# Anybody know about Caspian horses?



## Sheryl (Mar 15, 2007)

but I don't know much about them. Would love to hear what any of you might know.


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## FairytailGlennMinis (Mar 16, 2007)

I just know I have seen a pair of them driving ADS and then saw one of them go into the short stirrup hunter ring--wowsa!!!! It is said that the breed is as old as and MAY precede even the arabian horse. Google "caspian horse" and you will have a lot of great reading! You can find breeders on the registry page as well.


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## rabbitsfizz (Mar 16, 2007)

Been there done that do NOT want another one!!

Getting a saddle to fit was impossible- had to have one made for her.

She was pony sized all right but there was a TB lurking in there, not an Arab.

She was a neurotic mess- bucked, kicked (though not viciously) nipped and was hard to catch.

Now as a one off this could be said of any breed except a friend had had one when we were in a smaller pony size and they were one size up from us and that was a nightmare too.

They are also, in the States at least, though not here, expensive.

If you want a beautiful pony get a Welsh Section A- can't be beaten.!! (IMO




)


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## kaykay (Mar 16, 2007)

i disagree wholeheartedly with rabbit





My friend in illinois has been breeding Caspians for years and they are wonderful! her stallion just blows me away. He is not only gorgeous he has a dispostion to die for. I do believe they are one of the oldest breeds of horses still in existence. If you do a net search you will find their history which is really fascinating to read.

Unfortunately my friends hubby is very sick and she is selling out most of her herd. Let me know if you want her info.


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## Sheryl (Mar 16, 2007)

Thanks everyone for your input.

I actually did a bunch of reading on the 'net. I always like to hear first hand experiences though because according to every horse club, their breed is perfect for all purposes...lol To be frank, I am pretty skeptical of alot of the promotional writeups on different horse breeds....

I came across a nice sounding one for sale, at a very competitive price, comparable to Welsh etc - they have mostly ridden him but he is also a driving horse. I would look at him as a entry level cde/traildriving prospect. He is supposed to be dead broke and beginner safe etc. It is like an 8 hour drive to go see him so I am not sure....

Illinios is a LOONGGG way for me to go, probably 1,500 miles or more...

I agree that Welsh's are gorgeous and very similiar sized and abundantly available so might be a better choice for those reasons. The Caspians look light very light movers, very Arab looking, but this guy doesn't strike me as that "typey." He is cute and has a kind and quiet look though. I saw a short utube video of him and the driver was very inexperienced. He seemed quite forgiving and willing in spite of her mistakes.

It is funny how seeing a horse can just strike you as being interesting, even though I don't know much about the breed etc.

I love my mini, but I feel underpowered since I am a bigger person. So far, I don't feel that the mini I care lease is strong enough to lug me up hills. I really want to do some schooling CDEs this year and am not comfortable at even trying it with him yet since I want to be fair to the horse! I am starting driving lessons and will talk about all of this with the trainer.


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## FairytailGlennMinis (Mar 16, 2007)

The pair I have seen driving in ADS shows and mixed local shows has me very taken with them! To watch that pair drive in their fancy little rig and then to see the one go right under saddle with a young child....wow. These two are fancy and forward little movers and are very elegant and refined. I have had two Welsh crosses that I have adored, but I have to admit to being fascinated by Caspians!


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## mcharr36 (Mar 16, 2007)

Thank you, Kaykay.

Rabbitsfizz, if you have nothing nice to say about the Caspian, please keep quiet. As an owner, breeder and past President of the Caspian Society of the America's, I think I know a little about the disposition of a Caspian.

A kinder, gentler horse, or pony, will not be found. I have not heard of any here in the US that were as you described. so what if you have to have a saddle "custom made". There are a lot of horses out there that could and would perform much better with a custom fitted saddle.

We have several breeders here that let their Caspians run wild until they are brought in to be sold. They settle right in to the routine. And they are much happier with a "job to do". You don't tell a Caspian what to do. You ask it and show it what you want done. They are very eager to learn and please. Usually it only takes one or two sessions for the Caspian to remember it's task forever.

