So excited

[Rhondaalaska]

Hi everyone. I am so excited ,

My daugter and I bought a cart Tuesday.

It is a used ez entry cart , I don't know the brand.

We took diva out last night to introduce her to it.

She sniffed it and tried to eat the tires. Lol

She was fine with it still

So I ground drove her while my daugter pulled the cart . She spooked a little but not to bad.

I think that is as far as we will go till she is not afraid of it.

The I will see how she is with it touching her.

I am going to try to go slow and only advance as she seems to accept things.

I don't want to scare her.

We can't wait till we can drive her down the road.

 

[ksoomekh]

Congratulations!! Photos??

Karen

 

[Diva's Girl]

We will post pics as soon as we get the chance to take photos. Our daylight only lasts about four hours at the moment so by the time we get back from the school it is dark. I will take pics this weekend to show you all.

 

[Marsha Cassada]

That is great that you are all working together! You're bound to have success.

Did you check out the balance of the cart by one of you being horse/driver?

 

[happy appy]

Super! You will have so much fun together!

 

[Reignmaker Miniatures]

 

[Rhondaalaska]

We tested the balance with me in it and then with diva's girl in it , and last with both of us in it.

It was perfect with me in it and with us both. It was only a little heavy with just my daugter in it but not by much.

 

[Jules]

great!

 

[Rhondaalaska]

We have made great progress today.

The first day we just let Diva look at the cart and then one of us pulled it while the other walked diva.

Today we got as far as putting the cart in the tugs . We didn't have her hooked up to it yet so if she spooked the cart would not go

Any where it would just stay in place. My daughter had Diva and I had the cart. We put the shafts in the tugs and just had her stand there with the weight on her. I had my hand on the shaft next to me behind the tug so if she did move the cart would not fall to the ground and scare her. She seams calm and fairly relaxed around the cart. We are going to take it slow and go at her pace.

For the next step do I hook her to the cart or just have her walk forward a little with me being the one to keep it in the tugs.

 

[paintponylvr]

Hi RhondaAlaska - I would do several other steps before either of the ones you are considering - though it sounds like she's pretty quiet and agreeable! She sounds more like one of my mares (link to pics later) - Bell. Bell's full sister Bit was more difficult, tense and upset by everything - it took much longer to get her into a cart and even after we first started driving her, she would get highly upset. I'm VERY lucky. I have others I can drive with - practicing going in front of, next to, behind and away from - going further and asking for flat footed halts w/o getting upset (her first response when upset was to rear - in harness. She got quite good at also doing that Lipizzaner move of hopping forward while on her hind feet - while pulling the cart especially downhills when trail driving at first - SCARY).

W/ both you and your daughter working together - introduce her to some poles - either pvc or pool noodle type...or even wood if you have lite weight ones. Touch her body, chest, neck, head, upper legs, lower legs, between her legs, belly. Both sides. I don't have pics of this...

Then put it on the surcingle with one end attached (if you wrap hay string around a pvc pole several times it will hold if horse is quiet. if horse gets upset, the pole may come loose and bang on ground, quiet the horse and reattach. Keep doing it until it works) and one end dragging (pool noodle prob won't reach the ground). When you can lounge her and also ground drive her with her quietly accepting the "shaft" touching her while she's pulling it - switch sides. Kreature jumping a log w/ a single shaft...https://picasaweb.google.com/103622225470430126127/Kreature?noredirect=1#5644441130325277874

Then have her pull two (literally like shafts). Ground drive her over different surfaces. Put bags, tarps and even cavaltti on the ground - shafts and also tires make much different sounds on different surfaces (I still have one mare, Bit, after two years that gets highly upset when hooked in an all metal ez entry cart vs a wood shaft, wood bodied one. Makes different sounds that she just doesn't abide...LOL. Put her to a wood shafted cart or jogger or any farm equipment as a pair - she's a dream!). Poles that are dragging on the ground will hang up if the horse backs up. If she doesn't stand quietly w/o backing up when asked to halt or stand - she's not ready to pull poles. Eclipse upset by pole on her side (took several sessions before could do two shafts) - https://picasaweb.google.com/103622225470430126127/Eclipse?noredirect=1#5506171554989548114 Note - the pole is low on her side and with her circling to the side it's on it does poke her ocassionally. She learned how to push into it eventually. I don't remember how many sessions it took before she accepted the shafts. She still gets upset/tense in the cart - but often goes several months w/o being driven and I don't think she's a good one for that type of handling... Much better with continuous handling. Does work as a pair and does farmwork. GG - 3rd time pulling w/ 2 shafts - https://picasaweb.google.com/purplepaintpony/GGBellS2010ShetlandFilly#5832734573506127058 The shafts now have permanent holes w/ the string thru them so they won't slide off of the poles. The holes need to be moved closer to the front with the smaller ponies... Shafts out too far in front of the pony.

