# Advise please on older broodmare



## Taz (Mar 23, 2020)

Hi,
I just adopted a 21 yr old mare from a local rescue, don't even have her yet. Could some of you wonderful experienced people help me with a couple things? I don't know definitely that she's in foal but it's being assumed since she's been running with the same stallion and had many foals for a number of years. I'll be trying to get a yes or no answer after she moves in.

Do older mares have any more problems foaling? Anything I should watch for? 

Is she OK for full shots or should I stay with just rabies and tetanus until after foaling?

I read that they shouldn't be wormed in the last month. I don't think that's where she would be from looking at her but it's unknown so I want to be careful. She was wormed 6 weeks ago but had no care at all for a number of years before that.

Thanks so much for the help


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## Marsha Cassada (Mar 24, 2020)

I would wait on the vaccinations. see how far along she is first. if she has foaled without complications her age probably will not be an issue, but any foaling could go wrong. i got a 21 year old mare several years ago and she was one of the nicest horses i have ever owned. she took to driving like she had done it her whole life.


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## Ryan Johnson (Mar 24, 2020)

Hi Taz, there are always risks associated with birth and pregnancy in any mare. Id tend to be more worried with maiden mares but considering there is no history with previous pregnancies for this rescue mare, Id still tred with caution.

When you get her can you post a couple of pics ? 

I cant answer the vaccination questions as I dont Vacc for rabies here.

Cheers Ryan


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## Maryann at MiniV (Mar 25, 2020)

First, Kuddos for rescuing! 21 years isn't too old for foaling out if she's done it before. I'm like Ryan. I worry more about maiden mares. I also don't vaccinate for rabies. If she's not in her last trimester, giving her a regular 5-way (which includes tetanus), shouldn't be a problem. We don't do pneumabort shots anymore either because we had too many abort within a day or two of receiving it.


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## Taz (Mar 26, 2020)

Ok, I picked them, yes them I have "dad" too, up yesterday. That was the first time I've met them. Looking at her I thought fat old broodmare belly not in foal. After I got her home the rescue told me it was believed she was in foal for an April foal. They thought she caught on her foal heat, last years foal was born on mother's day, but you have to also know they were out together 24/7 on a property without anyone living there and no one watching them so ????? She caught on her foal heat the year before going on foaling dates. Still not thinking preagnant with the way she looks. Later in the afternoon she spent about 15 min rubbing her bum hard on the fence, walking away flipping her head and swishing her tail before relaxing and going back to eating. Hmm. This morning she was eating then started swishing her tail and went and rolled, flipped over 6 times, stood up blew out and went back to eating. Hmm. She has 0 udder. So for now I'm trying to get a stall up for her and watching and checking her over every day. 

In case anyone is wondering, dad is being gelded on Tues, they are best friends and then they can stay together.

The first two pictures are Tilly ( AF Tranquila) the third is Spirit (Strongs Chiantis Spirit) They are both pure falabella.



Her belly does look bigger from behind when you see her in person but not huge.


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## Marsha Cassada (Mar 26, 2020)

I got a mare from a sale last year. Past unknown. She was very round and we suspected she was in foal. Had ultrasound done and she was not. Just plump. Since you know for sure yours was with a stallion, I think you're smart to stay alert. They are handsome and appear to have nice manners!


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## Taz (Mar 26, 2020)

They are both super sweet and have lovely manners. You can tell they were treated well and cared for before the past 5 years. They are both fat and he has foundered and his feet are terrible but that can all be fixed.


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## Ryan Johnson (Mar 26, 2020)

They are both lovely 

Until she has dropped some of her winter coat , I would be treating her as if she is pregnant. 

Taz, if I can ever pass on advice to you for dealing with founder and Laminitis , All I can say is be the "Grass Police" Once a horse has foundered , they will always be prone to it. I have one that wears a grazing muzzle and one that is not allowed on grass at all. Im not sure whats available to you where you are, but if you are planning grazing time, I would strongly recommend something like "Founderguard" . If I can hlp with any otehr info on it, send me a PM happy to help.


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## Taz (Mar 27, 2020)

Thanks Ryan, you're wonderful. I'll take you up on that when I get a chance to breath again in a bit 

I'm going to go with she's in foal for April/May until I know otherwise. It's the safest thing and I might have felt something in there this morning. Could just be wishful thinking, it would be so much fun to have a baby...


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## Ryan Johnson (Mar 29, 2020)

You're welcome Taz


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## Taz (Apr 3, 2020)

Well, Tilly might be thinking about starting a milk bar. Nothing to see but but her teats were thicker for a few days and this morning a little bigger and softer. Her belly looks rounder too. Nothing to show in a picture but crossing my fingers. 

Her last two foals were born May 12, 2019 and June 21, 2018 so if she caught the same time and follows the same pattern it could be soon....or not at all and it's my imagination. Haha, time will tell.

I had to order a new camera which isn't here yet so I hope she's read the book and I have a few more weeks


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## Maryann at MiniV (Apr 3, 2020)

When she's eating grain, have your hands up along her side(s) to feel for movement. If she's as far along as you suspect, you definitely should feel something.


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## Taz (Apr 4, 2020)

*I've decided that yes, she's in foal. I have felt something a couple of times but very soft, I'd really like a big kick...
Her udder is definitely doing something, again just a small change but there every morning now.
Her belly has gotten wider up higher not just where it's hanging down.

I have finally tracked down an owner from when she was younger, she can hopefully tell me if she has a pattern to watch for. Breeding date is a guess by someone I don't trust to know it but I won't disregard it so I'm officially watching and stressing 
*


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## Maryann at MiniV (Apr 4, 2020)

If there's not a major kick and her udder isn't full yet, you have time... Once things are full and you get liquid, you can both examine the stickiness and even TEST with a milk test kit.


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## Taz (Apr 4, 2020)

Her udder isn't even close to full but she had a hard kick in the paddock today. She was lying down sleeping, startled awake and turned around and smacked her belly with her nose. Poor girl, I'm pretty sure she still has a while to go.


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## Ryan Johnson (Apr 6, 2020)

Keep us posted on her progress


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## Taz (Apr 7, 2020)

Tilly's moving along slowly. She had hard edema in front of her udder when I got her, it softened two days ago and is moving back tonight. Teats still a little bigger each day, not going down at night. Her tail swishes most of the day with the odd rush to rub her bum on something or roll. 

I heard back from a previous owner. Her routine is to have an udder for about two weeks then her back end turns to jello for two days then she foals fast and easy without any help. Hoping she follows that again this time.

The camera has been shipped and is supposed to be here tomorrow, with luck I ordered the right one and it'll be up and running for tomorrow night so I can spy on her. 

I'm slowly losing my mind worrying about everything that can go wrong, I don't know how some of you do this every year.


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## Ryan Johnson (Apr 7, 2020)

Sounds like she is progressing wonderfully. Info from a previous owner is great


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## Taz (Apr 9, 2020)

Have any of you ever seen a horse do this? I've used mirroring with horses that are having problems to help them connect and relax but never seen a horse do anything like this before. Tilly was standing and fussing yesterday, must have been more upset than she looked. Spirit came over and stood exactly beside her but about 10 feet away. He imitated her tail swishing, head shaking and shifting weight side to side then he would yawn(a sign of relaxing) every time she stood still. It went on for about 1/2 hour then she blew, shook and went off to eat. He stayed next to her for a while more then wandered off to do his thing when she stayed settled. What an amazing little guy! I've been told he throws his temperament to his foals, here's hoping.

Tilly started to relax her back end last night but no more changes to her udder yet. The camera came but I had to order the right connectors for my cables, I didn't know there were different ones now, sigh. Shipping today so fingers crossed here tomorrow.

Some of the horses here have a bit of a snotty nose, normal spring time bug. Should I worry about Tilly and the foal at all if she gets it?


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## Maryann at MiniV (Apr 9, 2020)

Horses are fascinating... What does the snot look like? If it's thick yellow stuff? I would pull your mare away. If it's just clear, I wouldn't worry yet...just keep an eye on it. 

Once your camera is up and running, here is a hint to pass on......A very successful, long time breeder told me this: While on Foal Watch at night, Drink a full glass of water before going to bed. In 2 hours you will wake up needing to go to the bathroom and can check the monitor. Drink another glass....This will make sure you wake up regularly during the night......She was RIGHT!


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## Taz (Apr 9, 2020)

Hahaha!! What a great idea, I'll do it 

It's white snot but not lots of it. It's just her and Spirit in the paddock with no one across the fence and their stall doesn't have contact with the others either. I'll watch and try not to add it to my list of things to worry about.


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## Taz (Apr 20, 2020)

I need to whine!!
The cold weather came back over a week ago and Tilly took back most everything and has been on hold there with the exception of one day when she was kind enough for have the most udder yet. I know this can happen but really?

She hasn't been showing ANY signs that the foal is bothering her any more. I was getting pretty nervous something had happened to it and talked her into standing while I 'moved' her belly around a couple of days ago. Pushed it right....nothing. Pushed it left...nothing. Got desperate and put my arms all the way around and lifted up a couple of times, got two wonderful little taps on my hand, made my week . 

The camera is up and running in my bedroom all night. Between it shining on my bed, the stress of missing something and the glasses of water I'm up checking on her about every 1/2 hour. I know she doesn't look ready yet but really don't trust that and would never forgive myself if I wasn't there and there was a problem I could fix. 

Someone please tell me this can't go on for much longer....even if you have to lie through you're teeth. PLEASE. LOL.


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## Ryan Johnson (Apr 20, 2020)

As she gets closer and closer, there is less room for the foal to move, in turn, making it uncomfortable for the mare. When mares are rolling they will roll the foal into an uncomfortable position also. 

How is she looking from behind ? is the foal still riding wide ?


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## Taz (Apr 20, 2020)

Yes the foals still sitting sideways, although yesterday morning she was really wide. It does look to me like her belly is lower but no v just rounded but could be farther forward(?). Minimal softening around her tail and no elongating. Pretty cranky though....poor girl.
She did have a bit more udder tonight though so I'm hopeful she might start doing something again, fingers crossed!


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## Ryan Johnson (Apr 20, 2020)

You will notice when she has dropped for sure. With her udder, its going to go up and down constantly . When you notice it is staying full for the entire day (whilst shes up and moving around) you know you are getting close.


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## Holly Chisholm (Apr 27, 2020)

Anything happen yet?


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## Taz (Apr 27, 2020)

Nothing much going on. Her udder didn't go down yesterday after being out and it has a bit more fill this morning. Taking her own sweet time......
Last time I had an alarm on the mares halter and was able to sleep most of the night. The trees around my house have grown too much so I don't have internet anymore for that. Not sleeping much, come on Tilly, baby soon please!


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## Ryan Johnson (Apr 28, 2020)

Its the finishing touches shes putting on, these usually take the most time , especially when their owners are just about falling asleep, waiting waiting waiting 

Wishing you the safest foaling , sounds like it wont be long now


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## Taz (Apr 28, 2020)

After watching her swishing her tail like mad, kicking and biting at her belly, she lay down and went to sleep. Had a peaceful night sleeping and eating, I'm jealous, lol. I did give her a pep talk this morning and a bribe of maternity feed once she's nursing might have been mentioned. Something tells me it could still be a couple of weeks.....


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## Taz (Apr 30, 2020)

My pep talk didn't work. We had a spring storm start yesterday and it's still going strong. Tilly took almost everything back again yesterday and still nothing today. The foals sitting low but I think she's holding off till the nice weather gets here. Sigh.


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## Taz (Apr 30, 2020)

I have a question just to make sure I have it right.
If she needs help I only pull with the contactions or just hold to keep the foal from going back.
If it's a red bag I pull no matter what, gotta be fast.
If it's a breech do I pull with the contractions or just get the foal out as fast as possible since the oxygen supply will be cut of before the head is out?
Banamine if needed after passing the placenta. Do you give a full dose or a small dose?

Thanks


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## Maryann at MiniV (Apr 30, 2020)

We always pull WITH the contractions. 
Red Bag: The minute the red bag shows itself , cut it open and put with the contractions as hard as possible.
Breech: Do the same...
Banamine: Yes if needed. We tend to do a half dose, depending on how much pain she is showing. 

The reason for timing WITH the contractions is so not to tear her either inside or her vulva. 
The only time we have just straight out PULLED is when it was a matter of life or death for our MARE.


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## Taz (Apr 30, 2020)

Wonderful! Thank you!!


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## Holly Chisholm (May 2, 2020)

Any change? Are you using a milk tester?


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## Taz (May 2, 2020)

Good morning Holly, I hope you had a good night.
Tilly is playing with me. She had jello butt and some udder back last night when she came in. Swished and kicked for the first half of the night before settling down. This morning the jello butt is gone and she only has a bit of udder left. I'll just keep watching and waiting......
I'm not using test strips, it's almost impossible right now to get anything delivered in less than 3-4 weeks and I can't get them anywhere near me, besides that she doesn't have enough to test yet. My other little one didn't have much udder either, it took her 3 hours to get her milk in after foaling. I don't think there's anything here to cause that but.....


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## Holly Chisholm (May 2, 2020)

Taz said:


> Good morning Holly, I hope you had a good night.
> Tilly is playing with me. She had jello butt and some udder back last night when she came in. Swished and kicked for the first half of the night before settling down. This morning the jello butt is gone and she only has a bit of udder left. I'll just keep watching and waiting......
> I'm not using test strips, it's almost impossible right now to get anything delivered in less than 3-4 weeks and I can't get them anywhere near me, besides that she doesn't have enough to test yet. My other little one didn't have much udder either, it took her 3 hours to get her milk in after foaling. I don't think there's anything here to cause that but.....



Oh my goodness! Sally acted like that the other night, then . . . nothing. She tested at 6.4 around noon, has jello butt, bags seem full and hard, but all she's doing is standing around, then takes a bite of food. I even think she's a little wider again now. I'm a nervous wreck from reading about all the problems that seem to happen quite a bit with minis. Would you like me to send you a couple Maybe Baby strips? PM me your address if you would like me to mail you some. Here's a few pictures from today. I wouldn't this slab sided.


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## Holly Chisholm (May 2, 2020)

Or for crying in the soup, it didn't even look like that second picture had loaded. Sorry. Again.


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## Taz (May 2, 2020)

Holly Chisholm said:


> Or for crying in the soup, it didn't even look like that second picture had loaded. Sorry. Again.


Haha, don't worry that's how it normally works for me.
Sounds like you're getting closer, yay Sally!! From everything I've read I wouldn't worry about her being wider, it's just the baby moving around, she'll get her in position when it's time. My other little one looked wide when she was in stage 1 labor.
Tilly came in tonight with absolutely no udder or jello butt. I have no idea what she's doing but she didn't stop swishing her tail all day. If something 'different' can happen it will happen here. If I hadn't felt some kicks and seen her belly dance a jig a couple of times I'd say she isn't in foal and get a good night sleep but she is and if I don't watch that's when she'll need help. Yes, it's terrifying knowing what can go wrong, hang in there you're going to do great if she needs you


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## Taz (May 6, 2020)

So Tilly has been working on her udder for almost 5 weeks now, It fills some, stays without changing for a couple days or gets a bit bigger every day then will disappear for a day or three then starts again. Same with her getting soft around her tail. She flashed me when she was rolling right after she went out yesterday and the inside of her vulva was very red, checked this morning...not. I keep thinking one day soon everything will make really fast progress, after all the book says 4-6 weeks for udder development LOL!!!! She has a low hanging pear shaped belly that's giving her lots of grief.





Has anyone noticed if a really active belly turns into a really active foal? I'm hoping not with the way this little one is now, I saw her whole belly jump up a couple of inches the other day. She just gets a long suffering look on her face and bangs it with her nose.


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## Holly Chisholm (May 6, 2020)

Oh, poor Tilly! Very red vulva is a great sign! What a cutie! Do you a have a colored photo you could post? We have the opposite problem in that I even hope we have a live foal. I felt a soft kick months ago and nothing since. Hubby says he sees the baby moving around. Praying . . .


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## Taz (May 6, 2020)

Oh Holly, I hope everything's alright. Have you tried moving her belly around a bit and seeing if you can feel a kick after that? It can be hard, you have to have your hands in the right place. My other little one had a very quiet foal(until he was born), I never saw any movement or signs from her that he was bothering her, only felt the odd kick even though I checked a couple times every day for months.

These pictures are from a few weeks ago, I have a horrible time getting her to pose in person for belly pictures so that's why I used the camera last night. With the two Tilly's on the right, Spirit(dad) on the left.



And yes, the belly is much bigger now, haha.


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## Ryan Johnson (May 6, 2020)

Looking at the pic on Cam, she is still really wide. Just wondering if she ate a watermelon lol as she looks HUGE 

All the signs and symptoms you are looking at with her udder, vulva etc, they are going to change constantly. Some days you will think "Yes " its tonight , tomorrow when you wake things will be back to normal. There are not many mares that play by the "book" , they'd much rather keep the owners guessing


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## Taz (May 6, 2020)

LOL, yes, she kind of looks like a beach ball on legs, at least her belly is big and not going away like everything else .
Pregnant mares are not for the faint of heart.....I don't see a lot of sleep in my future.


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## Ryan Johnson (May 6, 2020)

Yes , at this stage of pregnancy , is usually when most owners start adding toothpicks to the foaling kit ( to keep your eyes open )


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## Holly Chisholm (May 7, 2020)

They are adorable!!!!! Thank you for posting pictures!


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## Holly Chisholm (May 8, 2020)

How was your night? Did you get the ph strips yet?


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## Holly Chisholm (May 11, 2020)

Taz, what's new????


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## Taz (May 11, 2020)

Absolutely nothing new here, she's still coming and going. I think she's waiting for nice weather, since it snowed this morning it could be a while......


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## Holly Chisholm (May 14, 2020)

Any changes? Did you get the test strips?


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## Taz (May 14, 2020)

Hi Holly. I got a little excited this morning, she had more udder, it was gone again tonight. I'm looking at it as a positive that she had more than before though. Every day is another day closer, or at least that's what I'm telling myself. I'm still watching closely in case she doesn't give me much or any warning. She started developing an udder 6 week ago now so something has to happen sooner than later I hope. I had a boarder come out yesterday who hasn't seen her in a week who said she's bigger and much lower .

The test strips aren't here yet, maybe she's waiting for them

How are Sally and Sterling(did you decide to call him that?) doing? Have you gotten some rest and recovered?


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## Holly Chisholm (May 15, 2020)

Wow, maybe because the strips had to cross the border?  It sounds like Tilly is getting ready. I almost gave up on Sally thinking perhaps she had a false pregnancy, so I didn't sleep completely dressed the night The Little Prince Sterling came into the world. Hence I missed the birth, but Rob was there. Since the first contraction, that baby was on the ground in less than five minutes! Hopefully Tilly will give you an equally unremarkable delivery. (Rob did break the white sack, and it was strong!)

Yes, we both had mare-watch-lag for a few days, but all is back to normal now!

Dang, I wish those strips would get there. They seem very accurate.

Blessings,
Holly


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## Taz (May 15, 2020)

I think with everyone ordering online there's a backlog slowing the strips down, I'm confident they'll get here in time.

I'm trying not to get excited but Tilly had more udder this morning again even though it went away during the day yesterday, maybe she's starting to get serious. No milk yet. I'm sleeping in sweats so I can go if needed, not that I wouldn't in pj"s but sweats are nicer. I hear you about almost giving up, I was starting to turn my alarm off by 3:30(I'm up by 6) not believing anything was ever going to happen, had a talk with myself and that's not happening now, lol.

I'm really hoping to have something to update with soon


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## Holly Chisholm (May 16, 2020)

Do you have someone there who can help you watch her in shifts? I believe The Little Prince Sterling wouldn't have made it if Hubby hadn't gotten him out of the sack.


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## Taz (May 16, 2020)

Unfortunately I'm it for keeping watch at night. I'm thinking about biting the bullet and getting data for an extra phone so I can put an alarm on her at night IF there is enough coverage in her stall for it to work. Alarms aren't perfect but I wouldn't worry as much about not being there for a problem, even with waking up every hour I keep thinking she could give me no warning and I'll sleep right through it. 

I love that you call him The Little Prince Sterling


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## Holly Chisholm (May 17, 2020)

Good idea!


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## Taz (May 18, 2020)

Foal alarm on her halter last night. The data isn't very good out there but I had a couple false alarms early this morning so I think it's working well enough. I'm still waking up to check her but I'm more relaxed about not missing something.


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## Holly Chisholm (May 18, 2020)

Nice!!!!! How is the milk bar?


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## Taz (May 18, 2020)

Hahaha!! I almost said what milk bar but that's not quite accurate. She got that going again Fri and has been up and down, fuller this morning again. I think she's trying to make me completely batty, definitely not playing fair. I have no idea how long she's going to drag this out for, we're now starting week 7. Her belly is low and she doesn't look quite as wide, I think junior has the right idea at least.


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## Holly Chisholm (May 18, 2020)

It is all going to be worth it! A little mini from the rescue where I got Sally went to Texas. This morning, there was a beautiful little paint foal out with her in a storm! I can't wait to see what Tilly gives you!


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## Taz (May 18, 2020)

It will all be so worth it when the little bundle is on the ground safely.
This is Tilly's 5th foal with Spirit that I know of. The other 4 were 3 fillies and 1 colt. 2 black/white pinto, 2 chestnut/white pinto. Spirit is pintaloosa so there is a chance if appy. As far as I know he's known for throwing colour but I have seen one of Tilly's that was all black and her second(I think) foal was a black leopard appy. I've only been able to track down 6 of her babies and 4 of his. I have a feeling chestnut/white filly but ??????
I'll be happy with healthy mare and baby.


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## Taz (May 19, 2020)

Holly, the strips got here today, yay!!!! Now I just need little miss to have some milk to test. She was doing well for a few days, gone again tonight. Hahahahahahahah!!!! She's having fun with me


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## Holly Chisholm (May 20, 2020)

Please let us know when you get something out of her! Fun!!!


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## MerMaeve (May 20, 2020)

No foal yet?


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## Taz (May 20, 2020)

Hahaha!! That's so funny! She's playing hide and seek with her udder, her sides were flatter then the foal had a fit last night and she's a wide load again. Still hanging low and her back end is staying about half way to jello butt. This has been going on for about 7 weeks now, my vet laughed at me when I asked him about it and said 'yup, they do that'. I have no idea if she's going to foal tonight or 6 weeks from now. I will post pictures asap when she does


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## Taz (May 22, 2020)

This is going to sound REALLY whiny and well, it is, sorry. Still no foal..... Yes, there definitely is one.
7 weeks ago today she started developing an udder. 6 weeks ago her back end started to get soft, it has gone back and forth but softest so far this morning. 5 weeks ago her stomach muscles relaxed and she's been hanging low ever since. 5 days ago she was looking not as wide. 2 nights ago the foal was really active and she threw herself onto the ground flat on her side and lay there jerking every so often before getting up and putting her forehead into the wall and rubbing as hard as she could for a couple minutes then took a big breath and went to find something to eat. Talk about banging your head against a wall, I know the feeling! She was back to being a wide load the next morning. This is a picture of her udder from this morning, it's been the same for 3 days. It gets a bit bigger than this some days and some days is a deflated helium balloon, no consistency on when during the day it goes up or down. I'm starting to think she is going to be pregnant forever and this is never going to end. Oh ya, and the data reception was bad for some reason last night so her foaling alarm kept losing connection so it was going off every 20-30 minutes from 11 till I gave in and got up at 5:30, worked itself out and stopped at that point.

