# The Obama special last night



## Laura (Oct 30, 2008)

[SIZE=12pt]*I* thought it was AMAZING, moving, informative and *incredibly *well done. [/SIZE]

I'm sure that the anti-Obama folks on here, even those who didn't watch




will feel it neccesary to rant and rave, but you know what, I don't really care





*I* thought it was incredible and that is all that matters to me. Actually, it was BETTER than incredible, it was PRESEDENTIAL!!


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## Bassett (Oct 30, 2008)

I did not watch it but I heard enough about it this morning. I don't think a lot of people were as impressed as you were. No offense please. All I want to say is I don't think a lot of people have any idea, whatsoever, of what will happen if we are run by one party alone (regardless of which party). If we do away with the checks and balances there will be NOBODY to control their spending. Things will just go rampant. I pray we can keep BOTH parties in our government system. Things only have one way to go if we are controlled by one party and that is DOWNHILL. Spend, spend, spend.

Also heard this morning that Obama could not pass an FBI test. Too many unanswered questions.


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## minie812 (Oct 30, 2008)

I have to say that I am one of the undecided voters as well as my Hubby. We watched last night and have been watching all along on BOTH parties. I will say it was very powerful to watch for a change (I am so tired of hearing about "JOE the plumber & seeing JOE the plumber) it is like a broken record. Anyway still undecided but I am leaning to the _____


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## BlueMoonEmbroidery (Oct 30, 2008)

Bassett said:


> Also heard this morning that Obama could not pass an FBI test. Too many unanswered questions.


Wrong

"There is nowhere on the form that Obama's relationship to Ayers as it exists or existed would even come up," said Mark Zaid, a Washington attorney who specializes in security-clearance work. "It would never come up unless somebody mentioned it during a background investigation."

Moreover, even if it did come up, there's no reason to believe it would impede Obama's hiring, Zaid said. "Given what has been said publicly about their relationship, I can't fathom that it would ever get more than a moment's attention," he said.

A second lawyer specializing in security clearances, Elizabeth Newman of the Washington, D.C., firm Kalijarvi, Chuzi & Newman, concurred that the Ayers connection would pose no problem for Obama, even if it did come to the attention of the investigators.

"They would care if there was a recent relationship with someone who is currently on trial or currently considered to be advocating violent overthrow of the government," she said. "But not something that was 20 or 30 years ago."

A third security-clearance lawyer, Mark Riley of Odenton, Md., who is also a retired Army intelligence officer, was slightly less dismissive of the Ayers issue, saying it was "something they would investigate."

But Riley leaned toward the conclusion that the Ayers connection would not cost Obama a security clearance. "The issue is what is Obama's relationship with him in his adult life," Riley said. "If he didn't have one, other than they sat on a board and maybe had the same political causes, that's not enough to deny a fellow a clearance."

*So all three of the attorneys we contacted agreed unequivocally that Obama's relationship with Ayers would not be an automatic disqualifier, as the claim suggests.*

In fact, Zaid said someone with Obama's record – a law degree from Harvard, teaching experience at the University of Chicago Law School – would be an excellent candidate.

"The agencies would be fighting over him," Zaid said. "As an outright claim, this statement is false."

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/800/

And to stay on topic I also thought the special last night was very well done. I was very happy that Obama showed the woman with RA. That is exactly what many of us with RA are facing.


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## Bassett (Oct 30, 2008)

Blue Moon:

No one said anything about Ayres. Just as a person in general they said he would not pass. Just curious, Why did you say Ayres? Are you thinking maybe, just maybe there IS something to it?


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## Danielle_E. (Oct 30, 2008)

It was exceptional at the very least



. All the republican analyst that I saw after the speech interviewed were gracious and positive about his speech which was nice to see. It was nice for a change not to have any mud-slinging going on.

I truly hope that the U.S.A. will elect this "exceptional man". The U.S. needs to get their economy back on track, they need to bring stability in foreign policy and not the "bomb, bomb, bomb" mentality (even the UN wants to see Obama elected), they need to get their image to what it use to be and have the rest of the world respect them once again. I am afraid that Bush and the Bush mentality has almost destroyed your country's image





Whoever does win, whether it is McCain or Obama, I fervently pray that the divisiveness that I am seeing during this campaign will be healed and that the people of the U.S. will accept what the majority want in your country.

One thing is for sure - it has been one of the most interesting Presidential elections I have ever seen.


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## AppyLover2 (Oct 30, 2008)

His admitted drug use would be a huge factor in whether or not he was granted a security clearance. At least when I got mine it was a BIG deal. Could be that it's changed since then but I seriously doubt that it's gotten that lax.

Speaking of drug use and things becoming lax....a commentator was talking the other day about what a big deal it was when Clinton said he "didn't inhale". Now nobody seems to care that a presidential candidate was a user.

Edited after I read Danielle's post. Another thing the commentators were talking about was the fact that they all expected Obama to do a great job in his infomercial. They said that he's a great speaker when things are scripted. It's when things aren't scripted that he tends to say things he shouldn't.


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## BlueMoonEmbroidery (Oct 30, 2008)

Bassett said:


> Blue Moon: No one said anything about Ayres. Just as a person in general they said he would not pass. Just curious, Why did you say Ayres? Are you thinking maybe, just maybe there IS something to it?


"A chain e-mail has been burning up the Internet with the allegation that Sen. Barack Obama is not eligible for FBI or Secret Service jobs because of his acquaintance with former antiwar radical William Ayers."