To get her used to pulling weight - run hay string thru your traces and tie. Then attach a snapped lead rope to the haystring (puts person far enough back to keep from getting kicked if she's upset). have a 2nd person start by pulling back on the lead rope while she's walking. After she accepts that at a walk and trot - attach a tire to the lead rope or even a pole or something of weight. Again - ground drive at a walk, trot and get your turns and halts. I don't have pictures of doing this with the traces. I was told I'd skipped this step w/ most of mine - and it's better to include it. Here is what I use for weight at first - https://picasaweb.google.com/purplepaintpony/Bit1991ShetlandPonyMare#5474105151538068450 . (its a single tree made from a broken handle). Here's another pic - pulling a tire - https://picasaweb.google.com/purplepaintpony/Bell1992ShetlandPonyMare#5473925679318145154

One other thing - while one of you starts out leading her take her around and past the cart while someone is pulling it. DROP the cart shafts. Let her see and get used to the sound of it bouncing on the ground. Then ground drive her - have the "horsey" pulling the cart trot while she's ground driving - if she's bothered by any of this - have her "chase the cart" as she's ground driven. Then go back to circling each other, figure 8ing etc. Have her in front of the cart, beside the cart and then coming towards the cart and ground driving past it. Have the "horsey with the cart" trot past her while she stands still. Here's a link showing a 2 1/2 yr old filly that we are starting now - https://picasaweb.google.com/purplepaintpony/GGBellS2010ShetlandFilly There is one pic showing how upset she'd gotten over the cart shafts being dropped... That wasn't the first time - just the first time my girl freinds' granddaughter caught it in the pics. Then a series showing me being the "horsey". NOW understand -this filly went with her dam when I was starting her dam in harness 2 1/2 yrs ago. She felt the shafts from both sides while tied at her dam's side at a walk, trot and canter and heard the sounds of it too. She still got upset when doing this while wearing blinders by herself. Not so much now - 3 lessons later w/ "horsey and cart".

She does all this - then before putting the cart in the shaft holders - you can hook a rope between the shafts and set it over her back. w/ th rope "tail" being held in your hand, if you are coordinated you can ground drive her yourself w/o an extra person. if she jumps forward or gets upset - the cart "slides" off or you can lift it off. AFter all this - hooking her should be a non-issue and relatively boring until you step into cart and start working on actual driving exercises.

Then the rest of the fun begins... BE SAFE and create a safe mini for you and your daughter. HAVE FUN and enjoy this beginning training!

 

[Rhondaalaska]

Ok we did the cart part except dropping it on the ground for the noise.

I will try to get something for poles to use. Before we hook her up.

She was trained at one time when she was three but then left in a back yard for the next eight years.

After one lesson she remembered how to ground drive. I will try to do as you said. She doesn't care when my daugter runs with the cart beside her or past except she wants to catch up with it. Lol

It took us longer for lounging than ground driving for her to catch on.

As we walk we toss things under her legs make the soft lead ropes hit her as we walk. She has gotten good at that.

As long as it is not dark or starting to get dark she is good.

She is so afraid of the dark.

 

[susanne]

I would make use of both encroaching darkness and her wanting to catch up as ground driving exercises to build her patience and obedience, since either could happen while you are driving, and you want her to listen to and trust you. If you will be trail driving, I would ground drive her on your trails before taking her out there hitched to a cart. I was teased for the length of time I ground drove Mingus, but I have a totally trustworthy driving horse who has never run away with me and who spooks by standing still.