I know this is all normal but I surrender already, just have the munchkin!!!!! 


I am laughing as I write this but PLEASE get serious and foal already.


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## MerMaeve (May 22, 2020)

Ugh! I feel for both you and her! Keep us posted.


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## Pitter Patter (May 23, 2020)

Oh I am sorry Taz. Hopefully sooner than later! After looking at pics and getting some advice on this site, it would seem my girl isn't close to delivery at all. Maybe next month, maybe not! If it's next month, the previous owner was wrong on conception time. She swears it was June. Can't recall what part of the month either. Frustrating. Our shed has been more baby proofed though, so that's good. The good news is...you are closer than I am to seeing a baby. Hang in there!


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## Taz (May 24, 2020)

Pitter Patter, it sounds like the woman you got your girls from was herd breeding? It's very easy not to know when they caught unless they hand breed or just put the mares out for one heat. If you're feeling foal movement, you've had kids I'm sure you know what you're feeling, she has to be pregnant. My other little one is an experienced brood mare that I got as a rescue and didn't look in foal until her stomach muscles relaxed 3 weeks before foaling and she only had about 1/3 of an udder and barely soft back end. Keep an eye on her, she'll get there.


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## Pitter Patter (May 24, 2020)

Taz, do you have a baby yet? I may have to wait quite a while. I think she may have done herd breeding but not sure. I am sure my pinto is pregnant as her baby is very active. My other little mare may or may not be. Can't tell yet. She is "twitchy" or moving almost constantly (she is the leader), but if she is she has a long time to go (I think!). The pinto teases my little stallion a lot too! Trying not to obsess! I think they are getting tired of my staring at and feeling their bellies, and taking pictures.I sometimes get an annoyed sideways "look." Anyway, gives me more time to bond with my four minis. I don't think I have ever been more in love with any animal than my four mini's! (and trust me--I have and have add a lot of pets!) My favorite thing to do on a nice day is just sit with them in their paddock with a brush and they take turns coming up to get scratched or brushed. Can't wait to learn how to drive! I already have a small cart and harness. Just need more time! I love my job, but it sure gets in the way when you want to be outside! Good luck, Taz. I hope your baby is here VERY soon!


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## Taz (May 24, 2020)

No baby yet, I'm thinking she likes a loooong warm-up. 
These little ones are different then the big horses. I love my big guys but I think if I had found the minis first I wouldn't have gotten into the big ones. I don't drive even though one of mine does, no cart, no time, but it looks like a lot of fun!
I would be very suspicious if it's only your pinto flirting. Do you know what colour dad is? I've found the extra time with Tilly has been really good before baby. She's a little spicy and a not very trusting worrier so it's great to be able to work on that before I have to convince her I'm not going to hurt or take away a little one. I'm trying to relax and tell myself it will happen when it happens .

MerMaeve, after listening to us go through this are you going to get a mare in foal when you get your mini's?


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## Pitter Patter (May 24, 2020)

Taz, I'm with you..If I had gotten mini's first I probably wouldn't have my little "zoo." I do love all of them though, but the minis are awesome! I am sure she is pregnant because that belly is rolling and bumping. I can see it and feel it! I just can't tell how far along she is. Hopefully she'll let me know as she gets closer. smaller than she is (by the way, her name is Snickers). He is only 30" and Snickers is 36" and looks more like a shetland pony. He looks like he is a buckskin. I wonder what her baby will look like? I have some pictures of Snickers when she wasn't pregnant and there is a big difference. I had to laugh when I read your comment to MerMaeve. Looking around, it seems a whole lot of mares are sold pregnant! I got all three of my mares at the same time about two months ago. Then the owner said she "might" be pregnant when she delivered her here.


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## Taz (May 24, 2020)

Haha, nothing like finding out after the fact. I'm not good with colour genetics but does that mean she's going to throw pinto/? and he's dilute bay/?. Have you tried the colour calculator?

I have no idea on a due date for Tilly. I was told after I got her home it was thought she caught on her foal heat (foaled May 12). I didn't think she was in foal looking at her 8 weeks ago when I got her but she's gotten bigger and had more signs almost from day one. 

Yes, I'm starting to think it's easier to find a pregnant mini than not, LOL!!


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## Maryann at MiniV (May 24, 2020)

I LOVE color genetics! I think I need to check out the "colour calculator" that Taz mentioned.

Buckskin is indeed bay covered by a dilute gene. Whatever you get, it WILL carry some form of dilute coloring. Your mare, Snickers, is pinto? If she is Homozygous for pinto, she will ALWAYS throw a pinto foal. If she's not homozygous , you have a 50 percent chance for pinto. The rest is up to what is dominant or recessive between the two of them..... Fun, eh?? 

We always just want a healthy foal (with good conformation, of course)....Color is only the frosting, but it's still fun.


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## MerMaeve (May 24, 2020)

Taz said:


> MerMaeve, after listening to us go through this are you going to get a mare in foal when you get your mini's?


Well, actually one that we know we want IS pregnant, so we are waiting for her to have her baby then wean, THEN, we'll get to bring her home.


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## Taz (May 24, 2020)

MerMaeve said:


> Well, actually one that we know we want IS pregnant, so we are waiting for her to have her baby then wean, THEN, we'll get to bring her home.


Good for you. I'm not that patient, I'd bring her home in foal and have two. Haha, then be back on foal watch!


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## Taz (May 24, 2020)

She has a bit more udder tonight and isn't as wide again. Her belly is hard with no jiggle in it, is that normal or should I worry??


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## Taz (May 25, 2020)

Might be getting closer!! Still a smaller no jiggle belly(foal in/getting in position?) Her udder was bigger last night and again this morning, biggest it's been so far. Her vulva is open a bit and she's really quiet this morning. She's normally pretty spicy and quick, she stood with the lead over her neck not moving while I went over her and then slowly went out to the paddock. Fingers crossed!!!!!!


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## MerMaeve (May 25, 2020)

Taz said:


> Might be getting closer!! Still a smaller no jiggle belly(foal in/getting in position?) Her udder was bigger last night and again this morning, biggest it's been so far. Her vulva is open a bit and she's really quiet this morning. She's normally pretty spicy and quick, she stood with the lead over her neck not moving while I went over her and then slowly went out to the paddock. Fingers crossed!!!!!!


Any update????


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## MerMaeve (May 25, 2020)

Taz said:


> Good for you. I'm not that patient, I'd bring her home in foal and have two. Haha, then be back on foal watch!


It's really tempting, it really is. If it was a filly, I would consider it. But color would depend too. The mamma is a Silver Dapple Bay and they breed her to a Perlino I believe.


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## Taz (May 25, 2020)

Nothing much to report, she hung out eating all day. Still really quiet, walked behind me coming in, I normally have to slow her down. Her vulva is a bit more relaxed. I'll report in again tomorrow .


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## Pitter Patter (May 25, 2020)

Oh Taz, so excited! Please do keep us updated! Mary Ann at MiniV, I am not sure if she is homozygous. In fact all I really know is she is black and white and that she is grade and she is beautiful! Whatever she has (IF she ever has it!) will be beautiful too!


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## Taz (May 26, 2020)

Nothing yet. Her udder is a bit bigger again, she doesn't want her belly touched and she's even quieter. She was restless and swishing her tail a lot for the first part of the night then settled.


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## MerMaeve (May 26, 2020)

Ugh, darn mares keeping us in suspense!


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## Taz (May 27, 2020)

Nothing yet. She had a VERY quiet night, not her normal routine. Looks about the same as yesterday.
I have no idea what's going to happen when. The info I tracked down on her said she would 'get an udder for 2 weeks before she foaled'. Whether that means a full ready to go udder for 2 weeks or develop an udder over 2 weeks I'm not sure. Nothing was said about anything I've been seeing . Anyone want to take a guess?????


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## MerMaeve (May 27, 2020)

Taz said:


> Nothing yet. She had a VERY quiet night, not her normal routine. Looks about the same as yesterday.
> I have no idea what's going to happen when. The info I tracked down on her said she would 'get an udder for 2 weeks before she foaled'. Whether that means a full ready to go udder for 2 weeks or develop an udder over 2 weeks I'm not sure. Nothing was said about anything I've been seeing . Anyone want to take a guess?????


My guess is that she wants the baby out as much as you do! Or she wants to teach you patience. LOL Good luck......


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## Taz (May 27, 2020)

I think she wants the foal OUT but Jr hasn't decided to be ready yet.
Vulva is more open tonight.....getting closer


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## MerMaeve (May 27, 2020)

Taz said:


> I think she wants the foal OUT but Jr hasn't decided to be ready yet.
> Vulva is more open tonight.....getting closer


Darn kids! Oh wait.....I qualify as a darn kid....LOL


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## Taz (May 29, 2020)

Not yet. Her udder is a little bigger each day and her vulva is more relaxed and open. Her bum is soft but not droopy around the base of her tail. She's still quiet and has decided to sleep in a different corner than she has before. She hasn't rolled in two weeks(was rolling a few times a day) and doesn't want to lie on her side. Teats are not filled and I can't get any milk. Does she look like she's getting close to anyone?



It's been 8 weeks since she started an udder now, I'm thinking she's not going to look textbook when she foals? Waiting till the foal says she's ready now?


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## Pitter Patter (May 29, 2020)

Oh Taz...hang in there! Her belly looks a lot my girl but yours is further along I think. At least yours has an udder going! And I thought I was frustrated when my own babies were born (each one exactly 7 days late). This seems to be even worse because we can't feel what the mamas feel (although I can certainly sympathize!) Hopefully her discomfort will be over soon (and your stress reduced!). I'm just afraid I won't be there for my girl's delivery.


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## Taz (May 29, 2020)

Hanging in but going crazy, I think we all are.

I really think Snickers will foal at night. You'll have your cameras up and be watching her, or running out to check if you can't see her, who needs sleep? I've actually gotten good at waking up before my alarm every hour. I'm not going to say I'm not sleep deprived(really shouldn't be driving,haha) but I'm kinda used to it now. I agree with you though, I'm afraid I'm going to miss it. Had my surprise foal two years ago and said I was never doing it again then I fell in love with these two and here I am. I AM NOT ALLOWED TO LOOK AT ANY MORE RESCUE SITES!!!!! LMAO!!!


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## Holly Chisholm (May 29, 2020)

Dang, she looks dropped to me! I am no expert, but she LOOKS DROPPED! We had a hard time getting any milk out of Sally right up to the birth. My husband had better luck than I did. Are you seeing sloppy poops yet? Sally had that about two or three days before foaling. She also was very restless, but then got real quiet a few days before foaling as well.


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## Ryan Johnson (May 29, 2020)

Yep I reckon she’s definitely making good progress . She sure is keeping you waiting , but it’s so hard when you don’t know her history . When you are standing behind her , are her sides still sticking out ? . From that side on pic she does look like she is starting to drop .


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## Taz (May 29, 2020)

Her sides are still sticking out but not as much as before. 
She's back to being spicy tonight, trotted in next to me and was having a fit waiting for dinner. Don't know if that mean anything more than the foal is in a more comfortable position. No loose poop, no milk, was walking a lot one night but has been quiet since. If the foal starts bothering her she goes over to Spirit and he hangs his head over the partition till she relaxes and goes to sleep


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## Pitter Patter (May 29, 2020)

Taz, I bet you are right! Who needs sleep? LOL. Although I might be pretty worthless at work if I am up and down all night checking on her! I keep asking her when she's going to have it, but no luck. She's not talking....LOL. I think her muscles are starting to relax a bit. I can't move her tail to see if she is lengthening as she just tightens right up and side steps on me, but it looked a little more relaxed back there from a few glipses I got. Not much of an udder though. Don't know anything about her pattern for foaling. Last owner got her with a yearling and a new baby at side. So she has had at least two before.My little stallion is sticking pretty close to her and she is actually allowing it, which is unusual for her. Otherwise not much difference. We'll see. She's not riding low today and that seems to change day by day. Baby sure is an active one!


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## Taz (May 30, 2020)

Pitter Patter, does she like scratches? Can yo work back and scratch her next to her tail? Most of mine like that and will lift their tail, it might give you a way to check. If she can't clamp her tail down you know she's relaxed and closer.


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## Pitter Patter (May 30, 2020)

LOL, nope. She isn't that cooperative! I'm just getting where I can lightly touch under her belly. Udder and tail end still a definite no-no. Ears too! She doesn't seem to particularly like touch but is tolerating it more and more. To my surprise she actually allowed me to put fly spray on her the other day. She reminds me of a cat who likes affection only on her terms!


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## Taz (May 30, 2020)

Well pthth to her, she just wants to keep you out of the loop about the little one. This is crazy making enough with being able to check them all over, I don't know how you can stand it. 

I think mine wants to make me crazy. Her udder this morning was 1/2 what it was yesterday. I was just looking back at the thread I had two years ago on my other mare. She started an udder in the same way as Tilly and foaled 9-10 weeks later without looking ready ( 2 weeks before the breed date I was given for her). Maybe it's something in the water.....


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## MerMaeve (May 30, 2020)

UGH darn mares, just have your babies already!!!! It's frustrating for me, so it must be worse for you two!


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## Taz (May 31, 2020)

Just to add to that frustration.... she's gone backwards again.


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## MerMaeve (May 31, 2020)

Taz said:


> Just to add to that frustration.... she's gone backwards again.


*facepalm*


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 2, 2020)

Oh Tilley, you are so close! Hang in there, Taz! I need some good news to keep me going!


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## Taz (Jun 2, 2020)

Tilly is maybe moving forwards again, not much going on or back to where she was. No idea what's going on.


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## Jodie (Jun 3, 2020)

Taz, as frustrating as this whole process is for you, your experience is giving me some comfort! My little girl seemed like she was starting to get puffy in front of her teats about a month ago, so I took that to possibly be the beginnings of an udder and have been monitoring it. But since then there has been barely any change at all! I’ve even doubted if she’s even in foal lol 
While I’m sure you’re pulling your hair out, it is reassuring to know other owners are being driven crazy by their mares 
Here’s a pic of the above mentioned crazy lady creator! Excuse the dodgy clip


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## Taz (Jun 3, 2020)

Jodie, what a cutie!!!!
I'm glad it's helping you! It's very frustrating for all of us that don't have any history on them or even due dates but it really is worth it in the end. It helps me a lot to be able to whine and vent here and hear other people having the same thing going on. You're little one will get there and you won't believe how wonderful the foal is. Do you have a camera up?

I think we're all very jealous of Holly.....but she might be going through it again with her donkey, hahaha, poor Holly.


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## Jodie (Jun 3, 2020)

I don’t have a camera up yet, I was going to sort that “closer to the time” but I will likely sort it soon as with her being a maiden mare, she could trick me as to how ready she actually is! I got her on September 20th so she has to be coming up to 9 months at minimum as I know she did not get bred here! She was in a pen with a mini stud at auction so for all I know it could have happened at/on the way to the auction. The vet gave her an external ultrasound on March 10th as she is too small to palpate and she didn’t have a small enough probe to do an internal ultrasound. It was hard for her to see clearly but she said “ok there’s a big black blob in there that shouldn’t usually be there” with a bit of a chuckle, then she put the probe on her again, looked around for a bit and said “yeah I’m pretty certain that’s a head I’m looking at right now”. She is VERY knowledgeable when it comes to horses (though at her own admission, not so used to dating mini pregnancies) so I’m sure her diagnosis was correct. Plus I haven’t seen any signs of heat from Rosie while my other mares have shown very obvious signs a few times this year already, though I know that doesn’t necessarily mean much as some mares are more discreet so to speak.
She is not overly wide at the moment, but a very odd shape when looking at her from above and when feeling down her sides. I’ll post a few pictures, you will likely get a good laugh at the clip job - this little one had the thickest coat I had ever seen and even the “good” clippers struggled terribly on her. It will get touched up eventually.
Anyway, I hope your mare has a happy and healthy foal very soon for you!


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## Taz (Jun 3, 2020)

That's a better clip job than I've ever been able to do! I did one mini two years ago and it was awful but did the job, she had a winter coat in the summer and a summer coat in the winter. From what I knew of her life before I got her she probably didn't get out of the barn much. This is the first year she's not messed up with it.

The picture from above does look odd and different on both sides. The little one I had to clip was not a maiden and didn't have any more belly then that until about 3 weeks before foaling. Not trying to panic you, she could have lots of time left especially if you're not seeing signs of her getting ready. Mine 'worked on' an udder for 10 weeks before foaling without much of any other signs. They must have talked.....get her tired enough and she'll give us the big horses grain buckets instead of ours.

Please keep us posted? She looks tiny, how tall is she?


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## MerMaeve (Jun 3, 2020)

Well, not to make it worse for y'all but, Mom and I went to our local mini farm Monday and they had had a foal born the night before....from the SMALLEST mare!! (Pic attached) They had one mare, Maybelle who was huge, I swear her belly was probably 28" in diameter.


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## MerMaeve (Jun 3, 2020)

And we got to see the mare that we are definitely getting, Squirt. (She is currently pregnant) She is so sweet and friendly, I just love her so much!!!! She was checking out the camera in the last pic.


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## MerMaeve (Jun 3, 2020)

The breeders were saying you can't really tell when they're going to have their babies blah blah blah......I was like...uummm, yes you can, see if they've dropped, and their udders etc. LOL


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## Taz (Jun 3, 2020)

Squirt is so cute!! When is she due? How can you stand not bringing her home NOW? Is she silver dapple? I'm not good with mini colours...

And ohhh, what a cute baby!


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## Jodie (Jun 3, 2020)

Taz: Aww poor little soul, I’m glad she’s all fixed up now! A friend of mine did the clipping and it took a good while to even get it to the stage it’s at! She’s not a show pony or anything so it was more for her comfort than anything given that the weather was warming up faster than her winter woollies were shedding out.
She’s about 30 inches tall, though she thinks she and my 15.2 mare are the same size lol
Thank you for your advice, it definitely makes me feel more at ease! And yes I will definitely keep you updated! If she starts getting more obviously close I will maybe do a foal watch thread for her.

MerMaeve: Your mare is beautiful! I bet you can’t wait to bring her home!


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## attwoode (Jun 3, 2020)

Hi


1) First off, sounds like you are very prepared.

2) breathe and relax

3) chances are everything will go fine with this mare and foal. If not, you have everything you need to know in your head to create the best outcome possible 
4) over the years of breeding (wow, 18yrs I guess) I’ve learned this lesson above all else: be knowledgeable and prepared, BUT aside from things that you cannot prevent or control, the most likely cause for problems is a well intended human overreacting and creating a problem that nature has already solved. “Sometimes less is more”. You are well prepared for the exceptions to this rule eg redbag, dystocia, etc. you have a vet phone number handy.... now, prepare yourself also and primarily for everything to go well, with minimal intervention on your part. Let the mare do what she already knows how to do and what nature has planned. Only, when the emergency truly presents should you get worried and take action.
Enjoy!!! Often, we get so caught up in what goes wrong that we forget to appreciate the beauty and joy of birth, especially when we have lost a LOT of sleep and our patience


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## MerMaeve (Jun 3, 2020)

attwoode said:


> Hi
> 
> 
> 1) First off, sounds like you are very prepared.
> ...


Well said!!


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## MerMaeve (Jun 3, 2020)

Taz said:


> Squirt is so cute!! When is she due? How can you stand not bringing her home NOW? Is she silver dapple? I'm not good with mini colours...
> 
> And ohhh, what a cute baby!


Well, they don't know when she was breed because they just run the stallion with the mares for a month or so. I don't think they would let us bring her home now, they want the foal. And besides, we don't have the barn started yet and no fencing....LOL And yes, they said she is a silver bay dapple.


Jodie said:


> MerMaeve: Your mare is beautiful! I bet you can’t wait to bring her home!


Thank you!! yes, Mom and I can't wait! It'll probably be Nov. (depending on when she has her baby) before she can come home. Technically she'll be Mom's horse but........... I already steal her clothes...


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## Taz (Jun 3, 2020)

attwoode said:


> Hi
> 
> 
> 1) First off, sounds like you are very prepared.
> ...



Yes, that's perfect!
I'm wanting to be there but not planning on doing anything but watching unless it looks like there's a problem. Thank you so much


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 3, 2020)

Such beautiful girls! Jodie don't worry about clip jobs--oh my goodness, I try to rid my poor llamas of wool. NOTHING ruins a good clipper blade faster! My llamas end up looking a whole lot worse! AND I usually end up wearing a lovely hue of green llama spit because they love that process SO much! No baby for Tilley yet? I was just out with my minis after work and a root canal so not feeling up to playing. Wow, is Snickers ever cranky tonight! She tried to kick me a couple of times so I'm guessing she's probably tired and uncomfortable. She's only talking to the stallion and being sweet with him (NOT normal). I got some photos but nothing that looks real close. Again I will make an attempt to post some photos. What do you all think? Only a very small change in udder. Her sides don't stick out so much. Her belly has changed shape so often. Last month it looked like baby was in position then it went away,now it's kind of looking like it's in position again. She is very thick at both flanks. I know better than to borrow trouble, but I am hoping baby isn't thinking about being breech. This is my first time watching a mare give birth. Foaling kit ready to go!


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## Taz (Jun 3, 2020)

No baby for Tilly yet.
Poor you, you go to bed or at least relax in front of the tv I hope.
Looks like Snickers udder is changing a bit. Yay! 
Don't even worry about the baby being in the wrong position, he/she is still moving around. She will be working on getting the little one into the right position and has done this at least twice before. Besides, a breech is only a bad problem if you have to find a leg I think. I read it's only about a 3% chance of not having the right presentation. As Attwoode said so well, you're prepared, relax and get some sleep tonight.


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## MerMaeve (Jun 3, 2020)

Oh jeez, Pitter Patter, I hope you feel better soon!


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## Taz (Jun 5, 2020)

It's 9 weeks today and counting.....
She's been about back to where she was since Wed and is holding there for now, no changes morning to night but that's not new unfortunately.

How's everyone else doing? Any changes?


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## MerMaeve (Jun 5, 2020)

Taz said:


> It's 9 weeks today and counting.....
> She's been about back to where she was since Wed and is holding there for now, no changes morning to night but that's not new unfortunately.
> 
> How's everyone else doing? Any changes?


Ugh. Squirt hasn't had her baby yet either.


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## Taz (Jun 5, 2020)

Did Squirt look close when you saw her?


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## MerMaeve (Jun 5, 2020)

We hadn't been over there in like a month plus so yeah, probably. I wish we could go over more without being a nuisance. 

I'll see if I can find pictures from when we went over the time before last.


