# Do you think folks are spending less time here now?



## WhiteTailsMinis (Feb 10, 2011)

Just curious .....maybe its just me?

It seems the LB forum is slow these days (*no insult intended* and maybe I am not wording it exactly right) but I come on several times a day to see whats new and very few new posts (subjects/topics) are present.

When I first joined LB, it was really fast paced and hard to keep up with all the goings on with my 3 favorite forums (miniature horse, photos and back porch). It was extremely busy and extremely addictive. And always alittle bit of drama now and then to keep things interesting - and make us laugh - where have those people gone? Oops, maybe they were banned and maybe I'm a bad person for being entertained with some heated debate?

I also found back then that topics were quickly shoved to the 2nd page for all the new topics started (so you had at least 2 pages minimum on each forum to keep up with). Now it seems the same topics just sit there in the same positions.

Perhaps the winter blahs have people doing other things? but when you can't walk in 8" plus snow wouldn't you spend time on the computer in the warmth of your house? LOL And those people have time for other forum/chat sites because we talk there too.

*LB will always be my favorite of course* and will continue to visit multiple times a day (and all night through foaling) and will definitely keep my membership strong, but it seems to have gotten dull lately. Without upsetting anyone - - - do you find this to also be true?

Are people spending more time on the other popular forum/chat site instead? I live on that one too and notice tons of LB folks are also there.

I enjoy the wealth of knowledge from LB members experiences and adventures - always a good reference to come to for advice and other opinions on subjects and I'm sure the photo forum will be quite busy as foal announcements start happening - that's always fun.

Just wondered if anyone else noticed any changes over the last 6 months or it was just me?


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## topnotchminis (Feb 10, 2011)

I know I am not on as much because college classes are backmin session. I guess it is just a busy time of year.


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## little lady (Feb 10, 2011)

I have noticed the same thing. Same thought I had if it is snowy cold and just plain yucky outside I thought it may be hopin but not the case. I tried the other big name place but has since deactivated since I just have security and other issues with that place. So LB is my #1 and always will be. I LOVE all the info on here and LOVE pictures!!!!!!!!!

Maybe we need to come up with some good conversation issues? Put your thinkin cap on and I will too!


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## Sonya (Feb 10, 2011)

definately, not as many topics on the back porch as there use to be. I don't go to the mini horse forum anymore as I haven't had minis in a couple years and I don't have anything to offer there. I think FB has become alot more popular so maybe that's the reason? Also some topics on here are taboo(as in politics) because people took the debates personal. I actually miss the debates, I never took them personal. I actually learned alot from them. The debates forced me to research things that I may not have known about, etc. I still come here at least once a day though and have a fond spot for everyone here.


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## Jill (Feb 10, 2011)

I love LB and always will, however, I do think FaceBook "offers" some stiff internet time competition for any message board these days. I've noticed a big change in activity level here over the past year or so.

Sonya makes an excellent point. Maybe a lot of people like being able to talk about whatever strikes their fancy -- which you can do on FaceBook even if your fancy includes politics (just as mine might)


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## Ashley (Feb 10, 2011)

I have different reasons for not sticking around. Many of the old time posters that I used to love reading dont really post anymore so thats strike one and the main strike. Its just not as intresting to me anymore.

I do spend most of my time on homework, house cleaning, job searching and another forum relating to something else going on in my life.


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## Eohippus (Feb 10, 2011)

I've noticed that too. For me its show season so there's a big lack of time. Sometimes I'm browsing from on my phone too so I make note to come back and reply to a topic when I get on my computer again but then I forget. I do miss all the activity though! It was my excuse for not writing lesson plans ^^


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## Leeana (Feb 10, 2011)

I spend more time on facebook now, but I read here just about as much..just reply less unless its something I feel really strong about. I read a lot of the posts that are interesting. Also, I am just SO busy...


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## Allure Ranch (Feb 10, 2011)

_I actually spend more time on other equine sites/forums myself right now. _

_ _

_I personally prefer a more open controversial/interesting matter that allows for objective opinions good or bad without the threat of being banned/locked out from the subject matter/forum. With that I will add though that I'm opposed to any profanity or personal attack. _

_ _

_I've also noticed a serious decline in the patronage that previously visited the forum and contributed to the dialog over the last 8-9 years. However, I do frequent the forum daily to see whats new...._


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## Riverrose28 (Feb 10, 2011)

The other site you are referring to. FB maybe, well there are several mini people that have asked to be frieds with me, and I am about to defriend them because, instead of offering advice or just chatting these people are using the friendship as a sale opportunity. All they talk about is visit my site for this horse for sale or the little horse barn. It's getting old real quick. Or the other thing that bothers me is bragging. Your web site should be for that not FB, maybe one thing but some times there are way too many, it's getting on my nerves. I like this site because people try to help you or offer advice. It will remain #1. We could stir things up a bit with some other subject matter. Have to think on it. Some people are busy with work and marstare as so many people have foals due this time of year, and I know I am busy training yearling and putting stallions in and out. No breeding this year until the economy picks up. I am not giving anything away, it's best to wait to breed until the economy picks back up. so that means more stalls to clean, as stallions can't be with the mares.


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## kaykay (Feb 10, 2011)

I think FB has definitely had an impact, but I also think if FB doesnt fix their security issues and viruses they will end up like myspace. Remember when myspace was all the rage? And then the viruses took over? I can tell you my son got a fb virus on my laptop and it was horrible. Cost me 50.00 to get rid of it and the guy said mine was one of many he had to fix that month.

I have quite a few friends that have shut their pages down due to security issues. I never knew how easy it was to steal someones FB page until it happened to my friend. When she showed me how I was appalled! Crazy stuff.

I also think its a good place to market if you dont go overboard as the above post shows. Too much is too much. If you are constantly bragging people just get tired of it. I have always said if you really have a great horse you dont have to constantly scream it from the rooftops. LOL

I have a lot of fun on FB especially keeping in touch with my family, but its very different from a forum. I also use FB in conjunction with my forum and that is a lot of fun. But, if you are needing help or info a forum is definitely a better place to go.


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## LindaL (Feb 10, 2011)

I am on here several times a day to read new posts/threads, but rarely post myself. I think that is what a lot of people are doing these days, which would cause the forum to "seem" slower than usual. I love LB and would never give it up, but yes, other sites seem to be just as popular to me and others.


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## ~Dan (Feb 10, 2011)

Hmm, I too have noticed this recently. I too have not been on here as much as I once was (I used to be a junky)other than just to lurk and read but dont post much anymore. I also think that perhaps more people are spending more time on Facebook and other sites? I think that it may be easier for some but that's just IMO. But I agree, I think there should be some more topics on here to generate conversation and interest.

Dan.


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## Feather1414 (Feb 10, 2011)

Personally I don't pay very much attention to this forum anymore. Why? When I joined it was very fast paced and I was learning so much.

Now though, it seems like it's always a repetition of the exact same topics and I am very bored by that.


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## SampleMM (Feb 10, 2011)

For me, it is a situational thing. My husband had his open heart surgery in October and it's been downhill since then. I do agree with you, Marlene. Allure Ranch makes a good point too. If you have too many rules it just alienates people (imo). I miss the political stuff on the Back Porch.......that was my favorite.





The point I tried to make last night but my brain was foggy...........is that I just simply don't have the kind of time I used to have.


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## Bess Kelly (Feb 11, 2011)

My thoughts -- the economy has been in a slump for a couple of years and the mini horse markets/shows/farms and all associated activities have declined. This would account for some of the "slow-down" in people and related posts/question, etc. It's the snowball effect.

Some of the "old posters" are, well, older!



You will find a number who have slowed down, sold out, etc. Plus, I know of a few who had a great deal of experience and knowledge to share but stopped posting when they were slammed for their input.

Guess it's like those of us who have stopped breeding for a while...until things change. I do miss the previous forum events -- also, the foals, shows, meetings, all the things that we loved about mini ownership beyond the wonderful little horse and may not now participate in those.


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## wcr (Feb 11, 2011)

I think this forum has gotten very stale. I am on here everyday but the pages don't change much, the same topics day after day. I realize new people have lots of questions but after several years of the same topics coming up multiple times a year it gets boring. I also think it has become over moderated. Let people get into good debates, it is interesting. The more you moderate, the more people will go elsewhere.


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## Marsha Cassada (Feb 11, 2011)

I have also noticed fewer participating. But, fewer folks are involved in many social areas now. Clubs are having a hard time functioning now--not just horse clubs, but most social and hobby clubs. Whether it is electronic stuff, or whether people are spread too thin with life activities, not sure.

As for the controversial topics, one should just not open one and follow it if it is too hot. But, I can't practice what I preach because I opened the topic of which horse color do you not want in your breeding program. Of course, the two colors which folks seemed to dislike most are bays and appaloosas! So why did I open it again and read more???



Those are the two horse colors I have!


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## Reble (Feb 11, 2011)

I think I have read most of the replys.

I was just thinking as I was reading some of the replys, this forum is YOURS

You make it how you wish.. All that comment is slow, boring, etc.

well we are only too blame.

You can make a big change, just post.. don't sit back and complain do something. OK now I have said what I think..


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## AppyLover2 (Feb 11, 2011)

Interesting topic and interesting comments. I hadn't really thought about it but have noticed that things here are really slow now. I used to come on several times a day to see what was happening and what everybody was up to. Now I only come on once or twice a week and, as much as I hate to admit it, it's usually when I'm bored and looking for a place to browse. Since I don't breed or show, my interest in those issues is minimal although I do love seeing the new babies. I've gotten involved with a new craft/hobby and that is where I spend my time. I have to agree that there seems to be a lot of "oversight". After I posted something once and was admonished with a "you know better than that" I felt like a child who's hand had been slapped and started losing interest, not to mention being reluctant to post.

While we may not have agreed with(or been interested in) those topics that resulted in "debates",they were something I followed closely and was always anxious to see what the next person had to say.

I still think it's a great place to visit and get information/help, but it's lost it's daily appeal for me.


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## Jill (Feb 11, 2011)

While I would not want to be in the position of deciding what is and is not okay for a topic specific message board, we all know that the controversial and heated discussion threads are both the ones with the most activity and the ones with the most views. The flip side is that these threads are very frequently not horse related. I really do not know what is best for LB but I know that LB is a big part of why I have become the horsewoman that I am and the pretty direct reason I have some of the exceptional horses that I get to call mne. LB's been an important part of my life for many, many years!


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## Reble (Feb 11, 2011)

Would be nice the Like Button.

Save a lot of repeats. and easy to do.

Just a suggestion, thanks Mary Lou.

Yes joined the FB in December, and found my sister, brother, and niece and all their grown children with children.

I have not been in contact for 20 years.

Have so much to catch up on.


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## LAminiatures (Feb 11, 2011)

I have noticed the same thing. I do read this forum daily but don't participate often. I feel like some people have changed programs and are moving towards the ASPC ponies. Maybe things are just changing and some new people are slowly trickling into the minis and time will tell. Maybe we all need to participate more for the better of the forum.

I have learned so much from this forum and enjoy reading and learning.

White Tail don't even think about not chiming in I am waiting for your foals and look forward to your adventures on the farm.


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## ~Lisa~ (Feb 11, 2011)

As far as forums go there is not another one like this out there IMO for minis or ponies.

Yes sometimes those of us who have been here awhile see the same questions asked but that is a good thing - new people coming into the breed is wonderful.

I am on facebook alot as well but am still of the opinion that when it comes to small equine LB is a great tool that is helpful and has not yet even come close to being matched


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## WhiteTailsMinis (Feb 11, 2011)

wow, love all the comments and replies - all great points and much to consider. I've gotten some private PMs on this topic also.

Still a devoted LB member - I think I said that in the original post - was just curious if I was the only one to think things had changed here.

On the comment about FB being a sales marketing thing - that depends on whether your friends with other breeders/farms or if you wish it to remain just personal friends and family. Myself, I'm on there for the business and 90% of my "friends" are other breeders/farms so that's what my FB page is geared to - so yes I advertise. I think sometimes when you see multiple ads it is becuase first you post on your wall or profile, then another FB will pick it up and advertise it for you (as that is what their site is about). That particular site has other friends and viewers that are not your friends, so your ad gets double the exposure (meaning more people than just your own friends see it).

Mary Lou makes excellent points (doesn't she always) and I myself wouldn't want the burden of being the referree because for sure you can never make EVERYONE happy. By the way, where did the "signatures too long" post go Mary Lou? LOL I was looking for that this morning. I figure those of us that were in violation fixed it, so no need to keep it posted? ha (that's meant in fun)

I think all the comments here are great and I too will remain an LB fan -


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## WhiteTailsMinis (Feb 11, 2011)

LAminiatures said:


> I have noticed the same thing. I do read this forum daily but don't participate often. I feel like some people have changed programs and are moving towards the ASPC ponies. Maybe things are just changing and some new people are slowly trickling into the minis and time will tell. Maybe we all need to participate more for the better of the forum.
> 
> I have learned so much from this forum and enjoy reading and learning.
> 
> White Tail don't even think about not chiming in I am waiting for your foals and look forward to your adventures on the farm.



OH no worries! We're not going anywhere ......... I'm trying to think of a good topic to post so we can get some excitement going again LOL :modedit:


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## tagalong (Feb 11, 2011)

Feather1414 said:


> Personally I don't pay very much attention to this forum anymore. Why? When I joined it was very fast paced and I was learning so much.
> 
> Now though, it seems like it's always a repetition of the exact same topics and I am very bored by that.



Well, the exact same topics are bound to come up as new people want to ask about foaling stalls or clipping and so on. Topics need to get revisited. That happens on every forum.

People come and go, posting takes off for a while and then slows down - that is also normal.

But as was pointed out - any forum is what you make of it. If you do not like the topics or think things are slow - then start a topic that you find interesting and would like to discuss!

You get out of it what you put into it.





There are also a lot more forums out there and other places to post. I post on another forum that can rip along at light speed... or slow down to a crawl for a couple of weeks. We can also have heated political discussions there that never get nasty in any way... which sadly was not always the case here. That was too bad - I like those animated discussions!

I expect things will pick up as foaling season gets into high gear.


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## REO (Feb 11, 2011)

tagalong said:


> Well, the exact same topics are bound to come up as new people want to ask about foaling stalls or clipping and so on. Topics need to get revisited. That happens on every forum.
> 
> People come and go, posting takes off for a while and then slows down - that is also normal.
> 
> ...



I agree tagalong!

THERE ARE RULES BECAUSE.........

There is a difference between FB and LB. FB is owned by many and can't be sued if someone starts something personal or "goes" where they shouldn't. LB is owned by one lady, who pays for it out of her own pocket so we ALL have a place to talk about and learn about little equine. She has been threatened, and threatened to be sued in the past about things members posted.

Some people like "bear baiting" to get their kicks. Some like gentle conversation. Someone is always going to either get bored or their feelings hurt. On a site that has over 6000 members, ML tries VERY HARD to please everyone! It can't be done! But she always listens to people and works hard trying!!!

ML has done her best to have something here for everyone. Including a free sale board. So there's no need to post about having a horse for sale on the forums. There's a sale board for that! The only way ML can keep LB going is through paid advertisers. And they would not pay to advertise if everyone was posting away about what they were selling all over all the forums.

LB is a family place with people from all ages and personalities. Debates are fun! (I enjoy reading them myself) But when they get heated or personal (and they did) people run to ML to complain. What then is ML supposed to do??? Either way LB gets a bad rap from one side or the other. I don't feel that's fair.

See, all of the above are the REASONS there are rules here. Why there HAS to be rules (which most people here don't read)

I'm just afraid all of this will give ML one too many headaches and make her throw up her hands and shut LB down. I would rather have LB any way it has to be than not at all.





LB is a place for little HORSE people to come together. This is a forum FAMILY. I for one would be lost without it.

If people want to go to other places to talk about other stuff etc, they know that if they have a question or need help with horses, LB is always here.





LB is like a HOUSE with a HUGE family under one roof. That's why there has to be house rules.

Thank you ML for EVERYTHING.


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## mydaddysjag (Feb 11, 2011)

I've only been frequenting LB since 2006, but have defiantly noticed a big decrease in new posts, even on the sales board!

There is only one other forum I frequent, which honestly, it just as slow, it just has more pages of topics.

I wish the forum was a moving a bit quicker, It's freezing outside, and Im cooped up in the house. Sure wish there was something worth reading.


