True Arabian blood in minis???

[Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis]

Someone emailed me to ask me if it is true that the Jandts lines were from true arabians that were hardshipped into AMHR meaning 38 or under inches

I told her I never heard such a thing and I thought it was someone giving her a sales line but that I would ask here and check it out

She said she was told this was the rarest of minis since it had true arabian blood in it and therefore was a super herd sire prospect.

 

[user 488]

OH BROTHER! OH! Even if this was true the blood would be so diluted that it wouldn't mean a thing. Almost like people who say they have Buckeroo in their pedigrees umpteen generations back

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I am sure somewhere along the line, someone crossed a pony with an Arab. Arabs have been crossed on many breeds but as far as any horse being a SUPER HERD SIRE because of it? Ridiculous. Another bogus sales tactic, IMHO.

 

[HGFarm]

Lisa,

We were able to trace my daughter's POA mare back to two of the three 'key' Arabians...!!

Minis were bred down from something, so were ponies. IF the lines were traceable enough (which is why I do not agree with putting 'unknown' on imported horses that have a pedigree and other reasons that the unknown is listed on papers) I am sure we would all be shocked at what was behind some of the lines.

Look at the Falabella herd and the big Appies behind them.... they downsized quickly, so who knows??

 

[ClickMini]

Lisa, Sundance has some with Arabian in them. They have a beautiful 1/2 Arab pony mare there that is the family root. They hardshipped some of the foals in when the registry was open. I would say that some from that line are nice, others not my cup of tea. But the original mare is just gorgeous.

 

[StarRidgeAcres]

Judge less, support more.

A lesson for me.

 

[Danielle_E.]

OH BROTHER! OH! Even if this was true the blood would be so diluted that it wouldn't mean a thing. Almost like people who say they have Buckeroo in their pedigrees umpteen generations back

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I am sure somewhere along the line, someone crossed a pony with an Arab. Arabs have been crossed on many breeds but as far as any horse being a SUPER HERD SIRE because of it? Ridiculous. Another bogus sales tactic, IMHO.

I TOTALLY agree with Carol!!!

 

[nootka]

Simply not true, with rare exception, that there are ANYTHING but Shetlands (I do realize there are some POA, Welsh, etc.) as the foundation for Miniatures.

When someone uses a "gimmicky" sales pitch like that, one can't help but start to see the used car sales lot.

It's not ethical, IMO, to use an untruth to sell a horse.

EVEN IF IT WERE TRUE: what would that mean unless the direct parents were the "Arabian"? Frankly, if the parent were the Arabian, I would be in fear and trembling of breeding a horse like that because it could make "throwback" babies where the foals would be too large for the poor mare to pass.

UGH...

From calling a dwarfy head "Arabian" to selling a Miniature horse with "Arabian bloodlines" what's next?

Sadly, caveat emptor is so true.

Just wish some people had tattoos on their forehead for benefit of the rest of the world so they would know up front what they were dealing with.

L.

 

[Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis]

That is pretty much what I told them I had never heard of anything being close up enough to count for anything really.

All you can do is tell people what choices they make after that are there own.

 

[Minimor]

I do know that Joe Jandt has a line of Minis that were supposedly bred down from Arabians--as I recall he took over that herd of "bred down" Arabians from some lady who did the initial breeding of Arabians (have heard her name but never retained it!) I really don't doubt that there is some Arabian blood back in there somewhere--maybe quite a bit of Arabian in the one particular horse, but has been said the Arabian blood is back aways and definitely well diluted. I have horses that go back to that same line and while it's interesting to hear that the line goes back to Arabians, it sure doesn't make my horses Arabian! Definitely not a big selling feature to me--interesting is about as far as it goes.

I too know--or at least can make a pretty good guess--who is giving this sales pitch, and which horse she is talking about, and good gosh, that seller ought to be ashamed of herself.

Lisa, tell your person to disregard that line of hooey--regardless of how much Arabian there might back way back in the pedigree, she must look at the horse (or the pictures) and judge his conformation and decide from that if he is herdsire material.

If this seller is so convinced that the horse is such fantastic stallion material then I suggest that she needs to take him off the market until she gets him back into good condition--then get some photos of him that show the world that he's as great as she's saying he is. Currently the photos portray him as a rather sorry looking little horse that still needs more groceries.

 

[Leeana]

I think i know who this horse owner is to.

I'm sure if you could go back far enough in some of the minis pedigrees, well not pedigree exactly, but far enough back in their blood many generations back you could probably find arabian blood, QH blood ..possibly even draft horse blood. But in reality, if its back that far ..it really doesnt matter much.