 

[Rhondaalaska]

We ground drive on our roads that is where we train, because we don't have a pen to train in. She hears snow machines , passes cars ,

Hears chain saws and only dogs so far does she react to but not to where we can't control her. We try to be home by dusk because we have moose, wolves, dogs and idiots out then. Lol but my husband says he can get me the poles so that is what we will do next.

So you will see us going down the road pulling poles. Lol she loves to trot. I can't wait till she is ready. Hopefully by the end of summer .

 

[paintponylvr]

Hi again -

I saw that you'd done some of what I ended up restating and I meant to go back and acknowledge that and ...I forgot, sorry.

Some of what I wrote is "overkill". Not all trainers, especially pros, will do all of these steps. BUT those pros know when and which ponies that can usually be skipped with and they don't have a problem with that and it may never show up as a "hole" in the training. I also did note that you'd said that she'd been trained previously but she was only 3 yrs old (a baby!) and then was left alone for years... So you don't really know how much training she had, how much experience she gained (driving time or mileage) and you and your daughter are both "green" yourselves or maybe better would be inexperienced. Also, in seeing some of the other posts you've made on this forum, you've had some issues with training, discipline and ... her minding you (or mostly your daughter) - that says that you should do more before you hitch to a "free wheeling" vehicle in which you have less control over any situation.

The fact that you have issues with getting her to lounge (she "got" driving much faster than lounging), tells me you could still practice basic ground exercises and line handling. A reinboard can be invaluable. You don't have to purchase anything - use what you have around your house/barn to make one and utilize that to make rein/line handling "automatic" and easy for you and your daughter. Could be as simple as running a line or long leadrope around a post and practicing smooth and easy movements w/ your hands - you don't want the line to move from where you've put it around the tree. It's a fun and eye opening exercise with no bit or mouth to "abuse" as you perfect yourself, LOL.

All that you have done is awesome!! Keep up the great work and it's good that she's so quiet that way.

Part of the reason, again, that I stated to do all the things that I did - is because you are inexperienced your self and from what you've described you aren't able to drive or handle her everyday due to time contraints (darkness producing a set of issues - I think I'd be scared to death of wolves and more so of dogs running loose who have no fear of humans. One of our full size horses was killed just outside of our cabin by a moutain lion years ago in Montana.) Personally - better than trying to do all of this by youself would be to go and get some actual driving lessons. There is so much that can be gained/learned from even one lesson OR clinic.

I don't consider myself completely green - I'd ridden horses and taken lessons for years - from some of the horse insdustry's top professionals in several disciplines. Done most of my own training (partially because i enjoyed it and partially because we simply couldn't afford to send horses to trainers) and when I hit that "proverbial wall", I searched out help and answers. I actually ground drove dozens of riding horses - most learned all of the basics (including side passing and turns on both the forehand and hindquarters - all of which I seem to have forgotten how to train for as I have issues with that right now w/ our ponies that I'm training, LOL) before we ever set foot into the stirrups of our 2, 3 & 4 yr old stock horses - but when it came to actually hooking to carts and wagons - well I needed help and lessons. I'm still learning - 4 years after I "started". There is SO much out there to do with driving horses - and differences in harness, carts, wagons, farm equipment and carriages. The more I learn, the more I UNDERSTAND of balancing carts/carriages to horses, the more I understand that there's more to learn, LOL.

 

[Zipper]

You guys are doing great and I am using some of the things you have been doing but what is a

reinboard?

 

[paintponylvr]

a way to practice reinsmanship - or handling the reins. Most folk who've ridden - especially in disciplines that required contact (saddleseat, some huntseat/jumping and dressage), usually don't have any issues with switching to driving which is generally done on contact as well. Western riders, huntseat riders who ride predominately on a loose rein only, trail riders and new horse owners seem to struggle at times with the concept of driving where only the contact with the mouth & voice & whip take the place of weight shifts, legs and body cues for direction. I know that I've struggled with it this time around as we generally ground drove our riding horses on loose lines in the round pen and arena until they were ready for contact... Can't really remember how we did it all - just know that we did. Before I'd started driving the ponies, I'd been riding in NH style - on very loose reins. Horses expected to go where our bodies and "minds" pointed them and left alone until a mistake made - at which point rein picked up and slack taken out and correction made - then rein dropped again...

