# CONFUSED



## Bailey (Apr 7, 2014)

This is my story. I was delivered this beautiful mare on April 12, 2013. In August 2013 one of her udders swell and I called the Vet out. He told me she was in foal and the baby was putting pressure on her milk duct. The previous owner never breed her but again she didn't breed her the last time and she delivered a filly in July 2012. October 2013, I called the Vet out again to check on her. He told me the foal was active. Will today she still has not done anything so I am beginning to think she is not in foal. Here is some current pictures. She will be 6 years old on April 12 and she has delivered one foal.


----------



## Ryan Johnson (Apr 8, 2014)

Hey bailey ,

Welcome , maybe we can get your thread moved to the mare stare forum . As I'm sure you will have plenty of questions about your mare , it will be the perfect place for the aunties to answer.

Have a read thru the threads & the pinned threads on the mare stare forum , there is some valuable information to help you and your mare foal safely .

Good luck , hoping we can all help you thru your final stages

Cheers Ryan


----------



## Bailey (Apr 8, 2014)

Thanks Ryan but I believe this little girl is not in foal. She is at least 361 days and not doing anything. I will keep a close eye on her. I posted a comment on the nail test post and a couple ladies wanted to see her. If anything changes I will let you know.


----------



## Bailey (Apr 8, 2014)

This morning no change in udder.


----------



## Bailey (Apr 8, 2014)

first picture taken April 13, 2013 and second picture taken Feb. 13, 2014


----------



## chandab (Apr 8, 2014)

Don't count her out just yet as being pregnant, I know of at least one mini mare that carried 371 days from a known breeding date, so over a year isn't unheard of. If you really want to know, there is always a trip to the vet to check her out. And, its possible she was pregnant when the vet last saw her and isn't now, but from the looks of her, it looks like more than winter fluff and weight.


----------



## Bailey (Apr 8, 2014)

She has all the signs: butt rubbing, biting at sides, *attitude*, rolling and what seems and feels like foal movement. Her bag is just not filling up. I figure I would keep her on watch out until the end of month.


----------



## AnnaC (Apr 8, 2014)

Hi Bailey, glad to see you here! It is certainly possible that your pretty little girl IS pregnant - she maybe one of those mares who produces a proper udder as she actually foals. With her colouring the udder pictures are not that clear but IMO it does look as though there is some movement there from a normal 'flat' udder. Any chance that you could get us a close up picture of her side-on so we could see the shape of her tummy and perhaps one from the back with her standing square so we can see how baby is lying.

Meanwhile continue doing what you are doing and keep a good eye on her just in case - also dont forget to check the colour inside her vulva, even if she doesn't get much of an udder before she foals, she may well change her vulva colour to more of a red/deep red to give you a clue!


----------



##  (Apr 8, 2014)

I don't know about you, but I see changes. I wouldn't give up on her yet. Dream JUST started an udder a couple of days ago, and birth is rather imminent -- next few days, we think. I had a mare who routinely foaled at 365 each and every year, so I think you might be surprised!










Here's another girl who had no udder, and Dream's udder difference in just 3 days!

/monthly_03_2014/post-8375-0-93125100-1395838051_thumb.jpg/monthly_04_2014/post-8375-0-08478300-1396986236_thumb.jpg

See Huybers Utopia thread.


----------



## Bailey (Apr 8, 2014)

I just came in from taking these photos at different views.


----------



## Ryan Johnson (Apr 8, 2014)

Some Mares like to take their time before they decide its time to show the world what they have been hiding. If you have a look at my thread you will see im in the same boat as you.

Glad you have joined, the ladies on here are wonderful, their knowledge and kindness is amazing.


----------



## Bailey (Apr 8, 2014)

okay the first picture was taken oct.3, 2013 the second picture was taken march 29, 2014, the third photo was taken march 30, 2014 and the last photo was taken march 19, 2014.

In the first photo she was lopsided. Second and Third she started bagging but then deflated. The last speaks for itself.


----------



##  (Apr 8, 2014)

Personally, I say there is progress. I think she's filling an udder, and you can even see it in her side shot. So, give her a little time to fill a little more and get those nipples pointing straight down, and I think you'll see a little one.


----------



## Bailey (Apr 8, 2014)

My heart skip a beat reading your post. I hope she is because otherwise my family will think I am crazy.


----------



##  (Apr 8, 2014)

Well, I could be wrong, it happens to all of us, but I really think she's making progress from your first pictures, so we'll see for sure!