Look at the half Arabs, even in half arabs (for the most part) its hard to see any Arabian just by looking at the horse. Not imagine that maybe 20 generations later ..same with mixing any other breeds

Ahh shoots, just checked out the persons website ..wasnt this horse a rescue???? Rolls eyes

 

[rabbitsfizz]

What Carol said pure Hype.

The size does not go on coming down for a start- remember I have tried all this- first generation it comes down with a bump then it creeps down- or not- at an inch per generation.

Even if you were lucky enough to get it down to "Mini" (ie under 38") size and still registered (my litmus test registered blood, provable) you would lose it in the next generation and I would never be happy breeding a small mare to a horse bred this way.

There is nothing to indicate Falabellas were bred from big Appies- sorry I have not heard that one, I had assumed they were bred from the Dutch "spotted" ponies that were exported to Argentina for that purpose??

The original Falabella stallion was Appy- he was also, by all accounts, around 10hh- very small by the standards of the area at the time- and it would have been quite easy to breed him down using some of the Shetland mares they also imported.

I know the truth is not nearly as romantic as the myths but let's at least keep one foot in reality!!!

The "Arab" heads come from the Welsh influence, I think- I know they do in my horses!!

 

[user 488]

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Look at the half Arabs, even in half arabs (for the most part) its hard to see any Arabian just by looking at the horse. Not imagine that maybe 20 generations later ..same with mixing any other breeds

This is off topic.....but Leeana, for your information, because you probably have not been around a lot of quality Arabians, there are MANY Half Arabian who look purebred......some prettier than a lot of purebreds. I had a mare a few years back who was unanimous National Champion and she was just as nice as the nicest purebreds. It just depends on the "cross".

 

[Leeana]

Im sorry if i affended you Carol, that wasnt my purpose. I was just saying, if you breed an Arabian to say, a Percheron, QH, TB, Welsh pony (or whatever breed), that does not mean the result is going to come out with Arabian features. I agree 100% with you, i admire the arabs from afar and if i wasnt doing the minis and ponies and i had to choose a large horse breed i would go with Arabian BUT i was just trying to simply make a point

.

 

[user 488]

Trust me Leeanna..you do not offend me. It takes a whole lot more to offend me than your post. I was just trying to give you a bit of information.

 

[ruffian]

"From calling a dwarfy head Arabian" I have several mini's with very arabic looking heads, and I'm not talking about big foreheads.

I get so tired of people saying that the ONLY way we got mini's is from Shetland Ponies. If that were the case, why do they look different, or did until people started double registering because it's just a "size" breed.

If Arabians can go in just over 20 years from being 13 - 14 hands, to 16 -17, why can't they go the other way?

13 hands = 52". Add 3 hands and you've got 64", 16 hands. Subtract 3 hands, and You've got 40". not too far from an AMHR B. Keep breeding smaller and smaller, and you could easily get smaller.

While I don't know anything about what some of the other folks are saying on here, I personally think there is some exotic bloodlines in our miniature horses.

 

[mydaddysjag]

StarRidgeAcres, Im right with you.

A few days ago I posted about a horse on the sales board. Im sure most of you remember it. Anyway, that is part of their sales pitch on the horses ad. Even if that line was bred down from miniatures, it's not the way the seller is using it. Some people will do and say anything to make a buck.

 

[MiniHoofBeats]

Alright, alright whatever...it was something I strongly believed for the line this colt came from and yes he has come a very long way from how he came, the more I learned about his history the more amazing he turned out to be.

I whole heartedly apologize for believing in something, and turning this forum into yet another big bang...I guess I can't even stay off the forum and still not be talked about or judged! Try, try as I might...

Changed my website...forget it. It wasn't a sales pitch, it's my true belief. Haven't heard it was wrong yet so I guess it's my own fault for believing.

........

Ok i'm just going to change this now...not sure if it was about me but i'd feel stupid if it wasn't!

 

[user 488]

Steffanie, I for one, had NO unearthly idea who it was they were talking about. Sometimes things like this come up with no bad intention. I do not think you are a "bad person" for believing this as you probably were only saying what somebody else told you. Just chalk this up to a learning experience and not a put down. After all, MOST would have not even known it was you until you posted.

You can choose to make this into a bigger deal than it is or just move on.

 

[rabbitsfizz]

sorry, you have lost me (not hard

)

Where did that all come form??

Forty years ago we had an Arab X Welsh who looked more "Arab" than any purebred short of Skowronek I have ever seen!!!

It did not make her an Arab but it made her very "Araby"

Yes, Loads of "Araby" part breds out there!!!

 

[MiniHoofBeats]

It's fine really, i'm not taking offense this time. If I am wrong, i'm wrong, but I just feel bad that no one told me yet in person that I am wrong...so...it sort of just...was like a slap in the face to find this post!

Really I have no beef here...but I also am not afraid to step up and say something when I obviously know the topic is about me.

Thanks though!