Sorry I assumed you were referring to the email that was going around.


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## Irish Hills Farm (Oct 30, 2008)

For those of you who Obama made all warm and fuzzy inside, guess his infomerical worked.

Got this in an email...



> have made reference several times now to the fact that a lot of the supporters of Barack Obama have little idea of what is coming with him. We can now see as we get close to election day that even the things we do think we know are changing. Since Virginia is a battleground and since Mr. Obama has unlimited funds I have heard his commercials time and time again. And I have heard him say in them as late as this morning that those making under $250,000 will not see their taxes raised one dime. While that is not a quote that is his words.
> 
> 
> But I heard during the day and on NBC news tonight that Joe Biden said the tax scheme should go to the middle class – those making under $150,000. When Senator McCain pounced on that the Obama campaign indicated old gaffe Biden misspoke but then introduced a new ceiling of $200.000. What we know on this issue is this – for Barack Obama the American dream is alive and well to $150,000, or maybe to $200,000 or if we really stretch to $250,000. At that point those people are the scourge of society. Just look at what they have done to vilify Joe the Plumber. The American dream – catch it on the way to some number to be defined. But to be on the good side it would be best to stop at that ceiling.
> ...


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## BlueMoonEmbroidery (Oct 30, 2008)

AppyLover2 said:


> His admitted drug use would be a huge factor in whether or not he was granted a security clearance. At least when I got mine it was a BIG deal. Could be that it's changed since then but I seriously doubt that it's gotten that lax.


Looks like if it was more than 7 years ago, its not a problem.

Standard Form 86 Revised July 2008 U.S. Office of Personnel Management 5 CFR Parts 731, 732, and 736

Form approved: OMB No. 3206 0005 NSN 7540-00 634-4036 86-111

Questionnaire for National Security Positions

The following questions pertain to the illegal use of drugs or drug activity. You are required to answer the questions fully and truthfully, and your failure to do so could be grounds for an adverse employment decision or action against you. Neither your truthful responses nor information derived from your responses will be used as evidence against you in any subsequent criminal proceeding.

a. In the last 7 years, have you illegally used any controlled substance, for example, cocaine, crack cocaine, THC (marijuana, hashish, etc.), narcotics (opium, morphine, codeine, heroin, etc.), stimulants (amphetamines, speed, crystal methamphetamine, Ecstacy, ketamine, etc.), depressants (barbiturates, methaqualone, tranquilizers, etc.), hallucinogenics (LSD, PCP, etc.), steroids, inhalants (toluene, amyl nitrate, etc.) or prescription drugs (including painkillers)? Use of a controlled substance includes injecting, snorting, inhaling, swallowing, experimenting with or otherwise consuming any controlled substance

b. Have you EVER illegally used a controlled substance while possessing a security clearance; while employed as a law enforcement officer, prosecutor, or courtroom official; or while in a position directly and immediately affecting the public safety?

c. In the last 7 years, have you been involved in the illegal possession, purchase, manufacture, trafficking, production, transfer, shipping, receiving, handling, or sale of any controlled substance (see question a above) including prescription drugs?

d. In the last 7 years, have you received counseling or treatment or have you been ordered, advised, or asked to seek counseling or treatment as a result of your use of drugs? If you answered "Yes," provide date(s) of treatment and name(s) and address(es) of provider(s). You will be asked to sign an additional release if information is needed concerning any treatment.


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## Cathy_H (Oct 30, 2008)

Calculated polictical psychological hype presented Hollywood style to keep Obamanites in their slumberous spell. What a rude awakening for some when they come out of their stance. Beautifully done fanmercial will be the envy of Hollywood.



> for Barack Obama the American dream is alive and well to $150,000, or maybe to $200,000 or if we really stretch to $250,000.


... So WHY are the numbers jumping around? ....



.... Didn't Obama say last night something like "you will always know where I stand!




> There is no so called "unanswered" questions about Obama.. The problem is the far right people & media keep saying that and people believe it.. If you look up FACTS


We only know what Obama has told us. Do people honestly think he would reveal ANYTHING that would keep him out of the oval office!


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## Laura (Oct 30, 2008)

Seems like I was right about the negative comments that would be made. Why am I not surprised?


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## Irish Hills Farm (Oct 30, 2008)

I guess since we don't agree with you and we aren't buying what Obama is selling that is being negative.

Hrmm...interesting.


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## Pepipony (Oct 30, 2008)

Cathy_H said:


> Calculated polictical psychological hype presented Hollywood style to keep Obamanites in their slumberous spell. What a rude awakening for some when they come out of their stance. Beautifully done fanmercial will be the envy of Hollywood.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




If you think about it, the number isnt jumping around. All the numbers listed are still below his $250k mark. So yes, if you make $100k a year your taxes wont raise, if you make $200k your taxes wont raise.

I am SO proud of him for not stooping to McCain/Palins level and bashing his opponent during this speech. I dont even think McCain is liking what he is being made to do by his Rove-esque handlers.


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## AppyLover2 (Oct 30, 2008)

Mary Lou thank you for assuring me that I have no questions about Obama. Silly me....I thought I did. I feel much better now.


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## Cathy_H (Oct 30, 2008)

> Seems like I was right about the nagative comments that would be made. Why am I not surprised







Freedom of speech being taken away right here on the forum!







> this speech


 - Some of us don't call it that. I call it a self serving commercial.




> I guess since we don't agree with you and we aren't buying what Obama is selling that is being negative.