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 5, 2020)

Snickers is still the same! I am trying to not think about it or I'll go crazy. Right now I am a bit terrified that I will do something to screw it up so I quit asking her to tell me when! I just told her over the weekend would be best if she would like her human to be there, otherwise she will be on her own. Earlier I didn't think I would have to remove my little stallion from the group when she is ready to have the little one, but in the last couple of days he has started to stake his claim to certain things he didn't before (like the rolling treat ball). She looks increasingly uncomfortable and she looks a little more dropped than before. Udder is the same. So I think I still have a couple of weeks? If previous owner is correct though,that would put her at about one full year of pregnancy. So I guess my questions will be answered when it's the right time.


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## Taz (Jun 5, 2020)

Oh no, you're boy is getting comfortable and wanting to be in charge, that doesn't make your life easier but I'm sure you'll sort it out and it'll be fine. Yup, I'm trying to relax and not stress or I'll be completely nuts, it doesn't change their timing. From the reading I've done they can go over a year without any problems. It has to do with a delayed development in the foal, when they are where they need to be they show up. Not bigger than they should be for being late, can actually be smaller. Tilly is looking less uncomfortable than a while ago, go figure? Come on Snickers, we want a weekend baby or at least when your mom gets home and comes out to play with you.

MerMaeve, more pictures would be great


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## MerMaeve (Jun 5, 2020)

Last time we went (other than this week) was on April 26th. I didn't get any super great side pictures of Squirt but here they are because everybody needs some cute mini pictures! In the first picture the horse in the back is the one that gave birth first. The last pic I have is the best side view shot.


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## Taz (Jun 6, 2020)

I thought Tilly might foal last night, but not. Gaaaa!
When I went to feed her at 7 she had been down and didn't want to eat, she never does that. Her gut sounds were normal so I thought she was starting labor and I went into the house to watch her. She spent 1 1/2 hours yawning, laying down and getting up, rolling, looking at her sides, standing quietly but not relaxed and had two contractions standing up where she humped her back and tucked her bum. Held her tail up the whole time. After getting my hopes up she shook and went over to eat and had a quiet night. She's out looking very relaxed this morning. Her vulva is flatter this morning but still not a big udder. Fingers crossed she's going to foal soon instead of do this for a few weeks.......

MerMaeve love the pictures! She looks like she's a snuggle bug.


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## MerMaeve (Jun 6, 2020)

Taz said:


> I thought Tilly might foal last night, but not. Gaaaa!
> When I went to feed her at 7 she had been down and didn't want to eat, she never does that. Her gut sounds were normal so I thought she was starting labor and I went into the house to watch her. She spent 1 1/2 hours yawning, laying down and getting up, rolling, looking at her sides, standing quietly but not relaxed and had two contractions standing up where she humped her back and tucked her bum. Held her tail up the whole time. After getting my hopes up she shook and went over to eat and had a quiet night. She's out looking very relaxed this morning. Her vulva is flatter this morning but still not a big udder. Fingers crossed she's going to foal soon instead of do this for a few weeks.......
> 
> MerMaeve love the pictures! She looks like she's a snuggle bug.



Jeez oh peets!  Have your baby already, Tilly!!

Thanks.  From what time I've spent with her, she is!


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## Holly Chisholm (Jun 8, 2020)

Come on Tilly and Snickers!!!!! Toooooo much suspense!!!


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## Taz (Jun 8, 2020)

Hahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Nothing new going on here. Maybe she'll surprise me and have it without any warning tonight, I can hope .


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 8, 2020)

I think Tilly will have hers before Snickers. I think she has changed her mind about having a baby after all! She barely looks pregnant tonight. Discouraging! I even checked the shed to see if she lost it. Nope. Had to look really close to see any movement.


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## chandab (Jun 9, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> I think Tilly will have hers before Snickers. I think she has changed her mind about having a baby after all! She barely looks pregnant tonight. Discouraging! I even checked the shed to see if she lost it. Nope. Had to look really close to see any movement.


I know that feeling... I exposed 4 mares last summer. Unfortunately, one mare lost her foal late term, too premature to survive (I got there not long after she foaled, but it was too late, foal was too early, as she was 298 days at most). Anyway, onto the next three: one mare has been making a bag for awhile, but otherwise not really showing signs, second mare next to no bag, and third mare doesn't look pregnant (but has a ways to go and a larger mare, so could hide it). I was looking at the second mare the other day, still not much bag, but lifted her tail for a check, very lax tail and her lady bits were very elongated, we had a rip roaring storm that night with power outage, woke up in the morning to a tiny filly (313 days gestation at the most). First mare, still working on a bag, but still doesn't look very ready otherwise, although, a little off her feed. They like to keep us on our toes.


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## Taz (Jun 9, 2020)

I have a blind spot on the camera and it's where Tilly likes to lie down, of course. I check every morning first thing to see if she had it and I missed it and it didn't get out of the sack.
Snickers baby has been playing hide and seek with you all along hasn't he? Another one that's not following the rules .
I've given up trying to figure out what's going on. All I know is Tilly's pregnant, in her last trimester, the baby's still moving so I assume alright and she can't be pregnant forever. I'm hoping for sooner than later for both of them. Nothing last night though.


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## Taz (Jun 9, 2020)

If anyone has pictures of their foals in their baby fuzz and then shed out to their real colour could you please post them? I think Holly's trying to get some ideas how Sterling might look, most of the pictures on older posts aren't there anymore. I know, off topic here but it's what I can do this morning, not awake yet


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 10, 2020)

Taz, any baby for you and Tilley? We had crazy storm last night with a slight break this morning. Supposed to pick up this afternoon again. I was sure that if Snickers was going to have hers it would be when I would have to dodge lightening bolts to get to the shed! She didn't though. She isn't showing any signs of delivery any time soon  . Previous owner said she was bred last June, specific day unknown. So using a foaling calculator and giving Snickers the benefit of the doubt using June 30 2019 as her covered date, her last expected due date was yesterday! Baby has slowed down in movements, but my daughter was able to see and feel a few bumps yesterday evening. Daughter isn't terribly interested before, but is now! She received the same reception from Snickers that I did when we first met and wasn't happy about being touched at all. At least I know it wasn't just me. She has to get to know someone before things get personal I guess! So time will tell but I am getting anxious!


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 10, 2020)

OOPS! I was wrong...last day for Snickers, if she's playing by the rule book, would be TODAY! We'll see, but I'm not counting my foals before they're born!


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## Taz (Jun 10, 2020)

No foal for Tilly. Same thing though. The foal has been really active, her whole belly dancing and jumping, and now I can't see or feel much at all. Maybe they're both in position and can't move much anymore? . I was told Tilly was bred on her foal heat so that would have been around May 22nd. She's either going over a year or they got it wrong. It sounds like Snickers previous owner doesn't know either. We just have to hang in a little (I hope) longer. I really am starting to lose it though. Kristen's not having any better luck and Trixie's been giving her all kinds of signs that she's close.


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## Maryann at MiniV (Jun 10, 2020)

A lot of times when the foal is going into birthing position, they stop moving around so much. This is also when the mare looks "dropped" and not sticking out sideways.


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 10, 2020)

Why does Snickers look "less pregnant"? She has never really been very wide like I see in some of the mare photos? One day she looks "dropped" but then she's back to looking only a little chubby, not pregnant. She is a larger mini at 36". Baby is still bumping and kicking so I know she is still pregnant. Previous owner insists she was covered June 2019, but not what day. Shouldn't she look bigger? Any advice out there? Frustrated here! Thanks!


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## Maryann at MiniV (Jun 10, 2020)

Have you been able to express any "milk"?


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## MerMaeve (Jun 10, 2020)

UGH!!!


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## Taz (Jun 11, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> Why does Snickers look "less pregnant"? She has never really been very wide like I see in some of the mare photos? One day she looks "dropped" but then she's back to looking only a little chubby, not pregnant. She is a larger mini at 36". Baby is still bumping and kicking so I know she is still pregnant. Previous owner insists she was covered June 2019, but not what day. Shouldn't she look bigger? Any advice out there? Frustrated here! Thanks!



I wouldn't worry about her not looking big. If the foal is not sitting sideways most of the time and is instead lined up with mom she won't look as big. If the foal is in position she will look less pregnant. Dad is only 29inches (I think) so there's a good chance she could have a smaller foal. She's a bigger mare and could be carrying high, again won't look as big. There's a picture here somewhere, sorry couldn't find it, of a mare that didn't look pregnant at all then had a foal that afternoon. I heard a story about a tb mare who was bred, checked not in foal so was put back into race training, won her race and foaled that night. Had no signs at all. I know a person who did that too, 3 babies and didn't show with any of them and she was model thin. No idea where they put it but it happens. You know the foal is doing fine, that's all that matters. I'm loosing my mind waiting and worrying as you are. We are both as prepared as possible. From what you've been told she should foal this month or early next month if she goes long, remember it's not a problem for to go 'late' like with people. Hang in there!!!! They did it the right way with the mini donkey, don't know they're pregnant and find a beautiful baby in the morning. I never want to do this again......


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 11, 2020)

Oh boy. Any Tilley progress yet? When I went to feed this morning before work, I saw that Snickers has dropped a bit more. I tried to check udder, etc but I just put food down and none of my girls want to be bothered with food in front of them. I didn't want a hoof to the head just before work! Family will keep an eye on her today. I'm really pulling for the weekend! I have decided that when she does foal, I will keep stallion with the girls so he can see it, get used to the idea and then move him over to my other pen with "the boys" ( I had all male animals until the girls arrived!). Then he can see the baby through the fence and we can gauge his behavior safely. If I move him now, the baby would be a surprise addition when he is returned to his "harem." Is this logical or not? If I move him too early I feel they would all be upset because they would share a fence line. He used to pace the line and refuse to eat before I let him in there. Snickers has not bagged up any more than my last pictures unfortunately. Her rear muscles seem to have slightly relaxed though. I have not been able to get any milk and I don't think she would tolerate my checking well. When I get near that udder she is ready to bite and kick. She must be rolling a lot lately because she is so filthy! When I pat her lightly I get a dust cloud! Hopefully I will be there when she foals so I can wash her udders and teats when she is down. What a crazy time....


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## Taz (Jun 11, 2020)

Rolling is good!!! She might not bag up at all until she foals, don't stress on that. Dropped more is good! I think you're getting close, this weekend would be great!!!!!

Tilly's had absolutely no changes since last Wed. She rolled once the afternoon I thought she was in labour but nothing since or for a few weeks before that. Quiet at night, barely any tail swishing. Lots of eating. I think you're seeing more with Snickers than I am with Tilly. Going insane!!!!!! 

I would take your boy out if you know Snickers is in labour then bring him back in in a couple of days on a long lead so you can control him a bit for intro's. I heard of a very quiet gelding who was great with the new foal across the fence but attacked it when they put him in the paddock. I'm going to keep Tilly and the foal alone until she's over being overprotective but sharing a fence then I'm going to take Spirit in on a long lead when I reintroduce and hang with them for a while until they look really relaxed then leave it on him and watch from outside the paddock for another while. I'm not worried about my other mare. Yup, a little paranoid but I'd rather overkill then a problem.


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## MerMaeve (Jun 11, 2020)

Taz said:


> I never want to do this again......


Oh once you see the baby I'm sure you will!


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 11, 2020)

Thanks Taz! Yup, he's going out when she starts labor I think. The line is a great idea and I think i will be doing that too! He's a good boy, but taking no chances! He and Snickers are becoming fast friends and now groom each other, so that is good. Even if he was good with the foal, any human helpers might encounter a protective stallion. Overall, just a good idea to move him over until baby is very adept at moving and mama and other mares can protect as necessary. Snickers is being fickle. One minute she is all over me and the next she's pinning her ears back at me. I have a feeling (or maybe a hope!) that she foals this weekend. I told her that really Saturday anytime would be perfect, but Friday night is good too  . She seems close. She's dropped a bit more today, still no bagging up to speak of, or at least no changes. She looks quite uncomfortable. Baby is moving suddenly and you can see it's painful as Snickers will stop moving and arch her back, then walk it out a bit and then go back to eating. I can't lift her tail much to look but from quick glimpses she looks pretty swollen. Hopefully she doesn't go into full labor tonight! I don't have cameras unfortunately and storms are rolling in and out of the area. It seems a lot of mares have braxton hicks contractions or periodic contractions like we do. At least it seems that way when they seem to start labor and then back to everyday life! Come on Tilley! Maybe they will both go this weekend. Tilley seems so much father along, but Snickers is probably keeping secrets. I just hope one of my other mares isn't keeping a secret of her own. She's always looked pregnant to me but previous owner says no. I check her when I check Snickers and no changes, except for some edema in front of udder. Oh my goodness, I hope she's just gained some weight! Good night everyone and good luck  (I am so grateful for this site!)


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## MerMaeve (Jun 12, 2020)

Any babies over night? We drove past Squirt and I didn't see any foals but she didn't look super pregnant either.....maybe she's reversed too.  I just want her to have her baby so we can get her once the foal is weaned!


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## MerMaeve (Jun 12, 2020)

It may have been thought that we were on the road a ways away and not up close.....


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## Taz (Jun 12, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> Thanks Taz! Yup, he's going out when she starts labor I think. The line is a great idea and I think i will be doing that too! He's a good boy, but taking no chances! He and Snickers are becoming fast friends and now groom each other, so that is good. Even if he was good with the foal, any human helpers might encounter a protective stallion. Overall, just a good idea to move him over until baby is very adept at moving and mama and other mares can protect as necessary. Snickers is being fickle. One minute she is all over me and the next she's pinning her ears back at me. I have a feeling (or maybe a hope!) that she foals this weekend. I told her that really Saturday anytime would be perfect, but Friday night is good too  . She seems close. She's dropped a bit more today, still no bagging up to speak of, or at least no changes. She looks quite uncomfortable. Baby is moving suddenly and you can see it's painful as Snickers will stop moving and arch her back, then walk it out a bit and then go back to eating. I can't lift her tail much to look but from quick glimpses she looks pretty swollen. Hopefully she doesn't go into full labor tonight! I don't have cameras unfortunately and storms are rolling in and out of the area. It seems a lot of mares have braxton hicks contractions or periodic contractions like we do. At least it seems that way when they seem to start labor and then back to everyday life! Come on Tilley! Maybe they will both go this weekend. Tilley seems so much father along, but Snickers is probably keeping secrets. I just hope one of my other mares isn't keeping a secret of her own. She's always looked pregnant to me but previous owner says no. I check her when I check Snickers and no changes, except for some edema in front of udder. Oh my goodness, I hope she's just gained some weight! Good night everyone and good luck  (I am so grateful for this site!)



I hate to tell you this but if she doesn't look like she's put on weight it's probably edema not fat...but I could be completely wrong . It sounds like Snickers is doing more than Tilly. Then again they're all doing more than Tilly, she's had no changes since last Wed. It's been 10 weeks now since she started an udder, whine!!!!!! Fingers crossed Snickers has a little one this weekend.


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## Taz (Jun 12, 2020)

MerMaeve said:


> Any babies over night? We drove past Squirt and I didn't see any foals but she didn't look super pregnant either.....maybe she's reversed too.  I just want her to have her baby so we can get her once the foal is weaned!


Are they going to get hold of you when she foals? Good luck on it being soon, you don't even have her yet and you're going through this with her, that doesn't seem fair..... You'll get her home soon


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 12, 2020)

Aww. Taz is right. You don't even have her yet and are going through all this worry! She sure is a cutie! I don't know about Snickers. Always contrary, that girl! Both in attitude and having babies, I guess. Ah, but I love her so...I would love the waiting to be over this weekend but my camera hasn't arrived yet so it's going to be some hiking at least a couple of times each night out to the paddocks to check. If it wasn't literally freezing at night this weekend, I would just grab a sleeping bag and go out and sleep in the shed with them. (I wonder what the minis would think?! LOL) Of course last weekend it was in the 60's at night! Anyway, her udder is exactly the same. She looks only slightly pregnant now and it looks like baby is lined up and ready to go whenever he/she is ready. Now I just hope it's lined up correctly! Who knows how long it will take for baby to decide it's time? Ugh! I have some powdered colostrum and milk replacer just in case, but likely won't need it as she's not maiden, but lack of bagging up worries me a bit. Come on Tilley...your human is waiting


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## Taz (Jun 13, 2020)

Lucky you having powdered colostrum! My mare two years ago didn't have any milk, barely had an udder, and I had to run to the vet for milk replacer and something to get her milk in(March baby and there was no colostrum collected yet). By the time I got back she had skimmed milk and Ollie had had is first feed at 3 hours old. Before I left I had gotten some colostrum from Izzy and syringed it into him and then some goats milk so he had something. BUT what I hadn't found out anywhere was that if you give them any other milk or milk repacer except mares milk they shut down the ability to absorb colostrum. If I have to do it again I'll be doing sugar water for the first day as I'm finding colostrum(hoping there's some to find this time of year, I have a repo vet nearby who tries to stock up. He was borderline when I had his blood test done the next day and was very sick when he was about a month old, antibiotic shots 2x/day and banamine for 2 weeks.


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 13, 2020)

Ugh..Something else to worry about! I don't understand why any animal would not absorb colostrum after being given something else. I used to be a wildlife rehabber. We used goat's milk and colostrum for most animals if orphaned. It was in high demand in the spring, especially for deer, and while not ideal, it did wonders. (not goats milk found in stores. Cannot be processed and must be fresh or fresh frozen. Wish I still had my goat! She was maiden virgin who developed a very large udder and lots of milk. Kept many wildlife fed. Most wild animals do ok (their own mother's milk is always ideal) on goat milk. Cow's milk is very undigestable for most animals. I guess horses just want to be different! Any baby yet, Taz? Snickers is showing no signs of delivering still. Here is a pick I just took this morning.


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## Taz (Jun 13, 2020)

Is she sunken in in front of her hip?
No baby.
I've been in touch wit Spirits(dad) breeder, that's where I got any info on these two. She had a mare due this weekend who didn't look as ready as Tilly(I sent her pics) 2 weeks ago. She had an adorable colt two days ago. .
Our turn has to be soon.....


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## MerMaeve (Jun 13, 2020)

Taz said:


> Are they going to get hold of you when she foals? Good luck on it being soon, you don't even have her yet and you're going through this with her, that doesn't seem fair..... You'll get her home soon





Pitter Patter said:


> Aww. Taz is right. You don't even have her yet and are going through all this worry! She sure is a cutie!


Yes, they said they'd let us know and we could come over to see the baby. Yeah, Mom has said multiple times that she wished Squirt wasn't pregnant, then we could get her before Oct./Nov.......I do too! It seems so far away.... My uncle is building the barn for us and he got the corner post holes dug Friday. I'm super excited!!!


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## MerMaeve (Jun 13, 2020)

Squirt is technically going to be Mom's mini and Squirt's breeders are going to look for a mini for me as she has the "behind the scenes" mini breeders. (If that makes sense.  ) My dream mini would be an Appy/Pinto. We'll see what she can drum up for me.


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## Taz (Jun 13, 2020)

MerMaeve said:


> Squirt is technically going to be Mom's mini and Squirt's breeders are going to look for a mini for me as she has the "behind the scenes" mini breeders. (If that makes sense.  ) My dream mini would be an Appy/Pinto. We'll see what she can drum up for me.



You're going to find one that makes your heart melt, then you'll know it's the right one. I'm sure you'll be playing with Squirt a lot too  . You'll have them soon, it's so hard so wait though.


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 13, 2020)

Taz said:


> Is she sunken in in front of her hip?
> No baby.
> I've been in touch wit Spirits(dad) breeder, that's where I got any info on these two. She had a mare due this weekend who didn't look as ready as Tilly(I sent her pics) 2 weeks ago. She had an adorable colt two days ago. .
> Our turn has to be soon.....


She wasn't sunken in by the hip, but is this evening. What does that mean? Good or bad?


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## Taz (Jun 14, 2020)

I think that means baby dropped. Hoping soon for you!!!!!!!!


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 14, 2020)

Taz said:


> I think that means baby dropped. Hoping soon for you!!!!!!!!


She hardly even looks pregnant this morning...Has Tilley dropped yet? At this rate I am beginning to think neither will deliver at all!


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## Taz (Jun 14, 2020)

I've been thinking that for a bit now too, I don't think it's ever going to happen.
No. Tilly was super wide this morning.


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## Taz (Jun 14, 2020)

Tilly has more fill in her udder tonight and her vulva looks more relaxed.....?????? She's been here before, maybe it's a good sign tonight?


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## MerMaeve (Jun 14, 2020)

Good luck Tilly!!! Tonight's the night, no more messing around!


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## MerMaeve (Jun 14, 2020)

Ya know Tilly, if I don't have a notification of you had your foal, I'm going to be very disappointed!


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## Taz (Jun 15, 2020)

No foal.....I didn't want to write it again. She hasn't gone backwards again as of this morning at least


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 15, 2020)

Come on Tilley!!!! SOMEONE has to keep Snickers motivated ! LOL


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## Taz (Jun 15, 2020)

Tilly's udder went down again through the day  . It's been decided here that she's never going to foal.

Jodie, is she giving you any signs yet?


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## Jodie (Jun 15, 2020)

Taz said:


> Tilly's udder went down again through the day  . It's been decided here that she's never going to foal.
> 
> Jodie, is she giving you any signs yet?


No, she’s basically stalled at chunky, odd shaped belly and puffiness just in front of her teats that I can cup with my hand. I’m thinking she was bred pretty late and is going to be more late July, maybe even August.


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## Taz (Jun 16, 2020)

That sounds like what Tilly looked like when I got her 12 weeks ago. Then the edema softened up and she started an udder a week later. . If she'd read the book she would have foaled 4-6 weeks after that.

Big hard udder again this morning but still no milk to test. If I can remember I'll try the warm cloth trick later.  No idea.....


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 16, 2020)

No baby here either


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## Taz (Jun 16, 2020)

There's no way Snickers isn't pregnant if you've seen all that movement. It is VERY different than digestion and I don't know why else her shape would keep changing that much. I wish she'd get an udder going though. I suppose the previous owner, who sounds kind of clueless, could be completely wrong and she still has a while to go although I think you only can see lots of movement in or near their last trimester when the baby's bigger? Don't let your family get you down. Even if you're wrong and she's not in foal she's been cozying up the your stud so should be for next year when you can have all this 'fun' again! Hahahahahah!! Maybe x2....


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## Taz (Jun 16, 2020)

Udder went down again today, I don't get that, it will stay for a few days without changing then get big for a day then almost disappear for a while before coming back. Anyway here are some pictures of my frustration tonight. Sorry about the bad udder picture, it's the best of about 6. Any ideas? Her tail isn't really soft but when I picked it up and down for a while it didn't get tighter like it normally does. Very much still a wide load but so was my other one when she foaled so I'm trying to not get too discouraged about that.


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 17, 2020)

Tilley is beautiful!


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## Taz (Jun 17, 2020)

Thank you, I think so


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## Holly Chisholm (Jun 17, 2020)

I love your mom helping you! Have you been able to get a drop of milk out of Tilly?


