Letter to the editor

[Mona]

Jamie, I don't see anyone BASHING the registries, I am simply responding to Freeland's statement about being offended. All I am saying, is the way he feels about Renee and her feelings about this, is the same way many people (myself included) felt way back when. I did not say it was right nor did I say it was wrong. I said what I saw, and that now it seems to be a case of "what goes around, comes around". I am not against any registry, and was always an avid supporter of both, hardshipping into both as well on numerous occassions, BUT, like Renee said, if I had to have chosen only one registry, it would have been AMHR for me. Not because they were "better" horses, or more valuable, but because I appreciated that they did not toss out their horses papers that matured over 34" from under 34" parents, so therefore even if horses ended up maturing past th 34" they still had that to their credit. Sure, they may have matured over 38", and if that had happened, I would have lost them, but liked the 4" buffer zone between the A's and losing their papers. I was personally not too concerned as I was not breeding the taller end of the "B" division.

 

[lil hoofbeats]

OK i think i have finally found the handle and can put a shovel in this dig!

Lavern, i understand why you state your anger, but i think you will be pleasantly surprised at how this might help the AMHR registry, by allowing people to get their foot in the door with a little discount. I think it will raise the popularity of the AMHR, and it will be come even more desirable for a horse to be AMHR! Thus boosting prices of AMHR horses! and your horses suddenly become even more valuable then they were before this advertising boost done by AMHR. I can see this really working in your favor

I know i will personally take advantage of this price break and put a few of my AMHA only mares into it.

Over all i think i can see this as really good advertisement for the AMHR registry, and its breeders!

I hope you and everyone will benefit from this.

As far as i can see, i do not think there is a down side to this.

 

[Songcatcher]

Songcatcher, the above quote by you is EXACTLY the way it used to be thought about AMHR horses by many AMHA supporters. They somehow felt that AMHA was the "elite" registry and the AMHR was a "trash only" registry that you would only register your horses with if they outgrew their AMHA papers. I experienced it myself first hand when I was just getting into minis about 18 years ago. Looking in from the outside, it really made me angry with those that said that to me. It was them that I felt were the very ARROGANT ones, not only to think or feel that way, but to come right out and state this to a total stranger, in trying to make a sale of one of their horses once they found out I was looking at several other farms as well.

And it was back around that same time, that I met Renee in person, for the first time. She went out of her way to welcome me to the mini horse world, and to offer help and advice on horses, but was not pushy nor belittling other breeders choices in which registry was "the" one to use. She even offered me the use of one of her stallions for a year to help me get started! I declined, but looking back now at the great success she has had, maybe I should have accepted that generous offer of hers!

Anyway, I guess I got a little off track, but my point that I wanted to make was to point out to Freeland that the way he feels reading these posts of Renee's is exactly the way we were made to feel about AMHR horses many years ago. What do they call it....KARMA???

So, we now live in a world where two wrongs make a right? Too bad I didn't know Renee back when she had some dignity. Truth is, I was not into Miniatures of either breed at the time you are talking about. I don't appreciate being blamed for what someone else did years ago. I guess when you can sell 20 unregistered horses for a "good price" you don't have to worry what people on a public forum think about you.

 

[Molly's Run Minis]

And this makes me sad. Twenty horses sold without papers. Sure, good homes NOW, but what about down the road? What happens if they can't keep them forever? What if the owners decide "hey, I wanna show in Mini shows now? Oops, no papers, can't show this guy, gotta get rid of him and get a registered horse to show..." IT HAPPENS.

Then said unregistered horse ends up on Craigslist, where someone like me sees him. OOOO, gorgeous horse, let me inquire about him!! Soorryy.... no papers! (Yes, I have bought horses from Craigslist- one is a gorgeous AMHA/AMHR Futurity nominated colt!)

You do your horses such a disservice withholding papers. And if you got "fair money" why waffle about TWENTY DOLLARS to register a weanling?? That "worthless" piece of paper could save his life.

agreed. papers could mean the difference between a horse getting a home and a horse going to slaughter. my stepdad has a friend that goes to a few horse auctions a year and he says unregistered minis are selling for an average of $50 right now. he actually outbid a kill buyer once a few yrs back for a skinny and blind black mare. she only cost him $120. and this was when the economy wasnt as bad as it is now! she ended up passing away a few months later from age. she was 25 when he bought her. he didnt even know till the vet checked her teeth! she was probably a 2 or 3 on the bcs. she was such a love, but he said he's never doin that again. he said, and i quote, "little beggers are to easy to get attached to' lol! wish i had pics to show but this was back in 04, none of us had cameras back then.