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## Vertical Limit (Feb 11, 2011)

REO said:


> I agree tagalong!
> 
> THERE ARE RULES BECAUSE.........
> 
> ...


Thank you Robin! I totally agree! People just don't understand the position Mary Lou is in and WHY we do what we do. Anyway, I just hope people take the time to REALLY READ and absorb this!!!!! I would love for others try to take on this job! Maybe then they would get it!


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## Marty (Feb 11, 2011)

Where other forums can be nasty and chew you up, LB is very tame and welcoming.

LB is a really nice forum to learn about miniatures and lets not forget the archives which store a lot of good information. There is really no comparrison between LB and FB. A lot of the older posters sold out but many of them still lurk. I feel their expertise is still very valuable and would like to see them return and chime in.

Then there will be those people that only show up here in spring and summer to show you their foals and show wins only for more free advertisement and the rest of the time they don't even comment on a thread.

I haven't posted a lot anymore on the main forum because I've had nothing really to offer, but lookout because I have about 50 Neverending Sagas saved up for a rainy day!

LB is still the best place on the internet in my world.


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## WhiteTailsMinis (Feb 11, 2011)

Agree with Reo there have to be rules. I never complained about the rules.

I never mentioned sales in my post - I was simply asking if others thought it had gotten slow here (meaning the forums) or was I imagining things. I was worried maybe I was an evil person for enjoying alittle debate here or there ..............

I agree that the board is the place for sales (only) and I use that feature. I don't post as often anymore though as nothing is moving unless they are few hundred bucks and I won't comment on that.

I agree its nice to see fresh faces and will admit that even though questions for help and advice might be repeats along the way, what I notice is that different people answer now and sometimes the feedback is different - always nice to get different views from what works for different people no matter the subject. Its always interesting to hear what others practice at their place. We've made changes along the way over the years based on what we've learned through others experiences. I still have my experts I call of course, but I do make notes from things here too. I don't mind the simple questions as the feedback is always interesting and this IS supposed to be the ultimate place for newbies and oldies to go to for help. Kudos to LB on that.

Wow, I see my last post has a little man holding a MOD sign ............ LOL Too funny


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## WhiteTailsMinis (Feb 11, 2011)

while I"m enjoying the replies and agreeing with most - may I please say for others that join here (some don't read all the threads from beginning to end before they comment) - I *never* mentioned another forum by name nor did I ever compare other forums to this one in my original post. I am well aware of the differences between here and others and have no complaints whatsover. If I want strictly miniature conversation, here is where I"ll be always. Made tons of friends through LB.

I simply asked if people were spending more time elsewhere as I noticed the slow down of traffic here. Some comments being made don't say so but are replies to other comments/replies not necessarily mine.

With that said, it's getting quite interesting


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## Reble (Feb 11, 2011)

Yes, to your question, it has slowed down, but I know myself, there is a lot of work when posting things.

and than no replys





Again the like button might just help..

Sorry ML to bring this up so often.

I go back and forth with the two sites, but do find when I post on the other, get some reply's even if it is just the like button. Does make you think it is worth while.

This topic has been the most said in a long time


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## TheCaseFamily00 (Feb 11, 2011)

I love it here and feel like I'v made some good friends.I just have to add that I enjoy and respect others opions but I don't like to see mean comments made to anyone. I understand when a intervention is made and also respect that,thanks everyone for your hard work



.


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## Marty (Feb 11, 2011)

awwwww Whitetail I don't think you could be evil if you tried


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## Reignmaker Miniatures (Feb 11, 2011)

WhiteTailsMinis said:


> https://www.miniaturehorsetalk.com/data/emoticons/default_biggrin.png[/IMG] )


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## Relic (Feb 11, 2011)

Well l think for sure it's gotten a lot more slack in the past year...and yes like it or not even some days down right boring. l limit my computer time to 2 hours throughout the day and used to read only LB but find there's little to spend 2 hours on lately so have ventured to other sites. l so miss a lot of the old time posters that used to be here and wish they were still around..


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## Minimor (Feb 12, 2011)

I don't really think FB or any other site has anything to do with things being slow here. I also don't think it has anything to do with the fact that more people are changing from straight Miniatures to pony/Mini breeding (as one poster seemed to imply in her post



)

Winter time may seem like the time when people would have more time on the computer, but for me it doesn't work that way. Winter, especially this winter when we have so much snow and recently some really cold weather, makes my chores take longer. I have to haul warm water out to the horses, horses are in their sheds more so cleaning takes longer, feeding takes longer, especially when I'm having to wrestle with round bales as I am this year....so I'm on the computer less. When I am on, I tend to read but not post so often.

To be honest, sometimes I would post more but I read through the responses and think 'why bother'. Recently I've seen a couple posts that gave really poor--actually wrong--advice, but I'm tired, I'm short on time, and I just don't bother posting a better answer.

Here people are busy with other things in winter--kids have skating, hockey, backetball, school events, so parents are busy with getting kids to/from those events. People are taking winter holidays. There are lots of other things to do in the winter.

I do also think that the ban on certain topics puts a damper on things. I have noticed that there are so many things that are NOT being discussed here--events that I would think many people do have an interest in talking about otherwise, so I'm very surprised that there's not a word said here (or on the back porch) about them--I'm assuming it is because they "might" end up branching out into things political. So yes, I'm sure that a number of people do go to someplace where they can talk about those things without having to worry that some part of the discussion might end up being 'politics' even though the actual topic isn't political.


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## Minimor (Feb 12, 2011)

ML-I can appreciate those reasons, but those kinds of things aren't what I was referring to in my post.

There was no mention of things like the shooting in Tucson, or the events in Egypt....or so many other things like that....none of these things are 'politics' as such, but any one of them could end up leading to some 'political comment' being made--and I assume that is why these things have not been brought up here.

In this vein, if 9/11 were to happen today--we couldn't even talk about it here because it might lead back to politics.


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## Jill (Feb 12, 2011)

Mary Lou - LB said:


> So on with the Sara Palin slams!


I'm still a fan! GO Sarah!!! Sarah Palin and her energizing of the conservative movement is a part of the reason the 2010 elections went so RIGHT





As she said: "People know something has gone terribly wrong with our government and it has gotten so far off track. But people also know that there is nothing wrong in America that a good old-fashioned election can't fix."


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## REO (Feb 12, 2011)

Behind the scenes...............

People don't post for all to see who or what they're complaining about. They email ML and complain. She gets "it" from both sides of all things. She tries HARD to walk down the middle and make everyone happy! If she allows something, someone complains, if she closes down something people complained about, others complain.

It isn't easy, but she tries! And we're all LUCKY to have ML and LB!

People tend to look at things only from their own perspective. (it's natural) But if there's anything here that you don't care for, please know there's a reason for it. And the decision was made after a LOT of thought.

ML doesn't just UP and do something, she does it because enough people complained or is something she feels is best for everyone here.

DON'T RETREAT, JUST RELOAD

Sara Palin

IMO, we have a great mix of different personailites that make for a lot of interest!!!!


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## Jill (Feb 12, 2011)

REO said:


> DON'T RETREAT, JUST RELOAD
> 
> Sara Palin


I love that, Robin



:yeah


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## Shari (Feb 12, 2011)

I just post to what interests me and leave the other's because I have no interest. Not interested in Politics, Religion or such. Have no interest in any thing aggressive, life is too short to deal with that.

Things about mini horses, or any horse, garden's, other pets and how people are doing are good posts to me.



And I think I spend about the same amount of time here as I used too.


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## tagalong (Feb 12, 2011)

The only thing I disliked about the poltical threads on the back porch was that if you had a differing opinion in any of those threads or had a concern to share that the original poster did not approve of.... well, that was not welcome. That kind of stifled discussion/debate.

*All opinions should be respected* and shared - not just those who post the most and the LOUDEST....



Forums are meant to be a sharing of ideas, thoughts and concerns - and yet that concept seemed to be a bit hard to embrace at times... and then some wanted to get personal and at times, downright hostile and rude. It did not matter if you had personal experience and factual insight to share about something - if it was not what some wanted to hear it could get very ugly - and often did.



And then, regrettably, we all would get caught up in the drama and just make things worse.

*That was what shut down the political threads... not the topics themselves. *





We *all* need to remember that ALL opinions should be treated with respect and welcomed - no matter how heated a discussion may get or whether we agree with that opinion or not.


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## Magic (Feb 12, 2011)

The main reason that I slowed down posting here is because I was warned about posting horses for sale-- and I hadn't. It was just one of those "how many of what do you have" threads, and I mentioned that I was keeping some of the younger horses and some would be sold, but I never said which ones, never mentioned names or any specifics. It definitely wasn't a sales ad or any kind of attempt to sell on the forum. To have been here for so many years, basically since the very beginning, and to be officially warned, as in "you get three warns and you are banned", well, that freaked me out. I'd never had any kind of warnings in the past, ever. And I didn't and don't want to be banned, so I figured I'd only post when I felt a strong need to, and I would have to read my posts over carefully to make sure that I hadn't said those four letter words "sale" and "sell".





Even writing this post makes me nervous. I feel like I'm walking on eggshells....


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## Mona (Feb 12, 2011)

tagalong said:


> *All opinions should be respected* and shared - not just those who post the most and the LOUDEST....
> 
> 
> 
> ...






:yeah



VERY, VERY true words here in this post!!! *Let's all* keep this in mind and be RESPECTFUL of each other, because if not, we may just end up with political threads being banned once again!





Another reason not yet mentioned as to why threads are often locked or deleted is because the original poster asks us to.


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## Jill (Feb 12, 2011)

I'm not sure who wasn't careful before. It's been awhile and I forget... but I remember it got pretty heated because there are simply a lot of people who cannot accept well backed up opinions if they're not the same opinions they choose to hold. That brings it right back to exactly what I like most about FaceBook. Say whatever you want, share whatever news you want, and the "worse" that can happen is someone might defriend you. It's great to be able to say and read what you like without worrying about your thoughts being deleted or (worse) edited.

One thing I specifically do remember others being outraged about, but it's still how I feel, is that when it comes to US politics, the only opinions that matter to ME personally are those of other US Citizens. Do I think non-US Citizens shouldn't chime in on threads that are specifically about US Politics? No. However, no one is obligated to respond to or read posts that are of no interest to them no matter how repeatedly someone tries to draw them into a discussion.

I wouldn't ask someone who's only lived in New York if living in Florida would be a good idea. I wouldn't ask my attorney for accounting advice. I wouldn't ask someone who has only owned goats how to train a miniature horse. To me, it is only logical when it comes to some specific topics to value the opinions of those who "live the life" over those who observe from a distance.

And, Lori, I think I understand how you feel. I can't remember being accused of trying to sell horses on the message board, but I was told to stop doing something once yet I hadn't done what I was told to stop doing. It's been MANY years ago (way before the political stuff) but you know what -- I still remember it. It honestly hurt my feelings, which is why I still remember it. Many of the people on LB aren't just people on the internet to me, so being told to stop something I hadn't done (and was later told by the person who told me to stop that she really hadn't seen it herself) "stung". So, I think I can really relate to what you're expressing above.

PS is the hit count / popularity rising yet on this thread?


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## Minimor (Feb 12, 2011)

As I recall, Jill, you also didn't want to talk to US citizens who are no longer living in the US....because they apparently don't know anything about US politics or programs since they now live elsewhere with different politics and different programs?

It's one thing asking a NY resident about living in FL, but quite another thing to ask a former FL resident who now lives in NY? The former FL-now-NY resident can give a good comparison of the two places. Just sayin' because overall it really makes no difference to me who anyone does or doesn't talk to!


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## Jill (Feb 12, 2011)

While I don't remember saying that, what you outline is really pretty much how I feel in that it's the opinions of US Citizens who live in the USA that interest me when it comes to US politics. However, that doesn't mean I think others "don't know anything". It does mean that I know what opinions are of interest to me regarding US Politics.


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## hobbyhorse23 (Feb 12, 2011)

Jill said:


> I love LB and always will, however, I do think FaceBook "offers" some stiff internet time competition for any message board these days.


It definitely does. I know I find it very easy to post status updates from the shows, maybe even a few pix, and then by the time I get home I've already been congratulated by my friends and it suddenly seems like a lot of work to do a write-up for the forum when "most people" (I know that's not the case) have already heard. It seems like old news already by the time I'm home!





I realized the other day that I've had Turbo for almost a year and a half now and I don't think I've posted any picture threads except the introductory one (which was six months late too) and have only mentioned him in responding to other people's posts.



When I got Kody I was on the forum every single day reading and posted about every show, every major training accomplishment, every fun outing. I guess it's true that once you have your "second child" you don't have time anymore!



Still, if I didn't have FB I would have been on here because this is where I made my first miniature horse friends and I would have wanted to share. Now I talk to many of them on the phone and the others I see on FB.



Magic said:


> The main reason that I slowed down posting here is because I was warned about posting horses for sale-- and I hadn't. It was just one of those "how many of what do you have" threads, and I mentioned that I was keeping some of the younger horses and some would be sold, but I never said which ones, never mentioned names or any specifics. It definitely wasn't a sales ad or any kind of attempt to sell on the forum. *To have been here for so many years, basically since the very beginning, and to be officially warned, as in "you get three warns and you are banned", well, that freaked me out.* I'd never had any kind of warnings in the past, ever. And I didn't and don't want to be banned, so I figured I'd only post when I felt a strong need to, and I would have to read my posts over carefully to make sure that I hadn't said those four letter words "sale" and "sell".
> 
> 
> 
> Even writing this post makes me nervous. I feel like I'm walking on eggshells....





AppyLover2 said:


> I have to agree that there seems to be a lot of "oversight". *After I posted something once and was admonished with a "you know better than that" I felt like a child who's hand had been slapped and started losing interest, not to mention being reluctant to post.*


Exactly. In a way being suspended for awhile was a blessing- it broke my addiction to the forum. And it was an addiction! It took about 30 days before I stopped physically hurting with the urge to post!



Now I'm on here all the time because I'm bored at work when the phone doesn't ring but I barely ever visit when I'm home and won't if I get a different job unless something really spectacular happens with my horses.



Mary Lou - LB said:


> Should we allow people to fight openly with words and let this happen? ... Should we allow businesses be slammed here? What if it was your child or business?


First of all, let me agree with everyone else in saying *THANK YOU MARY LOU FOR HOSTING THIS FORUM!!* You work very, very hard for us and I do love LB. But yes, I do think we should be allowed to "fight openly with words." It is not the job of a forum host to try and make people play nice and decide what is "mean." We're adults, not kindergardners! If someone wants to say something negative about my hypothetical business, they have the right to as long as it is stated factually and respectfully. I also have the right to state my side in the same terms. And the moderator has every right to shut down the conversation after that if it starts to devolve into an catfight.



As for my child, well, I'd hope I'd taught them about correctly presenting themselves on web forums and would be using such an experience as a teachable moment.

But in the end...it isn't my forum.



It's Mary Lou's, she's trying very hard to make it work for a huge number of people, and I don't envy her the job. I want to be here so I try to play by the rules! I have thankfully never had to consider the lawsuit angle and I'll admit that's pretty scary.





And I will say that when it comes to the political discussions...CENSOR AWAY!!



That is the one topic I was so relieved to see vanish off the forum. Now that it's back...frankly, I'll be avoiding the Back Porch like the plague.

Leia


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## ohmt (Feb 12, 2011)

I'm really not much for the politics, but I do like to read up on things and sometimes I miss some things if I don't read what other people have to say. I try not to on forums though as it just reminds me how completely blind people become with politics. It is always my side against your side and not entirely about the issues at hand. There is already a topic on here about Lincoln and it says 'most famous republican'....He was an amazing president in many aspects and I could really care less what party he was with. It shouldn't matter.

Anyway, thank you ML for all that you do. I know you are probably bombarded with complaints when certain topics come up and have to do a lot of damage control that we all seem to forget about sometimes.

I for one have tried other forums and this one is by far the best. The knowledge, maturity, and willingness to help here is by far unmatched. Plus, I don't like drama-it is a complete waste of time. For all of those reasons, this forum will always be my only go to.


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## hobbyhorse23 (Feb 12, 2011)

Jill said:


> While I don't remember saying that, what you outline is really pretty much how I feel in that it's the opinions of US Citizens who live in the USA that interest me when it comes to US politics. However, that doesn't mean I think others "don't know anything". *It does mean that I know what opinions are of interest to me.*


You've got every right to feel that way. I think what rubbed some of us wrong was that you then implied that because their opinion was not of interest to _you_, personally, they should not comment on those threads. What those coherent, logical, mature adults had to say from a wider world perspective was very interesting to others! If you start a conversation on an open forum anyone is invited to reply. You don't have to care about what they say but implying they don't have a right to say it is something else.

