# Close to foaling ???---Day 346-we lost our colt :(



## amyjoy85 (Feb 14, 2014)

My wonderful girl, Sadie, is showing signs of foaling, but not sure about it. She is a 7yr old maiden mare (and I'm new to breeding too). She was put in the pasture with our stallion on April 14, 2013 when our other girl had a nasty 4 day colic (many trips to the vet, but I digress). We decided to leave her in the pasture with her "boyfriend" and see if we could get a foal this year. We tried one other year, but nothing came of it. Well, some pasture breeding happened on April 18 (saw it happen while washing dishes) and she never came back in heat. This puts her at 302 days. This morning I noticed that our stallion was paying TONS of attention to her like she was coming in heat. She ended up kicking out at him...poor guy. So, not sure if she is coming in heat or showing signs of foaling. She has been pastured with him since April. Struck me as odd. Any thoughts??

She has been holding her tail up, possibly sinking hips, looks like her udder is larger than normal-but not much, has quite the belly under her winter woolies, and I can't tell if she is elongating at all. I tried getting some milk to see what it looked like/felt like, but didn't work. I didn't want to push the issue much. This morning it looked like there was a tad bit of something on her vulva, but may have just been some kind of who knows what. I took some pictures tonight...not the greatest, but they are pictures I can compare over the next while. She is still eating and drinking normal. I will be continuing to take pics so I can compare them over time.

Here are a few pics. I have some before (couple years ago) pics as reference from when I first got her so I would have a reference point. The last picture of her udder is what it normally looks like. I should have done it from the back, but can't do anything about that now. The others were taken tonight. The last couple pics are what Sadie (mini cbs sensation sun kiss) normally looks like (she gets more and more silver every year!!!) and pictures of my stallion (stormy rivers show me the money). 









Any guesses as to what their baby may look like (if one shows up)?? I'm excited!! Rowdy and Buckeroo lines, excellent temperments, gorgeous (IMO) horses. Also taking thoughts on colt/filly. I know I can't do anything about it, but still fun to guess. I'm not sure yet...

Out to go check on my girl


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## AnnaC (Feb 14, 2014)

Hi and welcome to the Nutty Nursery! Can we have a name for you please. To answer some of your questions - yes I think you will be seeing a new little one to add to your herd before very long. From the udder picture I would guess at around 3 weeks BUT of course this would be if she has decided to follow the rule book, which they very rarely do!

Not knowing what facilities you have available, but now would be a good time to get her settled into a good sized night time stall which has also been safely boarded round for the new baby - no gaps in the walls/door where a little one could get a foot/head stuck in/through etc. The next most important thing to do is to remove your stallion - from now on your little Sadie needs her own space and some peace and quiet as indeed she will also need once the baby arrives.

Do go and read some of the pinned threads at the top of this forum which will give you an idea of what to expect as she foals, but the main thing to get organsed is your time/schedule so that you can be prepared to be sitting up all night with her as she gets closer to foaling.

So glad to have you and Sadie join us here, please keep the pictures coming and any questions too. Good luck and hoping for a safe smooth foaling.


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## MountainWoman (Feb 14, 2014)

I'd definitely be keeping a close eye on her. Don't know if you've ever seen this foal color calculator chart but it's a lot of fun and may help you with guessing the color of the foal.

Coat Color Calculator

Sadie is lovely and looking forward to seeing her foal.


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## amyjoy85 (Feb 14, 2014)

Thanks guys! MountainWoman, I have seen that chart, but don't know much about color genetics. Also I have not had either of my horses color tested, so it still gives me a ton of options. My stallion has the paw prints, so I'm assuming he is homozygous pinto. All of his colts (yep, all boys for him, but only 3 or something like that), came out some form of pinto from what I understand.

Sadie I don't know what to call her. She has a dorsal stripe. She is red, well, orange, in her winter coat. Underneath is a silvery red that gets more silvery each year. She has a white patch on her stomach. Her mane and tail are a salt and pepper color under the sun bleaching. She has striped hooves and a little mottling around the genitals. So, with all that, her color confuses me



Her papers say sorrel. Any ideas?

Anna C, we are working on baby-proofing an area at the moment. We have the run in area done, we are just debating about using our bigger old stall that is drafty and fixing it, or building a quick one using OSB and a large chain link dog kennel for the frame (OSB lining the inside) with a roof of some kind, or building something completely new and permanent. Our plan is to decide today and build/fix this weekend. Hoping we won't be too late, but it is what it is.

Timing is going to be hard and require lots of help from my mom and the hubby. We have an 11 month old and also another on the way in June/July, so hoping Sadie makes the timing right and makes it easy on me sleep-wise. I'm hoping there are no issues whatsoever with the delivery, but our vet is available if needed--about 45 minutes out.