 

[Minimor]

You know, I've only been in Minis for a wee bit over 10 years now. When I got my first ones I did see more than a little bit of a condescending attitude from some AMHA-only people. It didn't impress me much, but it also didn't make me feel inferior for having only AMHR horses. Honestly, I had horses I liked and I didn't want AMHA horses, I like them a little bit taller than 34". If some wanted to say that I didn't have "real miniatures" because they were over 34" and/or didn't have AMHA papers, well, that was up to them--not my problem. I bought one AMHA-only mare & transferred her papers into my name only because I wanted to use them to get her AMHR registration back in the day when that still cost only $50 extra. But, I am rambling....

What I set out to say is this: Now that AMHR is much more popular & highly regarded than it was a few years back, I see no reason why "AMHR people" should feel the need to belittle AMHA horses. If you didn't like being belittled before, why would you now turn around and do it to others--some of those others possibly never had anything to do with belittling AMHR and even those that did...well, like Freeland said, two wrongs never make a right. I rather think that it is better to be the bigger person and behave nicely toward even those who have wronged you.

I've been thinking this--anyone that believes a $100 discount on hardshipping fees will harm their breeding program or make their horses "worthless" should step back & take a good look at the situation. Please realize that what will harm a breeder the most is a bad attitude (specifically their own bad attitude) that results in a loss of respect from others in the industry. That's a very important thing to remember.

 

[lil hoofbeats]

You know, I've only been in Minis for a wee bit over 10 years now. When I got my first ones I did see more than a little bit of a condescending attitude from some AMHA-only people. It didn't impress me much, but it also didn't make me feel inferior for having only AMHR horses. Honestly, I had horses I liked and I didn't want AMHA horses, I like them a little bit taller than 34". If some wanted to say that I didn't have "real miniatures" because they were over 34" and/or didn't have AMHA papers, well, that was up to them--not my problem. I bought one AMHA-only mare & transferred her papers into my name only because I wanted to use them to get her AMHR registration back in the day when that still cost only $50 extra. But, I am rambling....

What I set out to say is this: Now that AMHR is much more popular & highly regarded than it was a few years back, I see no reason why "AMHR people" should feel the need to belittle AMHA horses. If you didn't like being belittled before, why would you now turn around and do it to others--some of those others possibly never had anything to do with belittling AMHR and even those that did...well, like Freeland said, two wrongs never make a right. I rather think that it is better to be the bigger person and behave nicely toward even those who have wronged you.

I've been thinking this--anyone that believes a $100 discount on hardshipping fees will harm their breeding program or make their horses "worthless" should step back & take a good look at the situation. Please realize that what will harm a breeder the most is a bad attitude (specifically their own bad attitude) that results in a loss of respect from others in the industry. That's a very important thing to remember.

I agree!!!!! Especially about the two wrongs do not make a right part!!! Well written!

 

[JMS Miniatures]

You know, I've only been in Minis for a wee bit over 10 years now. When I got my first ones I did see more than a little bit of a condescending attitude from some AMHA-only people. It didn't impress me much, but it also didn't make me feel inferior for having only AMHR horses. Honestly, I had horses I liked and I didn't want AMHA horses, I like them a little bit taller than 34". If some wanted to say that I didn't have "real miniatures" because they were over 34" and/or didn't have AMHA papers, well, that was up to them--not my problem. I bought one AMHA-only mare & transferred her papers into my name only because I wanted to use them to get her AMHR registration back in the day when that still cost only $50 extra. But, I am rambling....

What I set out to say is this: Now that AMHR is much more popular & highly regarded than it was a few years back, I see no reason why "AMHR people" should feel the need to belittle AMHA horses. If you didn't like being belittled before, why would you now turn around and do it to others--some of those others possibly never had anything to do with belittling AMHR and even those that did...well, like Freeland said, two wrongs never make a right. I rather think that it is better to be the bigger person and behave nicely toward even those who have wronged you.

I've been thinking this--anyone that believes a $100 discount on hardshipping fees will harm their breeding program or make their horses "worthless" should step back & take a good look at the situation. Please realize that what will harm a breeder the most is a bad attitude (specifically their own bad attitude) that results in a loss of respect from others in the industry. That's a very important thing to remember.

Totally agree with you 100%.

 

[Mona]

No, I am definitely NOT saying two wrongs make a right! I never have believed that about ANYTHING! I am merely trying to say that I know how it felt to be on the opposite end of that example that you shared in your post Freeland. I am not saying here that I agree with Renee, as I don't. I too think it is a wonderful opportunity for AMHR and it's members to have that available to them, but I just wanted to say, I can relate to how you said you felt in your post.

 

[Nathan Luszcz]

I'm happy to own a hardshipped PtHA horse, who will never see AMHA/R papers and frankly, I don't give a dang.

Why do I need a piece of paper to show my pony is worth his weight in gold? He'll do all the shows I want with him, and I can avoid the whole drama of AMHA/R paperwork. Seems more hassle than anything else.