Gah, I'm already getting sucked in! :arg!






Run away, run away!

*hustles out the door and vanishes into the driving forum*

Leia


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## Sue_C. (Feb 12, 2011)

> The main reason that I slowed down posting here is because I was warned about posting horses for sale-- and I hadn't. It was just one of those "how many of what do you have" threads, and I mentioned that I was keeping some of the younger horses and some would be sold, but I never said which ones, never mentioned names or any specifics. It definitely wasn't a sales ad or any kind of attempt to sell on the forum. To have been here for so many years, basically since the very beginning, and to be officially warned, as in "you get three warns and you are banned", well, that freaked me out.


Me too, I had posted a reply that mentioned that I was now driving a mare that I had had for sale but decided to keep...and got "THE warning"...ticked me off, been a member for a zillion years, have read tons of other posts with actual references to horses_ for_ sale...yet get my fingers virtually slapped for NOT having one for sale. LOLOL! Poor mod must of been having a bad day.


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## Jill (Feb 12, 2011)

hobbyhorse23 said:


> You've got every right to feel that way. I think what rubbed some of us wrong was that you then implied that because their opinion was not of interest to _you_, personally, they should not comment on those threads...


See, that's just the thing. No, I didn't imply because I'm personally not interested in "outside" opinions on the subject of US Politics that all people from other nations who want to express their opinions shouldn't post them. What I meant and still mean is that those people shouldn't act like, or insist that, I myself am obligated to get into online discussions with them on the subject because I myself have very little interest about their input on that specific topic. While others may find outside opinions of US Politics interesting, I personally don't. That's really all there is to it. Anyone can post anything they want and those who choose to read and/or respond are welcome to do so as far as I've ever been concerned.


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## barnbum (Feb 12, 2011)

Magic said:


> The main reason that I slowed down posting here is because I was warned about posting horses for sale-- and I hadn't. It was just one of those "how many of what do you have" threads, and I mentioned that I was keeping some of the younger horses and some would be sold, but I never said which ones, never mentioned names or any specifics. It definitely wasn't a sales ad or any kind of attempt to sell on the forum. To have been here for so many years, basically since the very beginning, and to be officially warned, as in "you get three warns and you are banned", well, that freaked me out. I'd never had any kind of warnings in the past, ever. And I didn't and don't want to be banned, so I figured I'd only post when I felt a strong need to, and I would have to read my posts over carefully to make sure that I hadn't said those four letter words "sale" and "sell".
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That happened to me months ago (maybe a year?)--and I had not mentioned anyone was for sale!! I felt picked on. Things were more fun when photo posts got more replies. If I post photos here--even once a year, I might get 6 replies. When I post on another forum (not MHR) I get 6 replies in 3 minutes. So, why would I take the time to upload to photobucket? The views are high, but so few reply. I come here about twice a month now simply because there's not much new to read, but one reason I don't add many replies is because I have to wait a minute between each one and that makes me NUTS. Time is limited.





PS I don't have a FB page...or whatever it's called.


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## Reignmaker Miniatures (Feb 12, 2011)

hobbyhorse23 said:


> Now I'm on here all the time because I'm bored at work when the phone doesn't ring but I barely ever visit when I'm home and won't if I get a different job unless something really spectacular happens with my horses.


I hope then that you don't get a different job





I for one would miss the input from you on the driving forum a great deal


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## WhiteTailsMinis (Feb 12, 2011)

I'm loving all the participation in this thread - fun fun fun and great hearing from everyone - like old times





Everyone has good & valid points - interesting to see everyones perspectives on so many different topics within this thread - enjoying reading all the inputs - thank you


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## tagalong (Feb 12, 2011)

> I think what rubbed some of us wrong was that you then implied that because their opinion was not of interest to you, personally, they should not comment on those threads. What those coherent, logical, mature adults had to say from a wider world perspective was very interesting to others! If you start a conversation on an open forum anyone is invited to reply.


Very true.



> Anyone can post anything they want and those who choose to read and/or respond are welcome to do so as far as I've ever been concerned.


*Jill*, to be fair, you repeatedly made it very clear that you were not keen on anyone who did not meet your "criteria" posting on any threads you may have started or taken part in. One had to be a US citizen living here to qualify to have an opinion and not a US citizen living elsewhere - not even someone who has lived here legally and paid taxes etc. for over ten years like me. Or even someone interested in US politics - or any politics. Or anyone with actual experience of the subject at hand who was not a US citizen.

The very nature of a forum is that anyone who is interested in the topic that is started can post. They do not have to pass a test to be able to do so or meet some kind of conditions that determine if their opinions/concerns are acceptable - beyond being a member of that forum and posting in a way that respects the opinions of others.


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## CharlesFamily (Feb 13, 2011)

Okay - jumping in on this fun thread! On other message boards I am on (NHR) I have seen the same thing happening. So many of us have connected on FB, that it feels like a duplication of posting onto the other board, too. Now, that said, I don't have a lot of mini horse contacts on FB because I am not a large farm, I don't breed and don't plan to breed, and we are just now getting back into showing. So, anything mini horse related I get here.

I know a lot of people don't know me - if you look at my "posts count" it would seem I'm not on here much. BUT - I lurked here for YEARS before I officially joined. Even if you don't know me, I feel like I know everyone here personally. I have two websites I visit every day - FB and here. I read almost every topic, but I just don't reply much because sometimes it does seem like a waste of time just to add a "Great job!" or "Very nice" to a topic that has already had those sentiments repeated 27 times prior.

Also, since I don't breed and haven't been in the show ring in years, I don't answer a lot of questions, but leave that to people with more experience, unless I feel like I have something valuable to add. That said, I love reading everything and soaking up all the information - especially on the driving forum as we have plans to get our boys driving this year!

I have learned SO much from LB, and while it has slowed down, it is still the best place to go for information. I never posted on any "controversial" topics. I take things too personally - I know this about myself, so I just stay out of it and enjoy reading them! But just like any train wrecks - they are a huge draw and you just can' t help watching!

Barbara


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## Jill (Feb 13, 2011)

tagalong said:


> *Jill*, to be fair, you repeatedly made it very clear that you were not keen on anyone who did not meet your "criteria" posting on any threads you may have started or taken part in...


Tag, that's simply not the case. You repeatedly kept trying to "make" me discuss US Political issues with you and I told you why I was not interested in discussing US Politics with you (for the same reasons I went into on this thread). Then you wanted to discuss why I wasn't interested in a discussion.

If other LB members want to discuss US Politics with Non-US Citizens, that's completely up to them -- just as the fact that I'm not interested in doing so was, is and will always be completely up to me. (<--- maybe I'll make this my Back Porch Political Thread Disclaimer?!?!)

While I'm sure many people do not share my perspective on this matter, I don't know how I could make the way I feel about it any plainer or less open to being twisted into something it's not.


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## kaykay (Feb 13, 2011)

Please do not bring back political posts. I saw sides of people I never wanted to see. I really hope that doesnt come back. I think they did so much damage here and that is when so many left.

I do know several other people that have been warned about the whole "sell" thing and I do think that it is over moderated. For many of us this is what we do. Buy, show, train and sell horses. It can be hard to write posts when your being so careful not to ever say "sell"

Seems like lately every post has the "edited by mod" sign.

But I strongly agree with not letting posts attacking someone stay. As said the problem is you usually only get one side of the story. Its just really unfair. Once you get both sides the truth is usually in the middle.

And I think people have no idea how real the threat of lawsuits is. Even if you know you will win to defend yourself is very stressful and expensive.


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## Jill (Feb 13, 2011)

Just a question here with the risk of liability -- are there ways to have insurance policies protect message board owners? I have no idea, not my line of work obviously BUT I know having held professional E&O insurance since 1995 gives me a lot of peace of mind regarding what I do do for a living. Since so many lines of work do hold E&O policies, it makes me wonder what protections are available to those who own message boards?


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## kaykay (Feb 13, 2011)

Jill I dont think there is such a thing? I know when you sign up as a member on pretty much any forum you hit an "agree" button that the forum owner cannot be held liable for statements made but as we know from the past that doesnt keep someone from filing. Ughh.

I think a lot of people forget they ever made that agreement when they sign up as a member on a forum.


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## Jill (Feb 13, 2011)

It just has my wheels turning. I was surprised last year when a famous comedian mentioned his E&O policy so I know it covers a diverse number of situations.

Also, I wonder when there is liability in a message board situation, how far does that liability extend? I'm going to guess it extends to more than just a message board owner. Surely there's protection in place for the more commercially successful message boards but the price tag might be very steep.

I'm such a nerd. It's just got my wheels turning on "what if" scenarios and makes me appreciate even more the protection I have with my E&O policy and the incorporation of my firm -- but the flipside of wondering what can others do for protection has my wheels turning.


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## Minimor (Feb 13, 2011)

I would suggest that anyone who doesn't like the political threads should just not read those topics. They are usually pretty obvious from the topic titles.

And for me, if I don't like the turn a topic takes, well, I generally don't take opposing posts personally. I don't expect my opinion to agree with the opinion of everyone else, and for those who become rude, that's their shortcoming, not mine. Walk away. When someone's mind is made up, no one else is going to change it, so there's no point in even trying. Post your view, even defend it if you feel it's necessary, but beyond a certain point when the thread is just going in circles and there's nothing more to be said--or no point in saying anything mores--just walk away and don't come back to that thread.


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## hobbyhorse23 (Feb 13, 2011)

Reignmaker Miniatures said:


> I hope then that you don't get a different job
> 
> 
> 
> ...






I very much enjoy teaching new drivers the way I was mentored and a forum like this is the best way to do that when you don't live near someone. FB is never going to replace that!



CharlesFamily said:


> That said, I love reading everything and soaking up all the information - especially on the driving forum as we have plans to get our boys driving this year!










kaykay said:


> Please do not bring back political posts. *I saw sides of people I never wanted to see.* I really hope that doesnt come back. I think they did so much damage here and that is when so many left.


 So true! I was getting literally sick to my stomach sometimes and whether you read the actual threads or not, the vitriol poisoned interactions all over the forum.



kaykay said:


> I do know several other people that have been warned about the whole "sell" thing and I do think that it is over moderated. For many of us this is what we do. Buy, show, train and sell horses. It can be hard to write posts when your being so careful not to ever say "sell"






I know it's very easy for things to slip over the line so they're doing their best to stop it in its tracks, but yipes. Selling is a fact of life. If the person is really trying to advertise the horse they're either going to use the saleboard or cross that line into specific details, at which point a mod can slap their wrist. Simply mentioning in the course of a non-sale-related, totally topical post that at one time or another you might have parted with a horse or are thinking of parting with a horse shouldn't be cause for a personal message from a mod. (And I have never had a horse for sale so I don't think I'm too biased on this particular issue.)

By the way- thank you Mary Lou for allowing this thread to go on uncensored!



It's been rather refreshing and we really do appreciate everything you and the other mods do. It's nice to be able to discuss things however.

Leia


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## SampleMM (Feb 13, 2011)

I believe Mary Lou already said that the political threads are allowed now............








I may not have posted much on those threads but I find Jill and many other's points of view very interesting. So, I am glad that they are back and that's why the US is so great......FREEDOM.

You have a choice to not read those type of threads or you are FREE to. I thank Marlene for starting this thread and now LB is starting to feel like it used to feel......FUN!


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## HGFarm (Feb 13, 2011)

I never even had a FB page til last week, and from what I have seen, in my own opinion, it will NEVER compare to LB. Here, I dont have to bounce from page to page to keep up on all the different conversations, and not all the folks on FB are into horses like everyone here has a common interest. I am not into computer games and all that other stuff on FB either.

I LOVE seeing everyones new foals, new purchases and all that here and experiences with medical, training and health things that you find on here....

Yes I have also noticed the slowing of conversations, however in my opinion, this is the place to come to keep up with registration info and possible rule changes and what's going on out there in the Mini world really. FB will never take the place of this Forum.


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## Mona (Feb 13, 2011)

> Seems like lately every post has the "edited by mod" sign.


Kay, the reason you are seeing more mod edit signs within posts is not due to "over-moderating". We have been moderating the same for many years, but were just editing the offending portions from the posts, but were not using that icon. It addition of the icon is something we just started using more frequently because in the past, no, the average reader did not know the posts were edited, but the OP did, and they would think "something happened" to their message because portions were edited and/or deleted, so they would "fix it" and put back what we took out, so we decided rather than having to do everything twice in mnay cases, or having to send people messages every time (which we should not have to if they would read and follow the forum rules as set out on the *Rules and Etiquette* page) explaining what we did and why, we would just insert the icon so they knew it was a mod that edited their post and not something that mysteriously happened.







> I know it's very easy for things to slip over the line so they're doing their best to stop it in its tracks, but yipes. Selling is a fact of life.* If the person is really trying to advertise the horse they're either going to use the saleboard or cross that line into specific details, at which point a mod can slap their wrist.* Simply mentioning in the course of a non-sale-related, totally topical post that at one time or another you might have parted with a horse or are thinking of parting with a horse shouldn't be cause for a personal message from a mod. (And I have never had a horse for sale so I don't think I'm too biased on this particular issue.)






Sorry, but not quite so! I WISH it was that simple! You say they are adults, but MANY times they act like children, just pushing and pushing the limits. Then there is a lot of the, "why did she and I can't?", acting all innocent when one was just "mentioning" a sale and the other was an all-out sales pitch but made up in a different way so as trying to make it seem as if it wasn't. Believe me, people can get pretty "creative" and WILL and DO push those limits. Give them an inch, they take a mile! This went on so much that we got to the point where enough was enough and if certain people wanted to ruin it for everyone, then so be it, and we had to shorten the leashes!


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## tagalong (Feb 13, 2011)

> Tag, that's simply not the case. You repeatedly kept trying to "make" me discuss US Political issues with you and I told you why I was not interested in discussing US Politics with you (for the same reasons I went into on this thread). Then you wanted to discuss why I wasn't interested in a discussion.


J*ill* - NO ONE ever "made" you discuss anything or even _tried_ to "make" you discuss anything - I never even started a single thread - let alone multiple threads - to "make" anyone have any particular discussion or initiate a topic. Not once. We just posted in the same threads - as everyone is welcome to do and did - _and you repeatedly told me and many others that our opinions/experiences were not appreciated/wanted._ No one tried to force you to do that, no one made you do it, no one badgered you into anything as you seem to be implying. You just did not want some of us to post or have an opinion on certain threads. And when you tell people that over and over again, _*of course*__ they are going to ask why. _





But I hope that is in the past and we can move forward.





I do hope that will not be the case this time around... and *everyone* can discuss the topics and share their experiences, concerns and opinions about any political topic *freely*. A respectful, interesting debate/discussion helps everyone learn about both the topics and the posters - and maybe gives them a different view on a topic that they might not have considered before...







> It addition of the icon is something we just started using more frequently because in the past, no, the average reader did not know the posts were edited, but the OP did, and they would think "something happened" to their message because portions were edited and/or deleted, so *they would "fix it" and put back what we took out,*


Guilty as charged! A few times I thought I was losing my mind! I just _knew_ I had typed Something or Other about something or other and yet when I checked the thread a few minutes later - what I thought I had written was not there! HUH? So I figured I had hit the wrong key or something, and I would redo it....and still not see it.... and redo it... so for me the little edit smilie would have helped! <<< is a dork


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## Vertical Limit (Feb 13, 2011)

Mona said:



> Sorry, but not quite so! I WISH it was that simple! You say they are adults, but MANY times they act like children, just pushing and pushing the limits. Then there is a lot of the, "why did she and I can't?", acting all innocent when one was just "mentioning" a sale and the other was an all-out sales pitch but made up in a different way so as trying to make it seem as if it wasn't. Believe me, people can get pretty "creative" and WILL and DO push those limits. Give them an inch, they take a mile! This went on so much that we got to the point where enough was enough and if certain people wanted to ruin it for everyone, then so be it, and we had to shorten the leashes!


