# NSPR Registering



## MDMminis (Jul 26, 2006)

I was wondering comments on registering shetlands NSPR? I'm wondering if it would be worth the cost, what are your thoughts on the value of the shetland if there NSPR? My colt's sire is the only one registered and he's shetland but his dam isn't registered so its my only option. Unless anybody has any other registry's, he's also going to be registered pinto and possibly tested for the TT gene. I don't think he will make AMHR since he will most likely mature over 38ins?


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## Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis (Jul 26, 2006)

Well NSPR as far as I understand it is meant to be a performance registry not a breeding one. It is open to ANY breed of horse 14.2 and under (again as I Understand it I could be wrong) as long as one parent is ASPC or AMHR reg and the foal is DNA'd along with that ASPC/R parent.

AS far as promoting a shetland NSPR again I dont think it would work well as a BREEDING program same goes with Pinto Assoc but there is plenty to do and will be more as NSPR continues to grow performance wise.

I wouldnt by a horse for my own personal breeding stock that was only NSPR or even Pinto reg only personally but that said we do have a 13.2 hand pony we may consider at some point breeding so the foal can be NSPR reg.


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## MDMminis (Jul 27, 2006)

Well i was planning on him being a nice showmanship colt but also for breeding. I was wondering if he would have the quailty of a breeder with just NSPR papers?


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## disneyhorse (Jul 27, 2006)

You might get some "negative" feedback on this question.

Many breeders look down their noses at unregistered breeding stallions or horses that are registered with less-prestigious registries or papers.

Most breeders breed with the intent of "bettering the breed" and breeding the finest registered animals that they are able to. They desire to make sure that the resulting foal has everything at it's disposal to make it a marketable animal that will be valuable enough to prevent it from future misfortune (a registered animal _may_ be ultimately less likely to end up in a feed lot or working some crappy pony ride, for instance). There are SO many inferior REGISTERED animals that to breed an unregistered animal just doesn't make sense. Particularly stallions, which should always be held to the highest scrutiny.

No one is going to say that your horse is inferior, or not correct, or not a nice temperament, because we haven't seen him in person and can't make that sort of judgement. But just because he is not registered properly in the first place sort of automatically makes him unfit to keep as a stallion in most breeder's minds.

Lots of puppy-mill or backyard breeders don't really care about registration or quality, and concientious breeders just get upset about that. They spend as much money as they can afford for the nicest stock they can find, and they put a lot of money, time, effort, and heartache into their business or hobby.

I don't have an opinion on the NSPR... I think it's a great registry for kids wanting to show the ASPC horses and have another set of classes they can do performance in.

For breeding purposes, the more easily a horse can be registered in a registry, the less prestigious it tends to be. If a "mutt" or "grade" horse can get papers, then the bloodlines are not as deep, and thus the whole point of the papers is sort of pointless. Papers are great because you can trace bloodlines very far back, but not if any old grade horse is in it.

That's just my opinion I suppose, and a warning to you that you might not get any responses that please you.

Andrea


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## Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis (Jul 27, 2006)

LOL Disney while I agree... in essence our minis are a grade breed that is very easy to get into the registry(ok until last year with AMHR) so yes they have a pedigree but only cause it is easy and was easy to get them into the registry in the first place




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However again NSPR is not meant to be a breeding reg. It is for those that wish to continue to use there stock and be able to do more performance thus having bigger ponies to be able to do more with so if your question is simply would I be interested in breeding to or purchasing a NSPR only shetland my answer would be no


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## MDMminis (Jul 27, 2006)

So more less point blank if i register him NSPR he'll be use less for breeding?


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## disneyhorse (Jul 27, 2006)

Well he won't be USELESS for breeding unless he's a gelding



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Anyway, I don't think registering him NSPR is going to make him or his foals any more marketable to anyone. If you want to show him NSPR, then go ahead and register him.

But a grade horse isn't useless for breeding, you just have to realize his foals will not command as much money as a registered foal might, and people are probably going to be less interested in breeding to a stallion that is unregistered, particularly if their mare is registered, so you won't be able to get as much in a stud fee.

If breeding some type of grade pony is what you are interested in doing though, he won't be useless. But from your previous posts I had seen that you were interested in starting a shetland breeding program of some sort. In that case I would probably mare sure to invest money in breeding stock that was registered, so that all your foals could be.

Andrea


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## MDMminis (Jul 27, 2006)

I hope i understand you right lol. Ok well i will be registering him NSPR and Pinto. He does have a good background from his dad which should help him in breeding. But no i won't leave him as a grade pony, i'm not looking to turn a profit on it but yea down the road i'll be getting registered stock since he has 2-3yrs before he is going to be a breeding stud.



