surgery or procedure like that its based on his time. Flat rate of $295 an hour. No call charge, no hidden fees, no drug fees, and 250 if its cash.

 

[chandab]

Guess those vets that won't geld something that small wouldn't have been willing to geld the 7 year old stallion that I had gelded two summers ago; he was infertile, dropped and his were tiny, like the size of almonds on a 36" stallion and in addition to tiny ones he also had some fatty tissue in that area (the vet pre-surgery was worried it might be a loop of intestine or something sticking through and was ready for suturing the ring smaller if needed). [i did have him done at the clinic, as previously he had been very sensitive to sedatives and I wanted him close to more help if needed; turns out he was just fine with the sedatives they used for the gelding procedure. His procedure at the clinic was about $125, but I did drive 150 miles to go to that vet, so did have some added fuel expense for the day.]

For the record, my new stallion has good sized ones, and his three yearling sons have bigger ones already than the stallion mentioned above (they are slated for gelding this fall, just need to wait for bug-free time and check with the vet on prices, last time I checked it was around $150, but didn't ask about multiple horse discount, won't hurt to ask).

The thought just dawned on me... Wouldn't it get some strange looks to show up at a free (or low cost) spay/neuter clinic with a miniature and ask for a neutering? For some reason I can just picture the looks.

 

[wildoak]

Again, I am so grateful for my vet and the number of good equine vets here. A routine gelding on the farm is in the $125 range, plus the call fee. I had a long yearling done recently that only had one testicle dropped, it was done surgically at the clinic and will be more like $600 when I get the bill but that I expect. I think our vet keeps it as real as possible to encourage gelding.

Jan

 

[wingnut]

Because I'm on the verge of buying a colt myself, I spoke with my vet on Friday about all things gelding. It will cost me between $300 & 400 to geld a mini. This covers the farm call, anesthesia, the surgery, post surgical antibiotics, and something else I can't remember. There were or two things that I don't have to do but it makes good sense to do (i.e., antibiotics). I plan to have OTC stomach soothing preparation of some stripe as well as the cleanest straw I can find for his stall during recovery.

This doesn't help anyone who doesn't live where they can use my vet, I know. I also realized that this cost would be part-and-parcel of the costs of bringing home a boy, so I prepared for that. I know it's not as easy as when you're a seller who is trying to do right by your "kids" and have them gelded before they're put up for sale. Explaining that your boy is better of gelded and they're better off having it already done for them, thereby making the price a little higher, is not always a message that is well rec'd unfortunately.

 

[Magic Marker Minis]

I had two stallions gelded in OK before we moved to Missouri. It cost $125. The younger stallion (3 years) had to be given three shots to put him out/down... We thought it'd take forever for him to get back up, but he popped up right afterwards... She was a good vet...

I have been doing all my own colic care recently using Aleve (Naproxen) and aspirin for pain, tubing mineral oil (being very careful not to get it down the windpipe) and soaked beet pulp and generic psylium, and haven't lost one this year. We've had 8 or 9 colic episodes... We lost four pregnant mares last year to the so-called experts... The vets out here are worthless and take four hours to respond. By that time, it's too late.

otoh, I had a vet in Colorado that was worth her weight in gold! (and she wasn't a small woman <g>!)

After watching vets geld horses and a farrier castrate a goat (with a knife) if I had access to anesthetics, I'd do it myself... It's not difficult. Once the animal is sedated, you clean the area with antiseptic, you slice open the ball sac, pull the testes out, abraid the cord, and pull... The testes snap right off, the cord snaps back and seals itself off and that's it... Afterwards, you just make sure the area is cleaned off periodically. If there is pain, there is aspirin or Aleve...

I switched to banding the bucklings (goats) now and it's a piece of cake... There is a little bit of discomfort initially, like any other procedure. But in a few minutes the buckling is up and running around like a banshee...

I also disbud goatlings and I've seen the same thing... After about 5-10 minutes the baby goat has forgotten all about its head and is up and running around... I disbud at 3-5 days for the boys and a few days longer for the girls.

