# Since there are no stupid questions.......



## Emily's mom (Mar 9, 2008)

Emily was acting strange today!

She is 17 months old.

Max always rides around on her back, or walks around hanging on to her neck.

Well today when he was hanging on to her neck, she chomped her jaws with her teeth showing, almost like chewing gum or something like that....

She'd squat and pee several times without any sign of pee...

I was wondering if any of this sounds like she is in heat...

I locked her in her stall, she pooped normal no pee, but the others were so upset that she was inside that I let her out.(yes Max actually brayed



)

She did squat over where the horse peed and there was a small stream...

she seems normal otherwise....no fever.

The only animal I've had that went in heat was cats, and a siamese was not pleasant!!

I welcome any comments, thanks!

Oh, by the way Max is gelded!!


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## minimule (Mar 9, 2008)

From what I've been told (and seen 2x) that is how jennys act in heat. The chewing air is the big sign. Some of the folks around here say that a jenny has a shorter "standing" heat than a horse does. Meaning they won't allow the jack to cover them as long as a mare will accept a stallion.


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## Shari (Mar 10, 2008)

Yes, she is in heat. Ella started at about 15 months old and she was a hussy the first year...but thank goodness she has calmed down about it.

Am pretty sure within a year your jenyy's outword signs of her being in heat, will quiet down.


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## Emily's mom (Mar 10, 2008)

Thank you I feel much better, now they told me Max was gelded, is there any way to tell, he is really "putting the boots " to her...would he have "familly jewels "hanging down OH!

Will he actually mate with her, if he has been gelded? And could it harm her?

When I catch them I remind him that he is her "brother"...

Thanks for the help


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## Shari (Mar 10, 2008)

Yes, many geldings can and will do everything a Jack would...except getting her in foal. I have found over the years that mixing geldings and mares/jenny's never works out well. Some people do not mind but I found that the geldings be it donkey or horse, breeding the jennys or mares...some times the females can get hurt by the males over exuberant .....well you know.

I have ended up with some pretty big Vet bills when a friend put my mares in with the geldings she had.

Just depends on what you will tolerate.

But yes..the female can get hurt and is one reason I do not have geldings on my place.


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## Emily's mom (Mar 11, 2008)

Thanks Shari,

I hate the thoughts of having to separate them...I guess I'll just wait and see if things get out of hand.

Thanks for all the help!


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## Shari (Mar 11, 2008)

You are welcome.


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## MeadowRidge Farm (Mar 11, 2008)

We have our arabian geldings and mares together ..never a problem. Alot depends upon the age he was gelded at. We gelded Snickers (our jack hinny) at almost 3 yrs of age. He was a pistol and a half with the mares and jennys, now that he is gelded he is in with all the mares and jennys 24/7 and is VERY good. At the most..when a mare or jenny comes into heat he will follow them all around.

Do you know how old Max was when he was gelded? (or how old is he now) If he is young, and acting this way..I would have my suspicions about him being gelded. Have you tried to see if you can feel anything "down there" alot of times when they are young they can pull those jewels way up and you really do need to feel.



I would try to find out who gelded him and talk to the vet that did it. To make darn sure he was gelded. As far as the jennys go..yes, she is in heat, as long as your jenny goes into heat (agewise) she will exibit those signs.

We bought a quarter horse gelding a few years back, we bought him only to get him out of the heck hole he was living in..had him by himself for about 6 weeks he was a big old gentle giant, he was 8 yrs old..we turned him out with the other geldings..turned out he was a crypto, neither had ever descended and he almost killed my sons arabian gelding. From looking at him and from what we were told he was a gelding...a drugged gelding when we bought him. That was the one and only "fight" we ever had and I would never want to go thru that again! That is why I am saying to make sure he was gelded..a intact male donkey can be very aggressive and dangerous. If its possible have your vet check also, or you might want to look and see if you can see a scar from where he was cut.


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## Emily's mom (Mar 11, 2008)

That is my fear, exactly where do I look for a scar?

And where do I feel and what would it feel like. We do not have a vet that would come, we live an hour too far OH! away.....He is a pussy cat really never agressive or anything, he just stands there and lets me paw all over him...

I'm going out to grope my little man!!!

