Todd Akin - how can you be this ignorant!

[ozymandias]

"From what I understand from doctors, that's really rare," said Akin said of pregnancy caused by rape. "If it's a legitimate rape, the female body has ways to try to shut that whole thing down.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/19/todd-akin-abortion-legitimate-rape_n_1807381.html

 

[Sonya]

Yes, he said something totally stupid and not factual...he did apologize, and I felt the apology was sincere...however, I think his comments will haunt him.

Quite frankly, all politicians have said some pretty asinine things, Pelosi, Reid, Biden, Obama, and many many others...only some comments get the attention they deserve.

 

[ozymandias]

Yes, he said something totally stupid and not factual...he did apologize, and I felt the apology was sincere...however, I think his comments will haunt him.

Quite frankly, all politicians have said some pretty asinine things, Pelosi, Reid, Biden, Obama, and many many others...only some comments get the attention they deserve.

Well said!

Perhaps a small quiz on basic biology - or just general knowledge should be a requirement to run for office lol. Facepalm.

 

[Jill]

It just shows that while the Democrats have claimed the Jack--- as their party logo, there are jack---es on both sides of the fence.

 

[ozymandias]

http://www.guardian....P=ILCNETTXT3487

I'm finding the more Fundie right wing the party gets the harder it is to support them.

I have a couple of very right wing Christian friends - very nice gals, never miss being in the front row at Church every Sunday and Wednesday and bible study every Tuesday morning. Both had teenage daughters who got pregnant and BOTH confided in me that they had arranged for them to have abortions because of the shame having an unwed teenage mother would bring on their family. No one else ever knew that their daughters had ever been pregnant. Having those abortions is something they chose to do. I don't know if it would be something I could do...but I sure as heck would never pass judgement or deny that choice to another.

 

[Jill]

DIsagree... Happy I live in a swing state that seems to be swinging right this time!

I like what I see in much the fundamentalist Right, and do not think that Aiken has many supporters OF WHAT HE SAID RECENTLY there. Though, I do know some won't miss a chance to try and bash Christian values, even if the example does not spout what many of that ilk would uphold.

And, speaking of swing states, I love the most recent elelectoral map... lots and lots of RED, and from a system that has been right since 1980:

 

[ozymandias]

I like what I see in much the fundamentalist Right, and do not think that Aiken has many supporters OF WHAT HE SAID RECENTLY there. Though, I do know some won't miss a chance to try and bash Christian values, even if the example does not spout what many of that ilk would uphold.

I've studied the bible in great detail so I'm very familiar with what the biblical God's "values" are. There's not many that are even legal (thank goodness) in today's civilized society. If you're referring to "Christian values" as being something other than what's in the bible then I'm pretty sure they're not exclusive to Christians. They're values we should all have as humans...love, caring, compassion, generosity, honesty etc, etc. I'm also 100% in support of everyone in this country having the right to their own beliefs but unlike today's right wingers I'm support TJ's views of keeping those values separated. We've certainly drifted a long way from the America that the Founding Fathers envisioned

. Allowing the right of free worship of whatever god or gods a person believes in, separate from the laws of our country was a pretty good idea

"Religious institutions that use government power in support of themselves and force their views on persons of other faiths, or of no faith, undermine all our civil rights. Moreover, state support of an established religion tends to make the clergy unresponsive to their own people, and leads to corruption within religion itself. Erecting the "wall of separation between church and state," therefore, is absolutely essential in a free society".

~ Thomas Jefferson

But here we go on a tangent

The initial opening post was in reference to how scary it is that someone already holding political office in this country - Representative Akin (correct spelling) - can be so ignorant. Maybe it's just me but I'm certainly not very comforted knowing people like that can help to pass laws that effect us all.

 

[susanne]

From what he has said, Akin seems only sorry that he used the term "legitimate rape." He has only apologized for using the wrong words, not for the basic idea he purports to be true.

Sadly, there are many benighted individuals who actually believe that "real" rape (a stranger jumping out from behind a tree) rarely results in pregnancy. In other words, if you get pregnant from a rape, you deserve it.

That said, I'm very appreciative that Republicans have loudly censured him, no matter their motives. Surprise, surprise -- Kirk Cameron fully supports him.

 

[Riverrose28]

As a rape victim myslef, I would like to know what is legitamate rape? Does he think the woman or girl asks for it, maybe they are wearing a short skirt or flirting, whatever! Or maybe like me they were just walking to the store to buy milk for their kids! As for the second statement, as we all are human and make a slip up, by mouth wonce in a while, the female body can stop the pregnancy! That is insane! He just didn't know when to stop speaking. A mistake is a mistake, stop once you realize your mouth is running in overdrive! I'm sorry this is a really sore subject for me, maybe I shouldn't respond! HIs apoligy was insignificant, the damage was done!