If you were truly one of the "innocent" ones that posted SALES without the intent of sales, we understand how you must feel. But it just got to the point, like Mona said, that way to many people were taking advantage of the Forum. There has been a pinned topic at the top of this Forum since Sept. of 2009 about having to crack down on this! We had to moderate the same for everyone. So if you mentioned SALES you got a warning no matter what your intent. Some of the adults are like children and it was kind of comical how creative they tried to be. What is good for one is good for all, even though some might not see it that way. I have been moderating this Forum for 10 plus years or so and I don't even look at the names when I read and have to give out a warning until I send the actual Private Message. We DO NOT play favorites!

Some of my very good friends on here have been slapped by me. It's NOT PERSONAL! But the mods have got to do their jobs to keep this Forum a nice and friendly place for everyone. So if you are one of the ones feeling like you are scared to post anything, JUST READ THE RULES AND FOLLOW THEM. There are not that many! Don't let the fact that you have been warned keep you from taking part in the discussions here. We do NOT like banning anyone and ratio of people banned to the members is minute and insignificant. It takes a lot to get banned. It's just sad that a few people on this Forum that do push the limits ruin it for others! But again we have to do the same for everyone or else we get accused of playing favorites.



Nobody wants this job! We can't win for losing no matter what we do.

And to be quite honest, I am, and always have been, up for the good debates. I love them. All you have to do is look at the number of hits they get and you can see how very popular they are! Nobody make anyone read anything they don't want to. And saying you will not visit the Back Porch because of political debates or religious debates, etc, to me is kind of ridiculous. Read the topics you want and stay away from the rest. Nobody is forcing anyone to read anything! After all it says right under the Back Porch Forum



> A "gathering place" for all of us to discuss almost anything "NHR". *PLEASE NOTE: Some topics may be very controversial... If you can't take the heat, don't read them!!*


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## Magic (Feb 13, 2011)

I've read the rules. And followed them. But when you are posting in a thread about your horses and write something like "I can't decide which foals to sell this year, if any, I want to keep them all" and then get a First Official Warning, no heads up, no editing of the post, just "two more strikes and you're out", it can be worrisome. I didn't dare post anything at all after that, for a very long time.


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## O So (Feb 13, 2011)

Magic said:


> I've read the rules. And followed them. But when you are posting in a thread about your horses and write something like "I can't decide which foals to sell this year, if any, I want to keep them all" and then get a First Official Warning, no heads up, no editing of the post, just "two more strikes and you're out", it can be worrisome. I didn't dare post anything at all after that, for a very long time.


That and when you are talking about looking at a horse or something. Can't mention where, even though you didn't give any info on what to look for or anything. Was just saying I was looking at a horse on a certain website ( can't mention its name or initials. Not trying to sell it, not trying to show where it was at, and not saying I wanted someone to sell me one.

I was pretty mad when I saw it was deleted and had the warning, but I just kept my mouth shut an let it go. Life is to short. I just don't mention that sort of stuff anymore, even though I was never trying to sell or post a link or anything.

If I have certain questions I will PM or ask on another forum. That way I won't get banned for asking or letting people know what I am trying to do or see. This is still a great forum for info on mini care and all. I do love posting pics of my guy's and getting much need help that everyone gives! Just got to watch what you say and do here more then other places! Not that big of a deal though!


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## Amoreminiatures (Feb 13, 2011)

Been with LB since 1998 I believe.. I have enjoyed it then, enjoy it now, being in the miniature horse industry since 1992 you see folks & farms come and go, another excited newcomer who breaths alittle excitement back into the mix, a old timer stopping back to check in on US, whatever the reason, I am just happy WE have a place that we know will be here for us to learn, listen, speak opinions, make friend repair bridges and most of all share the love of these amazing little horses, whom have really no idea the impact they make on our lives.. Enjoy being a part in someway...


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## Jill (Feb 13, 2011)

Hey, Tag, your recollection and mine don't come close to matching but I hope you enjoy LB as much as I do





You didn't make threads, rather you badgered me with the same questions on many if not most of the US political threads and asked me repeatedly "why" I didn't want to debate non-US citizens. That might explain why I repeatedly voiced my opinion about who *I* am willing to discuss US Politics with and why. Capiche? Hopefully you have no further questions or concerns about my prerogative because I cannot explain it any more simply than I have (repeatedly already) on this thread.


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## Reignmaker Miniatures (Feb 13, 2011)

ML, I love LB just the way it is so for me I need nothing changed



However reading your last post made me think that one advantage to having a forum location to mention sales is for anyone who may be only slightly interested (so many sellers have made it very clear they want only 'serious' buyers) there would be a place to ask those questions that might either rule out a particular horse or convince a prospective purchaser that horse was one they really wanted to try to deal on. Just a thought.


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## Allure Ranch (Feb 13, 2011)

Mary Lou - LB said:


> Just a question to all you out there.. If we were to have a single board on this forum that allowed SALES of horses and such, and any of the "questionable posts" on the main Mini Horse Forum got moved to the SALES Forum, would you be upset then?? I am just throwing around possibilities that may help make things smoother..
> 
> Another thing is we are going to try to get a BOARD UPDATE again for the LIKE BUTTON and other features soon..
> 
> Thank you for sharing your concerns, we do listen to you… Mary Lou


_Mary Lou, I think you may have hit on something there with your question.... Its not relevant for myself but there are probably some members here on the forum that this could possibly benefit from a forum page for sales aside for the original sales board. However, you'd want to set it up so the other members could comment on the horses. As were all aware its typically of all of us to want feedback and know whether we have something of interest or not. _

_ _

_With other sites such as FB if any of us are posting photos of horses for sale it affords the ability for others comments where on occasions those conversation/comments have eventually lead to sales. This might be an effective tool for some sellers on here to gage what there offering and give the opportunity for more dialog that right now doesn't transpires. _

_ _

_The other thing is I really think that something needs to be done to distinguish when there is a member posting on the forum that is under 18 or should I say something more noticeably obvious. I realize that our profiles reflect our ages but unfortunately there are a lot of individuals that aren't computer savvy nor do they no where to look. This might help curtail some members on here from jumping the gun and slashing their throats so quickly when they post anything. _

_Really everyone just needs to remember if you can't say anything nice just don't say it.... But we all know how that goes. Ha!_

_ _

_Maybe the word YOUTH in BIG BOLD letters out by the side of there name. Just a thought.... _


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## minimomNC (Feb 13, 2011)

While I was also one to post about my horses once and mentioned I was thinking about selling a mare, I to got the "shame on you" PM. Its ok, I am an adult and while I didn't think it was an issue, I was wrong. I won't do it again. However I do not think you should make yet another spot for people to sell horses, that is what the sale board is for. But what you can do is let people post one line saying they put an ad on the sale board and their farm name, no links, no specifics. One line. I am on a big horse board that also has a sale board ( please feel blessed here, the big horse board is a sale board you have to pay for) but you can make a post about something you have for sale after you pay for the ad. Just keep in mind, there are alot of ways to say I have a horse for sale without using those exact words. Please be respectful and lets keep the board as it is.

As for the political threads, I had no issue with them, if I didn't like someones opinion, I didn't read the thread. It was my choice and is yours too. The heated threads do get pretty hot, and I have at times lost my cool with someone. I shouldn't on a public board, but not sorry either. It was how I felt at the time. I know kids feelings get hurt, but personally on a public forum, parents should be keeping up with what their children post. And last if you don't want the truth, ask for a lie.

I don't post alot, most on here don't know me and thats fine. But if you ask a question I can answer, I try to. I think posting about our daily lives keeps everyone more of a family and I know when I needed prayers, everyone here was great. I still have every post printed out when my husband passed away and for those that remember the day, Feb 26 will be six years ago. I pull those out every year and read again, it helps so much.

Anyway I think the forum is just fine the way it is, I think we need to respect what it takes to keep it going, and if we make mistakes, its ok. Thats how we learn.

Now crawling back into my shell, I hope everyone has a great week.


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## REO (Feb 13, 2011)

Good post Karen!





The youth here DO have --->



under their name to denote they are a youth.

It IS possible to say "I'm not keeping the gelding" or "I won't be keeping all of this years foals".

RATHER than saying "My gelding is on my sales list" or I'll be having my foals for sale."

It's possible to say what you're trying to say without mentioning you have a cart, horse or whatever for sale.





I'm just saying!


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## barnbum (Feb 13, 2011)

Magic said:


> I've read the rules. And followed them. But when you are posting in a thread about your horses and write something like "I can't decide which foals to sell this year, if any, I want to keep them all" and then get a First Official Warning, no heads up, no editing of the post, just "two more strikes and you're out", it can be worrisome. I didn't dare post anything at all after that, for a very long time.





> If you were truly one of the "innocent" ones that posted SALES without the intent of sales, we understand how you must feel. But it just got to the point, like Mona said, that way to many people were taking advantage of the Forum. There has been a pinned topic at the top of this Forum since Sept. of 2009 about having to crack down on this! We had to moderate the same for everyone. So if you mentioned SALES you got a warning no matter what your intent.


I can completely relate to Magic's feelings. Is there some kind of tracking device for the word "sales" so any post that mentions it gets a warning? I remember my line was something about NOT having any horses for sale--there were none on my sale page at the time! I PMd a mod--no idea who--about it, but never got a reply. Oh well... doesn't really matter anymore anyway. Shrug.


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## love_casper (Feb 13, 2011)

<----- Yep see right there, youth have a big obvious waving smiley and youth member label. Which was nice when I joined at 13... but I am now 18 and don't know how to change it! Sure would be nice to "grow out of it" lol. I have looked under every tab in my profile settings, can't find it.

Anyway as for me, being busy is most of it. The other thing is that it was always the same circle of people replying to me, and other circles replying to other people, and it was getting a bit clique-ish. When I post something and the 2 or 3 people who knew me would respond, then it would become a personal conversation between friends, and I hated feeling like I was excluding new people. Often the conversation would even switch to weekend plans or personal things between friends... and I never respond when other people's threads get like that. I can post something on FB and the people who care will have a chat over it, the people who don't will ignore it. Occasionally I would come on to post a picture, but because the groups had changed to a whole new set of people, nobody knew me, so nobody responded.

I am excited to get to know the new groups of people though. Can never have too many friends!


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## Minimor (Feb 13, 2011)

I guess I don't see how a post to the effect of "I had intended to sell this mare but then took her off the market and broke her to drive instead, and I'm sure glad that I decided to not sell her after all because she's the best driving horse I've ever had" (or something along that line, that is just one example) can earn anyone a warning? I just don't get that at all.

I can see if it's a blatant "all my foals are for sale" or "I have 3 driving horses for sale" or "I'm selling everything" or worse "I'm selling everything, check out my sales page" but what is wrong with "I sold everything on my sales list except for one mare that I've decided to keep as my personal driving horse"

If the concern is that someone will see that & contact the person asking if they'll sell that remaining horse after all....well, then it's really no different than the post saying "see all my pretty foals" and someone then contacts that person asking which ones are for sale. The foal example is likely to be more of a sales 'hint' than the post about the personal driving horse being retained, or so it seems to me.


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## wildhorses (Feb 13, 2011)

I don't post as often as some, more than others, but have some thoughts concerning this thread and the changes that I would like to see made to Lil Beginnings. I usually visit the site daily. I browse the sales page, even when I'm not really shopping for anything, and usually visit the main forum page daily, and the back porch weekly...the other forums even less frequently.

I think there is no doubt in my mind that the traffic is down on the sales board and forum of Lil Beginnings. 3, 4, or 5 years ago when I would post an add for horses for sale on the US sales board, I would usually get dozens of emails inquiring on my horses for sale each week. There were days I would be at work and check my email and every ten minutes I had new emails inquiring...I would go home from work at night and it would take me several hours each night to respond to email inquiries, making it hard to even get chores done some nights...but that was a good thing! The buyers seemed to be serious potential buyers. In the past 2 years I can honestly say that I have not sold a single horse from my adds on LB. I am not saying this to say that it is no longer an effective advertising tool, as I feel just the opposite. And even better, it's a free tool, with very reasonable rates for advertising which I greatly appreciate and take advantage of when I can. There are several factors involved. #1. We all know the economy sucks and people just aren't buying horses because they don't have the money...I have been in the same boat as everyone else. But #2) I do believe that the traffic is down on the site as a result of several factors, and the people that do visit are just browsers. I try to run a very nice add with very nice photos and can get over 100 hits on the hit counter, and not get a single inquiry from my add. It's disappointing and discouraging, but always hope the next add will be different. What disappoints me so much is that when people do email requesting information, prices, photos, video's, etc. many of us put all of this information together and send it out and not even get an acknowledgement back stating they recieved the information, thank you, not interested, anything. I believe there are many that are lurkers, that are maybe salesboard and forum "junkies" that send the same email everytime that I have advertised...to the point I know their email address by heart, and send all the info, and never hear from them again until the next time that an add is run, re-requesting the same information on the same horse or horses. That is just part of the sales game I guess. But my point is that for me the inquiries are down probably 75% from what they were two or three years ago.

One of the biggest issues I have had with the forum in the past is that there was a certain individual who very cleverly got around the rules by posting every foal born on the farm, with endless photos and an "indirect sales pitch" and sold, many, many, many horses this way. Anyone else tried it and it was deleted, but I watched this individual get by with it year after year. I have never tried that persons method, maybe I should have, but I like to follow the rules. The rules need to apply to all or none. I have wanted to ask for input on my website, show off my foals, but never have for fear of breaking the rules.

Do I think there should be a forum for sales? NO. We have a salesboard, US, Canadian, International...that is enough. If you want to sell horses on this website, do it with the salesboards, not the forum.

Do I think that there is overmoderation of the board, Yes I do. I understand the legal aspects, but it does seem anytime there is a heated debate starting about a topic it is locked or disappears. When I see a particular farm being discussed, or a particular horse being discussed in a negative manner, I think it is wrong, and that topic should be locked immedately. If someone has a bad experience with a seller, the forum isn't the place to hash it out. It's a place for advice. Yes topics will be repeated, and for those who are long time members it gets old, but there are also those who will explain clipping or showing to a newbie whether they have done it 100 times before a not. A few months ago I watched a thread that talked about selling bred mares. I took an hour out of my day to post my thoughts and opinions on this thread, and an hour later the thread had disappeared, never to be seen again. It wasn't a mean thread, was no bashing, arguing, just a discussion which a forum is for. My other pet peave is when a topic is "Moved" say from the main forum to the Back Poarch....it still appears on the main forum and stated "Moved"....whats the point...it's now on both forums taking up space. Too many topics on the forum start out with a simple question or discussion and end up taking a complete 360 turn in a direction that has nothing to do with the original topic, often with bickering between a few individuals, and it seems to be the same few that can't get along quite often...this is very discouraging not only to me from posting, but also to a newbie who might be a potential future client for all of us.

Politics on the Forum....I don't like it. If you wanna bash our president, the senate, Sarah Palin, whoever...go do it somewhere else. Join a political forum somewhere...they have to exist. I can tell you that I have seen the bad come out of some people over politics on this forum, people who I once respected. People that I would have probably considered purchasing horses from, but because of the garbage they posted on this forum about Politics, political issues, etc. it totally discouraged me, I want nothing to do with them. I also removed some of these people from my Facebook page for the same reasons. I don't care if you have your opinion, but when you have to rub it in everyones face day after day it gets old...and it's not why I joined the forum. I think it's a big mistake allowing Political issues back on the forum.

I like the forum the way it is set up at this time. I do believe the Forum is the "Gossip Column" of the miniature horse industry...and I don't mean that in a bad way. There are many lurkers behind the scenes...some of the biggest farms, biggest breeders, biggest trainers, etc. keep a very close eye on this forum, I have been told so by many of them in the past...the same with our registries, directors, etc. If you want to know whats happening in our industry, good or bad, chances are one of the first placed you will read about it is on this forum. I have learned of the death of favorite people and horses on this website, before I ever got a phone call from a friend about it. It's a truly valuable tool to our industry.

Some things I would like changed with the Lil Beginnings Salesboard:

1) I would like a simpler format for running adds. I hate the "time out" feature. You can work on typing out your add for 2 hours, getting your pictures pasted, hit the submit button and it's gone...all that work is gone because you took too long. I have gotten smart and copy/paste my text from microsoft word, but feel it's just unnecessary to have it this way.

2) I would like a "renew add" feature, so that after the 7 days is up your add isn't gone and gone for good. If you want to repost it, you just make any changes or updates you need to make, click the "Renew add" button, and the add is reposted with just a couple clicks of the mouse.