 

[LaVern]

Holy crow, while I watched Desperate Housewives, I have taken the low road,bashed another registry, lost my dignity, and for sure sent my horses to the cannery, on top of being arrogant. Let's go ahead and add self-righteous. " It's tough being right".

 

[Minimor]

Just a point of clarification - Falabella's have to go through the same inspection process as ASPC Shetlands to hardship into AMHR. AMHA is the only registry that does not have to be inspected.

I have learned this just today, from someone that is "in the know".

 

[LaVern]

Really Minimor, I didn't know that. Guess, I'm not right about everything,huh.

 

[Molly's Run Minis]

Holy crow, while I watched Desperate Housewives, I have taken the low road,bashed another registry, lost my dignity, and for sure sent my horses to the cannery, on top of being arrogant. Let's go ahead and add self-righteous. " It's tough being right".

LaVern, i must ask, how did you think the comment of you selling 20 unregistered minis in a seemingly short time would be taken, exactly? this forum is very passionate about whats best for the horse and, imo, you make it sound like your running a 'pony mill'. please, everyone, correct me if i'm wrong but thats how it sounds to me from what i've been reading here.

 

[LaVern]

I had a phone call a minute ago, from a friend that said get off the forum, you are taking a beating, but why would I put something like this on a forum if I didn't want to stir something up. For Heaves Sake this is what we need, some passion and strong feelings.

You can only take so many pictures of Dwarfs and vulvas. We need controversy. So many have gotten scared off the Forum, because they get jumped all over by a few who think they know everything and off course it is only me that knows it all, until Minimor corrects me.

You say something like selling horses without papers and right away you are sending them to the cannery, You say something like not registering them and right away oh you will be sorry they are going to make a rule to catch you. You can't be afraid to say what you think. That used to be what the Forum was all about.

 

[Minimor]

Really Minimor, I didn't know that. Guess, I'm not right about everything,huh.

Surprise, eh?

It's really very sad that you are hanging yourself here on this thread, and either you don't see it, or you simply don't care.

To correct you again...I never said that anyone would make a rule to catch you....I said you could get caught in a bind if the wrong rule change did come into effect.

I've seen it before in Morgans--when a breeder quits doing foal registrations annually, it is too often the beginning of the end. They quit registering, get years behind, and then never can get caught up again. But, that is your choice.

 

[Molly's Run Minis]

I had a phone call a minute ago, from a friend that said get off the forum, you are taking a beating, but why would I put something like this on a forum if I didn't want to stir something up. For Heaves Sake this is what we need, some passion and strong feelings.

You can only take so many pictures of Dwarfs and vulvas. We need controversy. So many have gotten scared off the Forum, because they get jumped all over by a few who think they know everything and off course it is only me that knows it all, until Minimor corrects me.

You say something like selling horses without papers and right away you are sending them to the cannery, You say something like not registering them and right away oh you will be sorry they are going to make a rule to catch you. You can't be afraid to say what you think. That used to be what the Forum was all about.

you WANT this to happen? for hecks sake, why? all your doing is causing a big fight and it seems as though your also loosing your reputation. all that will happen is people will keep fighting with you and then the topic will be locked. trust me, i know this from past experiance

 

[LaVern]

Molly, I guess I didn't even think about how that comment would be taken at all, just wanted to make a point that I don't need the registry to sell my horses. I have sold -horses ponies- with no papers for almost 40 years to pretty much the same people and and their friends and families. I know what they want and there is a line every fall for them. Sometimes if it doesn't work out they bring them back,in trade for another or if circumstances change I might have to board them for awhile( no charge) , they usually get past down to the next generation. I am not bragging, but I make a call and they come as soon as they can. I am pretty much the last of the old pony boys in the area.

Also I bet that there are at least 100 horses that I have registered and sold to "miniature people" that have never been transfered into there names. Maybe more than that.

 

[chandab]

I will not comment, as I'd likely put my foot in my mouth, but I have read every post and find it all quite interesting. And, I learned a thing or two; like I didn't know Falabellas had to go through an inspection to be hardshipped.

 

[LaVern]

Why would I not want to hear others opinions? A good discussion is not a fight. It is fun and you do learn things. Have we gotten so scared of saying the right thing, that we don't dare say anything.

 

[Molly's Run Minis]

Why would I not want to hear others opinions? A good discussion is not a fight. It is fun and you do learn things. Have we gotten so scared of saying the right thing, that we don't dare say anything.

i've learned that when ML gets involved and says to cool it, that generally means its getting out of hand. which it kinda has. i would HIGHLY suggest you listen to your friend that called you. you've already lost a few 'fans' from what you've said. perhaps you should stop trying to rock the boat before you tip it....