 I guess that those of us that don't agree with Obama need to start our own thread!



> *ASSOCIATED PRESS SAYS SENATOR OBAMA WAS “LESS THAN UPFRONT” in his 1/2 hour commercial*
> THE FACTS: His proposals — the tax cuts, the low-cost loans, the $15 billion a year he promises for alternative energy, and more — cost money, and *the country could be facing a record $1 trillion deficit next year.* Indeed, Obama recently acknowledged — although not in his commercial — that: “The next president will have to scale back his agenda and some of his proposals.“


http://gretawire.foxnews.com/2008/10/29/as...our-commercial/


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## Laura (Oct 30, 2008)

Cathy_H said:


> > Seems like I was right about the nagative comments that would be made. Why am I not surprised
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It has nothing to do with freedom of speech, it has to do with no matter what anyone says positive about Obama, certain people can't refrain from attacking him and anyone who supports him. We're happy about something, so you have to try to point out why we're wrong and delusional and whatever, we can't just be allowed to be proud and happy about something we think is positive.


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## AppyLover2 (Oct 30, 2008)

> we can't just be allowed to be proud of happy about something we think is positive.


Laura you're right. I apologize. I wish I had the confidence in him that some of you do. I honestly hope he's the man you think he is.


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## littlesteppers (Oct 30, 2008)

Thur..is this what you want to hear?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I thought it was Hollywood. It was romance. It was realism. The technical quality of it, the production values were perfect, the way they timed going to live, the biographical material. But most important, the connection with the average person in the economic turmoil we face right now I thought was fabulous. Of course, there we see the setting, which is very much like an Oval Office setting, showing that he's comfortable and we should be comfortable and will be with him in such a setting. I thought everything was just right.

I thought, the most important part of it, I thought, was the biographical, showing him talking about his mom and talking about him taking a chance in history and not wanting to miss it having seen his mother die at a young age. It was very human and I think you'd have to be a tough customer not to be touched by it.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Man and I MISSED it,,..had to wash my hair..bet I would have tingles up my leg..like some news anchors..


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## McBunz (Oct 30, 2008)

How is McCain going to balance the budget in a years time...?????????? Both sides are saying things to get your vote.. not just one...


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## Laura (Oct 30, 2008)

AppyLover2 said:


> > we can't just be allowed to be proud of happy about something we think is positive.
> 
> 
> Laura you're right. I apologize. I wish I had the confidence in him that some of you do. I honestly hope he's the man you think he is.


Thank you Donna, I appreciate that very much


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## Sonya (Oct 30, 2008)

> It has nothing to do with freedom of speech, it has to do with no matter what anyone says positive about Obama, certain people can't refrain from attacking him and anyone who supports him. We're happy about something, so you have to try to point out why we're wrong and delusional and whatever, we can't just be allowed to be proud of happy about something we think is positive.


Laura will all due respect, this goes on with both sides...especially when it comes to Palin. Anything positive about her on here that came up was made negative by the left side...it goes both ways.

If this was about a McCain infomercial and his supporters all came on here saying how wonderful it was, you don't think there would be negativity from the other side??? Of course there would be.


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## tagalong (Oct 30, 2008)

> Calculated polictical psychological hype presented Hollywood style to keep Obamanites in their slumberous spell. What a rude awakening for some when they come out of their stance. Beautifully done fanmercial will be the envy of Hollywood.


Wow. *Cathy H* - IMO that ^^^ is an entirely uncalled for bit of sniping and dismissive rhetoric. I have friends who are out campaigning for Obama - they are not in a trance... but it is their stance that they want Change.

*Irish Hills* - you do not see something as being unnecessarily negative when posters who have different opinions are referred to in sneering terms? It's the same old song. You can say you did not watch it - or did not care for it - without resorting to sneers and jeers...

*Mary Lou* is right - the answers are out there - only some of you do not even bother to read them. Some of us have presented them here - from non-partisan websites and even FoxNews - and yet some of you blow it all off and still say there are no "answers". But AGAIN - you must think McCain is an idiot - if there truly were none of your "answers" out there and he would not jump on that fact. That in and of itself should tell you that the so-called answers you seek have been found. Not that they were hidden - you just insist that they are as it is a talking point that some cannot let go of.

*Mary Lou* - I was listening to Hannity the other day (cannot stand him but I ALWAYS listen to a variety of sources to get different perspectives on things) and he was assuring his listeners that once Obama was in office he would abolish right wing talk radio shows like his "in order to silence the truth I bring you" - he presented this as a fact. I do not think he believes that in any way - but he was using it to get people fired up and have them call in. The OTT calls he got were hair-raising - and he happily fed into that. It is all about ratings, after all...





_Yeeesh _- Obama was open and honest and said he dipped into some drugs when he was younger - and you insist he is hiding things?

I did not see the special... yet.

I still think the Frontline special on PBS a couple of weeks ago was WONDERFUL. Both candidates were examined in depth in an excellent non-partisan way - including all the bumps in their roads. Ayers, Keating, personal issues - everything was examined. And a lot of those mysterious non-existant "answers" were in there as well. Anyway - it is a worthwhile show to watch no matter who you favour... and will likely be repeated.



> If this was about a McCain infomercial and his supporters all came on here saying how wonderful it was, you don't think there would be negativity from the other side??? Of course there would be.


