# Tandem resources



## rbrown (Apr 9, 2012)

Since Skip is too sick to drive (likely Lyme issues, poor thing), and I'm nervous about Kandy being shipped here in two weeks, I need something to keep myself busy and looking forward to this summer. Now that I will finally have two trained driving horses in the same place, I would really, really like to think about driving them as a tandem. I promise I am not going to hook them together and drive and am planning to get lessons before I even ground drive them tandem, but I would like to start learning more and compiling some resources for future reference. Skip was the wheeler in a tandem last year, so she sort of knows what she's doing (it wasn't the perfect job for her/she went better in a pair, but she was green and is now a pretty solid driving horse), and Kandy is a very safe, sane, and well-behaved driving horse, so I think this could work! Anyway, I would appreciate any tips/references/etc anyone has to offer


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## Al B (Apr 10, 2012)

Have a knowledgable person help you. Where ae you located?


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## rbrown (Apr 10, 2012)

Al B said:


> Have a knowledgable person help you. Where ae you located?


I'm outside of Boston MA, and I'll be taking lessons with Andy Marcoux... but I still want to educate myself, at least a little bit, before I do lessons so I can get a better idea of what I'm getting myself into


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## Marsha Cassada (Apr 10, 2012)

I was trying the tandem thing a few years ago, but neither of my horses were good leaders so I gave it up. I had a makeshift harness, as I did not want to invest in the real thing unless it worked out. Though I actually did get mine going together, I could see they were not going to be very good at it and therefore it wouldn't be fun, so I gave it up. I did save some good advice from an experienced tandem driver (it was also recommended that the lead horse be "brilliant"):

Tandem is a lot of fun and quite challenging. I would recommend getting a fatter LONG pair of reins for your lead horse so you can decipher easily the difference between each horses reins.

as for where the lead horses attaches to the wheel horse it should be to the breastcollar/traces or the hames of the wheel horse. it should NEVER be attached to the cart as the lead horse can pull the cart over the wheel horse should something go wrong. I basically made my own gear out of harness's and parts that I had.

Technically a tandem does NOT have to be a matched pair. they do not even have to be the same sizes. I would HIGHLY recommend having a steady sane easy to drive horse as your lead horse and even a well trained wheel horse. you don't want things to go to heck in a handbasket and have one or both horses freaking out...not a pretty picture! Your lead horse should not be drafting (ie. pulling). Your front traces should always have a bit of slack/sway in them only the wheel horse should be drafting.


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## Al B (Apr 10, 2012)

OK, too far from me but good old Andy. Let me know how it goes with him.


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## rbrown (Apr 10, 2012)

Marsha Cassada said:


> I was trying the tandem thing a few years ago, but neither of my horses were good leaders so I gave it up. I had a makeshift harness, as I did not want to invest in the real thing unless it worked out. Though I actually did get mine going together, I could see they were not going to be very good at it and therefore it wouldn't be fun, so I gave it up. I did save some good advice from an experienced tandem driver (it was also recommended that the lead horse be "brilliant"):
> 
> Tandem is a lot of fun and quite challenging. I would recommend getting a fatter LONG pair of reins for your lead horse so you can decipher easily the difference between each horses reins.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the tips



That is sort of my plan- to just try them out, maybe even just ground driving, and see if it seems like they will work well as a tamdem before I get too invested. I think Kandy will be a better leader- she's more experienced, braver, and very very smart. Skippy listens well and knows how to behave herself, and it seems like she'd be happy to follow another horse, whereas Kandy is definitely more of a leader-personality. Skip is lazy and has decided it takes too much effort to spook, and not much bothers Kandy. They're both used to ropes and such being all over the place, so I think they'll be okay with the extra reins, and traces potentially getting tangled, etc. As an added plus, Kandy's definitely used to accidentally getting a leg over the traces (whoops, way back when my 15 year old self thought it would be cute to tie her to my sled without thinking about the logistics!). They're decently matched so I think they'll look quite cute together- Skip is a few inches taller, but they are both dark pintos.

I have heard that it's best to attach leader traces to the wheeler's breastcollar with twine, so I'm planning on doing that when we get started. I don't have two complete harnesses yet... just lots of leftover parts from upgrading Skip's harness piece by piece (bridle, saddle, breastcollar... and a bunch of odds and ends sitting in a bin somewhere, LOL), so I'll probably do a bit of improvising for the first few tries, until I know if this might work out. I'm getting so excited for Kandy to get here, and for Skip to feel better!


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## Farina (Apr 10, 2012)

There is a very good book on drving a Tandem availble. You will find it when you look up "tandem driving" at amazon.

If the leader is worked well in long reins and is wellmanered there should be no problem but I would suggest to have at least twohelpng people on your side.


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## happy appy (Apr 11, 2012)

Here is a neat website I just found.

http://www.wayoutwestminis.com/aTryTandem.htm


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## rbrown (Apr 11, 2012)

Thanks! I just skimmed over the link, and it looks like some good information!