----------



## Ryan Johnson (Apr 8, 2014)

Funny my family think I am crazy aswell. lol


----------



## Bailey (Apr 8, 2014)

My boys are keeping a eye on little Jazz. (Her Big Brothers)


----------



## AnnaC (Apr 9, 2014)

I agree with Diane and think you will soon be seeing a little one.



Keeping my fingers crossed for you.

Love that last pic!!


----------



## Bailey (Apr 9, 2014)

Front and back as of this morning.


----------



## Bailey (Apr 9, 2014)

I have noticed for the last week or so that Jazz's whole rear end is getting really soft. It is so soft when I press down in one area it jiggles in another.


----------



## Ryan Johnson (Apr 9, 2014)

Sounds like she is starting to relax for the big event. Should start to feel like jelly on either side of her tail bone.


----------



## Flame (Apr 9, 2014)

Hi Bailey, this sounds all normal



are you prepared for a foal?



do as much research on here as possible, watch the foaling videos and read through what you'll need in your foaling kit & keep us updated



maybe one of the other ladies can give you an idea of how long she'll have to go now that her backside is all mushy



Good luck!


----------



## Bailey (Apr 9, 2014)

http://youtu.be/7Uwz90DYlKo

I am not certain she is in foal. She seems to have all the signs but its been almost a year since I got her. Can you tell by this video if this is foal movement or gut movement?


----------



## Ryan Johnson (Apr 9, 2014)

To me that is that looks like one very active baby. Don't quote me on it tho I want some of the other more experienced people on here to see......

Can you feel kicking at all ?? ( Best time to feel is during her eating and having a drink)


----------



## Bailey (Apr 9, 2014)

It seems like it but again I don't know..


----------



## Ryan Johnson (Apr 9, 2014)

I know exactly how you feel , The is she or isn't she lol.

At the end of the day no one knows your mare better than you do. Have you had the vet look at her since Oct ?


----------



## Flame (Apr 9, 2014)

Looks like movement to me too, it's not uncommon for them to stay in foal for 12 months, my vet actually said to me 'the 11 months is just a guide, there's know need to be concerned if she goes to 12 months' it's just comfortable in her mummy


----------



## AnnaC (Apr 10, 2014)

From your pictures, what you have been reporting and now the video, I would say that there is a baby in there. She is still carrying a bit 'wide' which is why you are seeing so much movement, baby will suddenly 'drop' lower into her tummy as the birth gets closer and then any movement decreases.

I would be keeping a very close eye on her as any changes at this stage can happen very fast. You may soon be able to prove to your family that you are not crazy - of course this is just my opinion and I have been proved wrong before, but hoping ...............................


----------



## Bailey (Apr 10, 2014)

I will definitely watch her. Thank you All for the help.


----------



## Bailey (Apr 11, 2014)

I see no change in her. Is it safe to say she is not in foal considering it will be one year tomorrow. All four photos taken today.


----------



## Flame (Apr 12, 2014)

I was just doing some research and one site said they can deliver from 10 months to 12 months + 10 days? And that the foal will most likely be born measuring about 22" - 23" and have a fuller coat, I'm not much help just trying to give you piece of mind



and another site said that their udder can deflate through the day so best to check at night



so maybe don't give up on her just yet or maybe get the vet out to give her a once over just in case it's something else. Good luck keep us updated


----------



## weerunner (Apr 12, 2014)

To me it looks like her nipples are filling, and that seems to be too much of an udder for a non-pregnant mare. I'm the owner of Dream, the mare that took 4 days from no udder at all to full and waxing and then foaling. My girl was 350 days along when she foaled. Keep watching her, she looks suspicious to me.


----------



## Bailey (Apr 12, 2014)

today

It's been 1 year today and its also Jazz's 6th birthday.


----------



## Ryan Johnson (Apr 12, 2014)

I agree with Amanda those nipples look as tho they are filling . Now is the time to keep a careful watch on her .

If you can't be there to keep an eye on her , see if you can get someone to sit with her whilst your not there .

It can all happen very quickly , best of luck Bailey


----------



## Bailey (Apr 12, 2014)

Let me introduce her to you all. Her name is Pecos East All That Jazz.

Sire: Southridge Double Dynasty

Grandsire: Alvadars Double Destiny

Granddam: Bond Taffeta Tilly

Dam: Pecos East Haz Da Pizzazz

Grandsire: Dena Dales Red Shadow

Granddam: JPF Firecraker


----------



##  (Apr 12, 2014)

I'm in agreement.....just keep a close eye on her. She looks like she's moving forward, so 'forget' the day count, and just keep a close eye on her!