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Thanks that helps me some what.


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## crponies (Jul 28, 2006)

If I remember right, you cannot register offspring of NSPR ponies with the NSPR. It is meant to produce performance ponies for doing performance not for breeding. So, you can register your colt with NSPR but not any foals he might have in the future. Your only outlet for them would be Pinto.


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## Leeana (Jul 28, 2006)

Another option (and the way i would go) would be to registry WCMHR. They have a pony division as well and all foals will be registered WCMHR. Its easy to find AMHR/WCMHR double registered mini's and most i see are AMHR/WCMHR if there not AMHA/AMHR. Its only $75 to register him into WCMHR and you could also show him in allot of classes, they have halter, jumping, driving, showmanship, obsticle ...everything that ASPC and AMHR has. Also there nat'l/world show is in North Carilina (or around there) ...so its not very far and there are allot of good horses there. You would have a WCMHR/Pinto registered horse and thats the way i would go.

If you registered him NSPR, those ponies go up to 14.2hh and i havnt seen any NSPR classes at any of the shows i've been to. It would be much more worth you money to go with WCMHR/Pinto



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## kaykay (Jul 28, 2006)

MDM even if he stays under 38" you cannot register him amhr. I think we explained that in your other post that you got upset about us going off topic. You can only hardship a horse into AMHR that is already AMHA or ASPC registered.

Please keep in mind that you asked the question and I am going to give you my honest answer. If you want to be taken seriously you need to have an ASPC registered stallion that is the top of the top. A good thing would be to attend some shows and see what is winning and desirable. That way you can also meet some breeders that have been doing this all their lives and are very happy to share information with people newer to showing and breeding Shetlands.

As mentioned above the NSPR is just to showcase performance ponies. It is NOT a breeding registry. So foals from your stallion will be grade.

Also wanted to say I see your from ohio. You are welcome to come here anytime and see our ponies etc.


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## Leeana (Jul 28, 2006)

Kay brings up a good point.

Your only about 1/2hr or 45min from the Taylor pony farm who is basically best of the best in shetlands. They have some really nice foals for sale at the moment that are ASPC and you cannot beat the michigan bloodline or horses in the ring, believe me ..i've tried!





If you'd like to go over to Kay's and see her place we should be going over next month sometime, your more then welcome to follow us down or catch a ride with us.

He's very nice, if you really like him and are set on registering him with something and using him for breeding you should go with WCMHR/Pinto.

Also when i said its easy to find AMHR/WCMHR mini's i ment if you were looking in the future for a mare, i didnt mean that this colt would be AMHR/WCMHR. sorry that sounded really confusing, good luck


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## MDMminis (Jul 28, 2006)

I know alot about Taylor Pony Farm the father of Copper was born, raised, and sold to this breeder from them. Thats why he has Michigans King Pin in his lines which one of there hall of famers. Copper has Rockets pedigree which makes him a very incrediable colt no matter who his mother are its still in his blood. I don't have the money "or" time to go browsing at pony farms to see something i already know about.

A pony is a pony no matter what there registered with it doesn't make them any better than anybody else. I've met breeders and they agree its not about money or how much people "say" your pony is worth its about how much you feel he's worth. I don't need a super star stallion to look fancy in a show ring, it doesn't give you respect or anything because a peice of paper.

Another thing i do love GC's ponies, i'll save the trip KayKay if i want to go see some nice ponies she's down the road. I'm not saying i don't agree with you i do like registered ponies but not when people act like thats the only thing that matters. He will be a breeding stud but his foals "can" be registered if he's bred to AMHA, AMHR, Grade, Other Registry or ASPR. He will also carry his fathers bloodline down.


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## Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis (Jul 28, 2006)

MDMminis said:


> I He will be a breeding stud but his foals "can" be registered if he's bred to AMHA, AMHR, Grade, Other Registry or ASPR. He will also carry his fathers bloodline down.


I guess I am confused here or perhaps not understanding what you are saying. ANY OF HIS FOALS CANNOT be registered ANYTHING other then pinto or perhaps WCMHR if they are HARDSHIPPED or he is reg with WCMHR as is the dam.

I agree that registration isnt everything and there are many nice grade horses out there doing there job wonderfully as performance horses like I said Raven will be getting a grade pony this weekend a wonderful hunter pony who is kid safe and is good at her job HOWEVER just so you are very clear his foals cannot be registered AMHA, R. ASPC or anything else again unless they are pinto and are reg in as that.