Of course - but would it include sneers like _McCainites are all in a trance and are all fools/sheep and will wake up to realize that at some point? _ I doubt it. That kind of stuff has _mainly_ gone one way in these threads... oh - I left out the usual



that some use as a matter of course....


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## hobbyhorse23 (Oct 30, 2008)

Cathy_H said:


> > for Barack Obama the American dream is alive and well to $150,000, or maybe to $200,000 or if we really stretch to $250,000.
> 
> 
> ... So WHY are the numbers jumping around? ....
> ...


Would you rather have someone like Bush who is so determined to stick to his guns and his stance that he persists even when it has become obvious that he was WRONG WRONG WRONG?? I lost so much respect for him when he clung to the WMD thing against all the evidence. Reality is, people change their stances as they get more information or it becomes more advantageous to them to go the other way. Every politician I've ever seen does that. Normal people do that. It doesn't bother me. He's got a lot of hoops to jump through before he could change our tax system and there are a LOT of people who would have a say in that final number. Of course it isn't going to be whatever he originally said!







Irish Hills Farm said:


> I guess since we don't agree with you and we aren't buying what Obama is selling that is being negative.





Cathy_H said:


> > Seems like I was right about the nagative comments that would be made. Why am I not surprised
> 
> 
> 
> ...


"If you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all." So WHY, precisely, did you feel the need to come express your negative or dissenting opinion then scream "Freedom of Speech" when someone called you on it? If someone posts a thread looking for fluffy bunny comments on their horse we all get in trouble for pointing out it's got cowhocks and a big head. Why should this be any different? Laura stated her opinion, she didn't ask what anyone else thought or to have her candidate trashed.



> I guess that those of us that don't agree with Obama need to start our own thread!


Yes, you should! Exactly! And if you asked us not to comment negatively on that thread or turn it into a debate we should respect that as an expression of an opinion and nothing more.

Argh. Sorry, the longer this [email protected] drags on the harder it is to hold my tongue. I don't understand why one or two certain members feel the need to keep posting new threads two or three times a day that are nothing new at all! GET OVER IT. Vote and move on. We've got four years to complain about the winner, no need to cram it all in now.





Leia


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## Charley (Oct 30, 2008)

I believe they said the time he bought last night was at a rate of $190,000.00 per minute (even if it was a little lower it is still unreal)....and he claims he will get government spending under control and not raise taxes on most Americans.



And we wonder why the networks love him? One million dollars to each of four networks....that is mind boggling to me. I can't believe that more people aren't upset by this. Listen to what I say, but don't look behind the curtain....

I did watch and listened to it all. Most was the same old stuff with some fluff added. I about choked when he said he "STEALS" ideas ..... he certainly should have worded that differently.

Truthfully, I am disappointed in the choices we have. But I will vote....


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## Laura (Oct 30, 2008)

Sonya said:


> > It has nothing to do with freedom of speech, it has to do with no matter what anyone says positive about Obama, certain people can't refrain from attacking him and anyone who supports him. We're happy about something, so you have to try to point out why we're wrong and delusional and whatever, we can't just be allowed to be proud of happy about something we think is positive.
> 
> 
> Laura will all due respect, this goes on with both sides...especially when it comes to Palin. Anything positive about her on here that came up was made negative by the left side...it goes both ways.
> ...


There wouldn't nastiness from from me



I might not agree with him, but I don't have to. I just think that we should be respectful of each other.

I did catch part of McCain's interview last night with Larry King and he did great. It looked like he was much more relaxed and confident than I have seen him in a long time. It was nice to see.


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## hobbyhorse23 (Oct 30, 2008)

Wow, lots of replies while I typed!







AppyLover2 said:


> > we can't just be allowed to be proud of happy about something we think is positive.
> 
> 
> Laura you're right. I apologize. I wish I had the confidence in him that some of you do. I honestly hope he's the man you think he is.


Appylover, I just want to say I blinked and gained a lot of respect for you for saying that. Not that you hope you're wrong about Obama (your opinion is your opinion and you have every right to have doubts about any candidate without being made to feel bad for them) but the apology for as a group turning a Happy Post into something else. I'm probably saying this wrong but I just wanted you to know I was impressed and doff my hat to you!

Leia


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## Bassett (Oct 30, 2008)

> It has nothing to do with freedom of speech, it has to do with no matter what anyone says positive about Obama, certain people can't refrain from attacking him and anyone who supports him. We're happy about something, so you have to try to point out why we're wrong and delusional and whatever, we can't just be allowed to be proud and happy about something we think is positive.



Laura, I'm trying to be nice now so am not bashing you, BUT don't you see the same thing happening when someone says something about McCain or Palin. I do . It is coming from both sides.


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## Lucky-C-Acres-Minis (Oct 30, 2008)

> Argh. Sorry, the longer this [email protected] drags on the harder it is to hold my tongue. I don't understand why one or two certain members feel the need to keep posting new threads two or three times a day that are nothing new at all! GET OVER IT. Vote and move on. We've got four years to complain about the winner, no need to cram it all in now. rolleyes.gif
> Leia






:yeah



:yeah



:yeah



:yeah



:yeah



:yeah



:yeah



:yeah



:yeah


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## LowriseMinis (Oct 30, 2008)

I wasn't sure I was going to watch, but I did and I'm glad I did. I think it was nicely done, did a good job of outlining his plans and positions, and wasn't over the top.


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## tagalong (Oct 30, 2008)

> I believe they said the time he bought last night was at a rate of $190,000.00 per minute (even if it was a little lower it is still unreal)....and he claims he will get government spending under control and not raise taxes on most Americans.