3) Uploading photos...I wish they could be uploaded directly from your hard drive, and not have to have a URL address from photobucket, your website, etc. Again just click a button, select the photo from your computer, and it's uploaded to the add. It would simplify things...and for some reason, any photo that I have put on photobucket in the past 3 years will not upload to the add where the small picture goes next to the title of the add. (anyone else have this issue) I have several photobucket accounts, and it's doing it with all of them....not within the add itself, just in the photo URL at the bottom, and yes, I am doing it correctly...if I pull a photo out from the older accounts it works. Anyways, thats off topic...

Is there competition out there for Lil Beginnings, absolutely. Do I support other websites, yes I do. In this economy I have to use every tool possible to try to sell and promote my horses and my business. However LB is still my favorite and the first one I visit daily. I appreciate having it here and hope it will never be a tool we will have to live without. Just look at what happens when there is a glitch and things go down for a a fay or two, people nearly go crazy...they want their forum and sales board back.

I posted my honest feelings and opinions only to see improvements made to this site. I have spent advertising dollars here too, so feel I have a right to voice my opinion on things. Thank you to Mary Lou and all of the people behind the scenes that make this such a pleasurable asset to our industry. Not everyone could do the job you do to keep this site running smoothly.


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## WhiteTailsMinis (Feb 13, 2011)

woweee this thread gets better and better! I"m following and reading every single post - very interesting thoughts from so many - again I'll say it - LOVE THE PARTICIPATION from everyone - been great to see all the interaction - all the suggestions - and of course the explanations from ML and staff - keep 'em coming.

Gonna take me awhile to post my thoughts on some of the comments as there have been so many - this thread moves fast and I"m trying to keep up - LOL

One thing I have noticed and like - is that even though there are some that don't totally agree - it's still not ugly - it's tasteful and done in an adult manner - clearly indicating the folks can have their preferences, that may not be exactly as someone else's but it doesn't get ugly - I even see some humor in some that are trying to make their point and stand their ground but it's still not ugly or hurtful and hasn't been editted by a mod ....... so that's good and this is a good test that shows we're all entitled to our likes/dislikes and our opinions and don't have to be slammed by someone that doesn't agree totally.

one thing that did grab my attention was the mention of the "youth" identification - I for one never picked up on that - does the member select that themselves or is it automatically attached by the forum based on age at registration of membership? I'll know to check that now. I agree with one poster that age is not an excuse to be rude - if you ask for advice or you post something you know is sure to upset folks, then don't be disrespectful when you don't like the response. I thought when I first joined LB, there was a separate forum called youth forum?


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## Mona (Feb 13, 2011)

Very well thought out and thought provoking post wildhorses. A couple of things in your post I'd like to comment on though.

Where a specific farm is being dissed or a deal has gone sour, we do not allow that and we do lock them or delete them upon discovering them. If things are mentioned and no names are used, then yes, it can stay unless it gets to the point where the OP asks for it to be closed.

I am not sure which thread about the pregnant mares you are referring to, as I wasn't around much for the past few months, but perhaps it was because it was in regards to selling?? We (mods) really cringe when those topics come up, because we know it will just lead to conflict of forum rules. We try to leave it, and edit as needed, but when it starts to get pages and pages deep and we find we are having to edit sales portions out of nearly every post in the thread, we have to resort toshutting it down. That MAY or may NOT have been the problem with the thread you referred to, I don't know for sure, but I do know there have been posts as I have described here that resulted in the thread being locked or deleted.

Then your comment about the moved posts...again, we do a lot of moderating on the forum that readers are totally unaware of, and that is another area. When people post on the wrong forum, we normally just move the topic to the correct forum without any icon or anything saying it was moved. So we might move 20 and you may only see that on one. The reason we sometimes leave it, is if it is a fairly new member of the forums, and they may not be aware of the other fourms, or they may not understand why it disappeared, not knowing to look anywhere else for it, so they post again thinking something happened to the original one. By us selecting the option to leave the notice there, they can follow the link to their post, and to the correct forum, and figure out where it is and maybe why it ended up there. Also, it is not really taking up space on both forums...the subject line remains in view, but nobody can respond to it on that forum to bring it back to the top. Only response from readers on the forum where it was moved to will bump it up. So on the original forum, it will soon go to the bottom of the page and onto the backpages fairly quickly.

As to the people that post only foals for the sake of making sales, I think many of us see that too, but if there are no sales pitches made, there is nothing we can do about it, but I do totally understand what your saying because I see it too.


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## Mona (Feb 13, 2011)

> I agree with one poster that age is not an excuse to be rude - if you ask for advice or you post something you know is sure to upset folks, then don't be disrespectful when you don't like the response. I thought when I first joined LB, there was a separate forum called youth forum?


No, age is not an excuse to be rude, but that works BOTH WAYS! I have seen youth being rude to adults, as well as adults being rude to youth, and even getting to the point where I would consider it to be "bullying". What we need to concentrate on, is not age, but courtesy towards each other, regardless of the age. And yes, when questions are asked, hnest answers should be given, but we also should take into consideration other people's feelings...it's one thing to reply honestly, and without sugar coating, but another to be downright rude in the response, and we have all seen that happen time and time again.


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## SampleMM (Feb 13, 2011)

Regarding the posting of foals.........Mona is this okay? I have only had two foals and yes I did post them. I wasn't trying to sell them but was very proud and wanted to share with friends. Is this alright? I guess I'm confused.


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## Mona (Feb 13, 2011)

SampleMM said:


> Regarding the posting of foals.........Mona is this okay? I have only had two foals and yes I did post them. I wasn't trying to sell them but was very proud and wanted to share with friends. Is this alright? I guess I'm confused.


Oh yes...most definately YES! As long as you are posting to announce your new foals (which can be done on the main forum) or later to show them off in cute pics or whatever (on the Photo/Video Forum), and as long as they are not mentioned for sale or anything, then yes, it is definately OK to do! We all love looking at foals!


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## Jill (Feb 14, 2011)

I've posted lots of pictures of ALL my foals. You wanna know how many foals I've tried to sell so far? ...





Personally, I love seeing the foal pictures even from farms who don't post often. Foals are some of the biggest news that happen at any farm and maybe that excitement is motivation to share them with LB? I'd imagine that those who have sold foals as an indirect result of pictures posted on the forum probably have some pretty nice foals at reasonable prices if a person was motivated enough to inquire privately and a sale later followed. Some farms have really nice foals, some people take exceptional photos, and some farms set very reasonable prices. It's still a "free market" system when it comes to horse sales and if someone doesn't have what others want to buy, sales don't happen.

While I don't think posts that are blatantly sales oriented should be allowed, I think there is room for some people to resent the success of those who have no problem selling their foals and then they maybe want to look towards moderator favortism or other things that really aren't a factor. Really, what's the solution? You must post at least _____ times a year before you may share your foal pictures? Blah!


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## kaykay (Feb 14, 2011)

> Politics on the Forum....I don't like it. If you wanna bash our president, the senate, Sarah Palin, whoever...go do it somewhere else. Join a political forum somewhere...they have to exist. I can tell you that I have seen the bad come out of some people over politics on this forum, people who I once respected. People that I would have probably considered purchasing horses from, but because of the garbage they posted on this forum about Politics, political issues, etc. it totally discouraged me, I want nothing to do with them. I also removed some of these people from my Facebook page for the same reasons. I don't care if you have your opinion, but when you have to rub it in everyones face day after day it gets old...and it's not why I joined the forum. I think it's a big mistake allowing Political issues back on the forum.


I so totally agree with that! I think it will be a huge step backwards but I totally get that its ML's forum and up to her. I do think though that those political posts where such a turn off to so many and will be once again. I think it changed the whole atmosphere of the board and trickled over to other subjects/main forum.

Mona what I meant when I said over moderated is the whole "sell" thing. That is what I think is overdone. I have never been warned but its because I am so careful. But again for many of us this is what we do so its very hard to have every post never say the word sell. I just know that I have had many friends dinged on it and it really hurt their feelings because 9 times out of 10 they were not trying to sell a horse just talking about it.


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## Jill (Feb 14, 2011)

As many of you know, I am very politically minded and keep up with current events. I am passionate about the subject and have been ever since I was old enough to vote.

Mary Lou has _already_ said she's allowing politics back on the back porch. Mary Lou even instigated a little back and forth with her Sarah Palin comment and it's great to see that now she's a fan (LOL!)





I guess I didn't know that allowing politics on LB was up for debate? Below is my take on what Political and Controversial topics bring to LB.

First and foremost, one great thing is I've never seen a political thread on LB that was not clearly titled so anyone could see it's political and choose to read it or not. I've never opened a thread and been surprised that it was about politics when I thought it was about which horse color you like best





If anyone can recall the actual timeline, it's been a number of years since the political threads were banned. Those threads got more views and more comments than any others I recall on LB and I've been here since the late 90's. The decline in message board participation post-dates the political threads by more than a year so there is no way the politics drove "the people" away





The political and controversial threads will draw people here and while they're here, they will also peak in on miniature horse related threads. I know that I've come here to follow this thread and as a result noticed and remarked on miniature horse threads that I would not have even noticed if not for choosing to check up on this particular thread. It's going to work the same way for many other members, too





So if you don't like political conversations -- either because they don't interest you, you don't like controversy, you don't choose to pay attention to what's going on these days, or any imaginable ETC. -- you will have no trouble avoiding the political discussions but you will enjoy increased viewing and participation on the miniature horse threads that I'm sure do interest you


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## kaykay (Feb 14, 2011)

> I guess I didn't know that allowing politics on LB was up for debate? Below is my take on what Political and Controversial topics bring to LB.


I think we are still allowed to give our opinions on it? This is a prime example of what I am talking about LOL. Now Jill you know I shared my awesome chocolate coconut cake recipe with you



, but that sentence comes off very superior and like no other opinions matter but yours. Now I get that is probably not how you intended it, but its how it comes off to ME.



> The political and controversial threads will draw people here and while they're here, they will also peak in on miniature horse related threads. I know that I've come here to follow this thread and as a result noticed and remarked on miniature horse threads that I would not have even noticed if not for choosing to check up on this particular thread. It's going to work the same way for many other members, too


Although I dont post as much here either (due to time) I always try to post on advice threads that do not get many comments. If I see a thread that got a lot and the question is answered, then I move on.

The problem with political posts is they will bleed over to the main forum like they did before. So its not a matter of just not clicking on a political thread. Last time many people went after others that didnt agree with them on political threads on the main forum. To me its like an infection that spreads everywhere.

I adore Mary Lou and only want the best for this forum as I have been a long time member too. This forum is really close to my heart as I have seen so much good come from here. I have never seen any good come from a political thread. Just a lot of negativity, hurt feelings and bashing.


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## Jill (Feb 14, 2011)

kaykay said:


> I think we are still allowed to give our opinions on it? This is a prime example of what I am talking about LOL. Now Jill you know I shared my awesome chocolate coconut cake recipe with you
> 
> 
> 
> , but that sentence comes off very superior and like no other opinions matter but yours. Now I get that is probably not how you intended it, but its how it comes off to ME.


Well, see, that's how things become personal. Anyone who got what I was saying would gather THE opinion that matters the most isn't mine, yours or another member's. It's Mary Lou's



But since others were still debating it, I felt like giving my two cents. There's nothing "superior acting" about doing so


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## tagalong (Feb 14, 2011)

> If anyone can recall the actual timeline, it's been a number of years since the political threads were banned


Actually - I checked and there were still some at the end of July, 2010... so not as long ago as it seems. And I agree that if one does not like those threads, then they are easy to avoid.







> So on with the Sara Palin slams!


*ML* did not say she was a fan there ^ - she just said that Palin could be discussed freely...


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## Jill (Feb 14, 2011)

tagalong said:


> Actually - I checked and there were still some at the end of July, 2010... so not as long ago as it seems. And I agree that if one does not like those threads, then they are easy to avoid.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Political threads on LB were banned *LONG* before last summer -- undoubtedly, you know this is the case. If you were able to dig some up, then those threads must have fallen through the cracks or experienced what money managers would call "style drift" in that they started off as one thing and evolved into another





Regarding your other remark, maybe my joke about Mary Lou's well known affection for Sarah Palin escaped you... or your current joke escapes me... "






" and I'll throw in a


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## Jill (Feb 14, 2011)

Double post, sorry!


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## wcr (Feb 14, 2011)

Just to add my 2 cents worth on a few suggestions.

I don't think you need another sales section since you have the free sales boards.

A big improvement would be to make it easier to post pics. Off a hard drive like someone suggested. I have printed out several time the 2-3 page instructions on how to post pictures, followed them and have never had a picture come up. Congratulations to those who have figured it out, but I haven't been successful and while not a computer whiz, I am more knowledgeable than many people and give up because it is too time consuming to dink with it. I don't use photobucket or any of the other similar storage sites and am not about to get involved with that stuff just to post pics on the forum.

I have posted before on this thread that as far as the sales issue, I think you are way over moderated. Every time someone gets their hands slapped and they posted innocently it hurts their feelings and it makes them angry. Period. It is human nature and the first thing they do is stop posting. I understand the rules about sales and have always respected them and blatant disregard should be moderated. BUT, just because the words sell or sales comes up in a discussion, doesn't mean people are advertising horses for sale. As in a previous post someone saying they decided not to sell their mare and broke her to drive and are very happy about it. That is not selling a horse on the forum but discussion about a decision not to sell a horse. Read between the lines and you will see that person got her feelings hurt and is still angry about being moderated.

It is my opinion that we are doing a disservice to a lot of people by moderating the sales so heavily. How many times have we seen on here people getting minis for the first time and thrilled to death about it, asking lots of questions and getting good advice? As time goes on they decide they want to show their minis and realize their much loved mini isn't competitive. Not everyone has a trained eye to pick the best conformation and asking for advice to people who are knowledgeable is the same as asking how to feed. Yes, you have allowed discussion on conformation but it gets dicey when they start asking about upgrading their herd. If I say on the forum I have X horse for sale, I deserve to have my hand slapped, my bad. But buying and selling horses is a natural part of the horse industry. The disservice comes when newer people ask the questions about upgrading and not specifically selling X horse, but asking others who have been there, done that about how to go about it and what to look for. They need the guidance and many are qualified and willing to help. This type of thing is a discussion, not sales.

Okay, I'm off my soapbox. I appreciate this forum and overall very happy with it. I am glad this topic has come up because I don't ever remember seeing it in the years I have been here. For the first time Mary Lou really has input from the people here about what we like and don't like. We are also getting input about the things we don't understand about the runnings of a public forum. I even learned the youth have the wavy happy faces, learn something new everyday


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## tagalong (Feb 14, 2011)

*Jill* - I was just smiling about the Mary Lou being a fan comment.... and that was all. Nothing "escaped" me.





And the only reason I know that some threads were still happening as late as July 2010 is that I rarely clean out my message inbox and decided I better do that yesterday. There were several messages in there from then about that big healthcare thread that was extremely political and was obviously going strong at that time. So going by the dates on those messages, some threads were still around in July 2010. There were also a lot of them throughout March 2009 - just going from old messages - and then of course there were many during the 2008 election campaign.

I_t just __*seems*__ like it has been longer than that, I think.... _


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## ~Lisa~ (Feb 14, 2011)

Mary Lou.. first let me say thank you for many years of a great forum. I personally do not think you over moderate - I do belive you are very fair in your moderation when it has to be done not something every other forum can say. Lets be honest there is no perfect forum. People go where they feel comfortable be it with thousands of members or with just a few.

You can not please everyone and I can say that after getting to page 8 on this thread well it makes ML's point pretty clear at least to me





I will still come here and check in simply becouse I firmly believe it is the best forum out there and have not yet found one that can even come in as a close second - Political threads well I may read for entertainment value but I was taught politics and religion are things to believe deeply in- and not to discuss or convince others of but hey just my beliefs and yes I must admit if this thread is any indication of what will come.. I sure I will read those threads when I am looking to pass some time and the Jerry Springer show is not on lol


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## Reble (Feb 14, 2011)

~Lisa~ said:


> I was taught politics and religion are things to believe deeply in- and not to discuss or convince others



LIKE BUTTON


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## Jill (Feb 14, 2011)

tagalong said:


> *Jill* - I was just smiling about the Mary Lou being a fan comment.... and that was all. Nothing "escaped" me.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Tag, it's not like me to confuse anyone with the facts, but politics were banned here long before last summer.