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## Jodie (Jun 17, 2020)

Holy wide load! She is adorable! Hopefully she doesn’t keep this up for much longer, you must be exhausted!
I tried to take some pictures to show the puffiness in front of Rosie’s teats, but it doesn’t really seem to show in pictures (though I’ve attached them anyway). I know she has quite a ways to go yet, but given that she is a maiden and we basically have about a 3 month window as to when she could foal, I like to keep an eye on her and monitor any changes. Something that is really bothering me though is the shape of her stomach at times - when she doesn’t have a big full belly and turns a certain way, her belly almost lumps out underneath her rib cage. It does it on both sides and gets more bulbous so to speak as it goes towards her back legs. It’s so so strange, have any of you seen this before, or have any ideas as to why it may do that? I’ve attached another picture of her just because she is so darn cute lol


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## Taz (Jun 17, 2020)

Holly Chisholm said:


> I love your mom helping you! Have you been able to get a drop of milk out of Tilly?


Nothing, I've even tried with the 'mini mare breast pump' in my foaling kit, adding to the 'crazy'  My mom is out helping me turn out and bring in and feed every day 


Jodie said:


> Holy wide load! She is adorable! Hopefully she doesn’t keep this up for much longer, you must be exhausted!
> I tried to take some pictures to show the puffiness in front of Rosie’s teats, but it doesn’t really seem to show in pictures (though I’ve attached them anyway). I know she has quite a ways to go yet, but given that she is a maiden and we basically have about a 3 month window as to when she could foal, I like to keep an eye on her and monitor any changes. Something that is really bothering me though is the shape of her stomach at times - when she doesn’t have a big full belly and turns a certain way, her belly almost lumps out underneath her rib cage. It does it on both sides and gets more bulbous so to speak as it goes towards her back legs. It’s so so strange, have any of you seen this before, or have any ideas as to why it may do that? I’ve attached another picture of her just because she is so darn cute lol


I think I know what you're talking about, that would be the baby. I'll post a couple of pictures of Tilly, you can't see it(of course, I have the hardest time getting pictures to show what I see) but there is a ridge under where my hand is and it bulges out below my hand. Does that sound right? Definitely the baby, I've had kicks there. I think your side picture shows it. I'm not an expert so could be completely wrong or wishful thinking or just the picture, but it looks like she could be starting an udder. Yes edema but that doesn't happen behind their teats only in front. Do you have other pictures to compare to? Rosie is really cute!


Sometimes it sticks out and sometimes not but yes below the rib cage.

Oh and her udder was back up again this morning, we'll see what it looks like later.


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## Jodie (Jun 17, 2020)

Taz said:


> Nothing, I've even tried with the 'mini mare breast pump' in my foaling kit, adding to the 'crazy'  My mom is out helping me turn out and bring in and feed every day
> 
> I think I know what you're talking about, that would be the baby. I'll post a couple of pictures of Tilly, you can't see it(of course, I have the hardest time getting pictures to show what I see) but there is a ridge under where my hand is and it bulges out below my hand. Does that sound right? Definitely the baby, I've had kicks there. I think your side picture shows it. I'm not an expert so could be completely wrong or wishful thinking or just the picture, but it looks like she could be starting an udder. Yes edema but that doesn't happen behind their teats only in front. Do you have other pictures to compare to? Rosie is really cute!
> View attachment 41617
> ...



“Mini mare breast pump”  
Oh that makes me feel so much better, thank you! I did think was possibly the baby but it looks so creepy! She eats more during the day than she does at night so it’s more visible in the mornings when she turns to the side and you see where her ribs would end and then this big bulge!
And yes the puffiness/edema is in front of her udder not behind - it basically goes belly, puffy part, teats, if that makes sense. Almost like a little human baby butt lol 
I don’t have any pictures from the exact same angle, but here’s one from a week ago. I’ll be sure to take pictures from that angle from now on though.


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## Taz (Jun 17, 2020)

Jodie said:


> “Mini mare breast pump”
> Oh that makes me feel so much better, thank you! I did think was possibly the baby but it looks so creepy! She eats more during the day than she does at night so it’s more visible in the mornings when she turns to the side and you see where her ribs would end and then this big bulge!
> And yes the puffiness/edema is in front of her udder not behind - it basically goes belly, puffy part, teats, if that makes sense. Almost like a little human baby butt lol
> I don’t have any pictures from the exact same angle, but here’s one from a week ago. I’ll be sure to take pictures from that angle from now on though.
> ...


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## Taz (Jun 17, 2020)

I have no idea what I just did wrong but expand the quote above for what I wrote


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## Jodie (Jun 17, 2020)

Taz said:


> I have no idea what I just did wrong but expand the quote above for what I wrote


Lol no worries. And yes it feels like something is maybe starting to happen - she’s very good at letting me feel her udder/belly etc. She’s sure come a long way from when we got her - she was a nightmare to catch and would bite and kick at you if you even attempted to go anywhere near her feet/touch her belly. Now my 7 year old can halter her and pick her feet 
Ahh I sure hope Tilly quits holding out on you and has her baby soon!


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## Jodie (Jun 17, 2020)

I just realized I do have a picture from pretty much that same angle, taken this Monday. Putting the two pictures side by side it does look as though a little something is starting to happen, even in the space of 2 days. So if Rosie and Tilly read the same book, we have about 12 weeks to go


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## Taz (Jun 17, 2020)

I hope she hasn't read the same one as Tilly  but we'll see


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## Taz (Jun 18, 2020)

Nothing to report so I thought I'd give everyone something to laugh at me about. It's OK, you can .
I might be doing this again next year. A bit of a long story but here goes. My old donkey got REALY lame about 6 weeks after I got Tilley. Shaking and sweating trying to stand when I went into the barn in the morning. I called my vet to come put her down, she's had constant problems with laminitis since before I got her but never like this. He talked me into putting her on drugs and waiting thinking it was a severe arthritis flare up. She's doing amazing now. Anyway, she was down a lot and it was cold and wet out so I had her, my other donkey and Izzy(my other mini mare) turned out in the arena since they are normally a turn out group together. Izzy wasn't happy not being able to keep an eye on Ollie through the day(weaned but never separated by more than a fence or half wall). I put her out by herself next to Ollie the next day, I'm waiting for him to be geldable before he goes near a mare. She was better but not happy so I put Tilly and Spirit on the other side of her too, they were supposed to go out together at some point might as well start getting to know each other. She still wasn't happy so I put her in with Tilly and Spirit after a few days. Spirit had been gelded 6 weeks earlier so I never thought twice about it. Izzy was in season but so, he's a gelding now. Well, he bred her at her request for 2 days, I expected that but he was throwing blanks so it didn't matter. Day 3 and 4 she would bat her eyes and call him over and he'd trot over talking to her ready to go but when he got there every time he sniffed her and lost all interest. I thought that was really weird so started doing some reading. I found a couple vets who said not 2-4 weeks like I was told but that you should keep an exstud out for 8 weeks. I waited 3 weeks for her to come back into season and she sort of did, she looked like she was coming in but Spirit wasn't very interested and she never got to standing heat and went out in 2 days. I could get some clear fluid from her teats just after the first heat but nothing since then. SO, I'm waiting to see. Apparently it's uncommon but possible for a mature breeding stallion to do the deed up to 8 weeks after gelding according to Penn state and from what I was told he's very good at his job, never failed. GAAAAA!!!!!! The good news is she's an experienced broodmare and LOVES being a mom.


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## MerMaeve (Jun 18, 2020)

Oh jeez......I don't know if I should laugh or cry......LOL


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## Jodie (Jun 18, 2020)

Oh my god!!! Ok so how does this work with younger studs? The reason I ask is a week after I got Rosie, my father in law brought over a mini gelding to live at my place. He had been gelded a few days prior to being brought here, he was 3 years old. Would that mean he could possibly be Rosie’s baby daddy?!!


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## Taz (Jun 18, 2020)

Oh no!! Yes he could be. The average colt is able to breed for 2 weeks after gelding, give it 4 weeks to be safe. Removing the testicles doesn't stop breeding, there are still sperm in ducts and tubes that are at different stages of development. I don't know how many tries they would get but as the saying goes, it only takes once.


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## Jodie (Jun 18, 2020)

Taz said:


> Oh no!! Yes he could be. The average colt is able to breed for 2 weeks after gelding, give it 4 weeks to be safe. Removing the testicles doesn't stop breeding, there are still sperm in ducts and tubes that are at different stages of development. I don't know how many tries they would get but as the saying goes, it only takes once.


That’s the thing about not knowing how far along she actually is, she could have come here early in her pregnancy or Barney could be the culprit! I never saw him do anything but obviously I’m also not out there 24/7 so who knows.
On a side note, I’ve attached a picture where one of the things is not like the others! Little monkey broke through the wire fence to where she feels is her rightful place - with the horses the size she believes herself to be


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## Taz (Jun 19, 2020)

What a wonderful group. She's just giving you a big hint about where she wants to live, humans can be a little dense you know  .


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## Taz (Jun 19, 2020)

So week 12 today, no foal. BUT this morning....
Her udder is really big and looking like a proper udder, more elongated and her tail head isn't sticking out yet but I can feel it easily. Maybe she's getting serious finally? Foal in a week or two...or sooner please!!!!!!!!


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## Jodie (Jun 19, 2020)

Taz said:


> What a wonderful group. She's just giving you a big hint about where she wants to live, humans can be a little dense you know  .


Lol I think you might be right! She loves my “big girls” as we call them. And that’s exciting about Tilly! Come on little one, it’s time!


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 19, 2020)

Taz said:


> Nothing to report so I thought I'd give everyone something to laugh at me about. It's OK, you can .
> I might be doing this again next year. A bit of a long story but here goes. My old donkey got REALY lame about 6 weeks after I got Tilley. Shaking and sweating trying to stand when I went into the barn in the morning. I called my vet to come put her down, she's had constant problems with laminitis since before I got her but never like this. He talked me into putting her on drugs and waiting thinking it was a severe arthritis flare up. She's doing amazing now. Anyway, she was down a lot and it was cold and wet out so I had her, my other donkey and Izzy(my other mini mare) turned out in the arena since they are normally a turn out group together. Izzy wasn't happy not being able to keep an eye on Ollie through the day(weaned but never separated by more than a fence or half wall). I put her out by herself next to Ollie the next day, I'm waiting for him to be geldable before he goes near a mare. She was better but not happy so I put Tilly and Spirit on the other side of her too, they were supposed to go out together at some point might as well start getting to know each other. She still wasn't happy so I put her in with Tilly and Spirit after a few days. Spirit had been gelded 6 weeks earlier so I never thought twice about it. Izzy was in season but so, he's a gelding now. Well, he bred her at her request for 2 days, I expected that but he was throwing blanks so it didn't matter. Day 3 and 4 she would bat her eyes and call him over and he'd trot over talking to her ready to go but when he got there every time he sniffed her and lost all interest. I thought that was really weird so started doing some reading. I found a couple vets who said not 2-4 weeks like I was told but that you should keep an exstud out for 8 weeks. I waited 3 weeks for her to come back into season and she sort of did, she looked like she was coming in but Spirit wasn't very interested and she never got to standing heat and went out in 2 days. I could get some clear fluid from her teats just after the first heat but nothing since then. SO, I'm waiting to see. Apparently it's uncommon but possible for a mature breeding stallion to do the deed up to 8 weeks after gelding according to Penn state and from what I was told he's very good at his job, never failed. GAAAAA!!!!!! The good news is she's an experienced broodmare and LOVES being a mom.


Oh boy! (or girl!)...You get to do this all over again next summer! Then you can keep me company because I can't be sure my stallion didn't breed with anyone. I know that's my fault but he was being mistreated by larger male horse and goat so I put him in with the girls, at the time thinking at least 2, maybe even all three were already pregnant. For sure one is, one is a big question, and pretty sure the 25 yr old isn't, at least not from last summer! So guess who should be laughed at? Not you, that's for sure!


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 19, 2020)

Jodie said:


> That’s the thing about not knowing how far along she actually is, she could have come here early in her pregnancy or Barney could be the culprit! I never saw him do anything but obviously I’m also not out there 24/7 so who knows.
> On a side note, I’ve attached a picture where one of the things is not like the others! Little monkey broke through the wire fence to where she feels is her rightful place - with the horses the size she believes herself to be
> View attachment 41644


Awww....


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## Taz (Jun 19, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> Oh boy! (or girl!)...You get to do this all over again next summer! Then you can keep me company because I can't be sure my stallion didn't breed with anyone. I know that's my fault but he was being mistreated by larger male horse and goat so I put him in with the girls, at the time thinking at least 2, maybe even all three were already pregnant. For sure one is, one is a big question, and pretty sure the 25 yr old isn't, at least not from last summer! So guess who should be laughed at? Not you, that's for sure!



It sounds like we are both going to wait and see . At least we'll have company I'm not sure I wouldn't have done the same thing you did if I had been in your position. I'm on the fence about another baby next year. They are so much fun and Izzy is the happiest with a little one at her side. I don't enjoy foal watch,at all, but it's not the end of the world. The part that really bothers me is knowing that there's a risk to the mare and foal, it would be devastating if something went wrong for Izzy. Can't do anything about it now so I'll just wait, and wait, and wait..... I really like instant gratification .


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## Taz (Jun 21, 2020)

I thought maybe something was going to start at about 12:30 but she decided not. I'll go out soon to feed and check what condition her condition is in.


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## Taz (Jun 21, 2020)

Well, Tilly is still being Tilly. Her udder is still 'good to go' but her elongation is gone and she's tightened up around her tail. If what I was told holds true, she has about 1 1/2 weeks to go. We'll see. 
Mind you, I was also told she caught on her foal heat so that would have meant an April baby


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## Taz (Jun 21, 2020)

The sound you're hearing is me banging my head against the wall. She's back to half an udder but I did catch her rolling this afternoon which she hasn't been doing at all in weeks. I'm pretty sure I'll be watching her sleep again tonight.


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## Holly Chisholm (Jun 22, 2020)

Any milk yet???


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## Taz (Jun 22, 2020)

None . She's back to a full hard udder this morning and elongated again. My birthday is early July, maybe she's waiting till then.


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## elizabeth.conder (Jun 22, 2020)

Do you have any pictures you can share?


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 22, 2020)

Taz said:


> None . She's back to a full hard udder this morning and elongated again. My birthday is early July, maybe she's waiting till then.


She just might be!


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## Taz (Jun 23, 2020)

Her udder went down yesterday and not back this morning, there is no pattern to it at all. Tail tightened up again last night.
These are bad pictures from this morning. Any ideas???? I'm giving up guessing and trying to relax(ha!) and wait.


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## Holly Chisholm (Jun 23, 2020)

I'm no expert, but she sure looks dropped in that first picture..


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## Taz (Jun 23, 2020)

All thoughts are appreciated no matter what the experience level


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## Jodie (Jun 23, 2020)

Wow she looks like she’s dropped from previous pictures!


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## Jodie (Jun 23, 2020)

I could use some help if that’s ok? Rosie’s udder is definitely changing though it isn’t filling as such yet. What would be her actual udder bag used to be tight skin tucked against her if that makes sense, but this morning it has folds in it, almost like it’s a bit saggy, is that normal in udder development?


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## Jodie (Jun 23, 2020)

I suppose I should have added some pictures to try and show what I’m meaning (though of course it’s hard to get pictures to show exactly what I’m seeing in real life  ) I know she has a long way to go yet, but I’m just wondering if this a normal part of the process. I thought the bag was supposed to fill, not get saggy lol


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## Taz (Jun 23, 2020)

LMAO!!!!! Welcome to the looney bin, I think you're 100% one of us now  , it only gets worse from here!!!!! Sorry, I need more sleep.
I know what you mean, I'm going to guess that's her starting an udder. Try feeling instead of looking in the beginning, I find it's easier to tell a difference that way. Both my girls are experienced so I don't know if it's normal to get saggy in the beginning for a maiden but it doesn't sound too off to me. My girls were saggy and wrinkled to begin with . I'm trying so hard not to go anywhere else with this........


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## elizabeth.conder (Jun 23, 2020)

Taz, I agree, it looks like she’s dropping. However the foal is not quite lined up. It’s getting there though. And that can happen fast. Her udder does not look quite ready but you can see it better there and it can be hard to judge on photos. Especially since mares don’t all read the same book. She may finish bagging up right before or a couple of days before. There are a couple other angles that help a lot to judge and compare her udder. If you can get them that’d be great. Try from directly below her where you can see the entire udder. The other one is from behind between her legs. Her teats SHOULD point down and her udder will look almost flat from that angle when her udder is ready. Its hard to say for sure because they don’t all follow the same schedule.


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## Jodie (Jun 23, 2020)

Thank you Taz! I’m honoured to be a part of the Loony Lady Gang haha!
@elizabeth.conder your girl was a maiden wasn’t she? Did you have a similar experience with her udder development?


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## elizabeth.conder (Jun 23, 2020)

Jodie said:


> Thank you Taz! I’m honoured to be a part of the Loony Lady Gang haha!
> @elizabeth.conder your girl was a maiden wasn’t she? Did you have a similar experience with her udder development?


Yes one was a maiden this year and one was not a maiden. I can add a picture before and after her first udder development if you’d like? I can either post them on your thread or message them to you?


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## Jodie (Jun 23, 2020)

elizabeth.conder said:


> Yes one was a maiden this year and one was not a maiden. I can add a picture before and after her first udder development if you’d like? I can either post them on your thread or message them to you?


That would be wonderful, thank you! Like I said, I know she has a very long way to go yet, but being that this is my first foal and that my horses are all my babies, I worry and notice the slightest little things. I thought my human children were going to be the ones to give me grey hairs, but it’s looking more like my 4 legged children will be the ones who age me


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## elizabeth.conder (Jun 23, 2020)

Hahaha I totally get it! It’s such a long wait!


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## elizabeth.conder (Jun 23, 2020)

Okay here’s one before and after the first development. From the first sign of swelling it was 7 weeks till she foaled. She was pretty good about following all the rules.
Looking at your mare it is possible that she is getting ready to start filling. In a couple of days it should be more obvious if so.


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## elizabeth.conder (Jun 23, 2020)

Taz, these are the angles I’m talking about.

these were about midnight and she foaled at 5:15 am


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 24, 2020)

Jodie said:


> I suppose I should have added some pictures to try and show what I’m meaning (though of course it’s hard to get pictures to show exactly what I’m seeing in real life  ) I know she has a long way to go yet, but I’m just wondering if this a normal part of the process. I thought the bag was supposed to fill, not get saggy lol





Jodie said:


> I suppose I should have added some pictures to try and show what I’m meaning (though of course it’s hard to get pictures to show exactly what I’m seeing in real life  ) I know she has a long way to go yet, but I’m just wondering if this a normal part of the process. I thought the bag was supposed to fill, not get saggy lol


Jodi, your pictures of your girl look almost exactly like the ones I have taken of Snickers! They must have "due dates" around the same time (or maybe we just have to play the maybe/maybe not game like everyone else!)


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## Jodie (Jun 24, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> Jodi, your pictures of your girl look almost exactly like the ones I have taken of Snickers! They must have "due dates" around the same time (or maybe we just have to play the maybe/maybe not game like everyone else!)


Pitter Patter, I agree they look very similar! Rosie was confirmed in foal by an external ultrasound back in March. My vet is very experienced with full sized horses but said that she’s not so good with mini pregnancies but gave a very rough guess of around June/July. I’m leaning more towards July given that we’re nearly through June lol so hopefully that gives you more of a potential idea of timeline, assuming they are indeed at the same stage!


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 24, 2020)

Jodie said:


> Pitter Patter, I agree they look very similar! Rosie was confirmed in foal by an external ultrasound back in March. My vet is very experienced with full sized horses but said that she’s not so good with mini pregnancies but gave a very rough guess of around June/July. I’m leaning more towards July given that we’re nearly through June lol so hopefully that gives you more of a potential idea of timeline, assuming they are indeed at the same stage!


Yay! Nice to know we are in the same boat! Keep us posted on Rosie's progress!


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## Kristin (Jun 25, 2020)

Hi ladies.... Im jumping in on this thread so I can follow along and see how you & your girls are doing!!


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## Taz (Jun 25, 2020)

Kristin said:


> Hi ladies.... Im jumping in on this thread so I can follow along and see how you & your girls are doing!!


Yes, please do! We would love pictures and updates on your little guy too  Have you named him yet?


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## Taz (Jun 25, 2020)

I'm calling this Tilly's 13 week  update. Her udder hasn't gone back up since Mon night. This is what I call her 1/2 udder and where she likes to hang out most of the time with going down a bit now and then and up a bit now and then with it being BIG on Mon(?). No pattern to when she goes up and down. I think I can see a change in her vulva from the last pics(redder), anyone else think so? Her belly looks the same to me, I didn't take any pics of that. I haven't seen as much movement for a week or so but what I saw a few nights ago was all in her flank not lower like usual. I really don't know if she's going to give me much warning, she's got to be getting close doesn't she?


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## Taz (Jun 25, 2020)

Ooops, forgot the pictures, it's been about 7 weeks of waking up every hour 



Thank you elizabeth.conder, I'll be taking pictures from behind from now on, SO much easier than being on my knees under her and it shows much better , I don't know why I didn't clue in to that before.


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## Jodie (Jun 25, 2020)

Jeez, Tilly! It’s time to let us all see that baby you’ve been hiding, and for Taz to get a full nights sleep!


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## MerMaeve (Jun 25, 2020)

Oh jeepers creepers! I feel for you, Taz!


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 26, 2020)

I would think so! She seemed closer than Snickers quite a while ago! Oh Dear! Hang in there! Like you said, she can't do this forever!


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## Holly Chisholm (Jun 26, 2020)

Are those udders seen from the back, and is that a dark pink I see in the first picture??? Looking good to me!!! Any drop of milk to test yet?


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## Taz (Jun 26, 2020)

Yes that's her udder from the back, I think that's dark pink in the first picture . Not a drop of milk to be found, I would really like to test some for a better idea of what's going on. Her udder was a little fuller this morning and hard, we'll see how long that lasts but that's twice this week. Maybe she'll have a June baby? 
Did you hear back from your vet? Just being nosey


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## Holly Chisholm (Jun 26, 2020)

I could never get a drop out of Sally, but Rob could. Have you tried the warm wash cloth hack?


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## Taz (Jun 26, 2020)

I tried that last week and it didn't work but I'll be trying it again, can't hurt...


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## MerMaeve (Jun 26, 2020)

Oh yeah, I had a dream last night that Squirt had her baby......in our living room....under one of our desks!  It was a colt that was a Silver Bay Dapple.


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## Taz (Jun 26, 2020)

MerMaeve said:


> Oh yeah, I had a dream last night that Squirt had her baby......in our living room....under one of our desks!  It was a colt that was a Silver Bay Dapple.


  I've been having dreams like that too, well not your living room under a desk. Can't wait to see what Squirt has!!