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## hobbyhorse23 (Apr 13, 2012)

I live near Wanda and have known KC and Willie for years. It was fun watching her try tandem! As far as tandem resources, the best thing to do is A) get in-person lessons with an experienced tandem, B) read " Driving a Tandem" by Paul Doliveux, and C) talk to Iowa Valley Carriage about getting the Midwest Tandem Driving Clinic Handbook.

There is nothing like riding along cross-country with an experienced whip and her horses to teach you how tandem should be done. I was lucky to get that with my friend Breanna Sheahan and it made things so much easier when I started my first tandem. I think my own boys are finally ready to give it a whirl (after three years of waiting for my baby to grow up and Kody to learn to let me discipline the kid instead of trying to do it himself!) and I'm so excited I can't stand it!

Here's the tandem I put together in Kentucky.

http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc6/10232_1066993933773_1793810340_143473_1007784_n.jpg

Leia


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## brasstackminis (Apr 13, 2012)

This is on the Driving Pairs sight...

http://www.drivingpairs.com/articles/so-you-want-to-drive-a-tand.html

especially funny is the quote. “I always look upon a man who drives a tandem as a fool; He makes two horses do the work of one and most likely breaks his silly neck.”

It always makes me laugh...but I still want to try it eventually. It is harder to drive a tandem than a four in hand!


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## rbrown (Apr 13, 2012)

Thanks for the site brasstackminis- I think I've stumbled upon this before, will have to go back and re-read it.

I need to find someone around here with a tandem! I might have to start searching at shows around here



Thanks for the tips Leia! Cute horses- what were you using for the leader's reins? And what did you use for the wheeler's bridle for the leader reins to go through- tandem rosettes? Roger rings (I think that's what they're called...)? I'm trying to figure out what I really do need to buy before I attempt this, and what I can make/invent on the cheap until I know if this adventure is going to work or not!



hobbyhorse23 said:


> I live near Wanda and have known KC and Willie for years. It was fun watching her try tandem! As far as tandem resources, the best thing to do is A) get in-person lessons with an experienced tandem, B) read " Driving a Tandem" by Paul Doliveux, and C) talk to Iowa Valley Carriage about getting the Midwest Tandem Driving Clinic Handbook.
> 
> There is nothing like riding along cross-country with an experienced whip and her horses to teach you how tandem should be done. I was lucky to get that with my friend Breanna Sheahan and it made things so much easier when I started my first tandem. I think my own boys are finally ready to give it a whirl (after three years of waiting for my baby to grow up and Kody to learn to let me discipline the kid instead of trying to do it himself!) and I'm so excited I can't stand it!
> 
> ...


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## hobbyhorse23 (Apr 16, 2012)

rbrown said:


> Thanks for the tips Leia! Cute horses- what were you using for the leader's reins? And what did you use for the wheeler's bridle for the leader reins to go through- tandem rosettes? Roger rings (I think that's what they're called...)? I'm trying to figure out what I really do need to buy before I attempt this, and what I can make/invent on the cheap until I know if this adventure is going to work or not!


Tandem rosettes are what you call it when the ring is built into the bridle rosettes, also normally called the conchos. "Roger rings" are what you call it when the rings are suspended from a strap, either from the throatlatch or sometimes from the crownpiece or other arrangement. Roger rings are the more recent invention and are nice because they keep the wheeler's head from getting pulled around when a sharp turn is made and allow a straighter line from the leader's mouth to the driver's hands. There's a little more "play" in them. When using tandem rosettes it was traditional that the wheeler should wear a snug sidecheck to keep his head steady as any tossing would yank both the leader's mouth and the driver's hands. A couple of my older historical texts talk about that and how it was a great improvement when Roger rings were invented as it alleviated that concern.

I had a set of round rings suspended from short leather straps that were meant to be neck terrets on another piece of harness, so I simply buckled them through the join of the throatlatch, browband and cheek piece and had instant Roger rings. The leader's lines are a pair of ground-driving lines I had around (made myself, and they're not great material as it turns out) and while the length was good I wouldn't do that again. Thin round cord like that turns out to be very hard to keep a grip on when you're also holding wide flat synthetic reins! I extended the leader traces with baling twine and used my regular kicking strap as a trace carrier on the leader. She's also wearing my set of sliding side reins as when we started out that day she got very excited and hollow and thus was not listening to commands particularly well. The side reins got her working through her back a bit better which brought her into contact, something which is very important in your leader. For connecting the traces to the wheeler's breastcollar I followed Breanna Sheahan's example and used a set of stainless steel load-rated carabiners to connect a set of quick release snap shackles to the Freedom Collar. They go on and off very easily and best of all, if (when) your wheeler gets a leg over a trace you don't have to cut the twine but can simply pull the pin on the shackle, release the twine then put it right back on correctly and continue driving. It works great!

You can pretty much do an entire tandem harness out of baling twine if you want to. A couple of small loops of twine at the crownpiece makes Roger rings, more twine can make a trace carrier and extend your traces, the only thing you really have to buy or make for test driving is a set of leader reins and a suitable whip. I use an old lunge whip I have which is missing the bottom half of the stock! That makes the stock about the same length as my regular driving whip but the lash is long enough to reach my leader and it's surprising light as well as being conveniently black. I've been saving it for years just for this! LOL. I've heard that some people use a set of full-size horse reins for the leader, others use long-lines as I did, some find it better to simply buy leather tandem lines.

