A discussion on "when it's time"

[StarRidgeAcres]

Everyone knows I have Puddin', a wonderful older mare that has given all of her life to serving people and making babies for us (the collective us as she's had many owners) to sell or in some way serve us through being pets, showing or making more babies. I've found myself thinking about her a lot over the last few months, well since about January I guess when Cappy passed away, and wondering "how do I know when it's time?"

Puddin is currently 28 1/2 years old. She's had at least 14 babies that I can figure - probably more that weren't registered I'm guessing. Her last, and only foal for me, was in 2007. I did expose her to Corona (thank God that didn't take!), Spirit's sire and then Spirit. Obviously she didn't take for any of them and I really didn't expect her to after not taking with Spirit's sire. I'd had her examined after her 2007 foal and she was deemed very healthy and "young" for her age so I thought I'd let nature decide. I had her examined again in March of 2009 because I again wanted an outside, professional opinion on her condition, health, etc. She again was deemed very young for her age and the vet even questioned the accuracy of her age. Obviously, nature knew what was best.

Fast forward to January 2010. It was a tough winter and Puddin and Cappy didn't seem to fare very well. I at first thought they both had the same thing wrong (whatever "it" was) because they both lost so much weight, both had basically no appetitie, but unlike Cappy, Puddin' wasn't lethargic. But the tests on Cappy came back inconclusive, but showed something was wrong, Puddin's tests came back all in normal ranges. I tried every feed the vet could recommend for both of them and ultimately Cappy passed. Puddin made it through and we (the vet and myself) hoped that spring would help her to bounce back and the warm weather would help. Well, it's now August and although Puddin' seems happy enough, she's still much thinner than I'd perfer and she's just slowing down. She doesn't really want grain, just wants to mosey around the pasture, nibbling here and there. She seems to like having the babies around and doesn't get irritated with their antics and rough-housing. I've only seen her trot once this year and she seemed to be having fun, but mostly she just mosies around. The only other thing I've noticed is that I'm wondering if she's got some arthritis or something neurological because she seems to be crossing her back feet over each other as she walks. It's not severe, she doesn't stumble, it's just something new that she didn't do prior to this summer.

So, with winter a few months away I'm really wondering if I'm keeping her alive for me or for her. And how do I get to the answer to that question? I really do not believe she will fare well here with me over the winter. I believe I will need to board her somewhere (which is doable) where the barn is heated and she can exist without having to fight the elements. I can NOT see her outside in the whiping wind or in sub freezing temps. And since my barn is not heated, being in it isn't much butter at times.

So do I wait for her to fall over, or keep getting thinner or do I do something now while she stills has some quality of life left? She's not a total rack of bones, but honestly, she's thin enough that if I saw her at someone else's farm I'd be asking questions and trying to find out why one horse was so thin when the others look like they get plenty to eat.

No judgements please, I know not everyone has the same opinions on this topic and that it's a sensitive one. But my goal is to do what's best for Puddin and not what's easiest for me - emotionally or financially. She's the sweetest mare you'd ever find and she deserves to retain her dignity.

Thanks for reading and thanks in advance for your opinions.

 

[~Lisa~]

Honestly I think the fact you are asking tells you what to do. You have to sometimes in these cases go with what your head says not your heart.

It is the worst and yet most responsible and loving part of owning a pet

 

[Make A Wish Miniatures]

You will know when it is time. You know the mare and can tell if her quality of life is not what it should be.No one else can tell you when it is the right time. But you will know. We have an old Arab mare who is thirty and looks pretty good for her age. We also have a 26 year old mini stallion, that looked pretty bad this spring but now seems to have picked up weight and I am having the same thoughts. If he starts dropping weight this winter then I don't think I will make him go thru the bad weather. I am just going to have to wait and see. It is tough but you have to think of the horse and not how sad it will make you feel.

 

[mizbeth]

OH MY GOSH ............this is my scenerio almost exactly on one that is 28 and another 31. They did not come out of winter very well. Their coats are shiney now and they appear healthy but are thin. I feed them Equine Sr...BUT................

 

[bevann]

Everyone knows I have Puddin', a wonderful older mare that has given all of her life to serving people and making babies for us (the collective us as she's had many owners) to sell or in some way serve us through being pets, showing or making more babies. I've found myself thinking about her a lot over the last few months, well since about January I guess when Cappy passed away, and wondering "how do I know when it's time?"

Puddin is currently 28 1/2 years old. She's had at least 14 babies that I can figure - probably more that weren't registered I'm guessing. Her last, and only foal for me, was in 2007. I did expose her to Corona (thank God that didn't take!), Spirit's sire and then Spirit. Obviously she didn't take for any of them and I really didn't expect her to after not taking with Spirit's sire. I'd had her examined after her 2007 foal and she was deemed very healthy and "young" for her age so I thought I'd let nature decide. I had her examined again in March of 2009 because I again wanted an outside, professional opinion on her condition, health, etc. She again was deemed very young for her age and the vet even questioned the accuracy of her age. Obviously, nature knew what was best.

