# Got my catalog now for more questions about mini carts ? Brakes yes or no ? along with a few other q



## Never2Mini (Mar 19, 2013)

Hello, Just me again with tons of questions. Looking into ordering first easy entry cart or spring cart from the Amish. Not sure which cart yet ? My question is should I pay the extra to have drum brakes put on the cart ? I do live where it is hilly. Also does anyone know what Clevis Springs are ? And are they a good opition ? Surfed internet but could not find any info on them. What do you all feel about flat free tires ?




This cart will be for a 31 inch mini mare.


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## Never2Mini (Mar 20, 2013)

Nobody has any tips, pros, or cons on getting drum brakes or not ?


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## shorthorsemom (Mar 20, 2013)

My trainer who is very experienced driver hates brakes on two wheeled carts. She told me they even could be dangerous. I had a meadowbrook I bought that had brakes on it and she hated them. Wanted me to have them taken off. I sold the cart instead and had to chuckle because the new owner of the cart bought my meadowbrook because it had brakes. Funny I thought. I polled the forum before I sold the cart and had many responses pro and con on the brakes from all levels of experience. My trainer told me I should have a steady whoa and to skip the brakes. My horses former owner that had the brakes installed told me of a dog attack on her horse and the resulting runaway of her horse and that she felt safer with the brakes. Brakes can also help hold back a heavy cart on hills. For an easy entry cart two wheeled I would agree with my trainer that you could skip the brakes. Flat free tires are nice. I love my aerocrown. Meadowbrook and that type of wooden carts are very heavy for hills. Hope this helps Ps some easy entry carts can flip in the blink of an eye. Reason I chose my expensive aerocrown was balance and ease of entry and easy exit and easy fornmy guy to pull up hills.


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## Reignmaker Miniatures (Mar 20, 2013)

I've heard both pros and cons on brakes on 2 wheel carts. On the one hand I've heard they can help with down hill as they will help to hold the cart back. On the other I have had some older drivers (experience I'm inclined to trust) that brakes on a 2 wheel cart in the hands of an inexperienced driver can be down right dangerous. Since a 2 wheel cart tends to be light applying brakes will not make it impossible for a horse trying to bolt to move. What it will do I'm told is make it far more likely that the cart will not tolerate any turns, will flip over and create a bigger wreck. There was more to the reasoning but that is all I can actually recall at the moment. I have always felt that the britchen is brakes enough for an EE and if I feel the hill is too steep with my weight in the cart and the cart might push the horse I will find a way to alleviate the weight or the steepness of the hill. Either I get out and walk the horse down the grade (not really considered safe btw) or drive across the hill (again not safe) or find a new route. However horses being driven in CDEs are expected to navigate some pretty good hills and do just fine so don't underestimate your horse, as long as the harness is well fitted and the britchen is in the correct location they can hold you back pretty well. My one smaller mare will almost sit down in the britchen to slow the cart.


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## Never2Mini (Mar 20, 2013)

I was thinking of getting them but not using them other then when going down a hill. I am leaning towards skipping the brakes. They are an extra $145 to ad and it seems most people think they are a bad idea. Most likely I will be driving in my ring and back an forth my long private driveway. Also the local horse show grounds is open in summer months 2 days a week on non show days for anyone to ride. I was hoping to take advantage of it and take my mare and cart. They have several rings and many little roads all over the grounds that would be prefect to drive and all nice an flat. I don't see myself trying up and down the hilly parts anytime to soon.

I hear you shorthorse the areocrown is real nice but way out of my budget.

Reignmaker the mare sitting on her breeching reminds me of a young Appendix QH I had. He would almost sit down when going down hills while I was riding him. Now this was when he was first started and soon stop doing that but the first time he did it I had to change my britches. lol ! I was like what the heck is this colt doing. At first I thought he lost his footing and was going down. Thanks for the heads up that some do that going down the hills while driving.





Does anyone know what a Clevis Spinrg is ? Is is one of the extra options as well. I tried looking it up online but could not find any answers. I might have to call the Amish gentleman and ask but was hoping someone on here might have an idea. Thanks..


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## shorthorsemom (Mar 20, 2013)

Are you sure the clevis is the seat spring and not the style of hook up for the swing tree? Yep the aerocrown broke the bank.