I gotta tell you...

TANDEM IS A BLAST!! I finally put mine together this weekend using the same setup as in KY with the exception of having proper leader lines this time and can't wait to share the pictures! Kody and Turbo ROCKED!!!

Leia


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## rbrown (Apr 16, 2012)

hobbyhorse23 said:


> Tandem rosettes are what you call it when the ring is built into the bridle rosettes, also normally called the conchos. "Roger rings" are what you call it when the rings are suspended from a strap, either from the throatlatch or sometimes from the crownpiece or other arrangement. Roger rings are the more recent invention and are nice because they keep the wheeler's head from getting pulled around when a sharp turn is made and allow a straighter line from the leader's mouth to the driver's hands. There's a little more "play" in them. When using tandem rosettes it was traditional that the wheeler should wear a snug sidecheck to keep his head steady as any tossing would yank both the leader's mouth and the driver's hands. A couple of my older historical texts talk about that and how it was a great improvement when Roger rings were invented as it alleviated that concern.
> 
> I had a set of round rings suspended from short leather straps that were meant to be neck terrets on another piece of harness, so I simply buckled them through the join of the throatlatch, browband and cheek piece and had instant Roger rings. The leader's lines are a pair of ground-driving lines I had around (made myself, and they're not great material as it turns out) and while the length was good I wouldn't do that again. Thin round cord like that turns out to be very hard to keep a grip on when you're also holding wide flat synthetic reins! I extended the leader traces with baling twine and used my regular kicking strap as a trace carrier on the leader. She's also wearing my set of sliding side reins as when we started out that day she got very excited and hollow and thus was not listening to commands particularly well. The side reins got her working through her back a bit better which brought her into contact, something which is very important in your leader. For connecting the traces to the wheeler's breastcollar I followed Breanna Sheahan's example and used a set of stainless steel load-rated carabiners to connect a set of quick release snap shackles to the Freedom Collar. They go on and off very easily and best of all, if (when) your wheeler gets a leg over a trace you don't have to cut the twine but can simply pull the pin on the shackle, release the twine then put it right back on correctly and continue driving. It works great!
> 
> ...


Big thanks Leia! I am getting a much better picture now of how I can make this work



Sounds like I really do need actual reins- how long are yours? Do the horse-size driving reins work, or are those too wide? I'm thinking it's probably easy to find a cheap used pair. I'll have to see if I have anything laying around that could work for roger rings... Skip's bridle came with little leather loops right above the conchos, but I think they are too small for reins to slide through easily. There are about 50 different sizes and types of whips at my barn, so I'll have to check those out and see if there's anything suitable I can borrow. Where did you get the carabiners and snap shackles? (I did a quick google search and there's a lot out there to choose from!)

Kandy is leaving today and will be here Thursday, so can't wait to get her driving again so we can start our tandem adventure!!


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## hobbyhorse23 (Apr 18, 2012)

rbrown said:


> Sounds like I really do need actual reins- how long are yours? Do the horse-size driving reins work, or are those too wide?


That's a question I'm still working out. The set that came with my used tandem harness turned out to be WAY too long for how closely I had the guys coupled, but I'm going to increase the space between horses and then see how much needs to come off the reins. I'll let you know if/when I find an ideal length! Other people have told me the horse reins work but I'm already having trouble getting regular mini reins to fit through a mini-sized split terret; not sure how you'd get horse-width reins through there.



rbrown said:


> Where did you get the carabiners and snap shackles? (I did a quick google search and there's a lot out there to choose from!)


Carriage Driving Essentials in CA had both. Celine is the one who suggested the carabiners to me as the most versatile way to use the trace style of snap shackles to do everything and she'll know what you need if you tell her you want the style Breanna Sheahan and Leia Gibson bought for doing tandem.



You can use them on your cart for your traces, on a drag tire or other training application, and then for tandem when you need them so although they're pricey they're worth having around.

Leia


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## Performancemini (Apr 26, 2012)

We had very good luck getting draft and tandem accessories for our minis through "My Draft Horse". We bought betathane reins; they were pretty reasonable and of very good quality, the correct size for minis, very soft and supple. We had already bought some single draft mini accessories through them. Nice patton, etc. And as mentioned; Iowa Valley Carriage carries many things for all sizes.


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## Al B (May 2, 2012)

Have you hadyour session with Andy yet. I am anxious to hear how it went.


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## rbrown (May 2, 2012)

Al B said:


> Have you hadyour session with Andy yet. I am anxious to hear how it went.


Not yet- Kandy is still in quarantine (will be moved to Skip's barn as soon as the BO has time to move her over!), and I still haven't ordered reins... still debating between regular horse reins and buying tandem reins. Plus I need to get Kandy back into driving mode, since she's been mostly sitting for the past 4 years. So.. give me a month or two, and I will hopefully have a good update! I am getting anxious too


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