I think that everyone is just saying if your heart is in the breeding aspect and marketing those foals then yes usually registration matters. If your heart is in enjoying your pony and breeding a foal or 2 to keep then that is ok as well.

I am sure at some point in a few years Raven will want to breed her grade pony. We will look for a nice ASPC reg pony and reg the pony NSPR at least that is the plan now.

Bottom line as long as you enjoy your horse and are happy with him that is all that really counts


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## MDMminis (Jul 28, 2006)

Ok, these are the rules of NSPR. If Copper is "registered" to another "registered" mare the foal can be register ASPR. If "NOT" they can be registered NSPR or Pinto or both if wanted. He will be registered NSPR and Pinto, he also will be tested for TT. If i think he will be a good show stud i'll be using him as a breeder.

He will carry down his fathers pedigree no matter what he's registered with. But yes his foals will be able to be registered depends if the mother is grade or not. Both parents do NOT have to be registered to be NSPR or AMHA, WCMHR etc. The foals might not be able to be ASPR registered but they can still be registered. ASPR is not the most famous pony registry and it doesn't form the horse.

Showing, working, time etc.. that makes your breeding a good program and improves the breeder not because Snicker Ban Joe's is ASPR or somebody high primes in his lines. Alot of Buckeroo liners sell for way to much yes "Buckeroo" has a tittle but unless your horse does i don't see any real value. He has to work to own his own tittle to be worth what people say they are.


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## Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis (Jul 28, 2006)

sigh....


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## kaykay (Jul 28, 2006)

First of all i was not asking you to visit to sell you a pony. I dont have any for sale



I was just inviting you to learn more about shetland ponies and have some fun here at my farm. Please ask "GC" who has helped her along the way. You might be suprised at the answer.

I was lucky enough to be blessed with wonderful breeders who taught me along the way. They spent their valuable time teaching me all about Shetland ponies and miniature horses. I always promised myself I would return the favor when I met new people. And this is what I try to do, and this is all I was trying to do with you. I FOR SURE do NOT know everything!!! But I do think Ive learned a little bit and I learn more everytime i visit with other breeders that have been doing this their entire lives.

NO HORSE is worthless and I never said that. But you asked about his breeding potential as an NSPR horse and I gave you an honest answer

This is for sure my LAST post on any thread you start.


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## MDMminis (Jul 28, 2006)

Yea i'm sure GC has learned alot from breeders. But i won't just go to somebody's house for really no reason. If you want to teach me anything you can message me, pm me, e-mail me etc. There's many ways besides me paying $3 a gallon for you to tell me something you could tell me online.


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## Leeana (Jul 28, 2006)

I have said it before and i will prob say it for many years to come, i owe just about everything to Kay. She taught me to show and got me into showing and god knows i'd never been able to do it without her or Fran. Kay to say you 'helped' is very much an understatement, you dont give yourself enough credit for how good you are at what you do. Kay taught me how to show, clip, handle and allot of other things and Thanks is not enough for what she has done!

If i remember correctly, Kay learned from the best of the best ..Lowell Boone if im not mistaken (yes, the 'Boones Little Buckaroo' Boone).





MDM if you want to come over your more then welcome but i have NOTHING compared to what Kay has and many other miniature horse and shetland people here.

I do hope you figure all this out!



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## MDMminis (Jul 28, 2006)

Yea Kaykay seems very nice and wants to help but for right now i'm not really looking into much stuff since well one he's only a few months of age. Theres not much the little man can do, another like i said i don't have money to pay for gas or my time to make a 30min-1hr trip when i have people around me that i can learn from.

I'm not into big showing and its not my clear future either, neither is being a big time breeder. So i'll stick to online information i've got far on my own and i won't lean on somebody else for help its not who i am. I like to depend on myself to do the things i want and not copy over people.



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## kaykay (Jul 28, 2006)

This is to leanna and yes its off topic






Thank you so much for your post, it really means a lot to me. You have come such a long way from the first time I met you!!

You are so OPEN to learning new things and always wanting to do better! this is what will make you a great horsewoman. Like I told your dad, with some more experience you are going to be a force to be reckoned with





There are some people who just cannot be taught and do not WANT to learn. I know myself everytime i meet another breeder/handler/trainer i learn something new. I never want to stop learning more about horses!!