Fast forward to January 2010. It was a tough winter and Puddin and Cappy didn't seem to fare very well. I at first thought they both had the same thing wrong (whatever "it" was) because they both lost so much weight, both had basically no appetitie, but unlike Cappy, Puddin' wasn't lethargic. But the tests on Cappy came back inconclusive, but showed something was wrong, Puddin's tests came back all in normal ranges. I tried every feed the vet could recommend for both of them and ultimately Cappy passed. Puddin made it through and we (the vet and myself) hoped that spring would help her to bounce back and the warm weather would help. Well, it's now August and although Puddin' seems happy enough, she's still much thinner than I'd perfer and she's just slowing down. She doesn't really want grain, just wants to mosey around the pasture, nibbling here and there. She seems to like having the babies around and doesn't get irritated with their antics and rough-housing. I've only seen her trot once this year and she seemed to be having fun, but mostly she just mosies around. The only other thing I've noticed is that I'm wondering if she's got some arthritis or something neurological because she seems to be crossing her back feet over each other as she walks. It's not severe, she doesn't stumble, it's just something new that she didn't do prior to this summer.

So, with winter a few months away I'm really wondering if I'm keeping her alive for me or for her. And how do I get to the answer to that question? I really do not believe she will fare well here with me over the winter. I believe I will need to board her somewhere (which is doable) where the barn is heated and she can exist without having to fight the elements. I can NOT see her outside in the whiping wind or in sub freezing temps. And since my barn is not heated, being in it isn't much butter at times.

So do I wait for her to fall over, or keep getting thinner or do I do something now while she stills has some quality of life left? She's not a total rack of bones, but honestly, she's thin enough that if I saw her at someone else's farm I'd be asking questions and trying to find out why one horse was so thin when the others look like they get plenty to eat.

No judgements please, I know not everyone has the same opinions on this topic and that it's a sensitive one. But my goal is to do what's best for Puddin and not what's easiest for me - emotionally or financially. She's the sweetest mare you'd ever find and she deserves to retain her dignity.

Thanks for reading and thanks in advance for your opinions.

I am going to be facing the same decision very soon with an older (23)mare who has Cushings.Your mare will let you know when she is ready to go.You will see the light go dim in her eyes and she will let you know by her actions that she is ready.From your description of her actions IMO she is not ready to go yet.Good luck whatever you decide.It is so nice to find someone who is really concerned for her welfare since she has been so good to you.I feel the same way about my older girls.They have given me lots and I owe them.

 

[midnight star stables]

I too am in the same boat. I am with a heavy heart, but I can see it in the future. It is a fact of life and a hard one.

My mother does not agree with this type of thinking. Everyone is different, but I personally support your decision. I know how much you love this mare.

 

[chandab]

I'm sorry you have to think about this for your mare.

I had a half-Arab gelding, I lost him in June at 27 years old to colic. A couple years ago, he started having trouble holding weight on just hay and ration balancer alone, so I added some senior and other pelleted feeds, the old fart was picky in his old age, so had to keep his diet varied to keep him interested. This last winter he was upto 12# senior (two different brands, a sweeter pellet he liked and a quality pellet I liked

), 1.5# ration balancer, 1# beet pulp pellets (dry measure then soaked, he didn't like wet feed, so this is all he'd eat), joint supplement and free choice grass hay. Come summer, he wouldn't eat this much senior, but could graze, so I decreased his senior and let him graze. As the others saddle horses picked on him, and he was my best friend, a few years ago we built him his own corral within view of the others; during good weather he had free run of the ranch during the day(we raise beef cattle in the sticks so don't have to worry about neighbors) and liked to hang out where ever the minis were, especially my bay stallion. [He was in his corral at night, and as long as he could get out and graze during the day, he'd clean up his feed at night. And, as long as he could see the other horses, he was content in his paddock by himself.] He was doing so well, that I fully expected to have him for several more years, but unfortunately his colic was bad and his age worked against us and I lost him June 8, 2010.

 

[wpsellwood]

Jeez thats just worst buddy! I had to do that with Roanie my quarter horse, he was 28. Went out and he was caught in the fence colicing again. It was sept. I didnt want him to be laying in the freezing weather hung up in the fence while I was work. He couldnt get up from laying their so long so we decided to put him down. It was so hard to do but I couldnt let him do that in the cold snow :*( I miss him, 3 yrs this sept. 18th. It was such a nice warm sunny day. He is buried along the house. I sooo miss him. My last part of our race horse days. Makes me sad just writing about it.

 

[Crabby-Chicken]

Oh Parmela.