*Charly* - that expense was not government spending though - it was from donations. And no - not donations from mysterious terrorist organizations - but from people all over America - like my friends - who contribute.

At least the airtime was not Superbowl rates...





Hands up - ANYONE who thinks that if McCain had the same amount of funds coming in that he would not have done a similar thing....

_*crickets*_

Of course he would. And I would not fault him for it. But ALL the campaign spending is obscene IMO...

And both candidates are going to raise taxes - no matter what they assure you now. The deficit is too great... and the ongoing expenses and debt too huge not to have to go that route at some point. And no - this budget is not going to be balanced in one year. That is just campaign-speak... nothing wrong with that, but it is likely going to take 4 years to get us out of this current mess....


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## AppyLover2 (Oct 30, 2008)

Thank you Leia!


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## Laura (Oct 30, 2008)

Bassett said:


> > It has nothing to do with freedom of speech, it has to do with no matter what anyone says positive about Obama, certain people can't refrain from attacking him and anyone who supports him. We're happy about something, so you have to try to point out why we're wrong and delusional and whatever, we can't just be allowed to be proud and happy about something we think is positive.
> 
> 
> 
> Laura, I'm trying to be nice now so am not bashing you, BUT don't you see the same thing happening when someone says something about McCain or Palin. I do . It is coming from both sides.


I do see a lot of it, but *I* try not to do it. Some days are better than other and often I will type a response and then delete it or just turn off the computer and walk away. As I said, I don't support McCain, but I don't call people names and insult them because they don't agree with me...or at least I REALLY try not to do so.

This election will be over in 5 days and we will all have to find a way to come together again and heal. I hope Obama wins, but if he doesn't I will still be a VERY proud American and will love this country, as I know *all *of us, red, blue or independant do love and value this great Country.


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## CKC (Oct 30, 2008)

I also, thought it was amazing. I had not decided on who I was going to vote for, but I have now. I've thought it over and over and researched as much as I could. I've watched this forum and have gotten lots of interesting information from it.

I don't think I've ever had to put as much thought into a presidential candidate as I have with this election. I'm actually going to be glad when it's final.


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## Laura (Oct 30, 2008)

CKC said:


> I've watched this forum and have gotten lots of interesting information from it.
> I don't think I've ever had to put as much thought into a presidential candidate as I have with this election. I'm actually going to be glad when it's final.


I'll be glad when it's over too, but isn't it incredible how this election has gotten SO many people involved and interested? I think it's great to see the people of this Country finally get really excited and interested in how our government works and take action to BE informed. I think it's amazing!


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## LowriseMinis (Oct 30, 2008)

On the topic of campaign donations...my boyfriend is a member of a pretty big internet forum, and most of the members tend to lean liberal. To date, the members of that forum alone have donated over $330,000 to Obama's campaign, mostly in amounts of $25 and under.


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## tagalong (Oct 30, 2008)

*Lowrise* - on another non-horse related forum I am on, many of the members there have also donated... always in numbers of around $50.... and they have raised thousands and thousands of dollars.

I personally do not give money to _any_ politician - too many bills to attend to first...


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## Cathy_H (Oct 30, 2008)

> Laura stated her opinion, she didn't ask what anyone else thought or to have her candidate trashed.


I disagree - read this again. "*Say what you will*"

Did we not read *"say what you will" in her heading or not?* I translate that as an invitation to say what we wish even if we don't agree with her.



> Yes, you should! Exactly! And if you asked us not to comment negatively on that thread or turn it into a debate we should respect that as an expression of an opinion and nothing more


Read the below statement again please - WHERE did she ask for statements NOT to be posted if they did not agree with hers?



> I'm sure that the anti-Obama folks on here, even those who didn't watch will feel it neccesary to rant and rave, but you know what, *[SIZE=12pt]I don't really care[/SIZE] *






> I'm sure that the anti-Obama folks on here, even those who didn't watch will feel it neccesary to rant and rave


Did she not also state that she was " sure that there would be anti - Obama statements made". She was expecting it wasn't she?

Not being argumentive - just stating what I read!



> Laura will all due respect, this goes on with both sides...especially *when it comes to Palin*. Anything positive about her on here that came up was made negative by the left side...it goes both ways. If this was about a McCain infomercial and his supporters all came on here saying how wonderful it was, you don't think there would be negativity from the other side??? Of course there would be


Absolutely - yes the road runs both ways doesn't it!


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## Jill (Oct 30, 2008)

Of course, I didn't watch it. However, I find it very interesting that some people have truly been swayed by a slick, one-sided (obviously!) *infomercial* that was paid for by a broken promise.


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## Carriage (Oct 30, 2008)

McBunz said:


> How is McCain going to balance the budget in a years time...?????????? Both sides are saying things to get your vote.. not just one...


Precisely McBunz! You are the real winner here. So I guess the question that I've had for many years is.............. Why are folks voting for either side? In reality they are only two arms of the SAME side. The hegelian farce of holding one scary "candidate" against the other so that folks feel they have to vote for the "lesser of two evils" is done to scare them into voting for what they know and admit to be evil (quite often). And it works every time.........

Checks and balances have been gone for a long time, so it really may not matter which "side" wins. Imo Mr Bush has laid waste to checks and balances in the same vein as his predecessors, and Mr McCain told you he was going to do the same, speaking of "unpopular decisions on his part" and telling hankie to go ahead and give our money away to the banks..........