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## amyjoy85 (Feb 15, 2014)

She looks almost like she dropped last night, but she was wet and that may have made a difference in terms of what she looked like too. She doesn't like using her shelter unless there is a major downpour and eats (literally) blankets...so that is why she is always wet and quite often muddy. She is also quite wide these days! I really wish we had a paging system or something! It would make it so much easier.


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## Mousie96 (Feb 16, 2014)

Your mare is very pretty!! I cant offer much guessing wise sadly, Im in the same boat. But my mare probably wont foal until mid-late march! This is my first foaling too. Good luck!


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## amyjoy85 (Feb 17, 2014)

Thanks Mousie! Good luck with your foaling time too!

Okay, so I went out at 7:30 this morning to check on Sadie, clean stalls, etc. She stayed in the turn out instead of the stall, the goofball. She had complete access to it though. Her sides weren't sticking out anymore. A couple days ago, the 15th, she had a little gooey stuff on the outer part of her vulva, but not much. It was a reddish/brown color, and there was a tad bit this morning too. 
. She was also quite round (see above pic from second post). At midnight last night, she was kinda lop-sided
. This morning...well not round side to side
. This afternoon she is sticking out a little on the right, but not as much on the left. Kinda lop-sided. Any guesses as to how long I may have? I'm still not able to get any milk, but it's possible I'm not doing it right. She won't let me touch her sides today or her udder.









UPDATE FOR TONIGHT 5:30 tonight (10 hours after pics above)

This is her udder tonight, that is growing in size. Also a look from the side.


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## AnnaC (Feb 18, 2014)

It does look as though baby had dropped, which can happen anywhere between a few days before foaling to a couple of weeks. Keep a close eye on that udder as that may help you, but remember that udders/milk can fill as the mare actually foals. I wouldn't bother with trying to get any milk - some mares dont mind and some get very stressed - it's not something that I have ever bothered with in some 50 years of foalings!

But now is the time to get her settled in her foaling place so the gets happy and relaxed there. Plenty of straw for bedding - avoid shavings as these can stick to everything plus the new baby, during foaling, also the dust/small bits of shavings can get into baby's eyes or be breathed in via the nose, which is not good!

Good luck with organising your time - you certainly have your hands full - but if at all humanly possible it is really essential that you or someone experienced is with her at the birth, mainly to spot any problems early on but also because minis seem to foal with thick 'sacs' and the foal simply doesn't break free and lierally drowns within a minute or two - so very sad particularly for the poor Momma who has carried her baby for so long and is just waiting to greet the new little one at last.

Keep those pictures coming - it is great to be able to see the changes as she gets closer.


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##  (Feb 19, 2014)

I'm a bit excited about all that mottling!! Looks like she's hiding some appaloosa in there!!

She's looking great and the pictures are good. Looks like she's elongating nicely and everything is moving along beautifully! Can't wait!


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## amyjoy85 (Feb 20, 2014)

Well, Sadie's udder seems to be getting a little bigger and her teats were pointed straight down this afternoon, which I've heard is typical once foaling is "close". She ate all her dinner tonight, but she is kinda agitated. She won't even come up to me to get pet. Normally she is in my lap!! She is swishing her tail, stomping, seems longer in the back-end and also more swollen, and foal is doing gymnastics inside her. That in and of itself would make me uncomfortable too. Anyhow, going to watch her in her stall tonight for a bit. Have to do it the old fashioned way with a chair, hot cocoa, and blankets. Hoping it comes sooner rather than later. I know it could still be a few weeks out yet, but I can dream



Anyone have any guesses as to how much longer? I'm getting anxious.


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## AnnaC (Feb 20, 2014)

She's certainly moving closer! Her agitation could be due to the fact that the foal is not quite in the right position and she feels uncomfortable. I do feel that her udder will increase more - look for the actual teats to 'fill' and the colour in her vulva to change to a darker red. It is really difficult at this stage to predict when they might foal - from the look of her it could be a few more days or even a week or so! This is why most of us become beyond zombie like waiting for a foal to arrive - I'm sure the mares do it purposely a lot of the time and delight in our frustration!!


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##  (Feb 20, 2014)

I'm with Anna. Her vulva should be a good indicator for you, as you watch for a darker red. She is really moving ahead nicely, and all looks very good!


