Can we see pics of minis in training for driving?

[targetsmom]

I decided to post on this thread because Dancer is featured in the first post. I know we are progressing a lot more slowly than others (and Stampedoflove, Taz looks great!) but we haven't been in a big hurry. I say haven't been, because Dancer is doing well now, spring is showing signs of arriving, and I am getting more anxious to get her hooked. Photos from today, which was her first day in this bridle and new Myler bit. She loves the bit but the side check was too tight so we ended up unhooking it and letting it flop for most of the session.

We started in the back yard with the home-made travois we first used yesterday:

We didn't do much of this because she was totally unconcerned about it, even when I ran into the snow plow and the poles came apart!

Then down to a new place - the lower pasture: Trot on double lines:

Halt: (not square, but immobile and quiet). This needs the most work.

And a brief trot so i get some exercise!

To be continued some day... maybe the next update will show her hooked to our cart!!

 

[hobbyhorse23]

She's a gorgeous horse and I love the pictures, Mary! Can't wait until it's dry enough here to get some of our work. I notice you're doing your double-lunging with the lines through the rein terrets instead of down around her hip. Do you have any problem with her falling out through the rear that way, or trying to spin or anything?

Leia

 

[targetsmom]

Thanks Leia! Of course when I started double longing the reins were down around her rear end, but then I raised them up and she seems to do just fine. Well, she does tend to turn in sometimes when she halts, but her bend on the circle is wonderful and this way I can reverse her easily and go back to ground driving. That was what I was doing yesterday - ground driving her at a walk all around the pasture which was new to her, and then doing most trotting on the double longe. We actually have had more trouble with the spinning when driving from behind when she decides that is NOT where she wants to go! Like away from the barn or when she thinks she should be done! But she is improving all the time. Oh, and I think she figured out quickly that she couldn't spin in the travois. I started all of ours like this - blinders & breeching from day 1, moving quickly to the turrets, and never working inside a ring because we don't have one. I think it helps in the long run.

 

[hobbyhorse23]

I started all of ours like this - blinders & breeching from day 1, moving quickly to the turrets, and never working inside a ring because we don't have one. I think it helps in the long run.

How so?

I ask purely for discussion as it's always interesting to get other people's points of view on things, not because I disagree. You know I give both my kids a LOT of real-world work as my only "arena" is a small cleared and fenced area on the top of the hill so we do most our driving on the road but I found I had to go back and do a lot of training there with Turbo this spring because he found it so much more boring than The Great Wide World and didn't want to focus or be forward. I needed to limit him to that venue for awhile until he got over his tantrums and realized that together the work could be interesting no matter where we are. Then I felt comfortable letting him out on the road again. I know other people do nothing but arena work and then their horses are insecure and unable to focus when there are distractions around but it seems to me in either case you have to be careful to balance your work environments or the horse will have problems.

Breeching from Day 1 does no possible harm I can think of except that in rare cases it can distract a green horse from the real lesson you are trying to teach. I'm thinking of Turbo's tendency to focus on how it hit him repeatedly in the arse as he was cantering on the longe and start bucking rather than working! LOL. But that just meant we spent that day with the breeching BEING the lesson, and the work came another day. He has no problem with normal light leather breeching, it's the heavier padded sport harness breeching that he thinks is a bit much when it isn't tied down.

Blinders though I'm not sure are a great thing to start the horse in. They can be fine, I mean Kody was started that way and it did him no harm, just like having a check on from Day 1 he thought it was normal and therefore didn't resent it at all. But there's so much you can teach a horse in open bridle work, and it also means you KNOW they're safe if the blinkers ever slip and the horse sees the cart coming behind him. There's also a purpose to blinkers, don't get me wrong, but it's nice to be able to switch back and forth depending on your focus for the day.

Same thing with the rein terrets. Turbo was able to go off the saddle terrets immediately and has not had problems with that but I find he does BETTER work with the line down around his rump and it provides additional desensitization to lines around his legs and things rubbing on his haunches. I didn't like it at first, I'd always found it difficult to do with Kody. But Turbo has no withers so the pad tended to roll on circles and I was forced to learn double-lunging

and now find it a very versatile method. It seems if I want good bend I can either have him far away and use the outside line to help him or I can ground-drive and use the whip but I can't have him out on a circle too far away to use the whip and not have that outside line down. At least when we're only using the surcingle; it seems to be different when he's got the whole harness on.

So anyway, what specifically do you see as helping in the long run? Enlighten me! It's pouring rain, I can't train and I want to talk horses.