I wonder why horses have never been banded??? They band cattle, too. You can be sure that 50 - 75 years ago, vets weren't called out for castrating horses... The farmer/rancher did it themselves and a crap load of horses still survived... I wouldn't do it, however, without some kind of anesthetic and pain reliever afterwards...

Btw, Aleve (aka Naproxen) was originally prescribed for horses... It was too expensive, so it was approved for human use and you could only get it with a prescription... Obviously, you can now get it OTC... It's in the same NSAID group as Banamine.

As for aspirin, studies have been done on wild horses and they have noted that wild mares that have given birth will seek out and chew on willows for the discomfort.... (Willow bark contains acetylsalicylic acid, which is where aspirin originally came from... I guess it's cheaper to re-create it in the lab.)

I'm moving closer and closer to more natural healthcare and natural care in general.

And, I sure hope I can find a good vet out in Missouri when we move... We had a good one in the Bruner area. He was a mobile vet located on the west side of Ozark.... So, if we find a farm in that area, we call always go back to him...

Kari

 

[Magic Marker Minis]

How about statistics... It looks like, based on where you located, the vet costs are cheaper in 'horse or farm country.' Texas, ND, Montana, OK, CO...

I didn't check gelding costs in MO because we only contacted the vet we used out there to put down a Mustang mare that broke her leg just before we moved... That cost less than $200 for the euthanasia and another $200 to have her buried on the farm.

We later asked the same vet to do our Coggins and health inspection just before we moved because he was so reasonable... It cost $700 for 32 Miniatures, 2 donks, 2 llamas, 18 goats and 4 big horses... We had all the animals in small pens and/or tied up, so the vet just had to go down the line and do the blood work and the health inspection... That's the vet I mentioned in my previous post.

 

[FurstPlaceMiniatures]

Horses aren't banded because of the risk of tetnus. My veterinarian has seen 2 cases of tetnus in the last 3 years, both of which were from castration bands. IMHO, bands are crueler than cruel. A rotting chunk of meat between my legs? NO THANKS. We use them to dock tails on cattle. I put them on, then 2 days later, after the nerves and blood supply is dead, use floral shears and chop them off. Much less infection, flies, etc.

I've watched the Amish geld a pony, they put him in stocks, sliced, pulled, snipped, and were done. Whole process took ten minutes, gave him a few cc's of penicillin, voila. Wouldn't use it on my horse without at minimum some lidocaine and a lot of sedation, but, suprisingly it really didn't seem to bother him after the initial "my groin has a cut." However, I consider my veterinary skills far superior to those of the "average" horse owner, I work on a 1000 head herd doing vet work, and are 10 weeks away from a degree in the animal health field. I can hit a vein better than most vets (I do it 6 or 7X a week), have access to banamine, dexamethasome, antibitoics, and more.

 

[chandab]

I don't know all the details, but horses aren't banded due to the way the testis hang in the scrotum, you can't get all the tissue by banding (I believe it has to do with how close to the body the scrotum is in a horse, compared to say cattle where the scrotum is rather pendulous).

 

[Magic Marker Minis]

Okay, that makes sense about how the testes hang in the sac...

Yeah, I was thinking if you could use a local, that would work... Unfortunately, getting something like a topical or an injectable anesthetic would be next to impossible...

Kari

 

[Riverrose28]

My state has so many laws that are crazy. You can only get banimine, bute, and alot more through your vet or with a script. We do have Amish, but I don't have the stomach for their way of gelding. I think I'll just have to save up more money, or do one this fall and one in the spring after we get our tax refund.

 

[MiniNHF]

Targetsmom,

I have to agree with you there where it is a wake up call; I came from the eventing and show jumping world where even geldings were more sought after then mares, because some mares when in heat were a pain to try to get to do dressage or even just concentrate on their handlers at the trailers. Very rarely I saw stallions because 9 times out of 10 they were just way to much to handle especially when they were reved up for jumping.

I agree there has to be more done for the geldings and just the same amount of importance there is on halter and driving put towards as you said the all around horse, hunter, jumper etc.