From another thread , lowrise spoke of "pro gay rights", two points

1) There is no Constitutional allowance for the federal govt. to issue edicts on gay "marriage" As there is no specific enumeration to do so, they are prohibited from doing so, making it a state or 10th amend. issue. There is a chance that if it interferes with interstate commerce that the feds would have standing..... maybe.

2) ALL Americans have the SAME rights endowed upon them by their Creator whether they recognize and honor that Creator or not. Rights are not granted by any govt. Govt. can only grant privilege, which gov. can also take away at a whim. No additional or special rights should be conferred on anybody regardless of color, class, religious beliefs, political leanings, "sexual orientation" or any other yard stick you want to use period.

I took a moment to re-read the Constitution Party's platform again after watching the debate this past week-end. If you haven't done so yet, I would highly recommend it. It painfully shows how far we have fallen Constitutionally. Its still refreashing to read it periodically to see where we should be heading.

It was probably best that the bobsy twins didn't allow other parties, into the debate as they would have looked pretty silly imo. I even found myself agreeing with Mr. Nader on a few points.

No offense is intended in this post. Hard truth maybe, but no offense


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## tagalong (Oct 30, 2008)

> Not being argumentive - just stating what I read!


_Say what you will_.... is a phrase of speech acknowledging that others may feel differently - not an invitation to be trashed. Everyone is entitled to share their opinions - but you can disagree without sneering and bashing - or at least try to.

Picking apart someone's post to prove that you can say whatever the heck you want to is simply being argumentative, IMO.

Yeah - I guess I still long for the balanced, respectful discussions we used to have in political threads here a few short weeks ago... don't worry - I'll get over it - that's my problem.

I just wonder if we will still see endless trashing threads come Nov. 5....


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## Sonya (Oct 30, 2008)

> I just wonder if we will still see endless trashing threads come Nov. 5....


I wish people wouldn't take all this so personal...and they are. I admit, I've said some shrewd uncalled for things a couple times and they have been said to me as well...I just let it roll off, people need to do the same... I have no anger/grudge towards anyone who feels differently than I. I don't really know anyone on the forum personally, except a couple. I certainly wouldn't let a member's view on politics skew my opinion of them on a personal level.

I'm sure there will still be some controversial posts after next Tuesday. People need to not take them so personal or just not post/read them.


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## AppyLover2 (Oct 30, 2008)

> I just wonder if we will still see endless trashing threads come Nov. 5....


My guess it that would depend entirely upon the graciousness of the winners. Since I'm sure we all teach our kids to be good winners as well as good losers I'd hope we all remember to practice what we preach.


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## Bassett (Oct 30, 2008)

> but you can disagree without sneering and bashing


Probably done by EVERYONE at one time or another. Say what you will.


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## Danielle_E. (Oct 30, 2008)

The truly sad thing in all of this is that this thread was started asking what you thought of the Obama "special" for those that watched it. Why are the ones that posted on another thread, yes with derogatory comments in the other thread and saying no way they would watch it, yada yada, come here and continue. I don''t get it



. Please, at least have some respect and allow those that did watch to discuss what was said without the backlash that continues non-stop whenever someone says something positive about the candidate they have chosen to endorse and vote for. The same goes for the other side as well. What is the point to all this. Nothing you say, on either side of the fence is going to change anyones mind about the candidate they are voting for. I am sure the ones that haven't made up their mind yet are very capable to making their OWN choice without these arguments and pettiness on BOTH sides. Have some respect for them as well as I am sure they can make up their own mind and do their own research as they will make an informed decision based on what concerns THEM and how they personally feel about either candidate. I truly can not see how your country is going to come together after this election. If everyone just stopped replying in threads that get you hot under the collar and let each group talk to the wall if need be when something less than stellar is posted this entire nonsense would stop or at least not have the flames grow larger and larger. It's not worth it everybody. This is such a wonderful group of people and yes we are all entitled to our opinions, we all have free speech but sometimes its harder to bite our tongues but easy to just rant and rave and in the end we all look stupid and that certainly includes me for sure. I know if we really want to do this we can



We can



till November 4th but it isn't going to change a darn thing, except perhaps hurt people, which we don't want to do!

Lets get back to



instead of


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## Bassett (Oct 30, 2008)

Just want to say one thing Danielle. Just because we didn't watch it last night doesn't mean we didn't see it. It is being shoved down our throats all day on tv. I know, I know I could just shut it off



but that would be taking away my lifestyle. TV is part of my day. So I am seeing the aftermath. Which I don't mind. It is just confirming my decision even more that McCain is the man. Not bashing here just stating a fact.


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## hobbyhorse23 (Oct 30, 2008)

Cathy_H said:


> Did she not also state that she was " sure that there would be anti - Obama statements made". She was expecting it wasn't she?


So we should always strive to live up to people's worst expectations??



Wow, that's taking the high road.

Leia


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## SantaClaus (Oct 30, 2008)

I AM WATCHING ALL OF YOU



. Going to be lots of coal in stockings this year


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## CKC (Oct 30, 2008)

Swayed...No Inspired... Yes!

I'm ready for a change. You are taking a chance on either candidate and my chance will be taken on Obama.


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## Cathy_H (Oct 30, 2008)

> Why are the ones that posted on another thread, yes with derogatory comments in the other thread and saying no way they would watch it


................ If I am being referenced I did watch it.


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## Irish Hills Farm (Oct 30, 2008)

I will repeat what I said early and if Tag you don't like it, oh well.