It was June 2009 (about 20 months / nearly 2 years ago) that Mary Lou announced political threads were banned. However this ban followed a previously instated one in November 2008 (that may have been lifted for a short time -- I just don't recall). It is not until now that political threads have been allowed back on LB. Trust me, if we were allowed to discuss politics on LB last summer, I'd have noticed. There were_ tons_ of interesting and exciting political matters to discuss at that point in time.

As I recall, Marty had a thread last summer regarding health care / emergency room visits that was not "supposed" to become political. While it was not Marty's intention to have a political "debate", it is not possible to have a discussion about healthcare in the USA and it not turn political. I think this thread drifted well into political waters and that this is the thread you dug up from last summer and feel represented that politics were in on going discussion on LB, when in fact, politics were not open to discussion here.

To me, this is an important point BECAUSE the activity level drop off is something that's happened over the past year or so, and it was not 2+ years in the making from what I have observed. People were not leaving LB due to the political debates which were very popular leading up to the fall 2008 elections. Those threads had SO MANY views and tons of replies. They were extremely popular.

As further evidence, just look at how "popular" and how many views this one thread has generated. I think there's a message there for those who care about activity levels and increasing participation on the message boards. 105 replies and 3029 views. I don't think there's a recent topic that can match those numbers right now.


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## tagalong (Feb 15, 2011)

> I think this thread drifted well into political waters and that this is the thread you dug up from last summer and feel represented that politics were in on going discussion on LB, when in fact, politics were not open to discussion here.


I did not dig up the thread (as it was sucked into The Void) - as I mentioned, I reread messages about it. It did turn into a political thread - and that was the final straw. I was just pointing out that it happened even after it was not supposed to... that was all.

And there must have been quite a lot of those threads in March 2009, judging from the old messages in my inbox!


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## Jill (Feb 15, 2011)

I'm just going by the official, formerly pinned, announcements that were made by Mary Lou. I think it was specifically on June 21, 2009.... but if not, it was June _something_, 2009 when the political threads were banned and stayed banned and stayed banned until a few days ago. So we are talking about a nearly 2 year span during which political threads were disallowed. Which, again, I point out because it greatly pre-dates the slowdown we've seen on LB and in my opinion couldn't possibly be the cause.

I'm jealous you got to keep your old PM's. I think mine all bit the dust when the forum was upgraded awhile back.


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## AppyLover2 (Feb 15, 2011)

Just a comment about the "thumbs up" "thumbs down" thing. My opinion is that it will result in even less comments/conversation. If people can just push a button they won't bother to comment. For years there have been too many posts that have received little or no response. I paid particular attention to that and for a very long time I made it a point to post to threads that seemed to be being ignored. To me it's merely a matter of common courtesy to respond to someone who obviously has something to say or something to share. Can we possibly all be too busy to be courteous?


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## Jill (Feb 15, 2011)

AppyLover2 said:


> Just a comment about the "thumbs up" "thumbs down" thing. My opinion is that it will result in even less comments/conversation. If people can just push a button they won't bother to comment. For years there have been too many posts that have received little or no response. I paid particular attention to that and for a very long time I made it a point to post to threads that seemed to be being ignored. To me it's merely a matter of common courtesy to respond to someone who obviously has something to say or something to share. Can we possibly all be too busy to be courteous?


I think you make a great point, Donna!



:yeah


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## Raine Ranch Minis (Feb 15, 2011)

> AppyLover2 said:
> 
> 
> > Just a comment about the "thumbs up" "thumbs down" thing. My opinion is that it will result in even less comments/conversation. If people can just push a button they won't bother to comment. For years there have been too many posts that have received little or no response. I paid particular attention to that and for a very long time I made it a point to post to threads that seemed to be being ignored. To me it's merely a matter of common courtesy to respond to someone who obviously has something to say or something to share. Can we possibly all be too busy to be courteous?
> ...



Appy SO true!!!!

Jill Ditto


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## Minimor (Feb 15, 2011)

No wonder people get in such a huff over actual politics, if some are almost arguing over when political discussions were banned here. What difference does it make anyway?? "Awhile ago" is good enough for me



--and I agree that I don't see that the political threads were what scared people away from the forum. There have been lots of good discussions since the politics was removed--but not so much just lately, so the slow down has come well after the politics disappeared.

I personally didn't see the political issues/disagreements spilling over into other areas of the forum. Perhaps there were a few that allowed their posts otherwise to be tainted by things said on those threads, but I didn't see that or read it into any of the posts, and it didn't affect me that way--I like or dislike people for many different reasons and can appreciate the friendship of people that don't share my opinions be it on politics or whatever. I can also dislike someone that is of the same political beliefs as I am...that one thing doesn't have a whole lot of effect on my view of people. I've never been able to understand why so many people are so intolerant of religious differences either.


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## kaykay (Feb 16, 2011)

> Just a comment about the "thumbs up" "thumbs down" thing. My opinion is that it will result in even less comments/conversation. If people can just push a button they won't bother to comment. For years there have been too many posts that have received little or no response. I paid particular attention to that and for a very long time I made it a point to post to threads that seemed to be being ignored. To me it's merely a matter of common courtesy to respond to someone who obviously has something to say or something to share. Can we possibly all be too busy to be courteous?


Its just a like button so there is no "do not like" button or thumbs down. Its there now if you look and looks just like a FB like button.

I (and I dont think anyone else) said the reason for the slowdown was political posts. Just said that some quit posting after that.



> No wonder people get in such a huff over actual politics, if some are almost arguing over when political discussions were banned here. What difference does it make anyway??


LOL I noticed that too.


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## WhiteTailsMinis (Feb 16, 2011)

I was one that voted for the LIKE button. While I use it on FB, it has never prevented me from actually commenting also - which the point has been made by others that it'll reduce conversation.

I'll comment (sometimes multiple times) if I have something *new* to add to the conversation, but its also nice to select "like" to someone elses comment that has my same thought - that I am agreeing to the point they made - without having to repeat it exactly as they did. Shows I'm still following the topic and paying attention to the additional commentors on the subject. Unlike whereas I've seen here sometimes people actually write and admit "I haven't read all the comments but want to add .....". I'm thinking at the time, if you haven't read all the comments in succession, how do you know what you are commenting on? LOL

With that said, the like button at the bottom of this page ..... on LB ......... *my question is* ........ if I select it - it seems to me that I'm *liking the entire topic*? I don't see it for each post whereas I can "like" an actual comment/post that has been made (by a specific individual). I may not entirely like the whole post but agree with a certain comment ............ so how am I able to "like" what just one person actually said?

My 2 cents worth ........


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## Jill (Feb 16, 2011)

I think a discussion about one thing (politics or anything else) is bound to influence people's opinions about others and that only naturally influences interactions elsewhere. That's not bad or good. It's just the way the real world works





Based on things some members have said or shown of their horsemanship, I wouldn't put much stock at all in their horse advice. If people want to disregard what someone says on the main board because they don't like their political views or the books they read -- oh well





Hey, I may never be able to "s-word" a horse to a liberal democrat... *shrug* I'll just keep my (much enjoyed) day job


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## kaykay (Feb 16, 2011)

> With that said, the like button at the bottom of this page ..... on LB ......... my question is ........ if I select it - it seems to me that I'm liking the entire topic? I don't see it for each post whereas I can "like" an actual comment/post that has been made (by a specific individual). I may not entirely like the whole post but agree with a certain comment ............ so how am I able to "like" what just one person actually said?


Yes this like button likes the whole topic. I know ML is doing updates there is another like button that can be put on posts


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## Annabellarose (Feb 16, 2011)

WhiteTailsMinis said:


> *LB will always be my favorite of course* and will continue to visit multiple times a day (and all night through foaling) and will definitely keep my membership strong, but it seems to have gotten dull lately. Without upsetting anyone - - - do you find this to also be true?


It took me awhile to see (and respond) to this thread because I just haven't been "hangin' around" here as much as I used to - which goes right along with the theme of this thread! Someone else said something like this already and I agree that the "quality" of the participation has gone way down and, that, in turn, has caused me to lose interest and that, in turn, has caused me not to participate. I've actually made an effort to start participating more the last week or two, but I'm just not "feelin' it".


Allure Ranch said:


> I actually spend more time on other equine sites/forums myself right now.
> 
> I personally prefer a more open controversial/interesting matter that allows for objective opinions good or bad without the threat of being banned/locked out from the subject matter/forum.






:yes



:yes



I couldn't have said it better myself!


Minimor said:


> To be honest, sometimes I would post more but I read through the responses and think 'why bother'. Recently I've seen a couple posts that gave really poor--actually wrong--advice[snip]


Ugh, me too!






Allure Ranch said:


> Maybe the word YOUTH in BIG BOLD letters out by the side of there name.


I would prefer that over this...



I'd like to second that motion!


Minimor said:


> No wonder people get in such a huff over actual politics, if some are almost arguing over when political discussions were banned!






I had the EXACT same thought!


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## Reble (Feb 16, 2011)

I just seen the like button we are heading in the right direction, but under stand is saying we like all the comments just maybe need it under the one that started the topic would make it a bit better.


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## hobbyhorse23 (Feb 16, 2011)

AppyLover2 said:


> For years there have been too many posts that have received little or no response. I paid particular attention to that and for a very long time I made it a point to post to threads that seemed to be being ignored. *To me it's merely a matter of common courtesy to respond to someone who obviously has something to say or something to share.* Can we possibly all be too busy to be courteous?


Amen! Why bother to go to all the work to post photos when you know no one is going to respond?

Leia


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## ohmt (Feb 16, 2011)

> Hey, I may never be able to "s-word" a horse to a liberal democrat


OUCH. I still love hearing from you Jill, even if we are on very opposite sides when it comes to politics. No two people will ever agree 100% on everything. I have been dating my very conservative boyfriend for 3 years now and even though we disagree on politics, I love him no less. The reason for that is that we DO agree on more important things like respect, kindness, devotion, work ethic, etc, and that's what really matters. That being said, there are no politics when it comes to the love and care I have for my horses



I know that's how it is with you too. Actually, did I ever tell you about my orphaned colt 2 years ago? Your thread about your bottle/pan raised colt helped me tremendously and I thank you very much for that. It was amazing how well my Frankie kept up with the other foals in growth!


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## Jill (Feb 16, 2011)

ohmt said:


> OUCH. I still love hearing from you Jill, even if we are on very opposite sides when it comes to politics. No two people will ever agree 100% on everything. I have been dating my very conservative boyfriend for 3 years now and even though we disagree on politics, I love him no less. The reason for that is that we DO agree on more important things like respect, kindness, devotion, work ethic, etc, and that's what really matters. That being said, there are no politics when it comes to the love and care I have for my horses
> 
> 
> 
> I know that's how it is with you too. Actually, did I ever tell you about my orphaned colt 2 years ago? Your thread about your bottle/pan raised colt helped me tremendously and I thank you very much for that. It was amazing how well my Frankie kept up with the other foals in growth!






I was just attempting a joke at my own expense, but, I do imagine there are members who would hold political opinions against me. It's just that I'm not going to sweat it





I'm happy our experiences with Trooper helped you out!!! I seriously fought back tears of frustration several times while raising him up. I remember one night, I simply couldn't do the basic math of scaling down the Big Horse forumula measurements to Mini Horse measurements even though I knew I wanted to do like 1/4. It was just too much for me to figure out with so little sleep. I just couldn't make my brain kick into even turtle speed that night


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## Magic (Feb 16, 2011)

My husband and I have opposite political opinions at times, but we show respect for each other's concerns and don't debate about it. Our two daughters are also opposites that way. People too often take a stand and refuse to consider other views; we've learned to be very open to differing opinions and respect the people expressing them. We discuss, but we don't try to change the other's mind. Stating our views is enough, and if we just want someone to agree with us, we talk to the people who share our views.


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## HGFarm (Feb 16, 2011)

I dont think we need another sales section either.... the current board is quite sufficient and I dont want to weed through post after post on here to review horses for sale.

As to politics.... my parents always told me there was two things in life you just dont discuss with others- religion and politics. Every single person has their own idea of just what those should look like..... And I fear if I ever got started on the political one, I couldnt stop and would be foaming at the mouth and wild eyed within just a few minutes, LOL


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## REO (Feb 16, 2011)

HGFarm said:


> I fear if I ever got started on the political one, I couldnt stop and would be foaming at the mouth and wild eyed within just a few minutes, LOL



Me too!





Although, I'm not sure if my hubby would notice anything different about me


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## Sanny (Feb 17, 2011)

I don't get on the forum nearly as much as I would like to and I do miss being here and being involved in discussions. When we first started getting out of "big horses" and we were becoming interested in minis and ponies I spent a LOT of time here asking questions and researching old posts for information. I learned SO MUCH here and we got off to a great start with our minis and I know the forum was very helpful. I still come here to read and learn I just have less time to do it so you will not find me posting much. I haven't lost interest and I think if anything the forum has become more interesting and has more features than when I first joined.

One thing that has been VERY helpful to me since I haven't been online as much is that my husband is just as involved and interested in our minis and ponies as the rest of the family and he usually gets on the forum at least once a day to see what's going on and what the hot topics are. I know that if there is something that might be important or of interest to us that he will catch it and fill me in. I love that because it is like getting the Cliff Notes version of the forum. He is even busier than me because he works so much but when he is working he will occasionally be waiting around have time to kill and will go online and check the forum and let me know if there is something he thinks I should see.

Another thing taking up a lot more of my time these days is we also started homeschooling our five children last year and since my husband works a lot that becomes my responsibility. I love doing it and that we get to spend so much time together as a family but it is very time consuming. I was hesitant about it at first but all of our kids wanted to do it so we decided to do it for part of the school year last year and see how it went and everybody wanted to continue doing it this year. This fall our 15 year old Samantha who is a terrific writer already and had a plan to get into broadcast journalism after high school and college was hired this year and is now under contract to Fox Sports North as a teen journalist writing feature stories and doing on-camera interviews of outstanding teen athletes. I am her designated driver and chaperone and working for FOX was a huge opportunity for her and the beginning of many doors opening so I am very supportive of making that work for her.

We also have a LOT more minis than we used to and a larger show string since our whole family shows and since I am home the most I am in charge of a large portion of their care and needs. The kids help and do chores but I am always involved. This year we will have more ponies too and so far I think they take more time and are a little bit more high maintenance than minis.

OH....................and while I am thinking about how busy I always seem to be and how I am not on the forum as much anymore..............there is also housework, laundry, doctor appointments, kids activities...................

I have a sick child today and another not feeling well so I let them all sleep in which gave me a little chunk of free time and that is how I ended up here today. After writing this post though I am feeling like I need to get OFF the computer and get back to work. I just never have enough hours in the day for everything I want to do!


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## HGFarm (Feb 17, 2011)

HAHAHAHAHAHA REO, same here!


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## wildoak (Feb 17, 2011)

Wow, I've just waded through 13 pages of this thread!




Many good points made, many I agree with.



> Winter time may seem like the time when people would have more time on the computer, but for me it doesn't work that way. Winter, especially this winter when we have so much snow and recently some really cold weather, makes my chores take longer. I have to haul warm water out to the horses, horses are in their sheds more so cleaning takes longer, feeding takes longer, especially when I'm having to wrestle with round bales as I am this year....so I'm on the computer less. When I am on, I tend to read but not post so often.


Amen to this one!



> To be honest, sometimes I would post more but I read through the responses and think 'why bother'. Recently I've seen a couple posts that gave really poor--actually wrong--advice, but I'm tired, I'm short on time, and I just don't bother posting a better answer


I will add to this, that many times I read a post and just see no point in being the 15th person to say "yes good idea" or whatever. A like button will come in handy there. I've been here a long time, since near the beginning, and have gotten a tremendous amount from LB. I've also seen the same threads many times as newcomers join in, and feel like there are lots of folks now qualified to answer their questions. If a thread hasn't been answered many times I will comment, but if it's all been said I usually don't. If I have a question or an issue I need feedback on, this is still the first place I come for help or support.





Political threads? I read them if it sounds interesting, I close them if I don't like it...no big deal.

Overmoderated? Maybe so...I know you all have to walk a fine line, but it feels a little friendlier if we aren't getting our keyboards slapped for what seem to be pretty minor infractions.

All in all, it's still a pretty good place to come hang out & find out what's going on in the miniature world. Life just seems to have gotten busier over the years.