To make one (i don't have any pics of my own) - can do something as simple as running a line around a post or tree. As you pull one side you learn to release with the other hand slightly. Fun part - don't let the line go so slack at any point that the loop drops to the ground. Then you've lost contact with your horse - and you could have a runaway, a wiggly line as he wanders back and forth or just a startle. Hopefully quiet enough to wait for you to pick up contact again without jerking on him/her.

Another way is to do weighted bottles (water or sand). You can practice a few other things this way - such as holding the whip in your right hand along with the lines/reins. Reaching forward to shorten the line/rein. releasing the line to slide thru your fingers to go back to where you started. You attach your bottles to your lines and practice different holds with them thrown over the fence or run thru an actual board w/ holes cut out to signify the horses head... Practice using the lines in one hand - evenly - while using your whip. Many other things...

Here's a link - they used to have a rather elaborate rein board, but I can't get any links to work right now...http://www.coachmansdelight.com/CGuidePage.asp?pg=GUI35&k=39 Ahhh - here's the coachmans delite pic - http://www.coachmansdelight.com/PDGImages/reinboard.jpg Here's another - http://www.lilwoodhorse.com/pages/reinboard.html Here's another with a lot of extra info...http://www.mhco.ca/pdf/TheReinboard.pdf another - http://building-dwelling.blogspot.com/2009/10/rein-board.html

 

[Rhondaalaska]

I wish I could find someone that would teach me. But where I live there just is no one around, I have been looking for clubs and no go the closest clubs is anchorage which is over 2 hour away. So I am learning the hard way. I grew up with horses, and even had large ponys. But thanks for the encouragement. We are going slow so we know that we are good to go.

A question though. I looked at your pictures that you posted. ( beautiful horses) but what was the rein board ?

Thanks for all your help.

 

[Rhondaalaska]

Oh ok I see what you are saying.

Ok I already have my reins tight not loose because I am use to doing it. It is how I ride the big horses as well.

I can't use my legs for cues for the horses it is all done by hand and voice for me. Diva likes to lean into her bit just like an English trained horse. I use a western sadle but rein English. We even have diva doing half pass while ground driving. It is so cute watching her do it.

 

[Diva's Girl]

I did have some trouble with Diva listening but that was because she was bored and needed more exercise. We had really cold snowy weather that kept her in her barn for a while because of our driveway conditions where too dangerous for her to walk down the steep hill. Now that things have warmed up a bit and the roads are better I have been walking her more and her lunging is doing great, very balanced and responsive! She is very smart and if you build her trust with you she works to please. Diva is a working horse and hates to sit still so when she is cooped up for too long she becomes a bit of a brat once you finally take her out. Diva now does everything I ask of her(Within reason) without questions asked.

I have been riding full sized horses now for about 3 years in both English and Western riding disciplines. The first year was with one trainer and I rode a green horse that had been abused in his past home and the rest was with my current trainer who I ride 2 horses. One who is a sweet old TB who likes to mother her rider and the other who I swear is bipolar(She is my fav but is really difficult to ride. She is the one I ride the most.). I was being taught how to do a little hunter/jumper but had to stop because of my leg injury. I now do Dressage and pleasure in English and I am learning several disciplines in western. I have had experience with many different horses ranging from green to rescued problem horses to older more experienced lesson horses so I kinda know how to adapt to the horse and the situation quickly. Though I am still green myself I have not had any issues switching from saddle to diving.

I took to it fairly quickly. My instructor used to cart a long time ago so I'm going to look into possibly taking carting lessons from her and taking Diva and my cart with me every once in a while over the summer so she can socialize and get used to traveling.

Thanks for your advice and opinions everyone! You all have been so helpful and supportive as I try to travel along the path of new horse ownership.

Diva is my first horse and owning a horse and working with them are very different. I feel much more comfortable with you guys here to give me advice. Thank you!!!!

 

[Rhondaalaska]

Kim used to cart in Texas along time a go. As soon as I get a trailer I want to take diva down to her an hour and 15 min away from us .

And see if she will give a

Us a lesson with her.