It sucks and you have had way more of your share of things like this in the last couple years. You will know. It just sounds like old age. I am sorry you and Puddin are in this position. You will know.

 

[Minimor]

I can only say what is right for me...

So do I wait for her to fall over, or keep getting thinner or do I do something now while she stills has some quality of life left?

Well, I would never wait for a horse to just fall over, and I wouldn't let one keep getting thinner--if a horse is old & continues to drop weight, or if I know the horse will most likely start dropping weight once winter sets in--then it is time. I do not believe in letting them just die on their own--I have the means to make their passing a little easier & a little quicker, and I will use it. If a horse is so thin that someone is likely to report it to the SPCA if they see it, and if that horse isn't one that I'm quite sure is going to pick up & look good again if given some time, then for me it is time for that horse to go to greener pastures. I don't believe that old age and age-related health issues are any excuse for having a horse look like a starvation case. For me, those are all signs that it is time.

 

[rabbitsfizz]

This may just be a hiccup. Rabbit gave me pause for thought when he passed 28, it seems to be a milestone. I gave him the benefit of the doubt, changed his feed, juggled his turnout and he picked up. If Puddin is going to go on losing weight, I would say the time has come, if you have juggled and altered and she is not responding, I would say the time has come. Like you, I always rethink at this time of year as I hate to put animals down in winter, just does not seem right to me!

You have also to thin if she would be happy at the other barn, is she used to you now, would she pine away from her herd?

It is never an easy choice, every time I see Rabbit curled up in the sun I pray that one day I shall find him, asleep forever, in the sun, and not have to make the decision you are facing.

It is never easy, but it is not what is best for us, as you know, but what is best for them.

 

[Debby - LB]

Hi Parmela My heart breaks for you this is a tough decision. Just let me say Please don't send her to a strange place.

I'm not sure of the costs where you live but here to board one in climate controlled living quarters would be quite an expense. Maybe you have someone who will not charge you much? I don't know but what I'm getting at is that if you could afford to do that for her then I would think that you could easily afford to adapt a large stall in your own barn to accommodate her. I think moving her from all she is used to would be cruel at this point in her life.

If she is still eating and drinking well and can easily get up and down plus all blood work is fine then I'd want to keep her warm over the winter and out of drafts. This is easy enough to do with Kalglo heaters and a snug little blanket. How are her very back teeth? Have you tried anything to stimulate her appetite? If she just won't eat and/or if her body can no longer utilize what she does eat then it's time to let her go...we can make this so much more humane than mother nature does.

 

[barnbum]

Parmela--I just want to say thank you for being such a horse owner. You know your horses so well as is obvious from the details you shared from watching her.

Follow your heart and you can't go wrong.

 

[Genie]

I have not been faced with that dilemma with my little horses yet but I have had the situation with two of our dogs and we just knew what had to happen when the time came.

I am sure you will know what to do and when and want you to know our thooughts are with you while you deal with this most difficult decision.

 

[StarRidgeAcres]

Thank you all for the thoughtful responses and sharing your experiences. I do think that although the time might not be today, it probably will be before fall is over.

To answer some of your questions, I have juggled her feed a lot over the last 7 months. All that has really interested her is hay and now pasture. The grain just doesn't interest her much. I have had her teeth floated, that was back in February of this year. They weren't bad, but it was worth it to get some points taken down. To stimulate her appetite, I was directed to give her two steriod shots. I did them 2 weeks apart and this was in March. I saw no difference in her appetite after either, so we decided not to give her any additional shots. I hadn't really thought it through on boarding her and yes, I think moving her would be stressful. So, if she is still here come winter I think I need to re-work my foaling stall and get it set-up for her to live in. She hates being stalled, but if I can put another horse with her - maybe one of the babies, it might make it easier on her.

I do think her mind may also be going. She often stares off in a direction where there is nothing there to look at. And she sometimes calls and calls to nothing. Kind of like the call they do when they're looking for their baby. It's actually pretty distressing to see so I try to redirect her attention but that isn't always easy.

She does still really like Nicker Makers so she pretty much is living on pasture and those right now. When I grain the mares and babies she lives with she usually just walks off and starts to graze. I haven't seen her laying down in months - doesn't mean she's not, just means they usually get up before I get out there in the morning, so I can't say how easily she gets up and down.

Well, thanks again for all of the responses. I may see about taking a picture of her tonight and posting it. Maybe you guys can tell me if I'm seeing her honestly or if it's worse or better than I'm portraying her weight.

 

[minie812]

Only you know what is right for your little mare. This has been a horrrible summer for all animals with this heat. Our Fiesta is even showing problems with weight too. I keep food in front of him all the time as well as pasture but he is somewhat thin and he is 20 last month. We can't keep them forever and sometimes keeping them is for our own Peace of mind and happiness and not for the animal. Good Luck in whatever you decide!