I am not sure the real problem is the COST of the gelding but the fact that people don't know what to do with mini geldings. We actually had someone ask us that at a recent show - their show geldings were getting "old" (all of 3 years old) and they asked what they could do with them, since they didn't drive? Coming from the big horse world where geldings are the lifeblood of the industry, this was a real wake-up call. I know the registries are trying to promote geldings with special programs, and that is a start, but more needs to be done. I would like to see more emphasis on performance classes and awards for the "all-around" horse. At least the Open Shows in our area (New England) are helping by adding Divisions and High Point awards for miniatures. And using minis in 4-H is gaining converts in many states.

 

[disneyhorse]

As far as Amish gelding goes... Never actually seen their process but I've been around quite a lot of draft geldings from those areas... The amount of scar tissue is markedly higher, to the point we've gotten a couple testosterone tests done just to make sure testicles were removed! My vet might be expensive, but he does a careful, humane job that heals well and is aesthetically pleasing...

 

[KLM]

Wow, those are some high numbers!

here there are gelding clinics for $75.00 a couple of times a year. Of course you generally have to apply for a spot in the clinic and be selected from a questionaire that you fill out. I had a 12 year old stallion that I rescued. I got quotes from $800.00 to $1200.00 to have him done because he was so old. The gelding clinic accepted him... At that time the clinic cost was $60.00.

Had he not been accepted, I was told the UC Davis clinic would geld him for $150.00, but that price was only of he was in the learning hospital. I would have done that if he wasn't accepted into the gelding clinic. So that may be an option for you to take him to a learning hospital if there are any in your area.

My final suggestion would be to see if any of the vets in your area would be willing to do a gelding clinic and see how many people you can round up for a "group rate"

Good luck!

 

[paintponylvr]

and I have a teaching hospital about 50 miles from me and never thought of that!!

Don't know why I don't think of that for an option...

I had heard of the banding reasoning (that had been one of my ?s - as I'd been around cattle some). Makes sense to me.

As to someone else's ? regarding teacup poodles - our vet does small animals at a clinic w/ other vets. They used to state that they don't do any animals under 10 lbs - which cuts out A LOT of the smaller breeds of both dogs and cats!!! But since then, I've heard they are doing younger kittens and I know they weren't 10 lbs (they might have been 2 lbs). Also, I think our 3 "cat boys" were only about 6 lbs when I took them in at 5 months of age, have to look at the paperwork - I believe they were weighed. They did tell a friend of mine that until her Chihuahua was over 6 lbs, they wouldn't neuter him - HOWEVER - he may have had extra health concerns that she didn't tell me about. I know that he also has a breathing problem with his trachea and it drives me crazy when I visit inside the house. Now, he's almost 4 yrs old.

 

[atotton]

Holy smokes!!

When I got my colt gelded 3 yrs ago it was $80. I think it is close to $120 now but, WOW not even close to $600. It may almost be cheaper to send them to New Brunswick to geld, and then ship them back over the border.

 

[chandab]

While not quite the same, about 15 years ago I got a female Australian Shepherd puppy, moved to a state with a teaching hospital, so checked with them about spaying her when it was time to get it done, their cost was 20% higher than the good vet clinic up the road that we used for routine vaccinations and such, and was more convenient for our schedule. There was no way I was going to pay more to have students (supervised or not) do her surgery, than a qualified vet that my friends and I trusted.

Guess what I'm saying is thoroughly check out whomever might be doing the surgery for you; prices, experience, etc.

 

[disneyhorse]

Most small animal vets I've heard have a two pound minimum for spay/neuter.

Had a mini colt gelded at a month old... The vet said they were the smallest testicles he'd seen and wanted to know if he could keep them. I was like "sure, I don't want them!"

 

[KLM]

Disneyhorse, Had a mini colt gelded at a month old... The vet said they were the smallest testicles he'd seen and wanted to know if he could keep them. I was like "sure, I don't want them!"

ROFLMAO!!!