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## MDMminis (Jul 28, 2006)

I might look into showing outside of just open shows but i'm not sure. I might talk to you outside LB Leanna i'm adding a few questions for you direct. But anyways to jump us back on track, i think i'll still look into him being a breeding stud since he has a good bloodline and he might come out as TT in which i'll be testing him for.


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## JennyB (Jul 28, 2006)

[SIZE=12pt]Well this is my opinion for what it's worth. I think a person can't really judge an animal by pictures alone 100%, so I can't say that MDM's colt is NOT stallion material. He looks very nice and just because his dam is not a registered Shetland dosen't mean he is any less of a pony or a possible stallion propect. I would guess that most grade ponies who look like Shetlands are indeed Shetlands and just either didn't get registered or lost their paperwork.[/SIZE]

As for the NSPR, I think it's going to be a wonderful registry. It will give people opportunities with their ponies that they never had before. True right now you can't register NSPR to NSPR, but I might guess that will change in the future when there are many champion NSPR ponies out there and they will need to be bred to other Champion NSPR ponies. I have no idea why they aren't allowing this in the first place...gee many AMHR miniatures are a hodge podge of Shetland, POA, Arabian, Welsh, Hackney...what makes this registry any different. I think it's a real deal for pinto painted ponies as they can be registered Pinto and NSPR. If you can register your mini, pony or horse with as many registrations as you can, I would. Every single one of them makes your animal more valuable. So MDM I would registry Copper NSPR, Pinto and WCMHR. Like I say you never know what's going to happen down the road. Besides the Pinto National show ring is a GREAT place to show off your little guy! Plus you can show him at NSPR and WCMHR shows also..3 great arenas for him to make a great champion! Go for it :aktion033:

My stallion is registered ASPC, AMHR, Pinto and his get are eligible for NSPR also. I think that is GREAT! Plus to get them registered with NSPR they must be DNA'd so there you have their DNA for other registrations. I think ALL registries will be asking for their foals to be DNA'd someday.

Like I say JMO

Jenny :saludando:


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## keeperofthehorses (Jul 29, 2006)

MDMminis said:


> I was wondering comments on registering shetlands NSPR? I'm wondering if it would be worth the cost, what are your thoughts on the value of the shetland if there NSPR? My colt's sire is the only one registered and he's shetland but his dam isn't registered so its my only option. Unless anybody has any other registry's, he's also going to be registered pinto and possibly tested for the TT gene. I don't think he will make AMHR since he will most likely mature over 38ins?


I'm another one that's really excited about the NSPR registry. I'd love to get a shetland-sired sport-pony out of my TB mare. Eventually... it's on the 'to-do' list.



: The sport pony market is one that is really hot right now. I think the NSPR is going to give the registry a great opportunity to expand it's market. I also think that if/when the NSPR gains in popularity, eventually there will be an expanded offering of classes and full registry privileges. Right now, it's limited to just 3 classes I believe, and no offspring registry privileges. But if you get him trained up to drive, you could show him in their harness class.

Another option is the Show Pony division of WCMHR. If he stays under, he could go in their miniature division instead. AMHR closed their registry last year to all except AMHA & ASPC critters. I have a grade shetland mare that I registered with WCMHR just so I can show her in open shows. We don't have any WCMHR shows out this way yet, but those papers will open the door for her in local open events. It didn't increase her value at all, and didn't magically make her breeding worthy, but now we can have some fun with her at shows.

I think your colt is a cutie-patootie.


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## MDMminis (Jul 30, 2006)

I don't know if he would make WCMHR i think they have to be under so many inches? I'm not sure i haven't visited there site or anything because i don't know about them. Yea i got noisy and was browsing sites on NSPR ponies and they have some amazing breeders and such. So i think if he builds a nice show record he'd make an amazing breeder. Your right the market is getting hot for NSPR ponies for there showing records and with his pinto color flared in he'll burn up the show ring.



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Thanks for the comments as well i can't wait to get my lil man home. Now i thought the parent that was registered had to be DNA tested? Or is it just the foal that has to be. Thanks


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## Lisa-Ruff N Tuff Minis (Jul 30, 2006)

Yes the foal (meaning your horse) and his sire would both need to be DNA'd in order for him to be NSPR and then every resulting foal would have to be DNA'd to be reg NSPR they dont have like stallion reports and such as it is not a breeding registry but a performance one


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## MDMminis (Jul 30, 2006)

Thanks Lisa. I should be getting him home in a few weeks then i'll getthe DNA test (blood) and i'll get one from his dad. I'll sort threw all the blood testing stuff later and such when i get him. I think its much easier with out the stallion reports alot less stress.



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