Jan


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## McBunz (Feb 18, 2011)

kaykay said:


> Please do not bring back political posts. I saw sides of people I never wanted to see. I really hope that doesnt come back. I think they did so much damage here and that is when so many left.
> 
> I do know several other people that have been warned about the whole "sell" thing and I do think that it is over moderated. For many of us this is what we do. Buy, show, train and sell horses. It can be hard to write posts when your being so careful not to ever say "sell"
> 
> ...


I agree with Kay Kay...This is one of the reasons I no longer post.. Some people could say the most rude things and get away with it..

Others would get the NOTICE for getting ticked off in their replies.


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## Jill (Feb 18, 2011)

Where I think the political threads went wrong in the past was when some members (there were just a handful) made their remarks personal with things like name calling. It's one thing to state an opinion about a situation or political individual that others may not agree with, but it's another thing to turn that disagreement over an issue or politician into personal attacks and name calling.


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## McBunz (Feb 18, 2011)

Jill said:


> Where I think the political threads went wrong in the past was when some members (there were just a handful) made their remarks personal with things like name calling. It's one thing to state an opinion about a situation or political individual that others may not agree with, but it's another thing to turn that disagreement over an issue or politician into personal attacks and name calling.


I am not a political person. I believe all politicians are cut from the same cloth with different names..and who ever pays

to get them into POWER rules the roost..

I also believe that Canadians have just as much right to an opinion as anyone

else when it comes to this forum.. A member is a member.. I did not see any name calling... just a lot of disrespect for other

forum members..


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## Jill (Feb 18, 2011)

McBunz said:


> I am not a political person. I believe all politicians are cut from the same cloth with different names..and who ever pays
> 
> to get them into POWER rules the roost..
> 
> ...


McBunz, I agree with much of what you've said including that Canadians have just as much right to an opinion as anyone else. Absolutely true! Likewise, I have the right to the opinion that I_ personally_ have zero interest in the Canadian perspective on US politics. Anyone is free to post on whatever threads they'd like, and every single day, other members decide what threads they want to look at, and who's posts they want to read and / or take into consideration. If a Canadian member posted that she/he is not interested in the American perspective on Canadian politics (or any other issue that is at its heart a Canadian matter), it wouldn't even remotely offend me.


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## [email protected] (Feb 18, 2011)

Glad you posted this White Tail.

I've had this conversation with at least five+ people the past few months on how LB has become too over-moderated, and all of them stated they visit, but rarely post for that reason. I agree with that. I've been on LB since 1999/2000, and the exchange of information/ideas and healthy debate is just not what it use to be. I know I don't frequent LB like I use as frankly I find it a bit insipid and boring. Conversations that would be posted in the a.m. use to be on page 3-4 by night, now they sit for days. I've always appreciated LB as a place to go daily to share my love of all things Mini related and have learned tons. But haven't felt that way for at least a year. FB, other equine sites and the yahoo groups are unmoderated and many people use those as there isn't the fear a well thought out response to an honest question will be edited or plain disappear. I've started responses numerous times, only to delete or close the site as I figure it will get removed/edited.

I know there are many new people to the breed (yeah!), but why they don't do a bit of research before asking the same questions that have been asked for the umpteenth time in the past two months is beyond me? I won't respond to those as it's pointless, IMHO. They're unwilling to make any effort to educate themselves, so I'm not wasting my time to respond, plain and simple. Time as we all know is a precious commodity. I do feel bad they may not be getting the information they need, or often the wrong information, but if I wanted to ask about homozygous tobianos as an example, I would have researched it online, forum, websites - then I would ask 'hey I read xxx, is this right?. Responsibility is a key and people need to monitor their own behavior. And I don't mean I'm having a problem or what do I do about..., but the topics, what should I feed my Mini? (not how to I get a better topline/less belly...) or my Mini is sick what should I do? (not he's doing xyz and the vet said...) It shocks me, and I don't want to give a flippant response so just don't answer.

I do believe the mods have a difficult job, (one I would not want), but in all honesty if you're going to post on the a public forum, *the people frequenting the site* need to have the ability to take the criticism and disagreement from others. I may not like it if someone disagrees with me, but I do give ANYONE the right to their opinion. As many of us are, I'm on a variety of different forums for different activities in my life. Some can be downright evil in their responses, but I'd rather have that, than a lukewarm 'aren't we all happy and love blue eyed kittens', as it's just false. I would rather have someone disagree with me, send me a mail or contact me, than whine to the mods and have a post removed (mine or theirs). We all want to be liked, but not everyone will like you or agree with you. That's life deal with it.

RE: political postings. When the Back Porch was first started it was for all 'non-horse' threads - so political should be allowed and if you disagree with someone's political, religious or whatever beliefs DON'T READ THEIR THREADS! I will say in all honesty though I've very infrequently posted on the Back Porch, I don't have the time. I read alot of what Jill posts on FB as I don't always agree with her posts, but I do value her opinion as she is very passionate and knowledgeable on the topic and I have learned a few things.

RE: Sales postings on the forum. The mentioning of _'I think I may sell Sparky'_ or 'I_ decided to keep Blaze and not sell him_', shouldn't get banned or removed. That is "I want an opinion or what should I do", versus "here's my sales list with 46 photos pitch". Everyone's signature block has a link to their website - if you want to see what they have for sale it's a click away, but the forum shouldn't be used as a sales board. Opinions or information gathering, sharing of ideas, learning and education, yes - not a sales board.

MaryLou you have a difficult row to hoe, so to speak. I don't envy you and the mods trying to forge a middle path, but less editing/deleting, more /ignore the whiners might help. : )

Changes I'd love to see:


 

People not getting banned UNLESS they've flat out attacked someone or their ranch, or flagrantly disregard the forum rules.

Patrons of LB, *GROW UP*! If you don't like someone's post don't read it. If you don't like someone disagreeing with you don't post. If you can't take the critique of your horse, breeding program, feeding, whatever - then don't ask for opinions.

No like button. This isn't FB. Maybe an 'agree' so we don't have two pages of me too, but like is too 'I agree with the whole topic' IMHO.


Sales Board:


 

Loading photos from a HD.

Renew Ad feature would be wonderful and a time saver! I'd probably post more on the sale board too


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## McBunz (Feb 18, 2011)

Jill said:


> McBunz, I agree with much of what you've said including that Canadians have just as much right to an opinion as anyone else. Absolutely true! Likewise, I have the right to the opinion that I_ personally_ have zero interest in the Canadian perspective on US politics. Anyone is free to post on whatever threads they'd like, and every single day, other members decide what threads they want to look at, and who's posts they want to read and / or take into consideration. If a Canadian member posted that she/he is not interested in the American perspective on Canadian politics (or any other issue that is at its heart a Canadian matter), it wouldn't even remotely offend me.


Everyone has the right not to read posts from non Americans..but saying "i] have zero interest in the Canadian perspective on US politics.." Disrespect is another matter..

I believe the best you can expect from your elected officials is enough brain cells not to offend other nations or embarrass your own

country. YOU Bet Yah The rest is money talking and power grabs within the nation to aid their supporters.


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## Jill (Feb 18, 2011)

McBunz, I'm sorry you're offended that I, as an American citizen, have zero personal interest in the Canadian perspective on US politics. Still, it remains the case that I feel this way, it isn't breaking news, it's not an unreasonable point of view, and it's also not a rare point of view.

Since you know that's my opinion and there's a chance you may be offended by other opinions of mine with which you don't agree, maybe you should implement a zero interest policy regarding my perspective on all things? Or maybe there's still the ability to create ignore lists on LB?


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## McBunz (Feb 18, 2011)

Jill said:


> McBunz, I'm sorry you're offended that I, as an American citizen, have zero personal interest in the Canadian perspective on US politics. Still, it remains the case that I feel this way, it isn't breaking news, it's not an unreasonable point of view, and it's also not a rare point of view.
> 
> Since you know that's my opinion and there's a chance you may be offended by other opinions of mine with which you don't agree, maybe you should implement a zero interest policy regarding my perspective on all things? Or maybe there's still the ability to create ignore lists on LB?


Well maybe ML can put our country of origin next to our names..Maybe our color,political leanings, religion and a few other facts. Then some people would know who's posts they should not bother to read...


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## Jill (Feb 18, 2011)

McBunz, I really am sorry you are so bent out of shape and seem to be taking this restricted interest from me personally.

It's this one issue (US Politics) that I see as specific to the USA about which my _personal_ interest when it comes to online discussions is restricted to what other Americans think.

Some other LB members may be on the edge of their seats wanting to know what most of members from other Nations think about US Politics and they can have a field day with it as far as I'm concerned. But for me, I will not be interested in long discussions about why I think this instead of that with people who don't know what it's like to be an American (just as I don't know what it's like to be a Canadian) and cannot have an insider's perspective.

Truly, how interested would most Canadian members be in what most American members think in terms of who they should put into office, how they should run their healthcare system and other social programs, how their country should handle issues of national security, ETC.?

Again, I can't make you feel any differently than you choose to feel, but at least hear that I value "all people's" perspectives on honestly any other important topic. But for my online discussions about US Politics, my interest is limited to other US citizens.


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## Flying minis (Feb 18, 2011)

okay, so after wading through 14 pages of comments, I do have one new comment. Everyone is talking about tolerance, understanding others who post, etc. etc. How about that same tolerance with the moderators? Are we so sensitive anymore that if we are moderated in a forum, or a moderator thinks we posted a sale, that our feelings are so hurt we no longer participate in the community? Seriously?

I agree that we all need to be tolerant of other's opinions, but to some degree, we all just need to get over it when we think we've been "wronged" - especially when the wrong is as minor as being moderated or having our hands slapped on a public forum. . .


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## REO (Feb 18, 2011)

I've been thinking.......

OH OH!





I've been here 10 years and I've pretty much seen it all. Fast times, slow times etc.

I've enjoyed the fast, exciting, interesting times. I've been a bit *sigh* over the slow times when there was no new interesting topics.

I've seen it a lot of times on this thread how people got bored and left during the slow times.

Whose fault is that???

WE are ALL members of LB! This is our forum! And IT IS WHAT *WE* MAKE IT!!!

So, if you're BORED, DO something!! Why should it be up to someone _else_ to make it interesting? When it's slow, finally post that topic question. Or find something interesting to talk about.

I'm including MYSELF in this too. If you're sitting back being bored, you shouldn't blame everyone else! Because you're here being boring too!





??????????????????????????????????????????????????????

Well, if you're NEW to minis, new to the forum or even new on line, how do you expect people to know HOW to do searches and know where the info pages are right off the bat??? Why blame new people for asking the same questions? THEY don't know they're the same questions.

SO!!!

Why can't there be a link to a *NEW TO THE FORUM INTRO* page??? Or a forum that they could intro themselves. There could be pinned topics. A link to the rules page. A link to the LB info pages. Info telling them where to find the sale board and how to search topics etc.


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## Minimor (Feb 18, 2011)

Well, Jill is most certainly welcome to her opinion, though I suspect she would be a little more interested in what Canadians have to say about things government if some of them didn't praise the Canadian health care system. She isn't interested in what "we" have to say about US politics because we don't know anything about US politics and have no official say in US politics and so we don't matter. I find it interesting, though, to note that in the past she has claimed to know so much about our Canadian health care system....a system that she has never used and so has no personal experience with. Funny how that works. And no, I'm not in any way attacking Jill over this; she is most welcome to believe what she likes about the subject and even say what she likes about it, just so long as she realizes that we really aren't interested in what she thinks or has to say about it.

I do have to say that no everyone in the US shares Jills views on politics and who is worthy of entering into a political discussion with, just as there are many Canadians who are interested in hearing what Americans think/have to say about Canadian politics. I think some of the most interesting discussions I've been a part of have been in a group of Americans and Canadians combined, discussing US and Canadian politics, sharing views and opinions. I find it very interesting to hear what Americans think of Canadian politics/politicians and certainly there are plenty of Americans who are extremely interested in hearing the Canadian perspective on US politics!

Politics....people here are talking about the US proposal to remove the exemption on Canadians paying the 'entry fee' or processing fee or whatever it's called whenever entering the US on public transport. Now there's a US politics thing that does affect Canadians directly. I guess Canadians don't matter unless they can be made to cough up some money to help finance the US federal debt?


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## Jill (Feb 19, 2011)

Robin, I think that would be a great idea!!! I wonder if there could / should also be an INTRO Forum? A lot of message boards I see have a sepearate "WELCOME" board and some members (including me) make a point of going there to welcome new members. If that separate spot here goes into effect, maybe it could it be set up so those new people can upload some pictures from their computers if they want, vs. having to have them already hosted online? A lot of new people don't know how to show us pictures, but if they could just pick them from their harddrive, I bet it would be easier. I was thinking if they can show us their horses, themselves, their farm, whatever they want (assuming they want to show us pictures) it might "bond" them more to us through being able to more fully share with LB? It might seem like a small thing, but I think it would help them feel more at home if in addition to saying welcome, we could also say things about "oh, your mini is so pretty", "I love your barn", etc. It might seem like a small thing to us who are used to showing our friends here things in our lives through pictures, but I think it could be a big thing for a new person and make them feel more at home and understood





Minimor, I like you a lot but we've been there done that on this very thread. You really shouldn't put your own assumptions of why / what I think on me as my own but "whatever". Anyone who cares to have insight into that opinion of mine can already read it here in other posts. Some people probably even agree with the opinion, but the main thing for me is that I agree with it and I've been in charge of forming opinions for forty something years. I've held this opinion for a long time and it's not something I haven't thought through


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## Reble (Feb 19, 2011)

OK not sure why Jill and Minimor are debating politics?

I thought this topic was

Do you think folks are spending less time here now?

Notice how topics get changed by some.

I think this is an example of why things get removed, locked, or the person that started the topic would like it removed.


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## Minimor (Feb 19, 2011)

Reble, if you read all the posts you would see how one thing ties into the other on this topic! We haven't changed the subject, rather just exploring a different portion of it after politics was given as a reason why some might be on here so much, and then ML said political discussions are allowed again....our posts truly are still very much a part of 'why some may not be on here as much' !


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## McBunz (Feb 19, 2011)

Reble said:


> OK not sure why Jill and Minimor are debating politics?
> 
> I thought this topic was
> 
> ...


It changed because someone thought the lack of political debate caused some people not to post..but if only one person is

suppose to decide who can or can not reply to these posts.. a separate political forum in that persons name might be a good

idea..and then the rest of us riff raff will know that posting replies in a no no..

I agree face book has slowed down a lot of forums..Not that it is better.. just different..I am not a big fan of face book..

To many people posting their life stories daily along with hundreds of pictures of themselves..looks like a meat market of

love sick teenagers..


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## Jill (Feb 19, 2011)

McBunz, I guess I won't even try to confuse you with any of what's actually been said. The frustration of trying to "confuse" a person with the actual facts has run its course for me on the subject to which you are (inaccurately) referring.

Rebel, there is an ongoing discussion about political discussions on LB. I think some of the of members have tried to discuss actual politics, vs. the allowance of political threads on LB, but I've not personally had much interest in those parts of their posts


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## Jill (Feb 19, 2011)

Mary Lou - LB said:


> I looked at the stats of this forum and when facebook took off in popularity, it was clear the forums here started to slow down.. I am also not a fan of facebook because I do not have much time to play on it.. The LB web site and Forums were integrated into Facebook for business reasons and getting new people interested into Miniature Horses..



Oh see, I'd have clicked the LIKE botton for your post there, ML (teasing you a bit)






I don't know how other members like to use their FB accounts, but one "handy" thing people can do if they like is share a thread from LB over to their FB pages. I've done that with a few, and I'm sure as time goes on, will do so again. I thought it would be a good way to maybe remind people who used to spend more time here that it's still a great place to be an active part of!


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## wildhorses (Feb 19, 2011)

This is exactly the reason many people don't post anymore...this topic has gone off course again. The original topic started with a simple question if you are visiting LB less than you used to and other places more...and here we are on page 15 with a political debate going on between 2 or 3 forum members. GO START YOUR OWN POST ON THE SUBJECT AND STOP RAILROADING THE ORIGINAL TOPIC...PLEASE.

I hope some good comes of this topic, and some positive changes are made to the LB website, to make it more user friendly as suggested. I hope the Politics issue is reconsidered and banned again. I want the back porch to be about about light topics and fun topics, "look at my new puppy", "my daughters getting married today", "anybody have a good chocolate cake recipe", "Who do you like on American Idol", stc. There are plenty of other places on the World Wide Web for people to go discuss politics, it doesn't need to be done here on a Miniature Horse forum, unless there is politics involving Horses, The future of horse breeders, the future of equine dentists, etc., issues that affect us directly as horse breeders/owners. I have CNN, I come to the forum to get a break from the world, especially the "Back Porch". That's my opinion. It looks like Mary Lou is taking the steps to get the changes made, and I am excited to see them. Thank you for doing that.