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## MerMaeve (Jun 26, 2020)

LOL I know, I can't wait either! I feel bad for her because a month ago she looked dropped......And it's going to be 90 for the next few days.  I wish there was a coat color predictor, combining the mom and dad's colors.


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## MerMaeve (Jun 26, 2020)

OH, there is!!!! 
Here's Squirt's foal's chances:

*Offspring Color Probability*


35.16% -​*Silver Buckskin*35.16% -​*Buckskin*11.72% -​*Silver Smoky Black*11.72% -​*Smoky Black*6.25% -​*Palomino*


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## Taz (Jun 26, 2020)

There is, color calculator, look it up it's great fun!!


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## Taz (Jun 26, 2020)

Taz said:


> There is, color calculator, look it up it's great fun!!


Never mind, you just found it. Going to be a great foal!!


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## Taz (Jun 26, 2020)

Ok, she lost the extra udder today, what else is new, but she's softest she's been around her tail head maybe soon......


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## Taz (Jun 27, 2020)

I'm going out on a limb and saying I think Tilly is going to foal sometime in the next week. He udder was hard again this morning, vulva is still dark pink(looks it more to me in person than the picture) and she has serious jello butt. Not a drop of milk to test but she wasn't happy about me trying so I left that alone. I could be jinxing it of course, wait and see as usual but I'll be keeping a closer eye on her now.




What's going on with everyone else???????


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## Jodie (Jun 27, 2020)

Obviously I’m far from an expert but she looks a whole lot like a lot of pictures of mares I’ve seen right before foaling so !!!
Nothing really new with Rosie Pudding, she just seems to be getting larger by the day and the edema in front of her teats feels bigger too. My mum is coming out here from England in August, so who knows, maybe she will foal while she’s here!


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 27, 2020)

Oh Taz! Looks so close! Color Calculator? I will have to look that up! So I have a a color question...my little stallion is a reddish brown color with two white socks, a few white blazes on his body, black mane and tail, and a dark stripe down his spine. Is this a bay or bay dun? UGH. Not really sure.


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 27, 2020)

Taz, did I say this before? But Tilley and Snickers look a lot alike!Too funny-they could be sisters. LOL


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## Taz (Jun 27, 2020)

Udder is still there tonight, vulva a bit droopier, tail head sticking out a little bit    



Pitter Patter said:


> Oh Taz! Looks so close! Color Calculator? I will have to look that up! So I have a a color question...my little stallion is a reddish brown color with two white socks, a few white blazes on his body, black mane and tail, and a dark stripe down his spine. Is this a bay or bay dun? UGH. Not really sure.


I started a thread 'colours and changes' that I was hoping people would post babies before and after fuzz, colour questions and pictures with what colour they are so 'we' could figure some of it out. No ones putting much up but put his picture up and see what responses you get. I thought I knew colours before mini's, haha. I thought he was bay pinto when I saw his picture but the dorsal stripe could be bay dun pinto? Yes, our girls look a lot alike


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## MerMaeve (Jun 27, 2020)

Good luck Tilly! Hoping it won't be long now.


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## elizabeth.conder (Jun 27, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> Oh Taz! Looks so close! Color Calculator? I will have to look that up! So I have a a color question...my little stallion is a reddish brown color with two white socks, a few white blazes on his body, black mane and tail, and a dark stripe down his spine. Is this a bay or bay dun? UGH. Not really sure.



I’d like to see a picture of your stallion. I’m not an expert with colors but I’ve learned a lot in the last several years.


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## elizabeth.conder (Jun 27, 2020)

Taz said:


> I'm going out on a limb and saying I think Tilly is going to foal sometime in the next week. He udder was hard again this morning, vulva is still dark pink(looks it more to me in person than the picture) and she has serious jello butt. Not a drop of milk to test but she wasn't happy about me trying so I left that alone. I could be jinxing it of course, wait and see as usual but I'll be keeping a closer eye on her now.
> View attachment 41746
> View attachment 41747
> 
> ...



Definitely getting there. Still has some filling to do. But she’s definitely getting closer. And not all mares will fill completely before foaling. Does the udder still grow and shrink throughout the day? I’m sure you’ve said it somewhere but I can’t find it at the moment. Do you have a estimated breeding date?


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## Taz (Jun 28, 2020)

elizabeth.conder said:


> Definitely getting there. Still has some filling to do. But she’s definitely getting closer. And not all mares will fill completely before foaling. Does the udder still grow and shrink throughout the day? I’m sure you’ve said it somewhere but I can’t find it at the moment. Do you have a estimated breeding date?


Her udder grows and shrinks but will stay for days or hours before changing. No idea on a breed date, I was told on her foal heat last year, last years foal was May 12, so not then.
She wasn't a happy camper last night. Breathing hard all night, constantly swishing and fussing at her belly, laying down a lot with a bit of rolling.
I have her foal dates the last two years. 2018 June 21, 2019 May 12. So I'm assuming but that would mean she bred on her 30 day heat in 2018? I think that puts her at foaling about 2 weeks before her breed date for 2019? From that date I think she would have been bred week of June 9-16 and July 1-7. IF it was July and she follows the same timing I think that means she'll be foaling anytime. If anyone can check my math that would be great, the old brains not working very well right now, when it's working at all. Then again it could be she was bred in Aug and won't be foaling till July.


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## Kristin (Jun 28, 2020)

MerMaeve said:


> LOL I know, I can't wait either! I feel bad for her because a month ago she looked dropped......And it's going to be 90 for the next few days.  I wish there was a coat color predictor, combining the mom and dad's colors.


It has been 108-111 here since the day before Trixie's little guy was born.... Miserable!! Hopefully she holds out for a bit cooler temps!


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## Holly Chisholm (Jun 28, 2020)

Taz said:


> Her udder grows and shrinks but will stay for days or hours before changing. No idea on a breed date, I was told on her foal heat last year, last years foal was May 12, so not then.
> She wasn't a happy camper last night. Breathing hard all night, constantly swishing and fussing at her belly, laying down a lot with a bit of rolling.
> I have her foal dates the last two years. 2018 June 21, 2019 May 12. So I'm assuming but that would mean she bred on her 30 day heat in 2018? I think that puts her at foaling about 2 weeks before her breed date for 2019? From that date I think she would have been bred week of June 9-16 and July 1-7. IF, and that's a big if this morning it was July and she follows the same timing I think that means she'll be foaling anytime. If anyone can check my math that would be great, the old brains not working very well right now. Then again it could be she was bred in Aug and won't be foaling till July.



Oh, Sally was acting like that the week she foaled, with plenty of butt rubbing. SOOOOOOOOON!!!!!


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 28, 2020)

Taz--any good news yet?


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## Taz (Jun 28, 2020)

Nothing. She's wandering around in the paddock grazing, not a care in the world .
Everything was still looking good this morning, I'll see how she looks at 6 when she comes in


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## Taz (Jun 28, 2020)

Her udder is softer tonight, I don't think she can get any jigglier in her back end, softer around her tail head, sinking a bit. She wasn't breathing hard this afternoon but is again tonight. I'll let you know......


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## MerMaeve (Jun 28, 2020)

Let's hope it's very soon!


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## Taz (Jun 29, 2020)

No foal. Last night was basically a repeat of the night before. Less tail swishing and fussing at her belly but her tail was up or up and to the side a lot. Laying down but not sleeping and some rolling. She hasn't been butt rubbing at all but was doing a bit of backing up into the wall hard. Lots of heavy breathing. I'll see what she looks like as soon as I can get going.


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## Holly Chisholm (Jun 29, 2020)

Sounds CLOSE!!!!!


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## Taz (Jun 29, 2020)

We'll see if I'm right and she foals this week, I don't think she can go much more than two weeks. She looks so close to me, not quite textbook but nothing has been yet with her. Or I could be completely wrong and she'll hold on for another month


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## elizabeth.conder (Jun 29, 2020)

Do you have any more pictures for us?


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## Kristin (Jun 29, 2020)

Sounds close Taz!!


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## Taz (Jun 29, 2020)

Here are pictures from tonight. Not lined up, haha, even I can see that  . Her vulva looks darker in person, don't know if it's my eyes or the flash. Still soft and jiggly. Looks the same to me...
I got a response from someone who had her a few years ago and apparently she goes for about 12 months, is hard to predict and got worse as she got older. I'm now going with she'll foal when she foals and I'm never going to sleep again .


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## Taz (Jun 29, 2020)

Oh, and I have only seen foal movement once in the last two weeks so that's been added to my list of things to worry about even though I know it's not uncommon in the last couple weeks.


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 29, 2020)

No baby YET?!


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## Taz (Jun 29, 2020)

Not yet, I'll post ASAP when she does, I think it's worse for everyone else waiting to hear. Keep your fingers crossed!


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 29, 2020)

elizabeth.conder...Here is a picture of my little stallion "Busy Man's Electric Volt" or just Volt. He has a dark line all the way down his spine that doesn't show here.


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 29, 2020)

Here is tonight's picture of Pepper, who may or may not be pregnant from either this past summer or very recent with my guy above. Anyone have any thoughts. She has had some minor edema in front of teets. Seems to have gone down today though. I think she looks pretty even on the sides here?


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## elizabeth.conder (Jun 29, 2020)

Taz said:


> Here are pictures from tonight. Not lined up, haha, even I can see that  . Her vulva looks darker in person, don't know if it's my eyes or the flash. Still soft and jiggly. Looks the same to me...
> I got a response from someone who had her a few years ago and apparently she goes for about 12 months, is hard to predict and got worse as she got older. I'm now going with she'll foal when she foals and I'm never going to sleep again .
> View attachment 41772
> View attachment 41773
> ...



Udder is definitely looking better. They can change so fast. Do you have her on camera? My cameras saved me lol! I had a mare that’d lost her last 2 foals before I got her so I didn’t feel like I could sleep at all! But you are doing so good watching her so carefully!!!


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## elizabeth.conder (Jun 29, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> elizabeth.conder...Here is a picture of my little stallion "Busy Man's Electric Volt" or just Volt. He has a dark line all the way down his spine that doesn't show here. View attachment 41776



He’s definitely a bay. I bet he has nd1 which is causing the dorsal. Dun will be more diluted. Interesting white pattern through!


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## Taz (Jun 30, 2020)

Yes, she's on camera. I'm waking up every hour to check her but it's getting hard to stay awake very long to watch when I do, really hope I don't miss anything. I know she's very experienced and knows what she's doing but I worry with her being 21.
Quiet night, no foal, sigh.


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## Taz (Jun 30, 2020)

elizabeth.conder said:


> Udder is definitely looking better. They can change so fast. Do you have her on camera? My cameras saved me lol! I had a mare that’d lost her last 2 foals before I got her so I didn’t feel like I could sleep at all! But you are doing so good watching her so carefully!!!



That's right, she had a BIG colt. How's he doing? Any new pictures?

Tilly has a big hard udder this morning with some fill in her nipples. I forgot my camera as usual of course. She has a lot of hay left over from last night, she's normally a hoover, and is quiet.


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 30, 2020)

Any time now Taz!! So excited for you!!!


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 30, 2020)

elizabeth.conder said:


> He’s definitely a bay. I bet he has nd1 which is causing the dorsal. Dun will be more diluted. Interesting white pattern through!


Totally naive here. What is nd1? If he has or does breed with Pepper (picture previous post just a few before this one) what color combinations do you think they might produce?


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## Taz (Jun 30, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> Totally naive here. What is nd1? If he has or does breed with Pepper (picture previous post just a few before this one) what color combinations do you think they might produce?



You can do genetic testing on them to know what they really are and then figure out what they could have. Pull some mane or tail hair and send them in. It's about $100 each depending where you go and want. I'm thinking about doing it for fun with Izzy if she turns out to be in foal. Without that I think you could have anything but appy or any of the dilute? Plug them into the colour calculator it's lots of fun!


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## elizabeth.conder (Jun 30, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> Totally naive here. What is nd1? If he has or does breed with Pepper (picture previous post just a few before this one) what color combinations do you think they might produce?



no problem! Nd1 is a gene that causesfalse primitives. It stands for non dun. So you can get the dorsal stripe and barring etc. but it is not technically dun. Dun is a dilution gene so if you look up a bay dun you’ll notice how much lighter colored they are. Same with a red dun or grullo (black dun).

To know what you could get if you bred your mare to your stallion you would have to know the genetic make up like Taz suggested. Your mare looks black. So you could get any of the three base colors with or without the white pattern your stallion has. Does your stallion have any white on his face? I see tobiano but not sure on other patterns. If your stallion has nd1 that can be passed down too.


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## Taz (Jun 30, 2020)

Her udder is still big and hard tonight, holding her tail higher, everything else is the same.


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 30, 2020)

He does have a very tiny bit of white on his chin and either side of his mouth, kind of like a bit of a beard pattern..LOL. But very little. Isn't Tobiano black and white? That's all I've seen it referred to. I feel like I don't understand enough to use use the color calculator yet as I am unsure of the correct terms for the colors...Also is the color of the stallion a desirable one for breeding or not, what do you think? I am on the fence about gelding him. His behavior is great and he is 5 yrs old.


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 30, 2020)

Oh my goodness Taz! I wonder if she'll go tonight for you?!!! I guess she has to "bake" the little one just so....! I've given up on Snickers for now. She has hardly any signs other than belly and some edema. She sure is taking her time too, but isn't nearly as far as your girl!


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## Taz (Jun 30, 2020)

Haha, as soon as you stop watching is normally when they have them.
It would be wonderful if she'd foal tonight but anytime SOON will do .
Use the colour calculator and put your guy in as Bay tobiano unknown red, your mare as solid black unknown red. That's about as good as you can guess without a genetic workup.
I have no idea how much interest you would have for your stud from people. A friend of mine looked into it a few years ago with a stud she was thinking of buying, she was told it was average for 10 mares a year and he was a good hunter stud. Remember if you want to get into it you will have the mares coming to you and you have to deal with where to keep them, insurance, health issues for anything they could bring. My friend wanted to keep the stud here and have me do the breeding, it didn't happen for the above reasons . Not trying to be negative, I thought sure why not till I looked into it. I get being on the fence about gelding especially when they have a good temperament. I only decided to geld mine so he could stay with his best friend and I still might be having another foal from him anyway . There's no rush, you'll figure out what you want to do. Oh, all pinto's can be any colour with white


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## elizabeth.conder (Jun 30, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> He does have a very tiny bit of white on his chin and either side of his mouth, kind of like a bit of a beard pattern..LOL. But very little. Isn't Tobiano black and white? That's all I've seen it referred to. I feel like I don't understand enough to use use the color calculator yet as I am unsure of the correct terms for the colors...Also is the color of the stallion a desirable one for breeding or not, what do you think? I am on the fence about gelding him. His behavior is great and he is 5 yrs old.



tobiano is the white pattern but it can be on any color. If he white on his chin I would definitely test him for LWO before breeding to another pinto. A lot of people like white patterns. Not knowing much about him makes it hard to say.


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## elizabeth.conder (Jun 30, 2020)

Taz said:


> Her udder is still big and hard tonight, holding her tail higher, everything else is the same.



Still no milk to test? She’s confusing for sure. She should be “due” anytime. Udder is getting closer. I’m kinda surprised there is no milk since she’s not a maiden. They sure like to drive us crazy!


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## Taz (Jun 30, 2020)

elizabeth.conder said:


> Still no milk to test? She’s confusing for sure. She should be “due” anytime. Udder is getting closer. I’m kinda surprised there is no milk since she’s not a maiden. They sure like to drive us crazy!


Still no milk, I keep trying.... She is definitely driving me crazy. 'Due' anytime works for me


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## elizabeth.conder (Jun 30, 2020)

Taz said:


> Still no milk, I keep trying.... She is definitely driving me crazy. 'Due' anytime works for me



I wish horses had real due dates like dogs or cats. Would make the wait much easier. Here’s an interesting test you can try. When you take a picture of her udder or whatever, reach under her belly. Usually if they are within a couple days of foaling, they’ll lift their belly’s with a bit of a touch like in front of their udder. When they are super close you won’t even have to touch her belly to see it lift.


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## Pitter Patter (Jun 30, 2020)

Taz said:


> Haha, as soon as you stop watching is normally when they have them.
> It would be wonderful if she'd foal tonight but anytime SOON will do .
> Use the colour calculator and put your guy in as Bay tobiano unknown red, your mare as solid black unknown red. That's about as good as you can guess without a genetic workup.
> I have no idea how much interest you would have for your stud from people. A friend of mine looked into it a few years ago with a stud she was thinking of buying, she was told it was average for 10 mates a year and he was a good hunter stud. Remember if you want to get into it you will have the mares coming to you and you have to deal with where to keep them, insurance, health issues for anything they could bring. My friend wanted to keep the stud here and have me do the breeding, it didn't happen for the above reasons . Not trying to be negative, I thought sure why not till I looked into it. I get being on the fence about gelding especially when they have a good temperament. I only decided to geld mine so he could stay with his best friend and I still might be having another foal from him anyway . There's no rush, you'll figure out what you want to do.


Thanks Taz! I was just thinking of maybe keeping him intact for a little while and then eventually getting him gelded. He's sweet, and funny. Don't know about his confirmation or anything. Not doing it as a regular thing, but if anyone I knew wanted him to breed with their mare I would do that first, along with any of my own I would like to breed with him, which I'm not sure I will necessarily be doing purposefully. I'm really not looking to add to the population of minis. I see there are so many who are given up, sold at auctions, etc. If he can be used to improve any breeding stock though, that's great. If he has no desirable traits, I'd just get him gelded. They are my pets, they bring me peace (except when waiting on a foal!), fun, and love and I hope to keep them as my forever babies. Also, a question....why do the mares come to the stud? Are mares territorial with the stallions in their space? It's common in many species so I guess it would be a possibility.


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## Taz (Jul 1, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> Thanks Taz! I was just thinking of maybe keeping him intact for a little while and then eventually getting him gelded. He's sweet, and funny. Don't know about his confirmation or anything. Not doing it as a regular thing, but if anyone I knew wanted him to breed with their mare I would do that first, along with any of my own I would like to breed with him, which I'm not sure I will necessarily be doing purposefully. I'm really not looking to add to the population of minis. I see there are so many who are given up, sold at auctions, etc. If he can be used to improve any breeding stock though, that's great. If he has no desirable traits, I'd just get him gelded. They are my pets, they bring me peace (except when waiting on a foal!), fun, and love and I hope to keep them as my forever babies. Also, a question....why do the mares come to the stud? Are mares territorial with the stallions in their space? It's common in many species so I guess it would be a possibility.


That's exactly the way I think. 
The mares always go to the stud, I have no idea why it's just the way it's done. As far as I know mares are not territorial at all about the boys, it's the other way around.
Even though you've given up on Snickers I'm still waiting on updates whenever you want


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## Taz (Jul 1, 2020)

elizabeth.conder said:


> I wish horses had real due dates like dogs or cats. Would make the wait much easier. Here’s an interesting test you can try. When you take a picture of her udder or whatever, reach under her belly. Usually if they are within a couple days of foaling, they’ll lift their belly’s with a bit of a touch like in front of their udder. When they are super close you won’t even have to touch her belly to see it lift.


I'll try it this morning, cool!

Quiet night, no baby.

Can a tobiano carry LWO? It's been bothering me and I can't find an answer. Also, do you know if a pintaloosa has equal chance of throwing pinto, appy and pintaloosa?


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## Taz (Jul 1, 2020)

Her udder this morning. Didn't lift her belly for me, does that mean it's safe to sleep tonight?  I'll keep trying it and see if it predicts anything with her.


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## Holly Chisholm (Jul 1, 2020)

I never was able to get milk out of Sally, but Rob did. He said to squeeze the milk from the top of the udder. Squeeze it downward like the bottom of a funnel. As you're squeezing and messaging it down, work the nipple. He said like you're squeezing a lemon to get juice.


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 1, 2020)

Taz said:


> I'll try it this morning, cool!
> 
> Quiet night, no baby.
> 
> Can a tobiano carry LWO? It's been bothering me and I can't find an answer. Also, do you know if a pintaloosa has equal chance of throwing pinto, appy and pintaloosa?





Taz said:


> Her udder this morning. Didn't lift her belly for me, does that mean it's safe to sleep tonight?  I'll keep trying it and see if it predicts anything with her. View attachment 41781




That udder is looking much better. I think it still has some filling to do but that can happen quickly. I would still watch her closely. Not all mares will do the belly lift but it is helpful when they do.


Yes, LWO can express on any color even with tobiano or another white pattern. Sometimes solids can even carry LWO without it being visible at all.

a pintaloosa has the same percentage to throw an appy or a pinto as well as a solid if it is heterozygous. It has less of a chance to throw another pintaloosa because it requires 2 genes. However it is still possible.


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## Taz (Jul 1, 2020)

Holly Chisholm said:


> I never was able to get milk out of Sally, but Rob did. He said to squeeze the milk from the top of the udder. Squeeze it downward like the bottom of a funnel. As you're squeezing and messaging it down, work the nipple. He said like you're squeezing a lemon to get juice.


I'll give it a try, thanks  


elizabeth.conder said:


> That udder is looking much better. I think it still has some filling to do but that can happen quickly. I would still watch her closely. Not all mares will do the belly lift but it is helpful when they do.
> 
> 
> Yes, LWO can express on any color even with tobiano or another white pattern. Sometimes solids can even carry LWO without it being visible at all.
> ...


Sounds good, no sleep yet .
That's what I was afraid of, I'll keep worrying about it till I see a little one with some colour. Both pinto parents, I don't know if they are carriers or not.


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## Taz (Jul 1, 2020)

Ugh! I was just told she has been known to have changes then foal in a couple of hours. She's all over the place, nothing consistent from foal to foal that I'm getting.


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 1, 2020)

Taz said:


> Ugh! I was just told she has been known to have changes then foal in a couple of hours. She's all over the place, nothing consistent from foal to foal that I'm getting.




Don’t you love those?!? I wouldn’t be worrying over lwo right now. Looking at your mare I don’t see anything that says she carry’s it. Obviously you can know without testing but she looks like a textbook tobiano.


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 1, 2020)

elizabeth.conder said:


> tobiano is the white pattern but it can be on any color. If he white on his chin I would definitely test him for LWO before breeding to another pinto. A lot of people like white patterns. Not knowing much about him makes it hard to say.


Yikes, thanks!


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## Holly Chisholm (Jul 1, 2020)

I wouldn't worry at all about LWO. That only happens in Overos. Yours are Tobianos. I think.


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 1, 2020)

Holly Chisholm said:


> I wouldn't worry at all about LWO. That only happens in Overos. Yours are Tobianos. I think.



Yes it is an overo pattern. But white patterns can all express together. That’s what gives you a tovero (tobiano + overo). I agree theirs do not seem to have it, but if I was standing a pinto stallion, I’d want to test for LWO.