I have a friend who bought an 18 mo colt for her 18 mo daughter. They have literally grown up together. They are both now 7 yo. I think that colt, now a gelding, would lay down his life for that girl. She rides both English and Western. She trail rides also. After the trail ride, she removes the saddle and bridle, grooms her boy, then proceeds to ride around the horse campgrounds with just a halter and lead rope.

These horses are very people oriented.

And yes, they are hypothisized to pre-date the Arabian. Texas A & M is doing the genome of the horse. The Caspian is one of the breeds being extensively studied. At this point in time, it is conjectured that the Caspian was crossed with the Akhel Teke to produce the Arabian. The Bedoins needed a war horse. The AK was an excellent endurance horse, but has always stood 16+ hands. The Caspian also has the endurance, plus the sought after disposition, but was too small. Crossed, then fine tuned through years of culling, the Arabian was produced. The perfect war horse.

Also, the market here in the US is very depressed right now. Caspians are very reasonable. Too reasonable considering how rare they are. (Less than 1500 in the WORLD.)


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## susanne (Mar 16, 2007)

I am a huge Caspian fan, but jane (rabbitsfizz) has every right to speak her mind -- she is merely relating her own personal experience.

You certainly have every right to disagree and speak up for the horses you love, and I am fascinated by the information you posted, but please don't ask someone to keep quiet just because you disagree with them.


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## rabbitsfizz (Mar 17, 2007)

Absolutely- do I come on and say people have no right to speak against Arabs??

I find the Caspian a totally over rated and over priced (generally) breed that is mostly hype.

The person I bought our Caspian from was the premier breeder in England and we have been doing this a bit longer than the States as we would allow the import from Iran, whereas the States had a ban on that.

A lot of the horses in the states came from my colleague and I still say I do not recommend them to anyone for children, even though they were used extensively in the Riding School at my colleagues place.

They were also kept very very thin and, once we had the mare in the correct condition her temperament and outline both changed.

Rake thin she had a horse outline but in proper condition she still was not really a pony, but she was a very "awkward" shape.

I do think these animals are primitive horses as opposed to ponies, and they may well be the root stock of the Arabian but the Arab has been evolved and the Caspian remains a primitive horse.

Funnily enough I came across one pulling a cart in, of all places, Sorrento- a very nice little grey pony, very smart, I guess geograhically it was not that far form Iran!!


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## kaykay (Mar 17, 2007)

HI mary!

mcharr is my friend i was telling you all about. I know mary can defend herself but I know if someone came on her and said all miniature horses were ill tempered with poor conformation, neurotic messes, overrated full of hype etc etc a lot of people would be up in arms. Those are really strong statements to make about an entire breed.

You cant categorize any breed by one horse. There are good ones and bad ones in every breed. Doesnt mean the breed is bad.

In all my visits to Marys farm i never saw any of what Jane described in Marys horses. Kyle worked just a bit with Marys stallion and he was very young at the time and had no problems at all.

When i lived there we even thought of crossing Marys stallion on my Patches for a national show pony. but then i moved





Mary I wish you could post a pic of your stallion!


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## Sheryl (Mar 17, 2007)

Interesting discussion but the one I looked at (video and pictures only at this point) is not thin but actually winter plump. His build was light, not drafty, not pony like. He seemed pretty quiet and tolerant of a very green (ie bad) driver on the video I watched. Since I had never heard of Caspians, when I first saw the picture I really couldn't guess his breeding since he lacked the dished Arab head and well sprung ribs. I guessed maybe a Welsh cross and he does have a small horse look more then a pony look. Actually, he is cute and sweet looking. The big downside is that he has been driven and ridden by kids and seemed to have a bit of an inverted frame. I am not knowledgable enough to recognize this as a conformation issue versus bad riding. The owner referred to him as having "flat conformation" which doesn't mean anything to me.

I don't think there are any "bad" breeds, just some more suited for certain jobs. What I wondered if this breed characteristics tend to make good driving ponies and not too hot. Anyway, he is too far away to check out easily so I am probably not going to seriously look into it at this point.

Sheryl

p.s. and he was imported from the UK as a youngster!


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## Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis (Mar 17, 2007)

I have heard on these boards that many breeds are hype, a dime a dozen and much more.

Bottom line is a welsh pony isnt for everyone, a shetland isnt for everyone a gypsy not for everyone ect.