----------



## Bailey (Apr 13, 2014)

top left 11/13 top right 12/13

middle left 01/14 middle right 02/14

bottom left 03/14 bottom right 04/14


----------



## Ryan Johnson (Apr 13, 2014)

How is she today Bailey?


----------



## Bailey (Apr 13, 2014)

Today was exciting. My husband felt the foal kick 3 times in a roll. I am no longer the only one in the family that has felt movement. Today she was doing tons of butt rubbing and biting between her front legs. Still not increasing much in the udder. She is at least 366+ days from the time I got her today.


----------



## Ryan Johnson (Apr 13, 2014)

That's all good, she may not completely grow the udder until she foals. The Butt rubbing is completely normal and if she is having a few good rolls Jazz maybe trying to turn baby into position.

If you feel she is starting to show you a few signs that the slow cooker maybe starting to finish cooking, nows the time to have your foaling kit ready to go. (Great pinned thread up the top with all the info you need to put together your own kit)

See if you can take a few pics when you can. One looking at her side , and from behind so the experts can view where baby is riding.

Where abouts are you located ? Hoping the weathers nice for you


----------



## Bailey (Apr 13, 2014)

http://youtu.be/t0bBiG9koJ8

This is Jazz this evening....


----------



## Bailey (Apr 14, 2014)

How is she looking?

First photo underneath the belly.( front feet bottom of photo)


----------



## Flame (Apr 14, 2014)

Can't really tell from those pics




you need to take one directly from behind ( kneel or squat down and get it at her level, not standing over her) and a side view down from her level too and also one of her vulva, sorry to be a pain :/

I've never actually had a pregnant mare before until now but I've learnt everything off here lol if you get stuck just go through some of the other post to look at how they take their pics


----------



## Dontworrybeappy (Apr 14, 2014)

Can you get a vet to check her again? That way you'll be sure it isn't a false pregnancy. My gal Abbie was looking pregnant but not ready at 343 days from last breeding and so I had the vet check her then... there was a live foal, so I put her in a camera stall and put a foaling pager on her. Well, now she's 371 days along and still not looking as "ready" as most other mares look! But we know for sure there's one in there, no way could it have gone missing after 343!


----------



## Bailey (Apr 14, 2014)

I can definitely feel it now. It is getting stronger. I hope everything is all right since she is hanging on to it so long. She is approximately any where from 367 days to 371 days. I will call my Vet tomorrow and see what he thinks. I will update with his information.


----------



## Bailey (Apr 14, 2014)

I will update more photos once the rain stops here.....


----------



##  (Apr 14, 2014)

Can't wait to hear what your vet says. Goodness, the ladies are certainly carrying a longgggggg time this year!


----------



## Bailey (Apr 15, 2014)

This morning...

My veterinary is coming this afternoon.


----------



## JAX (Apr 15, 2014)




----------



## Bailey (Apr 15, 2014)

The vet doesn't think Jazz is in foal base on how far along she would be. He said she was healthy and it could possibly be hormones making her brain think she was pregnant. He couldn't feel any movement and I couldn't either. He said he could do a blood test but since she is this far along and nothing is happening it doesn't make sense to do one. He did notice her swelling in her udder but again hormones.. is it time to give up.....


----------



## JAX (Apr 15, 2014)

Well darn it!!


----------



## AnnaC (Apr 15, 2014)

What a shame! She certainly looks as though she has a baby in there in the side-on pictures. And feeling or seeing any movement at this stage is not unusual, so I would still keep a watch on her just in case - so many of the mares seem to be carrying well over the normal limits this year.


----------



## Ryan Johnson (Apr 15, 2014)

Hey Bailey,

As Anna said I would be keeping a close watch on her. My mare is going thru the same thing unfortunately. I have had the vet out a lot of late. Going thru one of those things where its just a case of being unlucky with horses. Abscesses , Suspected broken Pedal bone (thank goodness it wasn't ) Laminitis and a possibly pregnant mare.

My mare had an internal done two weeks ago and it could not be confirmed if she was still carrying or not. I asked my vet why she would still be showing signs that she is still in foal if shes actually not. My vet believes that she was indeed pregnant but has most likely miscarried along the way , possibly reabsorbing the foetus which in turn is leading her hormones to believe she is still carrying.

To be honest I am sure I can still see movement in my mare & I am a firm believer that whilst I trust my vet and will ring her with even the slightest of concern , No one knows your mare better than you.

Also as you can see there are a lot of mares that are carrying well over there due date,

Good luck to both of you


----------



##  (Apr 15, 2014)

There are false pregnancies, but watching her a little while longer won't hurt. Just keep us posted for a little while more....and she if she's being sneaky!