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## McBunz (Feb 19, 2011)

wildhorses said:


> This is exactly the reason many people don't post anymore...this topic has gone off course again. The original topic started with a simple question if you are visiting LB less than you used to and other places more...and here we are on page 15 with a political debate going on between 2 or 3 forum members. GO START YOUR OWN POST ON THE SUBJECT AND STOP RAILROADING THE ORIGINAL TOPIC...PLEASE.
> 
> I hope some good comes of this topic, and some positive changes are made to the LB website, to make it more user friendly as suggested. I hope the Politics issue is reconsidered and banned again. I want the back porch to be about about light topics and fun topics, "look at my new puppy", "my daughters getting married today", "anybody have a good chocolate cake recipe", "Who do you like on American Idol", stc. There are plenty of other places on the World Wide Web for people to go discuss politics, it doesn't need to be done here on a Miniature Horse forum, unless there is politics involving Horses, The future of horse breeders, the future of equine dentists, etc., issues that affect us directly as horse breeders/owners. I have CNN, I come to the forum to get a break from the world, especially the "Back Porch". That's my opinion. It looks like Mary Lou is taking the steps to get the changes made, and I am excited to see them. Thank you for doing that.



I agree.. if politics has to be here on LB it should be on its own forum where the rest of us are not subjected to it..


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## Jill (Feb 19, 2011)

McBunz said:


> I agree.. if politics has to be here on LB it should be on its own forum where the rest of us are not subjected to it..


Oh yeah. I just hate it when I see a topic title and know it's something I don't want to read but my computer makes me do it anyway. I mean, really. Come on people! Topics are accurately titled and if you don't like the subject matter, simply spare yourself the time and trouble and pass it up


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## Ashley (Feb 19, 2011)

wildhorses said:


> This is exactly the reason many people don't post anymore...this topic has gone off course again. The original topic started with a simple question if you are visiting LB less than you used to and other places more...and here we are on page 15 with a political debate going on between 2 or 3 forum members. GO START YOUR OWN POST ON THE SUBJECT AND STOP RAILROADING THE ORIGINAL TOPIC...PLEASE.
> 
> I hope some good comes of this topic, and some positive changes are made to the LB website, to make it more user friendly as suggested. I hope the Politics issue is reconsidered and banned again. I want the back porch to be about about light topics and fun topics, "look at my new puppy", "my daughters getting married today", "anybody have a good chocolate cake recipe", "Who do you like on American Idol", stc. There are plenty of other places on the World Wide Web for people to go discuss politics, it doesn't need to be done here on a Miniature Horse forum, unless there is politics involving Horses, The future of horse breeders, the future of equine dentists, etc., issues that affect us directly as horse breeders/owners. I have CNN, I come to the forum to get a break from the world, especially the "Back Porch". That's my opinion. It looks like Mary Lou is taking the steps to get the changes made, and I am excited to see them. Thank you for doing that.



I really don’t think going off topic scares people away. When anybody posts a topic this is bound to happen, a person asks for advice they are going to get it in all aspects. I don’t think topics should be limited at all, everybody has the option to read them or not. What mostly drew me away from here as the old timers that used to be here are not anymore, and the fact that no matter where you go on here it seems like people are using it more for promoting their own farms to an obsessive amount. That is what the sale boards or your website is for. There are a few on there that post, the rare time they do post it’s normally to brag about their farm, their wins or their foals. The learning ability is lost.


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## Sonya (Feb 19, 2011)

This is the back porch which is NHR so I think politics is fair game. It is funny, perhaps one reason this place is not so popular is because some take things personal, whatever the subject matter is, especially politics...Example: I work with/friends with folks who have total different political/religous views than I do...been in many debates (heated at times) but when the debate is over I am still friends with them....it is not going to stop me from socializing with them...or purchasing a horse from them, or responding to their posts, which has been mentioned here....it is childish.


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## Reble (Feb 19, 2011)

I believe as I am reading this I do see why this is brought up.

But:

ML has said yes, so yes it will be..

I do not think politics have stopped anyone from coming here.

A heading for Politics, Religion etc. would satisfy members.

Maybe ML can just call it *Debating Topics* should be added so the

back porch does not loose what we already have.

Just like with this topic it gets lost in some other important info.

and I think the same will happen if allowed back on the back porch.

Some do not make their titles clear..

Just another suggestion. and than can decide to read or not..

Example being I do not have donkeys do not usually go to that part of the forum.


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## Ashley (Feb 19, 2011)

Jill said:


> McBunz, I'm sorry you're offended that I, as an American citizen, have zero personal interest in the Canadian perspective on US politics. Still, it remains the case that I feel this way, it isn't breaking news, it's not an unreasonable point of view, and it's also not a rare point of view.
> 
> Since you know that's my opinion and there's a chance you may be offended by other opinions of mine with which you don't agree, maybe you should implement a zero interest policy regarding my perspective on all things? Or maybe there's still the ability to create ignore lists on LB?


I get McBunz point here. Jill we all know your position on politics, I also know we are very different in that aspect. I do remember when these threads were going on, the people from Canada that posted, were told to stop posting, they didnt belong on that topic since they didnt have any say in what the US does. This is disrepectful in my opinion. Some of those people have citizenship here. A person dont have to agree with them or even take what they say in to consideration, however they have just as much right to post to them as any others and shouldnt be told they cant or be treated like crap cause they do. (not saying you did this, and honestly I dont remember who it was, just remember it happening).


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## Jill (Feb 19, 2011)

Ashley said:


> I get McBunz point here. Jill we all know your position on politics, I also know we are very different in that aspect. I do remember when these threads were going on, *the people from Canada that posted, were told to stop posting*, they didnt belong on that topic since they didnt have any say in what the US does. This is disrepectful in my opinion. Some of those people have citizenship here. A person dont have to agree with them or even take what they say in to consideration, however they have just as much right to post to them as any others and shouldnt be told they cant or be treated like crap cause they do. (not saying you did this, and honestly I dont remember who it was, just remember it happening).


Never happened. No Nationality was told they couldn't post and this or that type of thread


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## Jill (Feb 19, 2011)

Sonya said:


> This is the back porch which is NHR so I think politics is fair game. It is funny, perhaps one reason this place is not so popular is because some take things personal, whatever the subject matter is, especially politics...Example: I work with/friends with folks who have total different political/religous views than I do...been in many debates (heated at times) but when the debate is over I am still friends with them....it is not going to stop me from socializing with them...or purchasing a horse from them, or responding to their posts, which has been mentioned here....it is childish.


I agree with this completely. Too many people just cannot handle an honest opinion EVEN when they say they want to hear opinions.


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## Mona (Feb 19, 2011)

Jill said:


> If that separate spot here goes into effect, maybe it could it be set up so those new people can upload some pictures from their computers if they want, vs. having to have them already hosted online? A lot of new people don't know how to show us pictures, but if they could just pick them from their harddrive, I bet it would be easier. I was thinking if they can show us their horses, themselves, their farm, whatever they want (assuming they want to show us pictures) it might "bond" them more to us through being able to more fully share with LB? It might seem like a small thing, but I think it would help them feel more at home if in addition to saying welcome, we could also say things about "oh, your mini is so pretty", "I love your barn", etc. It might seem like a small thing to us who are used to showing our friends here things in our lives through pictures, but I think it could be a big thing for a new person and make them feel more at home and understood.


There is already this option of uploading photos from hard drive, and that is the image gallery that each account member has. It then gives the simple option of using the code and/or url to add to the post to have your photo appear in your post.


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## tagalong (Feb 19, 2011)

> Oh yeah. I just hate it when I see a topic title and know it's something I don't want to read but my computer makes me do it anyway. I mean, really. Come on people! Topics are accurately titled and if you don't like the subject matter, simply spare yourself the time and trouble and pass it up


The new scroll-over feature will help with that - it lets you see how a thread starts before you even click on it... so political threads can be easily avoided. IMO extra forums are not the answer... just avoid the threads you do not care for and you can always scroll past the posts you do not like - seeing as there is no "ignore" button here.








> No Nationality was told they couldn't post and this or that type of thread


???!!!!

Well then, let's phrase it this way... only one Nationality was "approved" to discuss certain topics and post in a certain way about their concerns/opinions...

Whatever, that is in the past - one would hope.


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## McBunz (Feb 19, 2011)

Jill said:


> Oh yeah. I just hate it when I see a topic title and know it's something I don't want to read but my computer makes me do it anyway. I mean, really. Come on people! Topics are accurately titled and if you don't like the subject matter, simply spare yourself the time and trouble and pass it up



Did this topic indicate politics.????..I don't thinks so... You brought it into the mix.. And as far as I can see you are the only

one who wants it with maybe Sonja..The only reason I can see why there were so many posting to it before is that I made so many people

angry... And anger is not good for this forum...or any other...

As long as there is a little red button in the Oval Office I think other nations have the right to

opinions as to which is the lesser evil to be sitting behind that desk.. Preferably the one with some

smarts..


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## Reble (Feb 19, 2011)

tagalong said:


> The new scroll-over feature will help with that - it lets you see how a thread starts before you even click on it... so political threads can be easily avoided. IMO extra forums are not the answer... just avoid the threads you do not care for and you can always scroll past the posts you do not like - seeing as there is no "ignore" button here.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I understand we can over look the topics, or not read or comment.

but if there are so many people as said here that wants politics.

than there will be a lot of politic posting on the back porch and what happens to the info that is not bumped so often and gets lost & never get looked at. We might just miss some good info or topics.

If there is going to be that many wanting this, than an area would be best not the back porch.


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## Sonya (Feb 19, 2011)

I still don't see anywhere that anyone said that a certain person doesn't have a right to have an opinion or a right to post...everyone has a right to an opinion/post just as everyone has a right to decide if that opinion holds value for them personally. For myself I read everyones opinions on a matter however not all of the opinions hold the same weight for me...if I asked for opinions about a certain profession....I would hold a persons opinion who actually was involved in that profession of higher importance than someone who does not work in that profession at all. I think most would, it's common sense.


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## tagalong (Feb 19, 2011)

> I would hold a persons opinion who actually was involved in that profession of higher importance than someone who does not work in that profession at all.


So then, only politicians should start or comment in a political thread...



... that eliminates all of us!


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## REO (Feb 19, 2011)

Yes that was my idea, to have a *welcome forum*.





Glad you like it Jill.


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## Sonya (Feb 19, 2011)

here we go again....I don't know how I can explain it easier...i wasn't referring to politics there, I was using it as an example for any subject. If I asked for opinions on how rotating shifts affect a prison gaurd, I would hold Ashleys opinion in higher regard as she has walked in those shoes...Jill's opinion would probably not hold much weight for me since she's never been a prison guard (or a prisoner that I'm aware of) . I really don't know why this is such a sore subject for some. If someone tells you they don't hold your opinion of a certain subject in high regard, why is that a crime? Who really cares, why would you care so much? I hold opinions that my parents have gave me in high regards, and some not so much


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## Relic (Feb 19, 2011)

Well l can't see why there needs to be a seperate area for politics...seems the back porch is as good as any seeing as it falls under other things to talk about besides the minis..on the other hand if there is a need for it l think it should be called..Jills Political Comments



l hold no interest in the subject myself..On the other hand love that scroll over thing no need to even open and look inside if it holds no interest VERY NICE...waiting for that like button so l can click that on for anything and everything who cares like it or not if you can click it l say click it. l love clicking buttons okay maybe not always that delete button should be played around with but l'm learning:BigGrin


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## Jill (Feb 19, 2011)

Mona said:


> There is already this option of uploading photos from hard drive, and that is the image gallery that each account member has. It then gives the simple option of using the code and/or url to add to the post to have your photo appear in your post.


I didn't realize the gallery images could be used that way! That is great for people who don't have them hosted online







McBunz said:


> Did this topic indicate politics.????..I don't thinks so... You brought it into the mix.. And as far as I can see you are the only
> 
> one who wants it with maybe Sonja..The only reason I can see why there were so many posting to it before is that I made so many people
> 
> ...


Sooooo... how many times have you read and posted on this thread since you decided you think it's about politics? And for what it's worth, I'm not angry







McBunz said:


> I believe the best you can expect from your elected officials is enough brain cells not to offend other nations or embarrass your own
> 
> country. YOU Bet Yah The rest is money talking and power grabs within the nation to aid their supporters.


Mary Lou is the one who said the "P" word is allowed on LB, but as far as I can tell, the people who actually say they DON'T want politics discussed on LB are the ONLY ones who expressed political opinions on this thread -- and you're one of the ones who did, McBunz! How ironically funny







REO said:


> Yes that was my idea, to have a *welcome forum*.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I think it would be a great idea







Relic said:


> Well l can't see why there needs to be a seperate area for politics...seems the back porch is as good as any seeing as it falls under other things to talk about besides the minis..on the other hand if there is a need for it l think it should be called..Jills Political Comments
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Well I've got a secret I can tell you. Anytime you see my name and my horse avatar there to the left <--- the words in the box located where you're now reading will contain my opinions including poltical opinion(s) if I feel the topic is political





The only thing I've said that could even approach a political remark on this thread was a little joke / jab about Sarah Palin -- but, hey, who's really trying to see anything for what it actually is (or was) anymore?





But anyone who really does like a common sense conservative business woman's point of view on politics can friend me on Facebook because I post a lot of news links there and have many ongoing discussions at play. Likewise, anyone who's not into that would possibly not find me to be an enjoyable Facebook friend (which is fine by me -- I know how I like to use my Facebook account, and why it's so)


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## McBunz (Feb 19, 2011)

Relic said:


> Well l can't see why there needs to be a seperate area for politics...seems the back porch is as good as any seeing as it falls under other things to talk about besides the minis..on the other hand if there is a need for it l think it should be called..Jills Political Comments
> 
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## WhiteTailsMinis (Feb 19, 2011)

I'll say it again - I smile and enjoy all the participation from so many on this topic - actually POST would be a better description though as it has turned into all kinds of topics - and that's great too!

I had no idea it would take off like this but its been alot of fun keeping up with - - great group of folks - I always knew that - love the renewed activity from so many! awesome -


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## Ashley (Feb 19, 2011)

Sonya said:


> here we go again....I don't know how I can explain it easier...i wasn't referring to politics there, I was using it as an example for any subject. If I asked for opinions on how rotating shifts affect a prison gaurd, I would hold Ashleys opinion in higher regard as she has walked in those shoes...Jill's opinion would probably not hold much weight for me since she's never been a prison guard (or a prisoner that I'm aware of) . I really don't know why this is such a sore subject for some. If someone tells you they don't hold your opinion of a certain subject in high regard, why is that a crime? Who really cares, why would you care so much? I hold opinions that my parents have gave me in high regards, and some not so much



So Jill we all want to know, are you or have you been?


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## Jill (Feb 20, 2011)

Ashley said:


> So Jill we all want to know, are you or have you been?


No



However, I have been fingerprinted a number of times in relation to my securities licenses. It's something you have to do when you first register to take the licensing exams and then thereafter if you make a change of broker / dealers, etc. The first time I was fingerprinted was over 15 years ago and at that time, they used real ink on your fingers and you had to do it at the County jail! I was so humilated the rest of the day thinking anyone who saw my hands would think I had been arrested!!! Now they do it with a scanner and no ink


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## Jill (Feb 20, 2011)

Sorry, doube post


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## Sonya (Feb 20, 2011)

LOL Jill...I didn't mean to single out Ashley or you, but thought that was the best example I could give and I had just gotten done reading the thread about what everyone's day job is. Ashley's stuck out for me because I once wanted to get into law enforcement and my ex brother in law was a prison guard, he is now the warden at Pelican Bay in CA. I still would like to get into law enforcement but in a different way...I would love to be a part time DNR officer in MI when I retire...oops I changed the subject...sorry.


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## Jill (Feb 20, 2011)

:OKinteresting



Not a problem at all -- It made me smile



:OKinteresting








:shocked



But, hey... maybe I'll get arrested at a Tea Party Rally or something in the future



:shocked


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## Ashley (Feb 20, 2011)

OH I would love to tour that prison!


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