Lol. I may have to sell it as now we are on limited funds financially and it seems like a luxury item now. Girls here can give advice as to bargain easy entry carts that are a good buy and which to avoid. Xt


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## paintponylvr (Mar 20, 2013)

Brakes - For me, there isn't enough room in an EZ entry cart to be able to sit and operate a set of brakes. Even in some of the larger, marathon style carts - it was awkward for me to try to operate them while driving. But understand - I'm a .... rather.... large person and a *mini* sized cart is very small. Yes, they then affect a turn (causes skidding and tire lock - just like a car on ice).

R U talking about Fairview Country Sales? Here is the pic of a cart that they did not build, but I took to them for some "help". They put on the wooden shafts and a single tree, longer bracing from cart to shafts to balance it, heavier axle and the heavy duty wheels w/ no flat/no air tires. I really like it - wish I'd had the springs changed - didn't occur to me... There is definitely not as much give to the cart - the "regular" tires were great shock absorbers. BUT my size, even with X-country tires, slime filled intertubes (YUCK) and special mtn bike tires and tubes - caused lots of flats while trail driving here in the sandhills (w/ lots of pine tree debri) of NC didn't work... The new tires - don't go flat!!!






Brakes on the *hafflinger* sized forecart made by a different company - LOVE THEM!! Don't generally use them on the flat - lock them when load equipment into the trailer/hauler and use them when going down hill - which we have a lot of in some areas where we trail drive... I drive this forecart with 40" mares (pair & 3 abreast) and it is HEAVY. You can sort of see the brake pedal in this pic - the little blip of red directly in front of my right toe -






This pic it is "under" my foot (my foot is resting forward on the lower bar of the "foreward guard/rein rail". It almost looks like my heel is on the brake, but it isn't.






The brakes on our wagon - again - with pairs and use it when hauling the wagon, when mounting or dismounting the wagon and when the girls are <supposed to be> standing still (especially on a hill). It locks for braking. Will apply them when I'm going downhill as well. Accidently locked them last weekend while applying them going downhill and the mares were still able to pull it - just drug it w/ the wheels locked. I was mad at myself and totally apologetic to them!!






a different view of the wagon. The brake is similar to the one on the forecart (equipment made by the same company - Pioneer Manufacturing out of Dalton, OH) and is on the right side of the vehicle somewhere by my foot. Because I get "cramped" in this smaller wagon (really glad I had those eliptical springs put on the front seat!!), I often move my right foot around - forward, under the open seat or sticking out the right side.






All of my work harness is made by Fairview Country sales. The breast collar and lines in the top, single pony pic is also made by them. The rest of the mini size harness didn't fit this filly, so I used a surcingle and braided haysting harness that I made for her first few htches. Waiting for new harness that will fit her now...

On the Clevis - the only thing I found on those - is from Pioneer and it's a type of hitch "pin" used for attaching the tree (s) to a farm implement... Have no idea what a Clevis spring is.


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## Never2Mini (Mar 21, 2013)

I think you Gals are right and the Clevis is something to do with the singletree area. I also found some info online and it was about the singletree not the seat.

Sorry you might have to sale your Aerocrown shortyhorse. I did have another thread asking about which EE cart. Got some good advice and info.



I am looking at gettting one from Fairview County Sales. Its a Amish shop and close enough to me I can go pick it up and make a fun weekend trip out of it. I am excited to go !



They have all kinds of opitions and I am trying to figure out what ones to get. Their basic EE carts start at 375 then you can ad all the opitions you want to pay for. Paintponylvr put me in touch with them.





Thanks Paintponylvr for all the pictures of driving and your gear. You are giving me driving fever !!! lol ! I am planing on getting all the springs for a comfy ride that they can put on my cart. lol ! I I like the dash and cage they offer for the EE carts to but might have to order some of the extras like them at a later date. I think I will pass on the brakes. It was hubby that was thinking I should get them till I explain them better to him. I wish Fairview made leather harness. I think I want leather although I have halter/bridle combos made from Beta for my riding horses and love them. I am going to try to get incontact with Bowman. Do you know if they have a catalog ? I can't wait to make my 2 day trip to Homles County but it won't be till mid April that I can go. I hope my one Mini Mare Dolly pops out her foal by then. I don't want to leave her in care of my 17 yr old if she hasn't had it.