That doesnt mean they are all bad, crazy ect any more then a breed of dog or humans for that matter can be catagorized..

That said I have known someone who bred Caspians and the little I knew of them they were wonderful, as a general statement no better or worse then any other horse who had manners and was trained properly.

Hers anyway were a lot lighter in bone then many other pony breeds and were very pretty. They did hunters with them and they were great both on the flat as well as over fences.


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## Shari (Mar 17, 2007)

There has been someone posting on the sales board with purebred Caspians for sale..for well over 6 months.

Seems like she could not shift them. Might see if their is a search function for the sales board.

Could be she still has them for sale. Would be a good place to start.


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## susanne (Mar 17, 2007)

Kaykay (and Mary)

I don't object in any way to Mary defending her breed, nor am I surprised that she'd object vociferously.

However, I take issue with asking someone to keep quiet. Kaykay, you yourself recently stated that you love a good debate...and righhtly so. That is what forums are all about. (Although many have made it quite clear that they wish that I'd "keep quiet," LOL...)

I agree with Lisa that while not every horse is for everyone, one or two bad examples should not condemn any entire breed. Think how often we hear about how nasty ponies are or how useless minis are...but those are really opportunities to share information, now to shout down those who make the statements.

Mary, I'd LOVE to see your stallion and hear more about your Caspians,nd if you have a website, I would love to know so I can come drool.


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## mendocinobackofbeyond (Mar 17, 2007)

Hi: I don't have a lot to add; loved the info. As for the negative comments...it's part of life. How many of us American Shetlands breeders have heard, "Oh, a Shetland. Those mean little things." I grit my teeth every time I hear it, but it's a fact of life. I figure somewhere, in the ancient past, there was a legendary mean little shetland and because he/she was so mean, that he/she was sold/shipped all over the US, spreading the bad reputation wherever he/she landed -- sort of like a virus. We love our American Shetlands and I've yet to meet a mean one yet...but I know that somewhere, at sometime, there was a mean one who gave the whole breed a bad name, maybe it's the same case with the Caspians? You know the story of one rotten apple spoiling the barrel. Anyway, that's my take. Ta, Shirlee


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## kaykay (Mar 17, 2007)

shirlee i got such a giggle out of your post and that is most certainly true! I have always though Shetlands got that reputation as they were kids ponies and ummm werent ridden by the nicest of kids



: I know when i worked at one of those rent a horse ride stables the ponies were treated pretty bad.

This is probably why I feel for mary (and because shes my friend) because for years i have fought with people over shetlands being hot, nasty ill tempered ponies

And susanne i totally understand what you are saying! I think Mary just gave a knee jerk reaction as many of us would do if someone put down something we love so much and have dedicated years to. And theres a lot of people wish I would just keep quiet too LOL.

Jane and I talk all the time and she knows i have no animosity tword her at all. But sometimes its not what you say its how you say it.

I do so love a good debate but not when its just generalizations over an entire breed. Does that make sense?

To me its really hard to describe a Caspain. They are so light boned and elegant like an Arabian and really dont look like a pony at all except their size.


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## chandab (Mar 17, 2007)

mendocinobackofbeyond said:


> Hi: I don't have a lot to add; loved the info. As for the negative comments...it's part of life. How many of us American Shetlands breeders have heard, "Oh, a Shetland. Those mean little things." I grit my teeth every time I hear it, but it's a fact of life. I figure somewhere, in the ancient past, there was a legendary mean little shetland and because he/she was so mean, that he/she was sold/shipped all over the US, spreading the bad reputation wherever he/she landed -- sort of like a virus. We love our American Shetlands and I've yet to meet a mean one yet...but I know that somewhere, at sometime, there was a mean one who gave the whole breed a bad name, maybe it's the same case with the Caspians? You know the story of one rotten apple spoiling the barrel. Anyway, that's my take. Ta, Shirlee


I think the name Shetland has unfortunately been used to describe just about any pony whether actually a Shetland or not, and thus alot of unruly "shetlands" have been around the block.

My mom thought the minis were little Shetlands and must have bad personalities like the "shetlands" she knew as a kid (her first pony was a "shetland"/welsh cross).


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## The Dynamic Duo (Mar 18, 2007)

We have two.Bella is really sweet but Fera.............


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