stallion attacking child

[rabbitsfizz]

You treat a stallion exactly as you would any other horse. You require the same manners and the same level of cooperation as you would from any other horse, and, you NEVER forget he is a stallion.

Consequently, whilst I have had stallions I would trust implicitly, it has always been to a given level of trust.

For example, I would trust stallion "a" with my life....unless I was lying on the ground between his hindlegs and a mare in season backed up!!

Stallions are subject to instincts that we require them to sublimate to suit us (just one reason why I would never keep a non breeding horse entire)and most of the time this is reasonable- for example in the show ring. The first time I ask my stallion to breed a mare in the middle of the ring is the time he can start "drawing" when he sees...a mare...a gelding...a lamp post...the judge- some are not picky at all.

This also means I have no right to yell at him if he sounds off when I lead him past a mare tied up where he usually breeds.

I think Eagle just got his wires crossed here, no point in saying he is evil (horses are not evil, they are true innocents) and no point in even considering selling him.

If his behaviour were to become permanent then the responsible thing to do would obviously be to have him put down quietly, at home.

After all, worst case scenario, it could be a brain tumour.

I think it is all tied up with his being confined and with his having been ill.

He was simply having a really, really bad day.

Maybe he is still not feeling 100%?

I hope that all does continue to get better now, and that Alby bounces back- kids usually do.

 

[txminipinto]

I completely disagree with the underlined. It is never anyone's fault if a horse bites them, other than if they didn't correct it the first time it happens and they allow it to happen again. I don't care if it is a stallion, mare, youngster, etc., biting is not acceptable. John Lyons has said that biting is an aggressive, not defensive, behavior, and if it happens you have 3 seconds to "kill" the horse (heads are off limits). If biting behavior is "expected" then I would be working on an attitude adjustment during feeding time. I don't tolerate horses even putting their ears back at me during feeding. If they want to do that, they will find in short order that they just won't get fed. And if they continue it, they learn that mom is the boss and to lay their ears back at me will get mom to "bite back".

No, I don't trust stallions, but I sure don't allow them to have "stallion behavior" just because they still are intact! If that was the case, nobody could do anything with them. I have the same standards for all my horses.

I don't think you quite understood what I meant. If I have a horse in the barn that I know is aggressive for whatever reason, and not even aggressive, but maybe just oral and I get bit because I wasn't paying attention, then yes it is my fault. I am an adult. I understand equine behavior. I know that if I turn my back on a stallion I run the risk of being bit or mounted. Do I just shrug my shoulders? No. I will make that horse fear for his life for the next 3 seconds but I won't haul his butt off and dump him in a sale. My point was as an experience horseperson I take risks when I walk into the barn or stall or pasture. I know what could happen depending on the individual horse's or herd's mood at the time. I am also experienced enough to read signs and avoid being bit or kicked based on what I read from the horse. CHILDREN do not have that experience or ability. At any time I am handling a horse, in any manner, and I see signs of aggression I immediately become boss mare and put that animal back in their place. They aren't doing anything "wrong", they are just being horses but need a reminder who's in charge.

Case in point, turned a returning broodmare and a new broodmare out in the herd yesterday. That herd was not grained yesterday so they could work out their pecking order without the additional stress of grain to fight over. This morning I grained everyone. Did I just walk out into that pasture like they were all my best friends and all got along? No. In fact, I never do! My guard was up as usual, and actually more because there were new dynamics at play this morning. 2 additional mares to fight over feed. Mares were very aggitated this morning, running, pinning ears, kicking at each other etc. If any sign of aggression was made within kicking/biting distance of me THAT mare was corrected (yelling or smacking them with the scoop to get them to move away). I'll have to do that for a few days until everyone learns who eats first. Should I expect them to be all happy and respectful? No, because they are all establishing their spot in their herd and I'm the intruder, but they still have to be aware of where I am when they decide to kick another horse. A child or inexperience horseowner would label that equine behavior as "mean". They aren't being mean, they are just acting like horses. They aren't humans, do not react to stress like humans, and have only body language to communicate their intentions. Its up to US to learn their language and use it to accomplish our training. Everyone knows a horse moves away from pressure....in horse language, a horse moves away from the horse that bites or kicks them.

 

[rockin r]

First, let me say I am sorry your son was biten, and I hope it don't keep him from the horses. As much as I love my stallion Dillion, I do not turn my attention away from him when I am in "His Space",(be that of his stall, or when he is out) especially when the mares are in Season. Stallions are very hormonal. Its like the old saying, "My dog does not bite, Or atleast he did not till now". Maybe your guy is in some sort of pain? Any mares in Season? I hope you can figure out what caused him to basically attack like that...We do not tolerate any bad behavior from Stallions esp. but that goes for all the horses. Cubby, my 3 yo grson, loves the horses. But he is NEVER allowed in the stalls/pastures with the horses. He is only allowed in the pastures if we are right there with him. When we feed, Cubby helps, but we are between him and the horse, so we can intervine if needed. This could have been MUCH worse, thank God he walked away with a bite. Hugs to your little one, and you. That would have scared the begebbers out of me!