 

[ozymandias]

That said, I'm very appreciative that Republicans have loudly censured him, no matter their motives. Surprise, surprise -- Kirk Cameron fully supports him.

I'm glad they have too! I'm not sure how any man with a woman in his life be she his wife, daughter, mother, sister etc, wouldn't be outraged.

As for Kirk Cameron.I can't get upset at him because I can't take anything he says as credible - the man doesn't believe in evolution!!! How can you not believe in evolution? It's not up for debate - it's a scientifically proven, testable, FACT. It doesn't matter how deep in the darkness you bury your head...evolution is REAL. I don't know why there are people in the USA who don't understand it other than to say our education system is failing our children.

Here's a simple explanation that he may be able to understand.

 

[ozymandias]

As a rape victim myslef, I would like to know what is legitamate rape? Does he think the woman or girl asks for it, maybe they are wearing a short skirt or flirting, whatever! Or maybe like me they were just walking to the store to buy milk for their kids! As for the second statement, as we all are human and make a slip up, by mouth wonce in a while, the female body can stop the pregnancy! That is insane! He just didn't know when to stop speaking. A mistake is a mistake, stop once you realize your mouth is running in overdrive! I'm sorry this is a really sore subject for me, maybe I shouldn't respond! HIs apoligy was insignificant, the damage was done!

OMG !!!! Riverrose...I had no idea. I'm so sorry that you were violated like that ((((HUGS))))

 

[Riverrose28]

Sorry didn't mean to bum you out, I like words, legitimate has many meanings, none of which should pertain to rape. Rape is an act of violence, it is not consented to by the victim. The victim will not welcome the perp into their home or ask them on the street to violate them, the fear, shame, hurt is too hard to condone, then their is the anger. The victim must overcome and forgive in order to live a useful life, while the perp feels no shame remorse or compassion! Yes what he said may have been a mistake, but to keep on speaking was not, he should have stopped after he misspoke legitimate, and left it at that! I will not comment on this again, sorry, it's just too painful! By the way this happened in the 1960's, we will heal and forgive, but never forget!

 

[bevann]

His comment about the female body shutting down to avoid pregnancy just made him come across as REALLY STUPID.IMO anybody that dumb has no business being in any kind of office.Makes me wonder what else he would do.

 

[vickie gee]

http://www.guardian....P=ILCNETTXT3487

I'm finding the more Fundie right wing the party gets the harder it is to support them.

I have a couple of very right wing Christian friends - very nice gals, never miss being in the front row at Church every Sunday and Wednesday and bible study every Tuesday morning. Both had teenage daughters who got pregnant and BOTH confided in me that they had arranged for them to have abortions because of the shame having an unwed teenage mother would bring on their family. No one else ever knew that their daughters had ever been pregnant. Having those abortions is something they chose to do. I don't know if it would be something I could do...but I sure as heck would never pass judgement or deny that choice to another.

Just curious. Given the fact that constantly you remind us of how you feel about Christians with the offensive videos and cartoons of Christians that you post, threads you initiate to bash Christians, comments to other members' threads constantly to remind us that you are an atheist and that you do not believe in creation and certainly not God (always never capitalized) how do you know what row these gals that you believe to be your friends are actually sitting on? I know, we have heard how one of your sons is a Christian (goes to a Christian school) and your spouse is also a Christian. Did you see where these gals sit while attending something at the church that one of your own family members was involved in? Did the gals tell you (since they confided in you and no one else about their daughters) where they sat? Did family members that attend services tell you where these gals sit? Did you wear a disguise and use a different name on the visitor card? Just curious. Not curious enough to click on the video though.

 

[vickie gee]

Sorry didn't mean to bum you out, I like words, legitimate has many meanings, none of which should pertain to rape. Rape is an act of violence, it is not consented to by the victim. The victim will not welcome the perp into their home or ask them on the street to violate them, the fear, shame, hurt is too hard to condone, then their is the anger. The victim must overcome and forgive in order to live a useful life, while the perp feels no shame remorse or compassion! Yes what he said may have been a mistake, but to keep on speaking was not, he should have stopped after he misspoke legitimate, and left it at that! I will not comment on this again, sorry, it's just too painful! By the way this happened in the 1960's, we will heal and forgive, but never forget!

You did not bum me out Riverrose, I think we have all heard you tell it before and my heart goes out to you.

I am also a rape victim....1993...looked up from my shower through my glass door of the shower just to see two men had entered through my front door which someone had made the mistake of not locking. We forgive, and it is not easy, we heal to the extent that we can, and actually restoration is a process. The scars remain.