Obama has obviously left some warm and fuzzy inside. His infomerical was meant to do just that and apparently it did.

With his faux oval office and promises (those are faux to, lets not forget the broken promise on limiting spending on this election) that make people's hearts go pitter patter.


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## Jill (Oct 30, 2008)

You all keep hanging onto your "change". I"m hanging onto my wallet


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## littlesteppers (Oct 30, 2008)

Irish Hills Farm said:


> I will repeat what I said early and if Tag you don't like it, oh well.Obama has obviously left some warm and fuzzy inside. His infomerical was meant to do just that and apparently it did.
> 
> With his faux oval office and promises (those are faux to, lets not forget the broken promise on limiting spending on this election) that make people's hearts go pitter patter.


Irish..read a few posts from you and gotto ask..Don't you just love TN?? I gotto say you fit right in





Where did you move from??


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## Irish Hills Farm (Oct 30, 2008)

littlesteppers said:


> Irish Hills Farm said:
> 
> 
> > I will repeat what I said early and if Tag you don't like it, oh well.Obama has obviously left some warm and fuzzy inside. His infomerical was meant to do just that and apparently it did.
> ...


LOL Steppers, I'm taking the 5th on that, while I still can. God, does Obama want to take that ammendment away from us too?



And no, I actually don't fit in down here. The rednecks here don't like us out spoken yankee women.

Oh, I'm from MICHIGAN !!!

P.S. I'm looking forward to moving north next summer!


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## mininik (Oct 30, 2008)

Yay, coal from Santa! Free heat.


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## Irish Hills Farm (Oct 30, 2008)

mininik said:


> Yay, coal from Santa! Free heat.


LOL

Good one.


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## hobbyhorse23 (Oct 30, 2008)

mininik said:


> Yay, coal from Santa! Free heat.


Pppppffffppphhhttt!!! *chokes on water she just sprayed onto the screen* Okay, oh m'God, wasn't expecting that. Too funny!!

Leia


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## barnbum (Oct 30, 2008)

Just want to mention I've been covering the election in my 5th grade classroom for 7 weeks now and my students still have no clue who I will vote for.



They've been working on Election Journals (mostly at home), which consist of gathering four facts a week on the candidates, with resources cited. If they are interested in earning an A, responses to each fact must be included. It has to end with a paragraph about who they would vote for and why--using facts from their Journal to support their decision. A creative cover also helps.





We've talked about everything in the last 7 weeks...and it's refreshingly civil when one is discussing politics with 10 year olds.





I can't wait to read the Journals.

I'll tell them who I voted for on Nov 5th.


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## Crabby-Chicken (Oct 30, 2008)

Hey Laura,,,

I loved it!!! I think it was well done and made many good points he has tried to explain to people over and over. I am VERY happy I got to vote for him. I think he has a beautiful family and it makes me feel good that he seems ( TO ME) to have more integrity than the other candidate. I was very proud of him.


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## Frankie (Oct 30, 2008)

I have been back and forth about a million times, and keep waiting for one of the convence me.

So I did watch last night, and listened to every word.

I am still undecided.





Obama is a great speaker, but does that make him Presidential material? And then, do I hold that against him.

If we are looking for great speakers, then it would be Obama, but VP would be Palin. I would rather listen to them, than their running mate.

I come from a Military family and security is very very important to me.

I do like what Obama has talked about to help the economy, maybe just a touch more than McCain. But his foreign policy ideas, or lack there of, make me nervous.

I am not just real sure how important a THRIVING economy becomes, if Iraq were to come over and blow us off the map.

Still undecided.

I got it,,,,,,,,take the best of both of them,,,,,,,,,then I'll vote.


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## AppyLover2 (Oct 30, 2008)

Uh Uhhh Carolyn! Good idea but you can't clone your own candidate unless the rest of us get to do it too.


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## Frankie (Oct 30, 2008)

Ahhhhhhhhh,,,,,,,,,come on,,,,,,,I have a good name!!!!!!

McBama


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## Matt73 (Oct 30, 2008)

Mary Lou - LB said:


> There is no so called "unanswered" questions about Obama.. The problem is the far right people & media keep saying that and people believe it.. If you look up FACTS, you could learn it is NOTHING BUT SCARE-TATICS and fear-mongering by the far right media.. I am so tired of the slamming of non-truths about Obama.. My 80 year old mother is brain-washed with listening 24/7 to Rush, Hennity, Fox, Mark Levin and such that it makes me sad she believes EVERYTHING they say is truth.. It is like propaganda!! I know because I listen to it to.. BUT with very OPEN MIND.
> I am done with this crap.. And already voted..


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## Matt73 (Oct 30, 2008)

Is it just me, or are most of the jibes against supporters and the candidate from McCain supporters against Obama supporters? I don't think I've seen one post that has actively attacked or degraded McCain. But I've seen plenty going the other way. Why the insecurity?


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## AppyLover2 (Oct 30, 2008)

No insecurity here. I'm *totally* convinced that McCain is the right man for the job and I'm doing my part to get him there. You might not see many attacks on McCain himself (although there have been quite a few) but don't try to convince me you haven't seen any attacks on McCain supporters. IMO the one you just applauded was one of them. So, with all due respect Matt, I guess my answer would have to be yes....it is just you.

I do think one thing that's happening though is that when a comment is made - whether it's intended as a jibe or not - it's taken that way; people jump to O's defense and the battle begins.