I wanted to add that I am not critisizing by any means. These things DO happen. I have been biten more times than I can count! And it was NOT because I was not paying attention. I am glad that you are going to keep him, I have a 6 yo stallion, that for 4 yrs it was a battle between him and I. Almost everytime I walked by his stall, he was like a snake waiting to strike. When he was a 3 yo, he "ONCE" came at me in the yard, full throttle. HE took me out! I could not get up fast enough, he was kicking at me while I was on the ground, Art reacted in an instant, there was a 2x4 next to the tree, and Art whacked him on his rump. Startled him enough for me to get up, and he came right back at me, kicked me in the knee. Sounded like a gun went off. Art whacked him again and he went after Art. The 3rd whack, broke the 2x4. Art stood there in front of me as I lay on the ground like he was going to hit a home run with what was left of the 2x4. He told Shooter, "I will drop you where you stand, BRING IT"!!Shooter looked Art dead in the eye for about 15 seconds, dropped his head and walked up to Art. He did not hurt me, but I was banged up and bruised..Thank God Art was with me. After that, Shooter has NEVER even attempted to get out of line. I respect him as he is a Stallion, but he will also respect me. He would at times still get nasty when I passed his stall, but not everytime. After some time went by, we figured out it was a certain perfume that set him off. I quit wearing it, he quit behaving aggresively toward me. I did not give up on him, and now he is good Stallion. They may be small, but they have the capability to do major damage....

 

[sihri]

I hope your son is ok and doing better now. If I understand correctly you have a new stallion, eagle ( a stallion you are not using for breeding) and a toddler son who loves and has bonded with eagle. I have a similar situation but fortunately it was not my son the stallion went after. I have 5 horses 4 miniature amd 1 paint gelding. The boys are pastured together and do well. Our gelding is very protective of our minis except for the stallion. The mare was in heat and we were going to breed her to our our stallion. The horses had been outside in the pastureall day. I brought the stallion out of the pasture to cover the mare and every time he came close to her he would turn and repeatedly kick at her. I had no idea what was going on. After a while I came up with a possible solution. I put the gelding in his stall a few hours before the time we were going to breed the mare (I wait until my son is in bed) I expected to have difficulties but he got his breeding manners back and covered our mare nicely. Sometimes horses do the strangest things and the cause can be almost anything. You have had some good advice but don't trust a stallion. All horses can be unpredictable not just stallions. Here are my suggestions. Toddlers can be just as unpredictable as the horses are. I do not allow my son in the barn or pastures unless I am with him. I do not know how close your other stallion is to Eagle but if you can keep them as far apart as you can (Eagle may be feeling challenged by the other stallion and associating that with your son. Similar to what my stallion was doing to the mare.) And lastly if you are not going to use eagle for breeding and is young enough consider gelding him. It sounds like he would be the perfect horse for your son as they seem to have previously bonded. If eagle is ypung enough he may lose some of the stallion behaviors. Only one person has mentioned is about your son being afraid of eagle. I would recommend that that you have your son groom, brush Eagle as he used to asap with you controlling the horse. So he can overcome the fear of being hurt by eagle or other horses.

 

[Eagle]

Eagle is my original stallion who has been with me for 5 years. I have never had any problems with him other than him hating my eldest sons gelding (they are in separate pastures and I have never had an issues there) and my dog.

I have a new stallion that belongs to a friend who is having financial problems so I offered to keep him for a while for her and maybe even buy him.

This is where the problems started as I only have 1 barn. They were far enough away to not see each other but they could still hear each other. I never said that Eagle would never reproduce again, I just said that I don't go crazy over pintos (which Eagle always reproduces) so I thought I would use the new stallion for this year and see what he can produce with my mares for a change.

Stallions here have to pass a very costly test to be given approval so I don't want to geld Eagle after spending so much time and money.

Anyway since i posted my original thread i have bought the new stallion and my yearling home which is far enough from the barn and pastures where Eagle lives and he seems to have settled.

My son was not at all put off by the attack and has since been down to see Eagle under my supervision.

 

[Marsha Cassada]

Eagle is my original stallion who has been with me for 5 years. I have never had any problems with him other than him hating my eldest sons gelding (they are in separate pastures and I have never had an issues there) and my dog.

I have a new stallion that belongs to a friend who is having financial problems so I offered to keep him for a while for her and maybe even buy him.

This is where the problems started as I only have 1 barn. They were far enough away to not see each other but they could still hear each other. I never said that Eagle would never reproduce again, I just said that I don't go crazy over pintos (which Eagle always reproduces) so I thought I would use the new stallion for this year and see what he can produce with my mares for a change.

Stallions here have to pass a very costly test to be given approval so I don't want to geld Eagle after spending so much time and money.

Anyway since i posted my original thread i have bought the new stallion and my yearling home which is far enough from the barn and pastures where Eagle lives and he seems to have settled.

My son was not at all put off by the attack and has since been down to see Eagle under my supervision.

So glad everything is sorting out. Some horse folk would like to see that stringent criteria for stallions in the USA. But that is another topic!

I am especially glad your son wasn't scared off of horses. My gelding bit my granddaugher's finger. She was feeding carrots out of a bowl and before any of the 4 of us adults standing there knew what had happened, she had held her carrot-colored fingers out to him and he bit her. Drew blood (and tears) but thankfully it wasn't serious. She would not go anywhere near the horses for 2 years. We were using a bowl as I didn't want the children feeding by hand.

However, I no longer allow any children to give my horses treats--bowl or no bowl.