----------



## Bailey (Apr 15, 2014)

I will continue to watch her until the end of this month because I can't believe she doesn't have something in there. I see and feel movement or I am seeing and feeling something else. Just like my title...I am confused...


----------



## Flame (Apr 15, 2014)

how can a vet tell u she's not in foal based on how far she is????? That's silly, some vets get me upset grrrrr! You poor thing



you must be going out of your mind.

Your doing the right thing





Good luck & I'll keep checking in to see if there's any news


----------



## Bailey (Apr 16, 2014)

top picture is Jazz on 04/13/13 day after I got her. bottom picture was taken 04/15/14. (yesterday morning)


----------



## Bailey (Apr 16, 2014)

April 9

Can you see any difference?

April 16


----------



## Flame (Apr 17, 2014)

I can't tell with the udder but the top two pics WOW huge difference not just because she has her winter coat but her shape, it's not even a hay belly shape either, sorry I'm not much help.

The only advise I have for you is to keep your eyes on her, but also try and mentally prepare yourself to except that she may have lost it



I'm praying she hasn't but god works in mysterious ways unfortunately



I'll keep checking in in both if you. Take care of yourself


----------



## Bailey (Apr 19, 2014)

Nothing is happening with Jazz so I think we can say she is just having a false pregnancy like the Vet DX her with. She looks like she got less belly hanging now also.


----------



## AnnaC (Apr 19, 2014)

From those pictures I would say that, sadly, you no longer have a pregnant mare. So sorry!!


----------



##  (Apr 20, 2014)

Yes, I agree. Sorry this didn't work out for you, but perhaps next year. Please stay and join our other threads, we love having everyone share their experiences and value their opinions.


----------



## Bailey (Apr 20, 2014)

Thank You all so much...I am planning on breeding her to a palomino owned by a local breeder but I don't know when she will come in heat. The Vet said something about I wouldn't have to do anything to her unless I wanted to breed. I am not sure what he meant because at the time I wasn't even going to think about that. I was wondering if she would come into heat if she was around a stallion.


----------



## Ryan Johnson (Apr 21, 2014)

You Might want to clarify with your vet to what he was talking about re breeding her ?


----------



##  (Apr 21, 2014)

I think that sometimes being around a stallion helps them move into heat, but certainly not scientific. She'll come into heat when she's ready. Perhaps you vet wanted to culture her to be sure she's breeding sound with no infection that might cause her difficulties. It is certainly worth doing if she's never been done. Especially, if you want to be sure she didn't 'catch' anything last time.


----------



## Bailey (Apr 22, 2014)

Taken today and If I didn't know better!!


----------



## Ryan Johnson (Apr 22, 2014)

She is very cute Bailey.


----------



## Bailey (Apr 22, 2014)

Look at her belly right and left side. See the difference in her sides. How can that be? She got the reverse look..


----------



##  (Apr 22, 2014)

Well, we can still watch her -- even if we're waiting for her to come into heat. LOL Sure is strange, though. She doesn't look like a mare that's overweight, and so might have that belly, and in some pictures it seems like there is no belly. I think I'd still be watching her, at least until the end of the month!

I had a mare (new to me at the beginning of breeding season the summer before) who daily had me confused for months. One day I'd think she was pregnant -- and she looked pregnant -- and the next day I'd just scratch my head and decide she wasn't pregnant. This went on for at least 3 months. Then I decided she certainly wasn't pregnant -- she had no belly and no udder, and I put her in with some other ladies. I was very sad when later that evening I went out to feed and there lay her baby still in the sack on the ground, with her standing guard. Very sad, but made me realize that these ladies can really fool you right up to the last minute. She looked exactly the same as when I left her in the morning except now she had a full udder and a lost little one.

So, I guess I'd just watch until she comes into heat again. We've got nothing better to do than help you watch while we all wait.


----------



## AnnaC (Apr 23, 2014)

I agree with Diane - these mares are so good at fooling us (either being in foal or not), that I dont trust them until there is absolutely no possibility of them producing anything!


----------



## Bailey (Apr 23, 2014)

Play Time!


----------



## JAX (Apr 24, 2014)

Hahahaha oh yes play time indeed!! Love it when they feel so good!


----------



## blueberryburlap (Apr 24, 2014)

What a beautiful girl!! So sorry for the roller coaster you've been on





My mare just foaled Sunday and that was after probably 3 months of the same: is she or isn't she?(We bought her in July and were told she was exposed from December 2012-April 2013) So I definitely feel for you!