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## Matt73 (Oct 30, 2008)

Okey Dokey


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## AppyLover2 (Oct 30, 2008)




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## Southern_Heart (Oct 30, 2008)

AppyLover2 said:


> . I do think one thing that's happening though is that when a comment is made - whether it's intended as a jibe or not - it's taken that way; people jump to O's defense and the battle begins.


Yep! You got that right!





Joyce


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## Miniv (Oct 30, 2008)

barnbum said:


> Just want to mention I've been covering the election in my 5th grade classroom for 7 weeks now and my students still have no clue who I will vote for.
> 
> 
> 
> ...













What a wonderful idea!!! I bet this election will stay in their memories and will be a long time learning experience.

Would love to hear your classroom's voting results.....AFTER Nov. 4th.


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## Bassett (Oct 31, 2008)

Mandy, 6th grade, had their election yesterday. I asked her who won. She said overall Obama won but I did a lot of campaigning and in my class McCain won.



Gotta love that girl.


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## qtrrae (Oct 31, 2008)

barnbum said:


> Just want to mention I've been covering the election in my 5th grade classroom for 7 weeks now and my students still have no clue who I will vote for.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Karla, What a wonderful idea - a GREAT way to handle the election in your classroom, it will certainly be interesting to hear what the children have to say - these are the types of things that make you an awesome teacher.

How refreshing to read unbiased posts like this!!


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## AppyLover2 (Oct 31, 2008)

Karla I just wanted to add my



for you. You're students are learning at a young age to take interest in their country and I can only believe that that will help them become better citizens. I predict that someday they'll look back on this and be grateful for the lessons learned and the teacher who was wise enough to teach them.


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## minie812 (Oct 31, 2008)

MMMMM...after watching the postings about Obama and HIS drug use, well I felt I had to comment about Miss Cindy AND her drug use. Is it not true she was stealing controled narcotics and having a Dr. write scripts in the names of fellow workers so she could use them for herself?( mmmm...wonder how it felt for the ones that really needed the pain medicines?) Oh, and when caught red handed she got community service and wisked away for drug treatment and the Dr. was the one who lost his license. WOW, now if it had been Joe the Plummer who did that his A-- would have gone to prison and he would be doing plumbing for the state!


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## Sonya (Oct 31, 2008)

> well I felt I had to comment about Miss Cindy AND her drug use


she's not running for president


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## AppyLover2 (Oct 31, 2008)

Yes Cindy McCain was treated for abuse of perscription drugs. She's admitted it just as Obama has admitted his drug use. If you're referring to my mention of O's drug abuse - I wasn't throwing stones. I merely said that IMO it would affect his ability to obtain a federal security clearance. Evidently it no longer would.

This is a perfect example of what I meant when I said that people see jibes where none were intended. The only difference is that you didn't jump to Obama's defense; instead you attacked someone who isn't even running for office.


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## minie812 (Oct 31, 2008)

AppyLover2 said:


> Yes Cindy McCain was treated for abuse of perscription drugs. She's admitted it just as Obama has admitted his drug use. If you're referring to my mention of O's drug abuse - I wasn't throwing stones. I merely said that IMO it would affect his ability to obtain a federal security clearance. Evidently it no longer would.
> This is a perfect example of what I meant when I said that people see jibes where none were intended. The only difference is that you didn't jump to Obama's defense; instead you attacked someone who isn't even running for office.


Well if THAT isn't calling the kettle BLACK! I AM stating that because SHE has the "powers that be" she walks away with a slap on her hand because of WHO she is and the fact that it gets downplayed while O keeps getting his brought up. If you think that one persons drug abuse does NOT affect an entire family you are mistaken. Why if Miss Cindy were to fall off the wagon do you think it would not affect McCain and the presidency? Oh Yeah, they would keep it in the closet outta site outta mind. Of course he was clueless (blink-blink) that she even had a problem till she got caught. I am done I already cast my vote and it isn't for the McPalin clan


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## AppyLover2 (Oct 31, 2008)

minie I'm not sure which BLACK kettle you're talking about unless it's the one boiling on the cauldron. Maybe I'm slow but I'm still not sure what the point is about a non-candidates former drug problem. Is she one of America's wealthy individuals who may get preferrential treatment?----wouldn't surprise me at all.


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## Pepipony (Oct 31, 2008)

Bush Jr was a Cocaine addict and whiskey drunk ( HE addmitted to their abuse long ago) . But people forgave him since those are white collar drugs. Clintons/Obamas 'use' are blue collar. Totally different


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## AppyLover2 (Oct 31, 2008)

*Laura* I guess I owe you another apology. I fully intended way back there to not post on your "happy" thread again....but I got sucked in. I'm done this time for sure.


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## Laura (Nov 1, 2008)

AppyLover2 said:


> *Laura* I guess I owe you another apology. I fully intended way back there to not post on your "happy" thread again....but I got sucked in. I'm done this time for sure.


No apology needed


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## Sonya (Nov 1, 2008)

> Bush Jr was a Cocaine addict and whiskey drunk ( HE addmitted to their abuse long ago) . But people forgave him since those are white collar drugs. Clintons/Obamas 'use' are blue collar. Totally different


HUH??? Sorry, drugs are drugs.

I didn't know Bush was running for office again.


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## Crabby-Chicken (Nov 1, 2008)

He is,,, he just looks like McCain.


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## minie812 (Nov 1, 2008)

Crabby-Chicken said:


> He is,,, he just looks like McCain.


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