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## amyjoy85 (Feb 26, 2014)

So we are at day 314/315. Her udder is getting bigger and today felt solid. It's not tons bigger, but a little bigger than it was. She had a couple mixed looser stools earlier, but this afternoon and evening, it's back to the normal "apples". I stuck her in the stall for the afternoon to monitor her poops and gave her a little extra hay so she could nibble. She didn't finish all her dinner, but she nibbled on hay all afternoon, so I wasn't too surprised, even though she is a pig.

We've all been sick here with nasty colds, so hoping she waits til we are better and it's a tad bit warmer! Due to being sick, I haven't been taking my camera out since it is still kinda cold here. Just more of a check and go, watch her through the window when she is in view type of thing. We also don't have lights in our stall, so we have to rely on headlamps and an big emergency flashlight. Kinda difficult to check vulva color at night (after 5:30 pm) since the colors get skewed from light variation. I try to check in the morning and mid-day to see if there are any changes, and then check again in the evening--but it's usually starting to get or already is dark.

We decided to fix up our old stall since we didn't see the point in spending $400 or so to make a nice stall, when we could fix the old one with scrap lumber we have around. It is so nice in there now!! No more leaks, wind, holes, etc. Love it! It has a turn out attached and then if that is opened, it goes into a smaller pasture. I put a small amount of shavings down, then loaded on the straw. It's a pain cleaning itty bitty poop balls out of straw, but luckily she goes out in the turnout to do that most times. I will try to take some pics of her tomorrow so I can compare.


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## AnnaC (Feb 26, 2014)

Well done, it sounds as though you now have everything ready - just the waiting time now!!

Hope you are all feeling better soon.


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##  (Feb 26, 2014)

Sounds like she's moving ahead, and the feel of her udder sounds promising.

Hope you feel better soon, too!


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## amyjoy85 (Mar 8, 2014)

Well, it's getting warmer, for today at least, and we are all pretty much over our colds finally. Our daughter turned 1 on Thursday, so we are celebrating tomorrow with family. I'm up late baking cakes and cupcakes. Since my last post, we also found out that the human munchkin that is coming in July is a boy





On the horse side of things, we are STILL waiting! Ugh. We are heading into day 324 tomorrow. Her udder is getting rather hard the last few days, but still not big. She looked a little darker in her vulva today, but the sun was out (rarely happens) and outside lighting changes what it looks like in there sometimes. Still checking usually twice a day. Once in the morning when I let her out and then in the evening when I put her back in her stall. Today I decided to check her mid-day since I was outside working in the beautiful sunshine. Here are a few pics from mid-day today. She doesn't seem to be changing much, in my opinion. Foal seems to be back up higher again last few weeks, so it sticks out the sides. Usually she is a little un-even, poor girl.


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## amyjoy85 (Mar 15, 2014)

Day 331 and still waiting. Udder is getting bigger and there was what looks to be wet diarrhea under the tail (visible in the pics) this afternoon. We have been having much warmer weather and sunshine. It's been up in the low 60's as opposed to the 40's. Still getting in the 30's at night though. Hoping she foals on a day/night that is warm and not rainy...and soon!! Here are a few pics from this afternoon. Anyone have any guesses as to how long we have? I'm kinda hoping it's within the next week or two. Hoping it's an easy foaling, no issues, and and healthy foal.


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##  (Mar 15, 2014)

She's elongating nicely, and from the side view, I'm thinking baby has to move a bit more forward of center. It's hard to tell with the udder picture, but it looks good, and since she's filling nicely, I would expect to see a pretty full udder with her nipples separated and pointing straight down.

Doesn't look like you'll have much of a wait. She's so close, though, keep a close eye on her, as things at this point can change in a few hours!

Happy and safe foaling!


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## amyjoy85 (Mar 25, 2014)

Tired of waiting!! Ugh. Day 341. She is bagging up more and more each day. Today as she is out, her udder is not shrinking, but getting bigger. I'm thinking I know what you are meaning from the foal moving farther forward towards the center/in front of center...looking at a pic from yesterday and then from today, she looks more forward and lower.

Here are some comparison pics from yesterday to today. I see changes, but it could just be my anxiousness and wanting to see some changes. Sorry it's hard to see the captions on the pictures. They are all from yesterday and today (day 340 and 341). I paired them all up so it's easier to see and compare


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## eagles ring farm (Mar 25, 2014)

Won't be long now

The waiting is so hard


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## atotton (Mar 25, 2014)

Wow she is really starting to bag up. won't be much longer.


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## AnnaC (Mar 26, 2014)

Great comparison pictures! Doesn't look as though you will have long to wait to see this baby!


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##  (Mar 26, 2014)

You've definitely identified the changes between the two days. She won't wait much longer, I don't think. You'll be playing with baby VERY soon. Don't take your eyes off her or leave her without someone watching her now. She could go any time. Reread the pinned threads and be prepared! Baby is coming soon!