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## Taz (Jul 1, 2020)

I'm just going to keep that on my list of things to worry about at 2am. along with Tilly rupturing because of her age, the foal not moving right now, a red bag that I don't get out in time and a foal I can't straighten up. Lets not forget sleeping through it and having a healthy foal that can't get out of the sack. I would never make it as a breeder


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 1, 2020)

Taz said:


> I'm just going to keep that on my list of things to worry about at 2am. along with Tilly rupturing because of her age, the foal not moving right now, a red bag that I don't get out in time and a foal I can't straighten up. Lets not forget sleeping through it and having a healthy foal that can't get out of the sack. I would never make it as a breeder



It’s okay! Y’all will both do great! I would honestly not worry about LWO with her. She looks textbook tobiano. I don’t see any hint of any other pattern. Your mare looks quite healthy so I think she should be fine foaling. Oh and don’t worry about the foal not moving. If there was a problem there would be many other signs you couldn’t miss. The mare I bought in foal this year was 2 weeks before foaling, and I never saw or felt much if any movement. The foal is so big at this point there just is not much room. I don’t know what kind of camera you have but is there a way for you to get help watching so that you can sleep some?


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## Taz (Jul 1, 2020)

I really don't know how you all do it year after year with more than one. My camera is just CCTV. I have it run up to my mother's bedroom now so that hopefully if I'm asleep she'll see something and she's now watching so I can get a nap when possible, I'm surviving just whining . The LWO is the least of my worries, she has a white chin which I have always thought of as overo. These two have had many babies and no problems with any of them as far as I know. I'm just a worrier


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 1, 2020)

Taz said:


> I really don't know how you all do it year after year with more than one. My camera is just CCTV. I have it run up to my mother's bedroom now so that hopefully if I'm asleep she'll see something and she's now watching so I can get a nap when possible, I'm surviving just whining . The LWO is the least of my worries, she has a white chin which I have always thought of as overo. These two have had many babies and no problems with any of them as far as I know. I'm just a worrier



Hahahaha I get it! I am a worrier too!


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 1, 2020)

Taz said:


> I'm just going to keep that on my list of things to worry about at 2am. along with Tilly rupturing because of her age, the foal not moving right now, a red bag that I don't get out in time and a foal I can't straighten up. Lets not forget sleeping through it and having a healthy foal that can't get out of the sack. I would never make it as a breeder


Me either. Snickers isn't nearly as ready as Tilly. She looks so ready, I'm a little surprised her belly didn't just explode (and don't worry about that too--never heard of that happening!LOL). I'm worried too. No fancy set up and now it's super hot here, don't know about where you are in Canada but if it follows Northern Michigan, US you are probably suffering too--but hopefully not! Baby will be here soon!!


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## Taz (Jul 1, 2020)

Yes, it's hot here right now. She doesn't seem to be bothered by it though  . I was hoping it would move things along but it doesn't seem to be working that way.
I don't know how she hasn't had it yet, I don't think her belly can get any bigger. She's having problems getting her stifles bent enough with the belly in the way and is dragging her back toes on the ground. Poor girl must be very uncomfortable.
I tried the squeeze a lemon and got a drop of colostrum? Clear, thin and sticky. Couldn't get anything else so no testing but at least it was something finally.
MerMaeve, have you heard anything on how Squirt is doing?


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## MerMaeve (Jul 1, 2020)

Nope, nothing from Squirt.  I feel so bad for her! This week is in the low 90's.....I feel so bad for her!


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 1, 2020)

Taz said:


> Yes, it's hot here right now. She doesn't seem to be bothered by it though  . I was hoping it would move things along but it doesn't seem to be working that way.
> I don't know how she hasn't had it yet, I don't think her belly can get any bigger. She's having problems getting her stifles bent enough with the belly in the way and is dragging her back toes on the ground. Poor girl must be very uncomfortable.
> I tried the squeeze a lemon and got a drop of colostrum? Clear, thin and sticky. Couldn't get anything else so no testing but at least it was something finally.
> MerMaeve, have you heard anything on how Squirt is doing?



That’s awesome that you got sticky fluid! I’m sure you know it’ll get cloudy close. Just a tip for testing, make sure you don’t actually touch the fluid you test because it will change the ph.


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## Taz (Jul 1, 2020)

Poor Squirt and poor you. I'm sure she has some shade to get into and they're looking after her.



elizabeth.conder said:


> That’s awesome that you got sticky fluid! I’m sure you know it’ll get cloudy close. Just a tip for testing, make sure you don’t actually touch the fluid you test because it will change the ph.


Yes, it was in my hand so didn't even try to test, don't know if I should till it looks more like milk? I was thinking of wearing a glove when I try again tomorrow.


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## Holly Chisholm (Jul 1, 2020)

Rob would hold the test strip right up there under the nipple and would wipe the milk directly from the teat to the paper.


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 1, 2020)

Yes, it was in my hand so didn't even try to test, don't know if I should till it looks more like milk? I was thinking of wearing a glove when I try again tomorrow.
[/QUOTE]


it won’t hurt to start testing. At least gives us an idea. Some mares won’t get their milk milk in until right at or before foaling. But hopefully a ph will give an idea of how close she is. Might let you rest a bit easier.


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## Holly Chisholm (Jul 2, 2020)

Anything happen last night?


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## Taz (Jul 2, 2020)

Sorry, bit of a busy morning, no foal.
I think she's teasing me. I couldn't even get a drop this morning. Big hard udder still and her vulva is droopy drawers. Flat and relaxed all the way down. Ooh, just looked and she's standing in the shelter instead of grazing. Could be the heat, could be baby, I'll be watching and let you know.

False alarm just taking a break from the sun, back out grazing now


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 2, 2020)

Oh, she is keeping us on the edge of our seats!!!


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## MerMaeve (Jul 2, 2020)

Somebody needs to foal ASAP, this is ridiculous!!


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## Taz (Jul 2, 2020)

Everything looks the same tonight. I got a tiny bit and she's testing at 7. "Mare isn't ready yet and it could be days to weeks before foaling" . Not making me happy...... Lets hope it's days. I'll keep checking morning and night, maybe she'll make a fast change. I'm going to trust it enough and sleep for 2-3 hours first thing but I don't trust her to be 'normal' enough to go the whole night with longer between checks. It's been 14 weeks as of tomorrow, she is not 'normal' 
Thank you so much Holly for the test strips


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 2, 2020)

Taz said:


> Everything looks the same tonight. I got a tiny bit and she's testing at 7. "Mare isn't ready yet and it could be days to weeks before foaling" . Not making me happy...... Lets hope it's days. I'll keep checking morning and night, maybe she'll make a fast change. I'm going to trust it enough and sleep for 2-3 hours first thing but I don't trust her to be 'normal' enough to go the whole night with longer between checks. It's been 14 weeks as of tomorrow, she is not 'normal'
> Thank you so much Holly for the test strips



You are doing exactly what you need to be! Glad you can get some rest. But at 7.0 you know she is dropping. So you are in the home stretch. She may not quite be imminent, but she’s getting close to it.


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## Taz (Jul 3, 2020)

No baby, didn't expect one. Quiet night for both of us, I got some wonderful sleep. I'll let you know what she looks like in a bit.


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## Taz (Jul 3, 2020)

6.8 this morning!! "Mare is getting closer and could foal any day"
We're in the 90's here so I'm off to bring the last of my hay in before it gets too bad. Calling for thunderstorms this afternoon, the rain is badly needed. Foal watching and ice cream this afternoon (no A/C), maybe between the heat and storm she'll decide sooner is better


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## Jodie (Jul 3, 2020)

How exciting! I’m glad you managed to get some sleep last night. Come on baby, time to vacate!


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## Taz (Jul 3, 2020)

I'm hoping she hasn't talked to Trixie at all and it doesn't go up and down, I'll keep checking.


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## MerMaeve (Jul 3, 2020)

I texted Squirt's owner and asked if Squirt's had her baby yet..(she said she'd let us know but I wanted to make sure she didn't forget to tell us)....She replied "Nothing yet. Maybe she is just fat"


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## Kristin (Jul 3, 2020)

Taz said:


> I'm hoping she hasn't talked to Trixie at all and it doesn't go up and down, I'll keep checking.



Hopefully not!!
Sounds like she is getting close! Fingers crosses you can get off the "crazy train" soon!!


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## Kristin (Jul 3, 2020)

Here's something to brighten your day!
He still doesn't have a name! Any suggestions?
Im thinking something along the line of Simon, Walter, or Theodore (a nerdy name....no offense to anyone)....


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## MerMaeve (Jul 3, 2020)

Aww!! What a cutie! I think Theodore fits him nicely. Teddy for a nickname?


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## Taz (Jul 3, 2020)

Such a cutie! I agree with Theodore/Teddy. Norman? Stanley?I'm awful with names, although I do have a couple picked out if they fit for Tilly's foal that is NEVER going to be born. I'm trying to laugh but it's just not working yet, she is at it again. Vulva has tightened up some and wait for it......she tested at 7.6/7.8 tonight. I know it's not a false pregnancy, lots of foal movement. "Crazy train" is right.  Maybe she's waiting for Snickers and Rosie?


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## Jodie (Jul 3, 2020)

MerMaeve said:


> I texted Squirt's owner and asked if Squirt's had her baby yet..(she said she'd let us know but I wanted to make sure she didn't forget to tell us)....She replied "Nothing yet. Maybe she is just fat"


I’m honestly starting to think maybe Rosie is just fat


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## Jodie (Jul 3, 2020)

Kristin said:


> Here's something to brighten your day!
> He still doesn't have a name! Any suggestions?
> Im thinking something along the line of Simon, Walter, or Theodore (a nerdy name....no offense to anyone)....


I’m another vote for Theodore/Ted/Teddy! He’s an absolute darling!


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 3, 2020)

Jodie said:


> I’m another vote for Theodore/Ted/Teddy! He’s an absolute darling!


I love Teddy!


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 3, 2020)

Taz said:


> Such a cutie! I agree with Theodore/Teddy. Norman? Stanley?I'm awful with names, although I do have a couple picked out if they fit for Tilly's foal that is NEVER going to be born. I'm trying to laugh but it's just not working yet, she is at it again. Vulva has tightened up some and wait for it......she tested at 7.6/7.8 tonight. I know it's not a false pregnancy, lots of foal movement. "Crazy train" is right.  Maybe she's waiting for Snickers and Rosie?




hahahaha you must be exhausted. I’ve heard of a lot of mares go up on ph right before foaling this year. Both of mine did this year. My maiden most dramatically. She tested 7.8 one day and over about 24 hrs dropped to 6.8. I thought for sure this was it. Next test though and she was at 7.8. I thought I was going to lose my mind. But over the next days she dropped all the way to 6.4 and foaled about exactly 24-30 hrs later, on day 345. I think you SHOULD be safe, but I wouldn’t get too relaxed lol. But you are doing a great job and I'm sure you know not to get relaxed hahaha.


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## Taz (Jul 4, 2020)

Not relaxing, no worries. No baby either, haha. I'll check her this morning and report back. I did remember hearing something about red bags not showing low when they foaled? See, not relaxed at all, still worrying about everything


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 4, 2020)

Taz said:


> Not relaxing, no worries. No baby either, haha. I'll check her this morning and report back. I did remember hearing something about red bags not showing low when they foaled? See, not relaxed at all, still worrying about everything


UGH! ANOTHER thing to worry about?! The way Snickers looks she'll have a red bag and won't have her's until we are all in our 90's!! I hope Tilly isn't waiting for the slow pokes!


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## Taz (Jul 4, 2020)

Don't worry PitterPatter, I was talking about the pH and not being clear, wasn't awake yet, sorry!


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## Taz (Jul 4, 2020)

Pictures from this morning. She's testing at 7.2 this morning. She's eating grass during the day with brakes(not normal) and picking at her hay the last two nights. The only other time I've seen her not hoover until everything is gone was when she looked in labour for 1 1/2 hours a couple (few?) weeks ago. Watching her closely.


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## Holly Chisholm (Jul 4, 2020)

Taz said:


> Pictures from this morning. She's testing at 7.2 this morning. She's eating grass during the day with brakes(not normal) and picking at her hay the last two nights. The only other time I've seen her not hoover until everything is gone was when she looked in labour for 1 1/2 hours a couple (few?) weeks ago. Watching her closely.View attachment 41790
> View attachment 41791
> View attachment 41792



Sally's udder didn't get that big before having Sterling!


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 4, 2020)

Taz said:


> Don't worry PitterPatter, I was talking about the pH and not being clear, wasn't awake yet, sorry!


I thought you meant when they carry high there's a bigger chance for red bag delivery?


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 4, 2020)

Taz said:


> Not relaxing, no worries. No baby either, haha. I'll check her this morning and report back. I did remember hearing something about red bags not showing low when they foaled? See, not relaxed at all, still worrying about everything



Hahahaha no I think you are doing great! I haven’t heard that about red bags. That’d be interesting (and helpful) if you could predict them. She’s looking good! And ph dropping sounds hopeful!


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## Jodie (Jul 4, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> I thought you meant when they carry high there's a bigger chance for red bag delivery?


From what I have read, the most common causes of red bag deliveries are placental infections, fescue toxicity and stress. Obviously I am no expert, (any of you experienced ladies please feel free to correct me if I’m wrong!) but I don’t think that would mean there’s a correlation between the way a mare carries and the chances of having a red bag delivery?


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## Taz (Jul 4, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> I thought you meant when they carry high there's a bigger chance for red bag delivery?


No, so sorry. How they carry has nothing to do with it. Something about the ph in their milk doesn't drop before foaling when they have an infection that causes a red bag. You don't need to worry.


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## Taz (Jul 4, 2020)

elizabeth.conder said:


> Hahahaha no I think you are doing great! I haven’t heard that about red bags. That’d be interesting (and helpful) if you could predict them. She’s looking good! And ph dropping sounds hopeful!


It was a comment in one of the videos from I Am ranch. They had a red bag and were talking about the mares milk hadn't tested low like another one they had that was also a red bag. I don't know if anyone has looked at a correlation but it would be great to get feedback about it from anyone with red bags who is testing ph. Anyone looking for foaling videos, these are the best!


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## Jodie (Jul 4, 2020)

Taz said:


> It was a comment in one of the videos from I Am farms. They had a red bag and were talking about the mares milk hadn't tested low like another one they had that was also a red bag. I don't know if anyone has looked at a corrolation(sp?) but it would be great to get feedback about it from anyone with red bags who is testing ph.


Absolutely it would be a very worthy study to conduct! While I’m sure that breeders are very vigilant anyway, I imagine it would help to be more mentally and physically prepared if you were able to determine the likelihood of a red bag happening.


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 4, 2020)

Taz said:


> It was a comment in one of the videos from I Am farms. They had a red bag and were talking about the mares milk hadn't tested low like another one they had that was also a red bag. I don't know if anyone has looked at a corrolation(sp?) but it would be great to get feedback about it from anyone with red bags who is testing ph.



I love I Am ranch. I don’t know there’s ever been a study done but that would be fascinating.


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## Jodie (Jul 4, 2020)

On a different topic, there has been absolutely zero change in Rosie. The more time goes on the more I think either a) the vet made a mistake  or b) a little funny business happened on the way to/at the auction when she was in with the mini stud lol
Another strange thing is happening though - my other rescue mare is growing in the udder department! Not sure if it is a similar thing my pintaloosa went through but I noticed when checking for ticks that she has edema in front of her teats and visible swelling in her udder. I didn’t get her preg checked when the vet was out as she was very thin when she was seized so I assumed she wouldn’t be in foal as I didn’t think her body would be able to support a pregnancy. Not saying I think she is in foal as I don’t believe she looks pregnant, but it’s something I will be keeping an eye on just in case. It just so happened that I had a picture of her udder back in April as I compared it to Roxy’s when she was going through her false pregnancy/sympathy symptoms/whatever it was, so it’s a good reference point of “then to now”. 
I’ll attach some pictures so you can see what I mean!


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## Taz (Jul 4, 2020)

Jodie said:


> On a different topic, there has been absolutely zero change in Rosie. The more time goes on the more I think either a) the vet made a mistake  or b) a little funny business happened on the way to/at the auction when she was in with the mini stud lol
> Another strange thing is happening though - my other rescue mare is growing in the udder department! Not sure if it is a similar thing my pintaloosa went through but I noticed when checking for ticks that she has edema in front of her teats and visible swelling in her udder. I didn’t get her preg checked when the vet was out as she was very thin when she was seized so I assumed she wouldn’t be in foal as I didn’t think her body would be able to support a pregnancy. Not saying I think she is in foal as I don’t believe she looks pregnant, but it’s something I will be keeping an eye on just in case. It just so happened that I had a picture of her udder back in April as I compared it to Roxy’s when she was going through her false pregnancy/sympathy symptoms/whatever it was, so it’s a good reference point of “then to now”.
> I’ll attach some pictures so you can see what I mean!
> [/QUOTE
> I know you've said this before but when did you get Rosie? I thought you had felt kicking? Any new pictures of her? Still could have been your father in laws 'gelding'. Is your other rescue a mini, those don't look like you're talking about your big bay mare? Any other pictures of her? Sorry, lots of questions, I think I really am loosing my mind right now, hoping it gets better after foaling


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## Taz (Jul 4, 2020)

And again I managed to put a reply inside a quote. Click the expand above please.


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## Jodie (Jul 4, 2020)

Lol no worries. I got Rosie on September 20th 2019. I thought I had felt kicking but I could definitely be mistaken. Yes those pictures are my big bay mare, Dora. Here are some pics of both girls taken today, and Rosie’s non existent udder (just swelling in front) from this morning  I don’t really know what vulva elongation/relaxation looks like so I’ve added a picture of Rosie’s back end for your thoughts.
ETA: I don’t know why the pictures of Rosie came up sideways or how to fix it!


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## Taz (Jul 4, 2020)

Dora is lovely! In her udder pics it looks like she's had a foal, I think, she could be getting some edema from the heat and not be developing an udder. I'd watch to be safe but not panic on that one. That's what I'm doing and thinking about the little one I did panic about a while ago. Not Izzy, she was supposed to be in season again this last week and didn't even bat her eyes once at the boy, I'll know in Dec or so when I can start feeling for kicks. 

Rosie, well......I think it looks like she is thinking about starting an udder, but I said that about her last pictures too. Doesn't look like she's elongating at all. Can you get a picture of her from behind? I'm going with she's in foal BUT what do I know. I'm pretty sure by Nov you'll know yes or no and about when she was bred.  How's her weight? I have a large mini /small pony gelding who is VERY fat(he came that way, I didn't do it) and he looked more pregnant than a lot of the mares here and even has a v even after loosing some weight.

This pregnant mare business is CRAZY!!!!!!

What does everyone else think??????


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## Jodie (Jul 4, 2020)

Thank you, she is an absolute darling. With everything she went through it amazes me what a beautiful soul she is and how she hasn’t given up on humans. I’ll attach a picture of what she looked like when she was seized. But yes I wonder if the heat had something to do with it, or even maybe she’s one that gets some swelling when she is coming into season, but absolutely I will keep an eye just to monitor things in case there are any significant changes that could indicate something being up with her (not meaning pregnancy as such, but other issues that could possibly present themselves down the line). That’s the thing with owning horses hey, you almost need to have them for a full year to figure out what their “normal” is.
I can get a picture of Rosie from behind when I do my evening check. I’m sure she has to be in foal given what the vet saw (I imagine a big black blob of fluid containing what appeared to be a head would have caused her some health issues by now ), but she likely has a ways to go - if she did in fact get bred around the time of the auction, or even by Barney after being gelded then she wouldn’t be due til around August. Hahaha well given that we live in Manitoba, I sure hope it doesn’t end up being a November baby, or Rosie and foal will be moving into my house! Ugh isn’t it just, major kudos to those who do this on a yearly basis!


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## Taz (Jul 4, 2020)

Poor girl, she looks like one I have, went through auction like that, people should be shot.
I thought you'd seen something on ultrasound. She might not even get an udder until she foals or just before. Some don't even show until just before. Welcome to crazy land, you could just find a foal 

Just to give you an idea, this is Izzy from 2 years ago. The second picture was about 3 weeks before she foaled, the first was what she looked like the night before the second was taken. They can fool you and change very fast. She also had an udder that looked about like Dora's now. It went up a bit at night, down through the day. A few days before foaling it doubled and didn't go down. She didn't have a real udder until after foaling and she is an experienced brood mare.


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## Taz (Jul 4, 2020)

Nothing to report tonight, I couldn't get even a tiny bit to test, everything looks the same. We'll see.


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## Jodie (Jul 4, 2020)

I agree, I don’t know what goes through some people’s heads when they’re cruel to animals.
I can’t believe the difference in those pictures!! That’s such a huge change from one day to the next!
Here’s a picture of Rosie from behind tonight. Of course I couldn’t get her to stand with her back legs square lol but it gives you an idea at least, though I feel she is bigger in real life than the picture shows (although not overly huge).


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## Kristin (Jul 4, 2020)

Jodie said:


> Thank you, she is an absolute darling. With everything she went through it amazes me what a beautiful soul she is and how she hasn’t given up on humans. I’ll attach a picture of what she looked like when she was seized. But yes I wonder if the heat had something to do with it, or even maybe she’s one that gets some swelling when she is coming into season, but absolutely I will keep an eye just to monitor things in case there are any significant changes that could indicate something being up with her (not meaning pregnancy as such, but other issues that could possibly present themselves down the line). That’s the thing with owning horses hey, you almost need to have them for a full year to figure out what their “normal” is.
> I can get a picture of Rosie from behind when I do my evening check. I’m sure she has to be in foal given what the vet saw (I imagine a big black blob of fluid containing what appeared to be a head would have caused her some health issues by now ), but she likely has a ways to go - if she did in fact get bred around the time of the auction, or even by Barney after being gelded then she wouldn’t be due til around August. Hahaha well given that we live in Manitoba, I sure hope it doesn’t end up being a November baby, or Rosie and foal will be moving into my house! Ugh isn’t it just, major kudos to those who do this on a yearly basis!


Poor Dora!! 
So glad you have her now and she looking amazing!!


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## Kristin (Jul 4, 2020)

Taz said:


> Pictures from this morning. She's testing at 7.2 this morning. She's eating grass during the day with brakes(not normal) and picking at her hay the last two nights. The only other time I've seen her not hoover until everything is gone was when she looked in labour for 1 1/2 hours a couple (few?) weeks ago. Watching her closely.View attachment 41790
> View attachment 41791
> View attachment 41792


She looks pretty close to me! Her vulva is more relaxed than Trixie's ever looked!


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## Taz (Jul 5, 2020)

Nothing last night.

Jodie, there's definitely a belly there


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## Taz (Jul 5, 2020)

She looks the same this morning. Couldn't get anything to test , watching her closely.


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## Taz (Jul 5, 2020)

Back to 6.8 tonight. I don't think any of her back end can get more relaxed. Her udder could fill in the nipples more but other than that I think it's pretty big. Watching and waiting......


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## Taz (Jul 6, 2020)

Nothing, I'll see if I can get anything to test this morning.


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## Jodie (Jul 6, 2020)

Ah Tilly! You’re sure good at keeping us all in suspense little one!