 

[Hosscrazy]

I recently went through this with my mare Gracie, struggling to know when it's time. Such a tough, tough decision and also a very personal decision. There were people who would have put her down much sooner than I did, and probably some who would have let her go on her own. She had squamous cell carcinoma in her sinus cavity that within a matter of months, went from a small bump to a full deterioration of her face (bone and tissues). Looking at her face, you would think put her down. But...looking at her attitude - she was happy and enjoyed life.

I asked my vet over and over that question and she kept telling me that I would know when it was time. And she was right. I took it one day at a time, and asked myself whether or not Gracie was enjoying that day. And she was. Until one day I went out and she wasn't interested in eating. Beyond that, her demeaner had changed. The "spark" was gone. And I knew in my heart - it was time. She went quietly and gently, and it was the right thing for both of us. She knew she had to go, and I was there to assist her with love and compassion.

So, all I can say is.. you'll know. She will tell you. Trust her in that.

Liz R.

 

[Debby - LB]

She often stares off in a direction where there is nothing there to look at. And she sometimes calls and calls to nothing. Kind of like the call they do when they're looking for their baby. It's actually pretty distressing to see..

You are correct in wondering if it may be her time. I think this quote along with your other details may be a good indication for all of us to remember when we are faced with "when". I want to say how much I admire you Parmela...your ethics and obvious love for the horses is such a breath of fresh air.

 

[Aristocratic Minis]

So sad for everyone considering this subject. It is so hard to let our beloved animals go.

Many years ago, I talked with my vet about this subject. He said, "If you will listen carefully, they will tell you when it is their time to go."

He went on to tell me when they no longer got any joy out of living, it is time. When they stop enjoying eating or playing or have too much difficulty moving or have difficulty urinating or defecating, it is time. Sometimes it is one of these areas and sometimes it is a combination of all of them.

I had an elderly dog who was blind and deaf and had dementia, but man, did she still love to eat and go outside and bark. When she stopped enjoying eating and no longer cared about going outside, she told me it was time.

It is heartbreaking, but it is what I think they want and they try to tell you in their way.

 

[aBreeze]

Thank you all for the thoughtful responses and sharing your experiences. I do think that although the time might not be today, it probably will be before fall is over.

To answer some of your questions, I have juggled her feed a lot over the last 7 months. All that has really interested her is hay and now pasture. The grain just doesn't interest her much. I have had her teeth floated, that was back in February of this year. They weren't bad, but it was worth it to get some points taken down. To stimulate her appetite, I was directed to give her two steriod shots. I did them 2 weeks apart and this was in March. I saw no difference in her appetite after either, so we decided not to give her any additional shots. I hadn't really thought it through on boarding her and yes, I think moving her would be stressful. So, if she is still here come winter I think I need to re-work my foaling stall and get it set-up for her to live in. She hates being stalled, but if I can put another horse with her - maybe one of the babies, it might make it easier on her.

I do think her mind may also be going. She often stares off in a direction where there is nothing there to look at. And she sometimes calls and calls to nothing. Kind of like the call they do when they're looking for their baby. It's actually pretty distressing to see so I try to redirect her attention but that isn't always easy.

She does still really like Nicker Makers so she pretty much is living on pasture and those right now. When I grain the mares and babies she lives with she usually just walks off and starts to graze. I haven't seen her laying down in months - doesn't mean she's not, just means they usually get up before I get out there in the morning, so I can't say how easily she gets up and down.

Well, thanks again for all of the responses. I may see about taking a picture of her tonight and posting it. Maybe you guys can tell me if I'm seeing her honestly or if it's worse or better than I'm portraying her weight.

I feel like Im reading my own life and situation a year ago. I had a 32 year old Appaloosa mare that was in the same situation. She was my first horse and the idea of putting her down nearly killed me, but I am so glad I was able to control it and make it easy on her. I actually wish I hadn't waited until she was so far gone. She had had dementia for a long time, often confused and living in her own little world. What finally forced me to put her down was her joints. The spring mud stress is literally what killed her. It had gotten to be too much for her. I was always raised that they will tell you. When the spark is gone, its time... I wish I would have made this decision before the spark was gone. That she wouldn't have had to go through what she did.

A few years before this we had a 36 year old Walker gelding that went down on us in the middle of January and couldnt get up. I refuse to go through that again, or put my horses through that.

Now I have a 25 year old mare... its her time. She seems perky but her joints are killing her. Many days she doesnt go far from the barn (she has free range of the property). She's sassy, and runs the place but I dont want to see her be in enough pain to lose that spark. Iv waited until the spark is gone, and I dont want to see it again. If they're in pain in any way, and there is not and relief in sight... its time.

Good luck in your decision, its not easy but you'll do the right thing.