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## paintponylvr (Mar 21, 2013)

Check this out...

http://www.amishshoponline.com/store-listing/amish-shop-listings/harness-shops/

and yes, Bowman has a catalog... mine is 3 or 4 years old now...


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## paintponylvr (Mar 21, 2013)

Go check out the Bryants' website or the folks in Canada (she's on this forum, can't remember the name...) and a few others...

THEY have DROOLWORTHY vehicles and driving horses!!!!


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## Becky Horat (Mar 22, 2013)

I had also asked this question about brakes on a 2 wheel cart when we were cart shopping. I can see why brakes are certainly not safe in the situation of a run a way. I do regret not getting brakes for one type of driving with our Minis. Steep hills. We have some trails and there are a few hills that the little ones have troubles holding the cart back. These guys are just under 34". They will sit into the breeching and the cart will still push them down the hill. This would be the only time I would like to help them out a little. We had brakes on another cart and removed them as they were banging and clanking around. This was for a pony and not needed. Not sure if they're all made like that...but that's not good either. If no steep hills, I wouldn't think of brakes at all.


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## Never2Mini (Mar 22, 2013)

PaintPonyLvr I called Bowmen got an answering machine left my info for a catalog.



Thanks for their number. I will check out the website you posted.. I like looking at drool worthy equines anytime.





Hmm Becky you got me thinking about brakes again.



I was thinking if I get them I could use them for down hill times only. We do have some nice hills around here I am not fortune to live in the flat parts of Ohio. Now will I be trying the hills anytime soon no but I am sure once I am comfortable with my driving I might. My driving mare is only 31 1/2 inches tall. If I can do some hills that opens up more places I could drive. Decisions Decisions !


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## Carriage (Mar 22, 2013)

I think that Reinmaker did a great job of putting things in perspective about brakes.

They are a tool that requires knowledge to use properly. Our TrailBoss has always used mechanical brakes. Vehicle and driver weight combined with terrain givens and size and heart of animal are all among things to be considered. Also brakes are not an all or nothing proposition. Our instructed use of them are as an inertia mediating tool. Their use is as a "feathering" affair rather than on or off. Most often, slight application is all that is needed to assist that horse going downhill. Knowledgeable and carefully applied application, does not lead to wrecks or lead to significant increase in saddle weight. It is also important to remember the structure of the animal we are using.

I woul;d recomend that if brakes are selected , then a movable seat becomes a requirement as well. The use of brakes changes the balance point. On a long down hill grade where feathering is advised and prudent, the ability to move the seat back to the new and temporary balance point, will greatly assist the horse as well and insure that excessive saddle weight is also mediated.

On another cart we build, we do not use brakes and have no need for them as that cart changes everything including the previously mentioned givens.

The same is true of Pneumatic wheels. Many will emphatically tell you "Don't use them. They blow up!" After 24 years of sending hundreds down the road, I'm here to tell you that , no they do not. If all of the components of the pneumatic wheel are carefully selected and matched, they do not just blow up.

I am wondering if your cart builder has access to a lower weigh brake option as drums are heavy and generally more expensive.Or perhaps he is using a type that I don't know about (entirely possible) and they are not heavy. I guess I would rather have them and not need them than not have them. But then too, me and Murphy have been doing battle for many years now.

thanks for your time,

Bb


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## Reignmaker Miniatures (Mar 22, 2013)

Very clear reasoning Bb, thanks for your input on a subject that seems to keep coming up.

I guess I would rather have them and not need them than not have them. _Good point_ But then too, me and Murphy have been doing battle for many years now. _Too funny, in my case I believe Murhpy is winning_


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## Carriage (Mar 23, 2013)

Reignmaker Miniatures said:


> Very clear reasoning Bb, thanks for your input on a subject that seems to keep coming up.
> 
> I guess I would rather have them and not need them than not have them. _Good point_ But then too, me and Murphy have been doing battle for many years now. _Too funny, in my case I believe Murhpy is winning_
> 
> ...


If the horse comes first every time, we are better able to see, and then, see best how to go.

Best to you and yours,

Bb


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