Leia

 

[targetsmom]

Leia- I am by NO means an expert in driving training, and indeed I look up to you and always appreciate you comments and insight. Maybe I have just been lucky, but I started all of ours this way and so far 4 of them got hooked to the cart uneventfully. Two got little or no work after being hooked, for one reason or another (one was re-homed, the other is our stallion who has another important job!) but everything went smoothly to that point. The other 2 are reliable driving minis. Maybe it is the big horse trainers I work with or listen to that are rubbing off on me. One trainer gets his horses hooked within one ONE WEEK of their arrival at his place. Certainly that is not a goal of mine, but it also shows how wide opinions vary on training!

I guess a lot depends on the horse's reactions and how the trainer responds. Dancer had issues with the breeching at first and did a lot of bucking on the longe. But I figured she was going to have to get used to straps and things under her tail eventually, so why not at the beginning? One thing it helped was our communication - she would tell me right away when something got under her tail, or was really bothering her - and I would fix it. We finally arrived at a compromise where the breeching was tied up but still attached and loose enough that it wasn't pulling anywhere.

My comment about helping in the long run is due to my changing my mind and thinking I would now like to hook Dancer sooner rather than later. And if we hadn't gotten her used to the blinders or the breeching already, I would have to "stop" as it were, and get her used to those now. But they way we did it, she is well used to both already.

I think the main thing is to listen to your horse and be willing to find another way if what you are doing isn't working. Also, when ours are being trained to drive they are also getting a lot of in-hand work in halter (no blinders), including walks down the road and in the woods, and lots of work with obstacles. And Dancer - because she is already coming 4 - is working over jumps too. NOT IN HARNESS!! I have to admit, my driving trainer is horrified at the idea that a horse can do both - jump and drive.

And being used to driving or working away from the herd (down in the pasture) should pay off at horse shows. You are lucky that you can drive on your road, but I don't dare. We live on a narrow, straight road which happens to be a shortcut, and drivers are CRAZY, despite all the horse crossing signs.

 

[hobbyhorse23]

Maybe I have just been lucky, but I started all of ours this way and so far 4 of them got hooked to the cart uneventfully. ... The other 2 are reliable driving minis.
My comment about helping in the long run is due to my changing my mind and thinking I would now like to hook Dancer sooner rather than later. And if we hadn't gotten her used to the blinders or the breeching already, I would have to "stop" as it were, and get her used to those now. But they way we did it, she is well used to both already.

Ah, gotcha!! I tend to get very caught up in training "deep skills" because that's what I, personally, get a kick out of and sometimes I lose sight of how the rest of the world is doing things. Thank you for clarifying your training goal so I could make sure we're speaking the same language! If the goal is to teach them to pull a cart safely and happily then your comment about the long run makes perfect sense and is right on.

It's funny how everyone does things differently. I know quite a few breed show drivers who put them in the cart right away (skipping all the safety preliminaries that I know you cover thoroughly) and an equal number who keep them completely OUT of the cart until the last minute like the actual pulling-the-cart skills are an afterthought to a driving class that's all about headset and action. I think either one of those approaches is asking for trouble as both ignore the need to educate the horse about his job and how to handle things that go wrong. You KNOW they will someday, that's the nature of driving!

But there is absolutely nothing wrong with handling things as you do, going through all the prep and safety steps but focusing on the basic skill of getting the horse driving and then doing the rest of their training once they're in the cart. I did it the other way around because I didn't want Turbo doing hard physical work with his fine legs and bad stifles until he was as mature as possible but he was ready to learn so we started with dressage and road work in the same way breed show trainers will start with headset and pushing them up. You started with a physically mature horse with no issues so you didn't have to do things that way. You got to skip right to the fun part!

Lucky!

And Dancer - because she is already coming 4 - is working over jumps too. NOT IN HARNESS!! I have to admit, my driving trainer is horrified at the idea that a horse can do both - jump and drive.

:whistling

So you're saying I shouldn't admit to having long-lined Kody over jumps in the past? In blinkers?

Have to admit, he was horrified over that one too! Slammed on the brakes and gave me this look like "Jump? In blinkers? Are you NUTS?!" I had to reassure him that he wasn't hitched before he'd do it.

That proved to me that horses are more than capable of separating their jobs since he knew he shouldn't leap over things when wearing driving equipment.