Did you notice how on the thread Maesto started about abortion vs abortion involving rape that hardly anyone commented? With Todd Akin, it is not so personal to most folks, at least it seems,as to people like you and me that actually are rape victims. I think his comment was stupid. The word he used was not that bad if you consider Roe v Wade (she lied) or that statutory rape sometimes involves willing underage people. It has been a rough year for me. The guy that actually "did it" had his picture posted on the front page of the newspaper last year numerous times. I had a full fledged panic attack which you probably know is part of having PTSD. I pulled out the apology letter he wrote me 19 years ago. I wanted to ruin him. But he had asked for forgiveness. His own actions did catch up with him in a way that eventually cost him so much embarrassment. I so wanted to post on his facebook page so that his hundreds of "friends" that were hearing of his recent debaucle could hear that he is a rapist as well ...but I let it go.

 

[susanne]

It's not the word that is stupid.

IT IS THE MAN.

He has said he thinks his mistake was using the wrong word. I couldn't care less what word he used -- what disgusts me is what he means, no matter what word he uses. He believes that a woman's body can reject a pregnancy if hers was what HE considers to be rape. His choice of words merelyunderlines the fact that he thinks some rape victims are not to be believed, that they deserve what they get, and that they should not be allowed an abortion. If you got pregnant, WE KNOW you're lying!!!

He thinks that he is worthy of judging who deserves to call what they have suffered "rape." Might as well, as he thinks it is his right to tell a woman what she can do with her body. (Who better than a privileged white man, right?) TALK ABOUT A SENSE OF ENTITLEMENT.

Yeah, we really need some politician sitting in judgment of whether a woman was raped in a manner that he deems worthy of the term. Were they raped by choice? Is it no less traumatic if it was a college date who slipped her a mickey? A violent husband who beats the crap out of his wife before and after?

And why should this be a deciding factor on whether they can get an abortion or not? Abortion will always exist...the choice is whether it happens in a doctor's office or a back alley. I guess cretins like Akin think women should go back to dying from knitting needle abortions. If you believe abortion is wrong, then don't get an abortion. If you are upset about abortion as birth control (and I agree), then make birth control easier to obtain.

It seems that some think they'll stop people from having sex if they can only punish the ones who do -- make them bear those children and suffer in poverty unless they keep their legs crossed. Those evil sluts! Now, of course, if they are righteous and have wealthy parents, then the abortion can be hushed up and we can pretend it didn't happen, as it always should be. But as for those nasty poor women...oh for the days of the chastity belt!

Sorry to go on and on, but I'm so tired of this crap.

 

[ozymandias]

What a well written post Susanne.

Rape victims are already so reluctant to come forward as it is. it's shocking to think ignorant attitudes like this are held by those elected to represent those same women.

I often think the world would be very different if some of these men had to walk in a womans shoes for a while.

 

[MountainWoman]

Vickie and Riverrose, my heart goes out to you both. You are both so incredibly strong and brave.

As to Mr. Akin. Who knows if his apology is sincere? Only God knows what is in his heart and what he believes. My worry about all of this is that he is so incredibly judgmental for women confronting life changing, horrific events. I certainly don't want men (or women) who are so rigid and judgmental in their beliefs determining the fate of my life or my grandchildren's lives. Mr. Akin is free to believe as he chooses. Our freedom in this country is what makes us great. But I also have the freedom not to vote or support any candidate who thinks as he does.

Think before you vote. That's all I say. There's a lot more at stake than the economy.

And I admire the strength of all the women in the world who have been faced with difficult, personal decisions. They deserve respect and privacy and not condemnation.

 

[Jill]

Gosh, here we have someone who has been rebuked from all angels. Both political parties and both sexes. Sure, some men are obnoxious. Some women are just as equally misguided. To validate his view point of view by pretending it's owned by ANYONE other than him is a disservice and contrived.

As to a sense of entitlement, I'm not sure how what this moron has said equates to THAT, though I do think a sense of entitlement is at the heart of many of our National woes. A sense of entitlement, to me, means that you expect others to provide _______________ for you -- that you are entitled to benefit from the fruits of other people's efforts and success. While I find much (MUCH) fault with what Akin said, and I've not talked to anyone who doesn't, a sense of entitlement is not his encumbrance, even if it is a hot phrase these days.

The media has been ALL over this mess, but have they given equal time to Biden's most recent outrageous remark? Heck no. Why would they when they play for the same team? "Put ya'll back in chains..." Seriously? And just the icing on the cake is which party actually stood up against slavery (Republicans), and from which party the KKK was born (Democrats).

One of my all time favorite personalities in one of my all time favorite YouTube videos. It's both entertaining and informative:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xryXpK042pQ

 

[MountainWoman]

Jill,

I'll watch the video later but I agree with you 100% about entitlement. Maybe that should be a different thread? I was raised and raised my child to believe that you had to work for everything and nothing would be handed to you whether it was good grades, a car, a whatever, hard work had to be involved. And money doesn't grow on trees. It has to be earned.

I still not voting for Romney though but I respect those who chose a different path.