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## Taz (Jul 6, 2020)

Ph is at 8 this morning. What?????? I'm almost giving up on testing, it's adding stress


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## Jodie (Jul 6, 2020)

Taz said:


> Ph is at 8 this morning. What?????? I'm almost giving up on testing, it's adding stress


That’s crazy!! Aside from the ph, how is everything else looking?


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## Taz (Jul 6, 2020)

Her udder is hard and full, might not be completely full size yet but BIG. Her whole back end is jello jiggly, soft around her tail head too, vulva can't relax and droop any more than it is. I had my hand on her back end when she moved over last night and I can feel how loose her pelvis is. She's swishing her tail and breathing hard all the time but that's about it. She turns around the odd time to bite at her loins, up high not her flank. Still a very wide load.


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## Jodie (Jul 6, 2020)

Just read back in the thread and Elizabeth said her mare’s ph jumped then went low again days after, so hopefully Tilly does the same!


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## Taz (Jul 6, 2020)

Hopefully. It went up then down once already. If it can go from 6.8 to 8 overnight I would think it could go down very fast too, not trusting it, watching her closely.


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## Jodie (Jul 6, 2020)

Good idea. Especially with Tilly seeming to be about as far from textbook as they can get!


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## Taz (Jul 6, 2020)

It better be a sweet super cute filly after all of this


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## Jodie (Jul 6, 2020)

Oh baby will be beautiful, of that I have no doubt!


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## Taz (Jul 6, 2020)

All I really want is healthy baby and momma. I hate putting them through gelding and having to seperate out a colt if they don't drop in time. At least I already have two babysitters for a colt if needed.


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 6, 2020)

Come on Tilly...enough already! Everyone's awaiting your little one's arrival


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## Taz (Jul 6, 2020)

Maybe 7.6/7.8 tonight if I squint my eyes. No changes.  This can't go on much longer, can it?


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## MerMaeve (Jul 6, 2020)

Well, not to make it worse but........."The longest live foal delivery on record is 445 days!"


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## Taz (Jul 6, 2020)

Ugh!!!!!


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## Taz (Jul 7, 2020)

Nothing.........


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## Kristin (Jul 7, 2020)

Taz said:


> Ph is at 8 this morning. What?????? I'm almost giving up on testing, it's adding stress


I gave up on it... It was more stress!!


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## Kristin (Jul 7, 2020)

Hang in there Taz!!


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## Taz (Jul 7, 2020)

I couldn't get anything to test this morning. She's getting unhappy about how much I have to do to get a tiny bit, don't know if I'll keep going with it or not. I keep having dreams about dead babies.....I'm going to start checking her every 1/2 hour at night. During the day too of course since she had her last one in the afternoon.

Soon please Tilly, I'm begging, you're so close!


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## MerMaeve (Jul 7, 2020)

Aww, hang in there! Prayers for a healthy and happy baby and mama, and that she has it SOON!!


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## Taz (Jul 7, 2020)

Hanging in, doing better.


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## MerMaeve (Jul 7, 2020)

@Taz, do you have any idea when she was breed? Squirt was free run with the stallion until October I think they said so......It might be a while!


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## Taz (Jul 7, 2020)

I was told they think she caught on her foal heat which would have been around May 20. Oops, they got that wrong. She started getting an udder in early April so I was watching from then (would have been due mid April to mid May?). She was running with the stud until I gelded him a week after I got them, about 3 1/2 months ago. Haha, definitely happened last year though. The way she looks she has to be within days (PLEASE!!) but she has been so not normal everything's a guess. 

Oh poor you, you could be waiting till Sep.


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## Taz (Jul 7, 2020)

Does she look lower to anyone else? I saw her in the paddock today and wasn't sure if it was the angle. The pictures not the best but it's what I got. Still a very wide load. She didn't want me squeezing the lemon tonight, I don't blame her she must be getting sensitive, so not ph tonight. Everything looks the same and she wouldn't tell me her plans for the evening when I asked.
last pic posted 
tonight.


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## Jodie (Jul 7, 2020)

I think she looks lower. It could be that she is standing differently to the first pic, but even so I think her belly looks a bit lower in the second. Lol her plans probably include keeping you up all night, stressing you out, seeing if she can drive you to the loony bin before she actually foals, maybe pop out a baby if she has time


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## Taz (Jul 7, 2020)

Thant's exactly what I was thinking!  
It's my birthday tomorrow, maybe she'll be nice and foal then


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 7, 2020)

I will say that the udder getting hard is a good sign. Usually when they are very close the udder will still be hard but you should be able to get a squirt. If you decide you don’t want to do ph you can do a texture and color test or a taste test. Those are a bit more subject to guesswork though but at least you can see some changes.


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 7, 2020)

elizabeth.conder said:


> I will say that the udder getting hard is a good sign. Usually when they are very close the udder will still be hard but you should be able to get a squirt. If you decide you don’t want to do ph you can do a texture and color test or a taste test. Those are a bit more subject to guesswork though but at least you can see some changes.




what I like to do is use a small clear cup to collect milk. That way there is no touching it and you can see color and have an idea of consistency.


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 7, 2020)

Taz said:


> Thant's exactly what I was thinking!
> It's my birthday tomorrow, maybe she'll be nice and foal then


Did you tell her it was your birthday?? I bet she is waiting to surprise you!


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## Taz (Jul 7, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> Did you tell her it was your birthday?? I bet she is waiting to surprise you!


I hope so


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## Taz (Jul 8, 2020)

elizabeth.conder said:


> I will say that the udder getting hard is a good sign. Usually when they are very close the udder will still be hard but you should be able to get a squirt. If you decide you don’t want to do ph you can do a texture and color test or a taste test. Those are a bit more subject to guesswork though but at least you can see some changes.


I am going to keep checking the ph when I can get some milk without getting her upset if for no other reason I'd really like to know if it drops normally with her since she has been so abnormal. I've been collecting in a white plastic lid and thought that would show me the colour, I'll try to find something clear. I don't think tasting it would work for me  .

Nothing last night. She is drinking A LOT though. 3/4 of a bucket last night and whatever she wants outside. Drinking is good and it's hot here right now but is drinking that much a sign of anything wrong or is she just feeling it more than everyone else? No sweating.


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 8, 2020)

Happy Birthday, Taz!


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## Taz (Jul 8, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> Happy Birthday, Taz!


Thank you!


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## Holly Chisholm (Jul 8, 2020)

Happy birthday! Have a very blessed and hopefully FRUITFUL day!!


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## Taz (Jul 8, 2020)

Holly Chisholm said:


> Happy birthday! Have a very blessed and hopefully FRUITFUL day!!


Thank you!


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## Taz (Jul 8, 2020)

No changes this morning. She bit my mother twice and was swinging her quarters at me when I tried to get some milk, she must be getting pretty tender, so I'm leaving that unless I can get it easily. I've been working very hard to get her trust and don't want to lose ground with the little one almost here. Loose and droopy, maybe a bit sunken around her tail head, I can feel her spine easily there at least. soon.


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## Jodie (Jul 8, 2020)

Happy birthday Taz  I hope Tilly gives you the perfect present!


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## Taz (Jul 8, 2020)

Thank you!


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## MerMaeve (Jul 8, 2020)

Happy Birthday Taz!! I hope your day is foally and udderly amazing!


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## Taz (Jul 8, 2020)

MerMaeve said:


> Happy Birthday Taz!! I hope your day is foally and udderly amazing!


Thank you!


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## Taz (Jul 8, 2020)

No changes, nothing to report. Eagerly waiting to have something better to say


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## Jodie (Jul 8, 2020)

It’s not midnight yet! Still a chance you and baby could share a birthday lol


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## Taz (Jul 8, 2020)

Fingers crossed


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 8, 2020)

Happy Birthday!!!


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## Taz (Jul 8, 2020)

elizabeth.conder said:


> Happy Birthday!!!


Thank you!


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## chandab (Jul 8, 2020)

I have not been following, regularly, just playing catch up here and there. Anyway, tonight's catch up started with the comments about LWO overo. When it comes to minis, I'd make sure at least one of the two horses bred to each other was tested LWO negative to be safe. Minis are excellent at taking patterns to extremes, whether that is extreme minimal or extreme expression; and they like to piles up the patterns, obscuring obvious signs of a particular pattern. So, when it comes to LWO, always be sure one horse is tested negative to be safe. [I know someone with a solid, no white and no blue eyes mare that tests LWO positive, so you can NOT always go by visual assessment.] In this case, it's better to spend $25 and test one horse in the mix, than to be sorry 10-11 months later. [And, use UC Davis or Animal Genetics lab, as they are top notch with minimal errors.]


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## Taz (Jul 9, 2020)

chandab said:


> I have not been following, regularly, just playing catch up here and there. Anyway, tonight's catch up started with the comments about LWO overo. When it comes to minis, I'd make sure at least one of the two horses bred to each other was tested LWO negative to be safe. Minis are excellent at taking patterns to extremes, whether that is extreme minimal or extreme expression; and they like to piles up the patterns, obscuring obvious signs of a particular pattern. So, when it comes to LWO, always be sure one horse is tested negative to be safe. [I know someone with a solid, no white and no blue eyes mare that tests LWO positive, so you can NOT always go by visual assessment.] In this case, it's better to spend $25 and test one horse in the mix, than to be sorry 10-11 months later. [And, use UC Davis or Animal Genetics lab, as they are top notch with minimal errors.]


Definitely back on the list of things to worry about. Pitter Patter, are you going to test Volt?

Nothing last night except for some vigorous tail swishing and she backed into the wall 5 times in a row hard and fast enough to bounce off it.


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## Becky Smith (Jul 9, 2020)

I use Pool PH test kits. Normally the mare foaled within 12 hrs of ph reading 6.2 or less. Look up Facebook Miniature Horse Discussion Board to help!


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## Taz (Jul 9, 2020)

Becky Smith said:


> I use Pool PH test kits. Normally the mare foaled within 12 hrs of ph reading 6.2 or less. Look up Facebook Miniature Horse Discussion Board to help!


Thanks, I'll take a look.


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## Taz (Jul 9, 2020)

Anything going on with Rosie, Snickers and dare I ask, Pepper?


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## Jodie (Jul 9, 2020)

Taz said:


> Anything going on with Rosie, Snickers and dare I ask, Pepper?


Funny you mention that as I just posted on Pitter Patter’s original thread a moment ago asking if she had any updates! Nothing new with Rosie except I realized yesterday that I have been feeding her about half the amount of mare and foal that she should be having and feel absolutely terrible about it.


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## MerMaeve (Jul 9, 2020)

Nothing from Squirt yet either...


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 9, 2020)

Jodie said:


> Funny you mention that as I just posted on Pitter Patter’s original thread a moment ago asking if she had any updates! Nothing new with Rosie except I realized yesterday that I have been feeding her about half the amount of mare and foal that she should be having and feel absolutely terrible about it.


Snickers is coming along VERY slowly but nothing dramatic. Pepper? Ah, who knows? I can't tell if she is getting fatter or is pregnant! But she is getting more swelling near her udder and her teets are pointing downward. No movement though and from behind her belly looks symmetrical. She rarely stands still long enough to watch. When she eats her head moves back and forth a lot and it swings her belly to the opposite side. Pretty sure she is beginning to wonder if I am going to eat her because I am stalking her!(She has an annoyed expression when I just LOOK at her now...lol). Can't blame her though. Would love it if they could just talk for one day!


Taz said:


> Definitely back on the list of things to worry about. Pitter Patter, are you going to test Volt?
> 
> Nothing last night except for some vigorous tail swishing and she backed into the wall 5 times in a row hard and fast enough to bounce off it.


I might when all of this pregnancy stuff subsides, but not sure. Not sure if vet does it or if it's a DYI kind of thing. IF I decide to let others breed with him I definitely would but I am more leaning to getting him gelded at some point. Maybe MerMaeve wants a baby of her own from Squirt so she can experience all the fun first hand! HaHa


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## Jodie (Jul 9, 2020)

Totally get the annoyed look!! This was Rosie about 3 weeks ago, looking at me like “uh huh, that’s my butt, why are you so interested in it?!”


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## MerMaeve (Jul 9, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> Maybe MerMaeve wants a baby of her own from Squirt so she can experience all the fun first hand! HaHa


After all everyone have gone through, I don't know if I want to do that! Maybe in 10 years!


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 9, 2020)

chandab said:


> I have not been following, regularly, just playing catch up here and there. Anyway, tonight's catch up started with the comments about LWO overo. When it comes to minis, I'd make sure at least one of the two horses bred to each other was tested LWO negative to be safe. Minis are excellent at taking patterns to extremes, whether that is extreme minimal or extreme expression; and they like to piles up the patterns, obscuring obvious signs of a particular pattern. So, when it comes to LWO, always be sure one horse is tested negative to be safe. [I know someone with a solid, no white and no blue eyes mare that tests LWO positive, so you can NOT always go by visual assessment.] In this case, it's better to spend $25 and test one horse in the mix, than to be sorry 10-11 months later. [And, use UC Davis or Animal Genetics lab, as they are top notch with minimal errors.]


Thanks, Chandab! Does the vet take a sample and send it in or is it up to the owner?


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 9, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> Snickers is coming along VERY slowly but nothing dramatic. Pepper? Ah, who knows? I can't tell if she is getting fatter or is pregnant! But she is getting more swelling near her udder and her teets are pointing downward. No movement though and from behind her belly looks symmetrical. She rarely stands still long enough to watch. When she eats her head moves back and forth a lot and it swings her belly to the opposite side. Pretty sure she is beginning to wonder if I am going to eat her because I am stalking her!(She has an annoyed expression when I just LOOK at her now...lol). Can't blame her though. Would love it if they could just talk for one day!
> 
> I might when all of this pregnancy stuff subsides, but not sure. Not sure if vet does it or if it's a DYI kind of thing. IF I decide to let others breed with him I definitely would but I am more leaning to getting him gelded at some point. Maybe MerMaeve wants a baby of her own from Squirt so she can experience all the fun first hand! HaHa



It’s actually super easy to test. But it is diy. You pull 15-30 hairs and make sure to have the roots intact as that is what is tested. There are several labs but really only 2 that are recommended. UC Davis and Animal Genetics. Some others have mixed reviews and some bad reviews so the other 2 are the safe decision. You register online and fill out the form and then just mail it in. Results in a few days usually.


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## Taz (Jul 9, 2020)

Nothing new to report about Tilly. Cranky fat mare, can't say I blame her.


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 9, 2020)

Taz said:


> Nothing new to report about Tilly. Cranky fat mare, can't say I blame her.



Awww poor girl! Doesn't she know she will feel better if she would just release her hostage?


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## Taz (Jul 9, 2020)

elizabeth.conder said:


> Awww poor girl! Doesn't she know she will feel better if she would just release her hostage?


I keep telling her that, so far she's not listening


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## chandab (Jul 9, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> Thanks, Chandab! Does the vet take a sample and send it in or is it up to the owner?


Elizabeth pretty much covered it. It's really simple, and I'm pretty sure both reliable labs charge $25 for the LWO test; so really cheap insurance to avoid a possible 25% chance of a foal dying a horrific death within a few days of birth.


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## Jodie (Jul 9, 2020)

While there is nothing interesting to report, I figured I would upload a couple pictures of Rosie tonight, because everyone loves a chunky little pony!


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 10, 2020)

chandab said:


> Elizabeth pretty much covered it. It's really simple, and I'm pretty sure both reliable labs charge $25 for the LWO test; so really cheap insurance to avoid a possible 25% chance of a foal dying a horrific death within a few days of birth.


I will definitely look into it!! Thanks!


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## Jodie (Jul 10, 2020)

How’s Tilly today, Taz?


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## Taz (Jul 10, 2020)

Nothing to report....


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## Jodie (Jul 10, 2020)

This is the picture, Taz. Same “you’re a crazy woman” glare lol but definite growth in the belly area! 3 weeks ago on the left, this morning on the right.


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## Taz (Jul 10, 2020)

Haha, that's how it works. Is she acting as if the little one is bothering her yet? Izzy didn't during the day but on camera at night she did. Tilly is equal opportunity, non-stop telling everyone off right now
Poor girl.


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## Jodie (Jul 10, 2020)

Lol it’s nice to see evidence of it. When she was first clipped, she looked half the size that she was with her fluff and all the “the vet must have been wrong” thoughts were running rampant in my mind. But now she’s at the point where she actually looks bigger from the front and back than she did in her full winter woollies 
No she doesn’t seem to be. I mean she does bite at her sides now and then but it’s hard to distinguish if it’s due to baby or all the bugs!


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## Taz (Jul 10, 2020)

this is better, my datas working well enough to use my laptop now. Wow! Big difference in three weeks, way to go Rosie!!


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## Taz (Jul 10, 2020)

Lost my data again, really frustrating, it's been doing this since it got hot a couple of weeks ago. It's going to be interesting to see how big she gets as a maiden. I think you can definitely say she's in foal


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## Jodie (Jul 10, 2020)

Her heart girth has remained the same from when she got clipped late April to now so I would hope that belly is more than just fat


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 10, 2020)

Jodie said:


> While there is nothing interesting to report, I figured I would upload a couple pictures of Rosie tonight, because everyone loves a chunky little pony!


She is adorable Jodie! Can I ask how you did her mane? Looks like a braid or pony tail? Been looking for ideas on doing mane and bangs..Bought a braiding book which is lovely, but a little too fancy for just hanging out at home.


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## Taz (Jul 10, 2020)

Well, it's been 15 weeks today since Tilly started developing an udder. She hasn't really had any changes in the last two weeks, she looks very ready to me but what do I know, she's going to do what she does. It was easy to get a drop to test tonight and it was a translucent yellow and didn't move when I tilted the cap but she's still testing 7.8/8. Thunderstorms are supposed to role in tonight so fingers crossed she gets in the mood and the hydro doesn't go out.


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 10, 2020)

Ok, for those of you wondering about Snickers and maybe Pepper, here are some pics. Still a ways to go for Snickers I think. Who knows with Pepper? Any thoughts? She has gained some weight (food hog). Snickers almost always carries her little one length wise. Right after I took the photos, baby went sideways! (1) Snickers side view udder (2) Pepper side view udder (3) Snickers profile (4) Pepper rear view (5)Pepper profile. All taken 7/10/20. Still looking for more expert opinions!! Some days I think Pepper is pregnant and other days I just don' know....


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 10, 2020)

Taz said:


> Well, it's been 15 weeks today since Tilly started developing an udder. She hasn't really had any changes in the last two weeks, she looks very ready to me but what do I know, she's going to do what she does. It was east to get a drop to test tonight and it was a translucent yellow and didn't move when I tilted the cap but she's still testing 7.8/8. Thunderstorms are supposed to role in tonight so fingers crossed she gets in the mood and the hydro doesn't go out.


Hoping for baby tonight!


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## Taz (Jul 10, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> Ok, for those of you wondering about Snickers and maybe Pepper, here are some pics. Still a ways to go for Snickers I think. Who knows with Pepper? Any thoughts? She has gained some weight (food hog). Snickers almost always carries her little one length wise. Right after I took the photos, baby went sideways! (1) Snickers side view udder (2) Pepper side view udder (3) Snickers profile (4) Pepper rear view (5)Pepper profile. All taken 7/10/20. Still looking for more expert opinions!! Some days I think Pepper is pregnant and other days I just don' know....
> 
> View attachment 41839
> View attachment 41840
> ...


How big was Snickers belly when the foal went sideways? Hang in there, I think this is the most frustrating, crazy making thing I've ever done with horses, it goes on so long without any idea what's going to happen.


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 10, 2020)

Taz said:


> How big was Snickers belly when the foal went sideways? Hang in there, I think this is the most frustrating, crazy making thing I've ever done with horses, it goes on so long without any idea what's going to happen.


She was pretty big. About 10 minutes later, baby flip flopped the other direction again. Probably just trying to get comfortable I guess. Snickers is a bigger than my other minis. The father is smaller, I think even smaller than my stallion. Maybe the baby will show as smaller too? Not sure.


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## Jodie (Jul 10, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> She is adorable Jodie! Can I ask how you did her mane? Looks like a braid or pony tail? Been looking for ideas on doing mane and bangs..Bought a braiding book which is lovely, but a little too fancy for just hanging out at home.


Thank you  I literally just plopped it up in a ponytail as it’s so poofy you can’t see her belly with it down lol Ah a braiding book sounds great! I used to love getting the horses all pretty for showing (haven’t done that in a lot of years though!)


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## Jodie (Jul 10, 2020)

Sorry Pitter Patter, I can’t remember off the top of my head, but did Snickers and Pepper come from the same place?


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 10, 2020)

Jodie said:


> Sorry Pitter Patter, I can’t remember off the top of my head, but did Snickers and Pepper come from the same place?


Yes


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## Jodie (Jul 11, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> Yes


I would think that there’s a good chance Pepper is too then, as Snickers is and they’re from the same place and same herd - given that Snickers was obviously exposed to a stallion, if she and Pepper were in together then it stands to reason that the stallion got to Pepper too (though of course she may not have caught/could have slipped the foal) I may be wrong of course being a newbie to this part of owning horses, but those are my thoughts.


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## Taz (Jul 11, 2020)

That's great, you know the little one is still doing well . Have you been able to see any changes in her back end? Izzy is about 34 inches, Ollie was about 10lbs when he was born and has finished at 28inches and very fine build, I have no idea about his dad. The foal could easily be smaller I would think. Poor Snickers, it sounds like she has an active munchkin too.
I agree with Jodie about Pepper.


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## Taz (Jul 11, 2020)

No foal, never going to foal.......


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 11, 2020)

Taz said:


> No foal, never going to foal.......


She can't go much longer!!! So hoping to hear good news this morning!


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## Taz (Jul 11, 2020)

I didn't think she could be much longer 2 months ago!  
She has to just be waiting on the munchkin to give the green light. She's been fussy the last few nights between 8-10, that's the same timing as when I thought she was in labor a few weeks ago. Izzy did that, she was fussy around the same time she foaled for a few weeks leading up to it. I'm hoping it's only days more for Tilly not weeks, but it would be wonderful if she would stick to that timing. I got the tiniest drop to test this morning and her ph is still up at 7.8/8. Still cranky, the other two have learned to just move out of her way, hahaha! Didn't get a storm last night but they're still saying it's coming so maybe she'll think a storm tonight would be perfect .


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## Taz (Jul 11, 2020)

She came in tonight looking like a BIG mud ball . Everything looks the same but she's testing at 7 tonight. Anyone want to take a guess on whether she'll go back up, stay there for a while or drop fast and foal tonight? I'm voting for drop fast and foal tonight but so far my votes haven't been counted so we'll see.


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 11, 2020)

Taz said:


> She came in tonight looking like a BIG mud ball . Everything looks the same but she's testing at 7 tonight. Anyone want to take a guess on whether she'll go back up, stay there for a while or drop fast and foal tonight? I'm voting for drop fast and foal tonight but so far my votes haven't been counted so we'll see.