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## paintponylvr (Mar 26, 2014)

Awww, this should be a beautiful baby. Looking forward to seeing the results of all the long days of "baking"...!


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## amyjoy85 (Mar 30, 2014)

Sadie had her colt this morning around 4am. He was sorrel pinto, but may have been pintaloosa. He had striped hooves and only a couple white patches on the top of his rump. LONG legs. He may have been around 22-23" tall, but not sure. We didn't measure him. Cute little guy. We had the cams on that we just got 2 days ago, but didn't get out there soon enough. He couldn't get out of the bag. I'm mad at myself for not getting out there. We didn't see her go down and when we came back he was on the ground. We tried to help him survive, but he was too far gone. The vet wasn't too hopeful when we called her either. We didn't have her come out since it didn't look promising. Would have taken half an hour at least for her to get here. So frustrated!!!! Hard to lose him, especially since I feel it was my fault. I was pretty sure she was going to foal tonight just from different behaviors--didn't dump grain bucket, standing in different corner, and tried kicking me at feeding time. Other than that, there was nothing new or different than any other day or night. I'm gonna contact local vets in the morning and see if they know of any orphan foals...might be able to help someone not have to feed a foal every couple hours. Doubt there will be anyone, but ya never know. Poor Sadie is so anxious and depressed!! I don't blame her. I'm staying up watching her on the camera to make sure she doesn't colic from anxiety. She has been pacing, lays down every now and then, gets up, shakes her head, etc. I know she doesn't feel "good" for several reasons, but I still don't want her to colic. I really want a foal from those two, but at the same time, I don't want to go through the pregnancy and delivery aspect of things again. She seems to foal easily, but I don't want the risk for her or the risk of losing another foal to that. I've been considering gelding our stallion this spring--he's 18 now I think. I'd have to look at his papers. So many thoughts at 6am.


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## MissysMum (Mar 30, 2014)

I am so sorry for your loss, please don't blame yourself. You weren't to know.

Rest in Peace little one xx


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## eagles ring farm (Mar 30, 2014)

I'm so sorry for your loss...(((HUGS)))

so glad it sounds as your mare will be ok

It's so heartbreaking to lose a foal after waiting so long.

We almost came close to losing both our foals due to bag not tearing

but Thank God made it out in time both times, there is so little time to save that situation

I am thankful our house is very close to the barn and for marestare phone calls


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##  (Mar 30, 2014)

So sad to read this. Mom's have to grieve, too, so sometimes leaving baby with mom until she acknowledges her loss can take away her anxiety and help keep her from stressing too much.

She might also need some banamine -- 1cc/100 pounds. The birth can still be painful, and her behavior can be from pain as well as loss. The banamine will help settle her and relax her pain. Remember, even though there has been a loss, please give her some soft mushy feeds during this next 24 hours, to help her system get running again.

Sounds like your mare will be fine which is the important thing.

Breeding is not for the faint of heart, but if you're wanting a baby from this cross, don't be afraid to try again. An 18 year old stallion is 'young' for breeding, they can breed well into their 20's. The key is always taking the extra steps to watch and be there for the birth. I'm sure the next time, you'll be there and everything will turn out fine.

Again, I'm so sorry for your loss.


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## MountainWoman (Mar 30, 2014)

I am so sorry you lost your foal. I learned the hard way mares do grieve and it takes them a while. It's so painful and heartbreaking. Just sending you sympathy.


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## AnnaC (Mar 30, 2014)

I'm so sorry that you lost the foal. In spite of all the cameras etc etc, as we say, the only sure way is to be sitting with them on the run up to foaling. But even in spite of actually being with my girls, I lost a beautiful filly to an unbroken bag simply because the mare was quietly eating her hay and I needed the loo. Five minutes was too late!! Lesson learnt - no loo unless someone can take over!

Have you left the foal with her - most mares need the time to assure themselves that their baby is actually dead (and this can take anything from a day to a week or more), she will stress less if she is not 'searching' for her lost little one. But also, as Diane says, she may be in pain too and this can lead to unsettled behaviour.

Sending ((((HUGS)))) to you and to her, bless her.


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## amyjoy85 (Mar 30, 2014)

Oh, and the more we thought about it after the fact, we are pretty sure he was breech. His head was closer to Sadie's bum than his back feet. We don't think she had gotten up yet. We are so thankful that we still have Sadie!! I know it's easy to focus on the losing the baby and hard to remember to be thankful for our sweet mare.