He'll be 3 in June


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## Emily's mom (Mar 11, 2008)

I just came in from giving Max a little going over....I can't see a scar, or feel anything from his tail to the opening of his sheath.....



would they be grape size or bigger


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## MeadowRidge Farm (Mar 11, 2008)

Cheryl, the incision is made right thru the scrotum, alot of times it is very hard to see the scar..but if you look close enough OH! you should be able to see something. Also if you are feeling for them..its better to do it when he is relaxed and warm, and if he is a cuddlebug try to do it when he is laying down..if he lets you. OH! How long have you had him? Anyway to find out how old he was when he was cut? He probably is cut, but maybe he wasnt cut till later..jacks usually dont start to drop till 12 to 18 months old, you cant see them, but you can feel them. If you cut a jack later its like being counter-productive, and all that really does is give them more of the bony head and platter jaw like a mature jack would have, and of course...the wonderful testorterone behavior. Gelding them dont always take away the hormonal behavior but there body is no longer being dictated



by testorterone. Corinne


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## Emily's mom (Mar 11, 2008)

Thanks for the info..

we got Max in May, and his old owner had him for a year, and said he was gelded, didn't think it mattered to ask more questions about when ...so he was about 1 year when they got him, I'll have to search for their telephone number and find out so I have piece of mind. He is only 3 now. How long will Emily's heat cycle last, it has been since Saturday, and will it happen again in a month or when?


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## PaintedPromiseRanch (Mar 11, 2008)

Cheryl sorry i have not been on in a few days to see your questions... you will be thrilled i am sure to know that even jennets will mount each other when they are in heat! the gal i got my donkeys from said the mounting and the chewing were the signs to her that they were ready for the jack... and i have seen even my pregnant jennets mounting the ones in heat!

i don't know about them dropping as late as Corinne said (12-18 months), as ours have generally been sooner than that. in fact Moses had visible and "feel-able" nuggets in his sac at less than 3 months! his actually are grape-size about now but at 3 your boy's should be at least golf-ball sized if not bigger. my smallest jack has a good handful if you take the whole sac...

now i am talking bigger animals here but as an example, i had my yearling horse colt gelded and what the vet took out was about the size of golf balls. the next year we had a 3-year-old standard BLM donkey gelded and what the vet took out was the size of tennis balls - EACH! i have not been in the position to have a mini horse gelded, but the mini donkey we had gelded, what the vet took out was about the size of my big horse colt...

and i know geldings can mount but we have only had one do it in all my years of horses, and he was most likely cryptorchid (undescended testicle that was not removed) - not confirmed as i had already sold him when i learned about cryptorchic horses, but i swear in reading the textbook that i was going to turn the page and see his picture, the behavior was EXACTLY what the book described...


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## MeadowRidge Farm (Mar 11, 2008)

Just so everyone knows...



all jacks are born with there family jewels dropped, but they do pull them back up. I have had them drop alot sooner then 12 to 18 months too, but that is considered the avg. I did have one not drop till 2 1/2 yrs old, we thought for sure he was going to only have one..but we could always feel the other, WAYYYYYYYYY up there....and then one day it finally came thru the ring, and it was down. My jennets also mount one another when in heat. OH! and the chewing..OHHH YEAH....



definitely want to be bred.


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## Emily's mom (Mar 11, 2008)

Thank you for the help...

I can not feel anything on or around Max's private area, we have been calling around and when Max came to his last owner he had stitches, so that is a good sign, tomorrow at an earlier time we are calling the breeder who had his vet do the deed, maybe they documented something...

I so very much appreciate all the help, thanks!


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## MeadowRidge Farm (Mar 12, 2008)

I am so glad to hear you found out he had stitches.



Great sign, he is gelded.


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## FlatCreekFarm (Mar 12, 2008)

This has been a very educational post! Cheryl, I hope things are less "exciting" at your place soon



My girls may be going through the same thing in 6 months or so. Doesn't seem possible - time flies



So I will know what to watch for when the time comes. At least we don't have any equine boys around us - but they do have each other to pick on


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## pepperhill (Mar 25, 2008)

For what it is worth, we have two jennies, a gelding and a jack that all hang out together all the time. They get along great. The gelding and the jack don't fight at all. The gelding never tries anything with the girls. The only time they are apart is during the foaling season so I don't have to worry about the babies getting stepped on. Maybe I'm just lucky, but they all just love each other.

I, too, would wonder about your gelding. If he was gelded at an older age, after those hormones were already starting to show up, he may always try to breed the females. If he was gelded young, before the hormones started, he shouldn't really have any idea what is going on. One last possibility, perhaps he retained a testicle, and isn't a true gelding? Just some thoughts.


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## Emily's mom (Mar 26, 2008)

Emily seems to be over her first heat!!

Now I wait to see what happens next time....

We did contact the original owner who had him as a baby and gelded him, the vet was the same vet that gelds all of his donkeys. So I guess he would know how to check for the correct number of testicles...am I right....don't know much about testicles OH! or this sort of thing.


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