Leia

 

[Stampedeoflove]

Taz's first time shown in harness was this past Saturday at the Oak Ridge Horse show. He was such a good boy. Photos can be found in the photos section of the board.

http://www.miniaturehorsetalk.com/index.php?showtopic=128663

 

[Jules]

5th ground drive. Note dog in background, it rushed at us with its hackles up. I was quietly and calmly,internally

freaking out, but my pony didn't bat an eye lid. I am still driving using the headstall, but will slowly introduce the bit over the next few weeks.

Still using lowest possible guide rings on the surcingle as he is so green, but he is turning and responding beautifully, so may move the reins up to a higher position after another week or two.

This next picture is a bit rubbish, but the general idea is that there is a noisy, rattling,screeching coal train going past. My 'photographer' was my 15yo son, I think he thought I was a giant weirdo for a) driving my horse in the first place and b)for wanting him to take pictures.

 

[izmepeggy]

5th ground drive. Note dog in background, it rushed at us with its hackles up. I was quietly and calmly,internally

freaking out, but my pony didn't bat an eye lid. I am still driving using the headstall, but will slowly introduce the bit over the next few weeks.

Still using lowest possible guide rings on the surcingle as he is so green, but he is turning and responding beautifully, so may move the reins up to a higher position after another week or two.

This next picture is a bit rubbish, but the general idea is that there is a noisy, rattling,screeching coal train going past. My 'photographer' was my 15yo son, I think he thought I was a giant weirdo for a) driving my horse in the first place and b)for wanting him to take pictures.

Jules. Your doing really good with him..I still haven't ground drove on the road yet because I want to live a little longer..lol..We ride on the road with the big horses but with some Idiots around here I don't think they would have the patience if I ground drove.So for the time being I'm staying on the property..

 

[Jules]

.I still haven't ground drove on the road yet because I want to live a little longer..lol..We ride on the road with the big horses but with some Idiots around here I don't think they would have the patience if I ground drove.So for the time being I'm staying on the property..

I live in a quieeettt country town. I don't think Alex (DS) would have ventured out with me if he thought we would see too many people.

The tarred road in the first pic turns into the dirt road in the second pic and is hardly used. I did encounter one driver who was very respectful and stopped and had a chat as he had trotters and was saying he had done what I was doing many times before but with a *slightly* bigger equine.

Boo to crazy drivers where you live! How is your driving training coming along?

 

[Marsha Cassada]

I have a new driving prospect. Tipsey is a shetland--my first shetland and my first mare. Very different than my miniature boys in the past! She was pretty much unhandled, and at first I did not think it was going to work out as she is rather spooky. But I've had her a month and feel pretty confident that we will be in the cart this summer. She is doing pretty well with the bit now. I don't start with blinders, but use an open bridle at first.

The harness goes to my sulky. I like to use it for training as it has a little breast strap that snaps to the saddle. No extra straps to worry about. I can put the reins through the terrets, or through the quick hitch rings down lower. She is uncertain about the crupper and the girth being tightened, but is getting better every time. So far we have only done our 2 mile walks with harness and bridle, but I'm hoping to try ground driving this week.

She is 36", and seems like a giant next to Dapper Dan. And she can MOVE. (My husband wondered if I would be scared to be in a cart behind her! Frankly, I think it will be exhilarating!)

To clarify my goal: a calm, safe horse to do pleasure driving with. I didn't know I would be starting over, training another horse, but I lost my Dusty right after Christmas. And Dapper Dan seems almost well of the stifle injury, but I don't want to take him far. I miss driving! Am anxious to get Tipsey going.

Not a good photo, but it's hard to take pictures by yourself. At least you can tell what she looks like.

http://www.cassphoto.com/tipseyharness.jpg

 

[hobbyhorse23]

I didn't know I would be starting over, training another horse, but I lost my Dusty right after Christmas. And Dapper Dan seems almost well of the stifle injury, but I don't want to take him far. I miss driving!

Oh, Marsha!! I didn't know about Dusty, I'm so sorry. How awful. My heart aches for your loss and I know exactly what you're going through with a horse recovering from injury and no one else to drive. It's a long, painful road! So glad your new girl is old enough to start driving right away.

Leia

 

[sdust]

Oh Marsha, I did not know you lost Dusty. I am so sorry! Good luck with the new girl. I am heading back to Colorado on Sat. and will be back in Oklahoma in Dec. Maybe then we can go driving. Debbie Goad & Trey

 

[Jules]

My 3yo gelding, taken this afternoon.

I have been ground driving him 3-5 days a week since the end of March or beginning of April. He has been put to a jogger cart once last week, but I didn't actually drive him, just let him feel the shafts and do some halts and quiet standing around. Driving is just around the corner for us now...