Just from some of the pictures you posted, I would guess she was pregnant but something happened or it was a false pregnancy? Either way, keep an eye on her and let us know when she comes in heat or ... ???





Hope to see a foaling thread for her next year, too!!


----------



## Bailey (Apr 24, 2014)

Sharing the Drool


----------



## AnnaC (Apr 25, 2014)

She's such an attractive mare - she will have a beautiful baby, if not now then sometime in the future. Good luck!


----------



##  (Apr 25, 2014)

Well said, Anna! DITTO!


----------



## Watcheye (Apr 25, 2014)

That is a really good looking little mare.


----------



## Bailey (Apr 29, 2014)

http://youtu.be/pWSnHV4SAZU Coming to the end of April and she still has unexplained movements. I am thinking this is normal for her.


----------



##  (Apr 29, 2014)

Could you please take a full side shot of her down at her level, and one from the back looking down her sides. I'd appreciate it. It all still seems "suspect" to me seeing what looks like a big belly in that video.


----------



## Bailey (Apr 29, 2014)

top (3) today-bottom (3) taken on the 26th.


----------



## Bailey (Apr 29, 2014)

and udder shot of today..


----------



## Bailey (Apr 30, 2014)

April 9 april 16

april 22 april 30

Should I continue to watch her. Last 3 photos taken this morning.


----------



## Bailey (Apr 30, 2014)

and front view She looks the biggest from the front.


----------



## Rocklone Miniature Horses (Apr 30, 2014)

I've looked through this entire thread and not once thought there was significant enough changes to indicate pregnancy. I'm by no means an expert, i've never bred yet! But i have been looking at pregnant mares for the last year lol

Is your vet not able to scan either rectally or from the outside? A vet with really small hands (usually a female) will be able to get into a mini no bother.


----------



## AnnaC (May 1, 2014)

I think we will have to finally admit that she is not pregnant - has she shown any signs of coming into season yet?


----------



## Bailey (May 1, 2014)

AnnaC said:


> I think we will have to finally admit that she is not pregnant - has she shown any signs of coming into season yet?


She has not shown any signs of coming into season. I am going to breed her in late May or early June. I am hoping being around the stallion will bring her into heat.


----------



##  (May 1, 2014)

Yes, okay, I'll join the group. After my experience with my one mare that kept me guessing day by day, and losing the foal ultimately because I decided she really wasn't pregnant, I'm usually the last to "give in".

Keep us posted on how she's doing when you take her to her new boyfriend!


----------



## Bailey (May 1, 2014)

Castle Rock Miniatures said:


> Yes, okay, I'll join the group. After my experience with my one mare that kept me guessing day by day, and losing the foal ultimately because I decided she really wasn't pregnant, I'm usually the last to "give in".
> 
> Keep us posted on how she's doing when you take her to her new boyfriend!


The only reason I was holding on so long was because of the strange belly movement. It looks like something is in there moving around. She had a lot of people fooled, including my Vet.


----------



## Rocklone Miniature Horses (May 2, 2014)

It could be a muscle spasm, i get them in my leg and if you got pregnant in your leg my leg would look pregnant too.


----------



## Bailey (May 2, 2014)

This little guy is the stallion I found for Jazz....not for sure his breed but he looks like a pinto. Any ideas...


----------



## AnnaC (May 2, 2014)

Is he actually yours or do you mean that you have 'found' him locally or elsewhere as a possible future stud for Jazz? So how big is he and how old? Is he an experienced stud, does he have other offspring that you can view to get an idea of what he might throw from a mare like Jazz?

To be really honest, and bearing in mind that Jazz is such a good looking girl, I'm not that impressed with him from your pictures. Yes he has colour, but you must always look beyond this and go for conformation first. His head looks a little plain to me and I'm not too sure whether his shoulder is generous enough. To give you a proper answer, we really need to see a picture of him from both sides standing in a nice upright pose - those pictures may well not be doing him justice! Is there any way you could find out about his breeding, as if he has some good strong lines running through his pedigree, this might give you an idea of what he could produce even if he is a bit lacking in some areas.


----------



## Rocklone Miniature Horses (May 2, 2014)

Is he a registered stallion? Has he produced show worthy offspring? If not, then why are you breeding to him? As above i'm not overly impressed. He looks a little leggy and large for her..


----------



## Bailey (May 2, 2014)

I will find out more when I go to visit him next week. I was told he was around the 32" and jazz is 36". I am not going to breed her until late May or early June so I will keep looking.


----------



##  (May 2, 2014)

Aw, what am I doing wrong. I can't see the pictures! POOH!


----------