That’s awesome! You said her history indicated that she finishes getting ready last minute right? I’d definitely be anxious to see what happens tonight. Ive seen one mare drop from 8.4 to 6.8 in 18 hrs and foal 1-2 hrs later. So you never know. She was checking every 2-4 hrs at that stage plus had her on camera. Saying that though I’ve seen some take weeks to drop lol.


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## Taz (Jul 11, 2020)

Yes, from what I've been able to piece together she finishes getting ready fast at the end, sometimes within an hour or two. I didn't have anyone say they had checked the pH though so ?? Fingers crossed and watching closely.


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## Taz (Jul 12, 2020)

Nothing, she wasn't even fussy. I'll see what she looks like soon.


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## Taz (Jul 12, 2020)

Her udder is hard full sized ready for nursing with filled nipples this morning and she's testing 6.4/6.6.


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 12, 2020)

Taz said:


> Her udder is hard full sized ready for nursing with filled nipples this morning and she's testing 6.4/6.6.



Oh boy! Maybe this is finally it! From 6.4 it is USUALLY 24 hrs. But the way your mare has gone about things who really knows. I bet it’s soon though.


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## Taz (Jul 12, 2020)

elizabeth.conder said:


> Oh boy! Maybe this is finally it! From 6.4 it is USUALLY 24 hrs. But the way your mare has gone about things who really knows. I bet it’s soon though.


24 hours sounds GREAT to me!! Here's hoping!!!!!!


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## Jodie (Jul 12, 2020)

Taz said:


> Her udder is hard full sized ready for nursing with filled nipples this morning and she's testing 6.4/6.6.


Ah that’s fantastic news! A new baby and a full night’s sleep is just around the corner, Taz!


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 12, 2020)

Fingers crossed for you and Tilley tonight!  Farrier was here today to do everyone's feet. I asked him what he thought. He looked at their undercarriages and asked me what made me think Snickers was pregnant?! Yikes! Of course little one lying lengthwise again and just decided not to move at all! He asked me if I palpated either of them and I said no because they are too small. just shrugged and said he didn't think so. Depressing, but there are changes and I am sure about Snickers. What i'm not sure about is how far along she is! no udder changes tonight but still "puffy". Come on Tilley! We need some inspiration!!


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## Taz (Jul 12, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> Fingers crossed for you and Tilley tonight!  Farrier was here today to do everyone's feet. I asked him what he thought. He looked at their undercarriages and asked me what made me think Snickers was pregnant?! Yikes! Of course little one lying lengthwise again and just decided not to move at all! He asked me if I palpated either of them and I said no because they are too small. just shrugged and said he didn't think so. Depressing, but there are changes and I am sure about Snickers. What i'm not sure about is how far along she is! no udder changes tonight but still "puffy". Come on Tilley! We need some inspiration!!


If it makes you feel any better the guy that owns the local feed/tack store was here last week delivering bedding. He bred for years. I asked him about Tilly and his answer was 'are you sure she's in foal?'.  You know she is, I'm just happy you already bought baby blankets in case, the little one might be a while. Or, if she looked pretty big when he/she was sideways then she could just be one that gets ready fast. Either way it's crazy making, hang in there.


Tilly came in dragging on the end of the lead and has her top lip stuck out like when they get a scratch. The drop of milk I got looks like milk now. No changes in how she looks tonight BUT her pH is back to 8. If I wasn't for the pH I would say she's good to go so...... I'll be checking every 1/2 hour from now on, so much for sleep. I figure if the pH can jump around as fast as it is she can drop and go any time too.


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 12, 2020)

Tilley looks SO pregnant! I don't know how he could have thought otherwise! But it does make me feel better, like I am not imagining things! Read somewhere that the lip business might indicate early labor


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## Jodie (Jul 12, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> Tilley looks SO pregnant! I don't know how he could have thought otherwise! But it does make me feel better, like I am not imagining things! Read somewhere that the lip business might indicate early labor


Don’t stress Pitter Patter, I remember before the vet came out I asked my farrier what she thought about Rosie and she said “nah she’s not pregnant, she’s just fat”. When you get your hands on her she’s not fat at all, she would be right where she is supposed to be.


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## Taz (Jul 12, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> Tilley looks SO pregnant! I don't know how he could have thought otherwise! But it does make me feel better, like I am not imagining things! Read somewhere that the lip business might indicate early labor


My answer to him was "YES she's pregnant, go look at her!" LoL.
Oh I hope so, that's what I was thinking but never read it anywhere.


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## Jodie (Jul 12, 2020)

I’m sure @elizabeth.conder would be a better source than me haha but isn’t it when they have actual milk coloured milk that they’re super close too?


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## Taz (Jul 12, 2020)

I think so. She's not acting right but not looking in labor right now. Her lip is still stuck out though.


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## Jodie (Jul 12, 2020)

Just read on PennVet that curling of the top lip could be a good sign that this marathon wait will soon be over for you!


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## Taz (Jul 12, 2020)

Here's hoping. She's down for the third time now which isn't normal but she's done this before more severely and nothing came of it.


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## Jodie (Jul 12, 2020)

Hopefully that was just practice for the real thing tonight!


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 12, 2020)

Taz said:


> Here's hoping. She's down for the third time now which isn't normal but she's done this before more severely and nothing came of it.


Ah, but she's so much closer now and so many signs....Hopefully your wait is soon over!!


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 12, 2020)

I’m sure you did it correct but you are certain she’s back up to 8.0? That’s pretty drastic lol. But evidently she seems to like keeping you at your wits end lol. If she’s up and down a lot and curling her lip I’d be on very high alert. Milk can change right with foaling. But if her milk is white and sticky then I’d expect it will be soon.


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## Taz (Jul 13, 2020)

Nothing, back to acting normally and eating like it's an Olympic sport. A bit of cow kicking/laying down/breathing hard, then back to everything's normal and eating again. Very itchy though no bum rubbing.

I did it the same as the other times but who knows? I'll try again in the morning. My mother is there hovering to look too and the first thing she said was "What? Back up?!" so I know I at least read it right.

She's not curling her lip like when they colic, she's sticking it out like when they like you scratching them...


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## Taz (Jul 13, 2020)

Nope, nothing....
I'm 40 min away from the farm most of the day, anyone want to bet on what happens?


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## Taz (Jul 13, 2020)

I took a new container out this morning and was very careful, didn't even breath on the drop I got. Still testing high AND it's gone back to clear. ???????????? Making me a little concerned about how weird she's being with this.

She is noticeably sunken along her back end to her tail and she had a bit of pink discharge. Could that be loosing her mucus plug? She's hit a new level of cranky, if she thinks anyone is even looking at her food run for your life! Hahaha. Poor girl, over soon I hope.


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## Holly Chisholm (Jul 13, 2020)

Sounds like the mucus plug to me!!!


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 13, 2020)

Well she can’t hold the foal forever...we hope. She’s got to be getting close. She seems to be having a lot of practice runs for sure. I agree it does sound like her mucus plug. Could you add some more pictures when you get a chance? Mainly her udder. Are you checking her vulva color? Does she have much tail resistance? You can test that by wagging her tail back and forth and see if she can clamp it down. I’m not sure what ph strips you are using but if you can you might check hardness/calcium. Can you try to get these two the one behind the udder that you’ve been doing but can you try this one to? If you have a smartphone you can do it by basically taking a selfie so you don’t have lean so far over. But see if you can get the whole udder. Is her udder still changing size throughout the day?


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## Maryann at MiniV (Jul 13, 2020)

Does sound like the mucus plug to me too. 

I've always paid attention to the consistency of the milk, not just the color.... Is it super sticky like honey immediately???


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## Taz (Jul 13, 2020)

I'll get more pictures tonight. 
I picked up some pool strips on the way home that are 4 way test so I'll check hardness. 
She does still have tail resistance.
I've only been getting a bit of milk, so checking the colour, whether it runs easily, which it doesn't anymore, and pH. After the pH it's mostly gone. Is it better to use the test strips or see how sticky it is if I only get a bit as usual?


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 13, 2020)

Taz said:


> Nothing, back to acting normally and eating like it's an Olympic sport. A bit of cow kicking/laying down/breathing hard, then back to everything's normal and eating again. Very itchy though no bum rubbing.
> 
> I did it the same as the other times but who knows? I'll try again in the morning. My mother is there hovering to look too and the first thing she said was "What? Back up?!" so I know I at least read it right.
> 
> She's not curling her lip like when they colic, she's sticking it out like when they like you scratching them...


Maybe try to look at another way....she could still be in stage 1 labor which could last a long time. Consider humans. Our cervix usually starts dilating way before actual birth occurs. That can be uncomfortable and often painful. Perhaps her body is just slowly plugging away as baby prepares to make a grand entrance! Hang in there!


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 13, 2020)

Taz said:


> I'll get more pictures tonight.
> I picked up some pool strips on the way home that are 4 way test so I'll check hardness.
> She does still have tail resistance.
> I've only been getting a bit of milk, so checking the colour, whether it runs easily, which it doesn't anymore, and pH. After the pH it's mostly gone. Is it better to use the test strips or see how sticky it is if I only get a bit as usual?



Great! If you only get a little I would check color and then ph. Sticky can be helpful but it can change right before or days before. Ph is usually a much better indicator. In fact they say that 90% of mares foal within 24 hrs after testing 6.4. Hardness can be helpful but it varies more. Usually you dilute the hardness but it requires a lot of milk. So you can just test it and see what it is but know it shows higher than it actually is. However it does show the normal jump.


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## Taz (Jul 13, 2020)

Pitter Patter said:


> Maybe try to look at another way....she could still be in stage 1 labor which could last a long time. Consider humans. Our cervix usually starts dilating way before actual birth occurs. That can be uncomfortable and often painful. Perhaps her body is just slowly plugging away as baby prepares to make a grand entrance! Hang in there!


I've mostly resigned myself to waking up every half hour from now on, I really don't think it can be much more than another couple of days. Hoping not anyway, she's really uncomfortable. That's a great way of thinking of it!


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## Taz (Jul 13, 2020)

elizabeth.conder said:


> Great! If you only get a little I would check color and then ph. Sticky can be helpful but it can change right before or days before. Ph is usually a much better indicator. In fact they say that 90% of mares foal within 24 hrs after testing 6.4. Hardness can be helpful but it varies more. Usually you dilute the hardness but it requires a lot of milk. So you can just test it and see what it is but know it shows higher than it actually is. However it does show the normal jump.


What hardness am I looking for?


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 13, 2020)

Taz said:


> What hardness am I looking for?




When it is not diluted, it should be off the charts. Diluted will be 800-1000+


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## Taz (Jul 13, 2020)

Ok, I think I got everything:
Milk is still clear, 
doesn't run, 
sticky the third time I tap my fingers together,
pH was 8 last night and this morning, 7.2 tonight,
hardness not diluted is 250.
She still has her lip stuck out, whatever that means. She's feeling something.
Her udder is more sensitive, I don't know if I'll be able to get more to test in the morning, I'll see.
Pictures from tonight:


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 13, 2020)

Perfect pictures! That udder does look close. With the ways she been you are being wise to keep a close eye! Usually hardness will spike as ph drops. So seeing the base calcium might be a good way to measure if ph drops for real. I expect the vulva will look better soon too.


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 13, 2020)

Okay so I asked a friend of mine who has bred minis for a long time. She says she wouldn’t be surprised to see a foal in 48 hrs. She suggests just take pictures for the next 24 hrs unless you see a big change. I described how she has fluctuated so much with ph and she said be ready. I know you are though! Hopefully it’s very soon!


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## Taz (Jul 13, 2020)

Thank you, I have her on a close watch. Fingers crossed for soon!  She'll be happy with just pictures tomorrow


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## Taz (Jul 14, 2020)

It's a boy!!!! Red bag, all good. Still in barn more info later


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## Jodie (Jul 14, 2020)

Taz said:


> It's a boy!!!! Red bag, all good. Still in barn more info later


Ahhh!! Huge congratulations, Taz! So glad to hear all is well, especially after a red bag. Sending love


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## Taz (Jul 14, 2020)

He's sort of getting the milk bar figured out, I had to give him some. Pooped a bit, watching for more. Going to bed to watch, more info later tomorrow.


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 14, 2020)

Congratulations!!!!!


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## Willow Flats (Jul 14, 2020)

Congratulations! I've been following along. You have some sleep to catch up on!


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## Holly Chisholm (Jul 14, 2020)

OH MY GOODNESS!!!!! He is BEAUTIFUL! When you are ready, please give details of what happened. Thank God you were there!


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## Taz (Jul 14, 2020)

He's doing great, vet just left, he has a clean bill of health. He was up in 10 min but didn't even try to nurse for at least 45min. I gave him a syringe of milk at about an hour and he finally got interested but didn't figure it out for another hour. Now he doesn't want to stop!
I would love to say I was a star and was there when he was born, I was there about 30 seconds after he was on the ground. I woke up at 12 ish and looked and Tilly was eating and relaxed. After getting up to pee, (thank you Maryann!!!!!!) I was wide awake so watched her for a bit instead of resetting my alarm and going back to sleep. Her stomach started dancing and that went on on and off for about 1/2 hour with Tilly swishing her tail now and then but just eating. Then she lay down and did her heavy breathing routine, got up, had some hay, wandered around a bit, lay down and did the heavy breathing again. At that point I was wondering/hoping she was going into labor. Well, she lay flat on her side and stared pushing. I ran out of the house and by the time I got to her stall he was on the ground, she was up and had the sack off his head and was licking him. The placenta was layed out behind him. It had ruptured but the sack hadn't, it was still over his front legs, only his head and neck out. I would have been there in time but way to go Tilly!!!!!! 
I'm guessing he's a black pintaloosa? He has a lot of grey/roaning in the black on his body and a light muzzle. Ideas? No name yet.......


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## Pitter Patter (Jul 14, 2020)

Taz said:


> He's doing great, vet just left, he has a clean bill of health. He was up in 10 min but didn't even try to nurse for at least 45min. I gave him a syringe of milk at about an hour and he finally got interested but didn't figure it out for another hour. Now he doesn't want to stop!
> I would love to say I was a star and was there when he was born, I was there about 30 seconds after he was on the ground. I woke up at 12 ish and looked and Tilly was eating and relaxed. After getting up to pee, (thank you Maryann!!!!!!) I was wide awake so watched her for a bit instead of resetting my alarm and going back to sleep. Her stomach started dancing and that went on on and off for about 1/2 hour with Tilly swishing her tail now and then but just eating. Then she lay down and did her heavy breathing routine, got up, had some hay, wandered around a bit, lay down and did the heavy breathing again. At that point I was wondering/hoping she was going into labor. Well, she lay flat on her side and stared pushing. I ran out of the house and by the time I got to her stall he was on the ground, she was up and had the sack off his head and was licking him. The placenta was layed out behind him. It had ruptured but the sack hadn't, it was still over his front legs, only his head and neck out. I would have been there in time but way to go Tilly!!!!!!
> I'm guessing he's a black pintaloosa? He has a lot of grey/roaning in the black on his body and a light muzzle. Ideas? No name yet.......
> View attachment 41869
> ...


Oh is he ever beautiful! Congratulations, Taz!!! What a sweetie!! So, was he worth the wait?


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## elizabeth.conder (Jul 14, 2020)

He’s beautiful! I believe black tobiano. If you look up foal camo on a black foal the light roaning is normal and will disappear after the first foal shed. However that’s just from pictures. Dam is not appy. Is the sire? If he’s not than the colt can’t be. That said, he has a lovely pattern!


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## Taz (Jul 14, 2020)

Thank you elithabeth.conder. Dads pintaloosa. I'll see what he is when he sheds out, it really doesn't matter. He's a double decker oreo .



Pitter Patter said:


> Oh is he ever beautiful! Congratulations, Taz!!! What a sweetie!! So, was he worth the wait?


The wait, the worry, the sleepless nights, yup all worth it. Although, I did just wake up from a 2 hour nap and casually walk out to check on them instead of a 30-45 min nap and wake up panicked and run out to check. Your turn will come sooner than you think, you should only have a max. of two months about. You can do that for the most wonderful little munchkins


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## Taz (Jul 14, 2020)

THANK YOU EVERYONE for the advice, support, and letting me whine. I can't tell you how much it helped and how much I appreciate it. You are all amazing.


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## Taz (Jul 14, 2020)

Kristen, what did you name your little boy?


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## MerMaeve (Jul 14, 2020)

CONGRATULATIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I had so much catching up to do...I had two of my girl cousins over since Saturday so I got way behind! Taz and Tilly, he is perfect!


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## Taz (Jul 14, 2020)

Willow Flats said:


> Congratulations! I've been following along. You have some sleep to catch up on!


Thank you. Going to be so wonderful to sleep tonight


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## Taz (Jul 15, 2020)

MerMaeve said:


> CONGRATULATIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I had so much catching up to do...I had two of my girl cousins over since Saturday so I got way behind! Taz and Tilly, he is perfect!


Thank you! We think he is. Hope you had fun with your cousins.


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## Kristin (Jul 15, 2020)

Congrats Taz!!!!! What a handsome boy!!!! He looks so tiny!


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## chandab (Jul 15, 2020)

Congrats!
By these pics, I only see black tobiano.
He's darling.


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## Jodie (Jul 15, 2020)

How are Tilly and baby doing today, Taz? Any name ideas?


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## Taz (Jul 15, 2020)

Kristin said:


> Congrats Taz!!!!! What a handsome boy!!!! He looks so tiny!


Thank you! He's about 13 inches. He's already put weight on. I carry him to and from the paddock to make life easier and could feel a difference by last night and again this morning. It doesn't surprise me, he eats every 20 min  What did you name your little guy?


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## Taz (Jul 15, 2020)

chandab said:


> Congrats!
> By these pics, I only see black tobiano.
> He's darling.


Thank you!!


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## Taz (Jul 15, 2020)

Jodie said:


> How are Tilly and baby doing today, Taz? Any name ideas?


They're doing great. Tilly is getting less protective and poor no name is now getting 'mauled' multiple times a day. I couldn't handle him as much as I wanted to in the beginning, Tilly was very good but got upset. By last night she started to relax some. I've come up with lots of names I like but none fit yet. I'm going to try getting a close up of his face and posting it to see if anyone has ideas.


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## Jodie (Jul 15, 2020)

Aww that’s so good to hear. Looking forward to the pictures!


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## MerMaeve (Jul 15, 2020)

Black Jack?


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## MerMaeve (Jul 15, 2020)

I asked Cindy (Squirt's owner) if Squirt has foaled yet and she said "No baby yet, I'm beginning to wonder about her " I said she needed to give Squirt a big squeeze and see if that helped.  Can someone please help soothe my anxious brain and tell me this is all normal?!?! Cindy said almost a month ago that she was very pregnant then....I can't imagine how big she is now, she must need a wide load truck in front and behind her!


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## MerMaeve (Jul 15, 2020)

Taz said:


> They're doing great. Tilly is getting less protective and poor no name is now getting 'mauled' multiple times a day. I couldn't handle him as much as I wanted to in the beginning, Tilly was very good but got upset. By last night she started to relax some. I've come up with lots of names I like but none fit yet. I'm going to try getting a close up of his face and posting it to see if anyone has ideas.


Who is he getting mauled by?


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## Taz (Jul 15, 2020)

MerMaeve said:


> I asked Cindy (Squirt's owner) if Squirt has foaled yet and she said "No baby yet, I'm beginning to wonder about her " I said she needed to give Squirt a big squeeze and see if that helped.  Can someone please help soothe my anxious brain and tell me this is all normal?!?! Cindy said almost a month ago that she was very pregnant then....I can't imagine how big she is now, she must need a wide load truck in front and behind her!


If the foal has changed positions she will look bigger or smaller depending on whether the little one is sideways or facing the same as mom. Don't worry, that IS normal , Snickers and Rosie are both doing it. She probably meant she's wondering if she's actually in foal, not if she's doing OK. LOL about the big squeeze! Tilly's gate wasn't closed as much as normal a couple of weeks ago and she could fit her shoulders through it to graze on the 'good' grass. She tried to go farther and her belly didn't fit so she backed up, I was rooting for her to keep going and squeeze the foal out that way


MerMaeve said:


> Who is he getting mauled by?


I'm rubbing and scratching and checking his legs and ambilicus for heat and swelling every time I go out to see them, which is pretty often. It's just the two of them in the paddock next to Tilly's normal turn out buddies. I'm planning on keeping them alone for two weeks or until she's super comfortable with the others around him. No worries, he's fine


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## Taz (Jul 15, 2020)

MerMaeve said:


> Black Jack?


That's the name of my mothers horse, black with a white nose.


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## Taz (Jul 15, 2020)

I'm thinking about Finnegan but not quite decided yet. Anyone have any other ideas? He has an introverted sweet personality.


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## MerMaeve (Jul 15, 2020)

Aww, Finn is a sweet name.


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## MerMaeve (Jul 15, 2020)

Taz said:


> If the foal has changed positions she will look bigger or smaller depending on whether the little one is sideways or facing the same as mom. Don't worry, that IS normal , Snickers and Rosie are both doing it. She probably meant she's wondering if she's actually in foal, not if she's doing OK. LOL about the big squeeze! Tilly's gate wasn't closed as much as normal a couple of weeks ago and she could fit her shoulders through it to graze on the 'good' grass. She tried to go farther and her belly didn't fit so she backed up, I was rooting for her to keep going and squeeze the foal out that way


Thanks, that helps.  LOL @ Tilly


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## Trudi Babich (Jul 16, 2020)

Congratulations. I've been following along and I couldn't be happier for you


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## Taz (Jul 16, 2020)

Trudi Babich said:


> Congratulations. I've been following along and I couldn't be happier for you


Thank you! I'm watching him zip around the paddock as fast as his little legs will go, such a wonderful little guy.


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## Jodie (Jul 16, 2020)

Taz said:


> I'm thinking about Finnegan but not quite decided yet. Anyone have any other ideas? He has an introverted sweet personality.
> View attachment 41895
> View attachment 41896


Oh I love Finnegan/Finn for short!


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## Holly Chisholm (Jul 16, 2020)

Sally was pretty rough with Sterling at first, but things settles down rather quickly.

Isn't it fun watching him zip around? Such a miracle! 

I love the name Finnegan!! I am SO HAPPY for you!!!!


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## Taz (Jul 16, 2020)

Tilly's being an amazing mom. Last night I watched her let him nurse while she was laying down then he decided he wasn't done sleeping so he fell over half on her and went back to sleep. Hahaha!!
I've decided yes to Finnegan/Finn, it does seem to fit.


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## Kristin (Jul 19, 2020)

Taz said:


> Thank you! He's about 13 inches. He's already put weight on. I carry him to and from the paddock to make life easier and could feel a difference by last night and again this morning. It doesn't surprise me, he eats every 20 min  What did you name your little guy?


Oh my...he is tiny!!! I love the name!
We decided on Wilson for our boy!


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## Taz (Jul 19, 2020)

Kristin said:


> Oh my...he is tiny!!! I love the name!
> We decided on Wilson for our boy!


Oh I love that name for him!! Finn's already bigger, growing like a weed


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## Holly Chisholm (Sep 2, 2020)

Taz, please post an updated photo of Finn!


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