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## Ryan Johnson (Mar 30, 2014)

So sorry to hear of your loss, Take Care ((((( HUGS))))


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##  (Mar 30, 2014)

The mare is the most important thing. The baby's are a gift, but saving the mare is the most important.

We've all lost a baby in the sac, well, I'm sure most of us have. So you have good company here. But, it makes us wiser next time. So, don't give up on your 'favorite' cross just yet.

Sending lots of {{{{HUGS}}}} to you, and hoping Sadie is doing better.


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## AnnaC (Mar 31, 2014)

How's Sadie this morning? Hope she's feeling better and more settled bless her. As Diane says, our mares are so special but the foals are a gift that, sadly, we are sometimes not allowed to have.

Again, ((((HUGS)))) for you both.


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## Barefootin (Mar 31, 2014)

Sorry for your loss. Don't beat yourself up too much over losing the colt. We all make mistakes no matter our experience. The key is to learn from those mistakes. Next time things will go better.


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## Bonny (Mar 31, 2014)

So Sorry.....


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## misty'smom (Mar 31, 2014)

I am so sorry you lost your colt, but thankful your Sadie is ok.


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## amyjoy85 (Apr 1, 2014)

Thanks everyone. Sadie is pretty depressed. Luckily she is eating and drinking though. I know if will take her some time to grieve. I feel bad for her. We put our 3 yr old filly in with her, and the filly is alpha right now. Very strange to see. Normally Sadie is alpha. She is very happy for the company though. Her milk supply is very low and I think our chance to put an orphan on her is gone. Haven't been able to find one anywhere since it's so early in the season.

I'm trying not to beat myself up over it, but still mad that I wasn't there in time. I had some hope when I got out there and he was still alive, but so hard to have him die in my arms after trying to help him. After-the-fact I keep thinking of different things I could have tried. I know I can't change anything, but it's still hard. I hate going down to the stall. It's just a reminder. Sadie isn't going in there at all either. In the mean time, we are just plugging along. I'm thinking I'm not going to breed her anymore. Foal was breech and 23.5-24" tall. He was pretty heavy too. Big baby for a 32" mare. I'm grateful that she was able to deliver him and be okay though!! I think we are just going to look for a foal to get this spring/summer at auction or as a rescue. That's how we got our 3yr old. She was in bad shape as a 6 month old. 23" tall (20" at birth), skin, bones, and fur is all that made her. We got her for $150, even though owners asked for $400. She is an excellent horse, very healthy, and will make an INCREDIBLE driving horse. Neat mover!! Anyhow, that would be a safer route in terms of safety for Sadie and would help another foal rather than making another one. There are tons of minis in our area and also a handful of kill pens.

After he had dried off and hubby got home Sunday afternoon, we buried him in the back pasture in our "animal graveyard". He looked so much like Sadie in terms of color. Had the same nose color. He was definitely more appy than anything. Mottled genitals, striped hooves. He had all white long legs, and 3 very strange spots on top of his hips-almost like lines in some ways. Would have been neat to see him clipped and see what those spots/stripes really were. He was really cool looking.


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## AnnaC (Apr 1, 2014)

I love the way you are thinking amongst all the sadness - to perhaps rescue a foal like you did with your 3 year old, would be a fitting tribute to the little one you have lost.

So glad to hear that Sadie is eating and drinking ok, it sounds as though she will soon be back to her old self, she just needs time and your love.


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##  (Apr 1, 2014)

That's a wonderful idea about adopting/purchasing another foal. There are so many out there, and certainly Sadie would not be at risk. Such kind thinking.

I'm glad Sadie is doing well. And don't beat yourself up, these things happen in breeding. And if you choose not to breed again, but can give another little one a wonderful home, that's sensational!


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## targetsmom (Apr 2, 2014)

I am just reading this and want to add how sorry I am. This happened to me TWICE, with the same mare both times, with her on Mare Stare. I feel your pain. We decided never to breed our favorite all around mare (and we never did) and now we have given up breeding entirely. Our stallion and his yearling colt are being gelded next week. We feel lucky to have never lost a mare. I do not miss the stress and sleepless nights at all. If I want another mini I will buy just what I want and save money and grief.


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##  (Apr 2, 2014)

Mary, it's so nice that you stopped in. We all miss you and your wonderful input. I read your post that you were giving up breeding, and gelding your boys. You have produced some incredible babies with that wonderful stallion, and we hope you will continue to come here and share with everyone, and post some pictures of those beautiful babies!


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## AnnaC (Apr 3, 2014)

I agree with Diane - we will so miss your knowledgable input, your friendship and the pics of your beautiul furkids. Hoping that you will stay in touch and post us lots of updated pictures every now and again.


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