 

[Marsha Cassada]

My 3yo gelding, taken this afternoon.

I have been ground driving him 3-5 days a week since the end of March or beginning of April. He has been put to a jogger cart once last week, but I didn't actually drive him, just let him feel the shafts and do some halts and quiet standing around. Driving is just around the corner for us now...

I wish I were that close with Tipsey! You seem to have a nice, sensible boy. And lovely country to drive in!

 

[Reignmaker Miniatures]

Congratulations on reaching this point Jules! He is coming along great and you'll be in the cart in no time.

I was just looking for this thread Wednesday evening and had to leave my search (ok I got rereading some old threads and it took me a long time lol) while I got some things done. I must get pictures of my guy to post. He was ground driven lightly last fall with just his halter. This spring I started him carrying a bit them fitted him with a saddle/girth/back band and crupper and let him learn to accept those. Finally started ground driving again about a month and a half ago and he is now being driven in a set of pvc shafts (like a travois <sp> ) and on Wednesday (last day we worked since Thursday is booked with non horse things) we did a one hour cross country ground drive. This boy is brave, he so enjoyed our outing, no worries about any of the many new and surprising things out there. No concern he has left herd mates and his comfortable/safe pen. The only time he startled was when squirell popped up on a fence line and darted along the rail, then he took 2 quick steps with his head lifted then settled right back down. I am soo pleased with his progress,and so happy I chose to geld him last fall and make him a driving horse.

 

[Jules]

That is a great! A really level-headed response to a squirrel, I think I would have run off screaming for the hills, glad your boy took it all in his stride.

I had my boy gelded when I got him and it made such a difference, he seemed to let go of his macho small-man syndrome attitude

which would sometimes over-run his sweet personality. He is just such a softie now. Sounds like it is working out for your guy too Reignmaker.

Marsha Cassida, yes I am very lucky to live where I do. The pic I shared is alongside a residential street in the outskirts of my town and when you live in a small rural town like mine, the outskirts of town are never more than a 15minute walk

 

[targetsmom]

I am so glad someone else picked this thread up again because I wanted to add to it too. LOVE the updates from all over the world! Can't wait to see your cart Jules and more of your beautiful scenery. And Marsha - SO sorry about Dusty.

Anyway, if you started at the beginning of this thread, I was training our new (in August 2011) mare Buckeye WCF Last Dance to drive. Well a lot has happened since then, most of it good and exciting, so plans changed. First we started a 4-H Club (took several months to get off the ground) which has been a wonderful new adventure, sharing our love of miniatures with youth of a range of ages and abilities. Then this spring we had a fabulous foaling season, with 3 live, healthy, and gorgeous foals. Dancer has not been easy to train, but neither was Princess, so that wasn't bothering me until I realized that neither of them would likely make good beginner driving minis. We needed a nice, quiet, sensible mini to drive, and in looking around the farm realized we had potential right under our noses: Taffy, a lovely moving 2 year old, safe for all the 4-Hers and already entered in the AMHA driving futurity for 2013! So I started working with her and she is just as sensible as she seemed and coming along nicely even though only 2! As you can see from the picture, she is pretty "sturdy" so I don't worry that she will have issues with the cart when hooked.

Meanwhile, we totally changed our minds about not breeding for next year, again thinking about the 4-H needs. We have one broodmare that is not too trusting, so not a good candidate for 4-H, but she gave us an awesome potential driving colt. So easy decision to breed her for next year. Then, just as we were thinking that two would be better than one, Dancer came into heat and she got bred the same week as Toffee. Yesterday's ultrasound confirmed both are in foal for mid-April 2013 foals!!

Having trouble with photobucket so I will attach other photos.

 

[Jules]

I googled 4H the other night as I saw it mentioned so much on threads- it looks like an amazing program for youth! I wish we had something like that here. Good on you for starting own local club Mary

What sorts of things are they working on at the moment?

Taffy looks great, I love a bit of chunkiness in a horse.

 

[targetsmom]

Our website now has a whole section for 4-H including photos of activities and we post the material we use for programs. So that way you can more or less see what we are working on at any time. We are starting showmanship today and will be having a lesson in driving soon!! The first lessons were basic horse safety, then grooming, leading, general horse care etc. Aimed at minis but useful for anyone, I think. Help yourselves to the info! There is also a general mini info sheet at another place on the website which has lots of links (of course LB!!), books, registries, etc.