# Draft Style Minis



## miniwhinny74 (Aug 13, 2009)

I was just curious if anyone breeds draft style minis.

Last night I saw several draft style minis in harness at the local fair, and they were GORGEOUS. (I wish I had pictures to post, but my camera broke a while back and I have not yet replaced it.) I've seen so many of the Arabian style minis that made my heart flutter





but these guys amazed and intrigued me. I guess 'cause all of the heavier type minis I have seen have always been "out of pasture" with shaggy coats and no grooming--not really much to get excited over.





The horses I saw looked just like draft horses, only in minature. Wide chests, strong quarters, heavy necks, and suprisingly noble and beautiful heads. They were trimmed and clipped and shining with good health, and I just fell in love with them. And they could move--collected and stepping high with flexed necks.





Somebody out there must be breeding them, but it seems most are breeding for the lighter boned minis. I'd just hate it if these incredible horses (the draft style) faded away because of lack interest. Does anyone here breed them, or know of anyone who does?

What is your opinions on draft styles? Love 'em or hate 'em?


----------



## Sabrina (Aug 13, 2009)

my little 31"mare is more drafty type - more like a stocky qaurter horse. i prefer it to my stallions more arab build. ( but i have always preferred qh lol) i am not sure of anyone who breed them , i just happened upon her becuase the lady was getting out of minis and thought she wasgood for anything.


----------



## backwoodsnanny (Aug 13, 2009)

I have a draft style stallion just like what you speak of though I dont use him for breeding he is midnight black and I love him sooo much. But since the trend has been away from that kind of mini we are not using him for breeding but have been thinking of spending the money to have him trained to drive. He would do nothing as a show horse because as you said he has a wide chest and thick neck and an apple butt to die for. Many big horse friends pick him as their favorite when they come to see the horses.


----------



## Little Wolf Ranch (Aug 13, 2009)

Let's just put it this way -

If I saw a Miniature Horse (38" & under) that looked like a mirror image of a Clydesdale. . . . .I would give anything to have him/her. Would there be any way to breed for the "feathers" that you see on a Clydesdale? How would you go about making "Miniature Clydesdales"? 

I may have found my calling!!!


----------



## miniwhinny74 (Aug 13, 2009)

backwoodsnanny said:


> I have a draft style stallion just like what you speak of


I'd love to see a picture if you have one.


----------



## loveminis (Aug 13, 2009)

Of all the mini horse websites I have visited over the years LOL I have never seen anyone breeding for the draft type.

I often wonder why people prefer the arab type. In the large horse world there are SO many types why cant there be in miniatures too ?


----------



## Maple Hollow Farm (Aug 13, 2009)

I have seen one farm that has a website that advertised some of their horses as perfect for breeding for the draft type and they bred them and I think they had a team too but cant remember, and sorry cant remember who the farm was either, it was I while ago and I look at too many websites to remember them all


----------



## MindyLee (Aug 13, 2009)

Katie Guinn said:


> Let's just put it this way -
> If I saw a Miniature Horse (38" & under) that looked like a mirror image of a Clydesdale. . . . .I would give anything to have him/her. Would there be any way to breed for the "feathers" that you see on a Clydesdale? How would you go about making "Miniature Clydesdales"?
> 
> I may have found my calling!!!



THAT IS MY BREEDING STALLION ALL THE WAY!!! He is a spitting image of a miniature clydesdale with the feathering to boot! I even advertize him as such. I know that the big breeders want away with these types and I do own the refined type as well BUT my biggest love is my 30.5 inch Bobby. Talk about a power house in the cart and very drafty! Im even cutting his tail off so its short and same with his mane so I can do it up in bows like a clyd.



His foals turn out just like him and I am expecting a foal next year that I am hoping looks just like him in every way! My Bobby is a deep rich mahagany bay with jet black points and feather everywhere! He is of the old bloodlines of Komokos and Johnstons and has a little dishy face with huge does eyes that just make you melt. Out of all 7 minis on my farm most being refined, everyone... I mean EVERYONE always falls head over feet in love with him.

Im sooooo glad Im not the only one out there that loves this type and sees the beauty they have!





Sorry dont know how to post photos BUT oh do I have some awesome ones of Bobby!


----------



## IloveMiniatureshorses (Aug 13, 2009)

The draft style minis are super cute, but I also like the arab types as well. I guess people like the arab type more because they do better in the showring. But I really do like the draft type as well. They are great for harness.


----------



## shelly (Aug 13, 2009)

Here is my little filly--she reminds me of a Fjord!!!!! She is very "drafty" built and will be a superb driving horse!!!


----------



## Gizzmoe (Aug 13, 2009)

In this pic my stallion reminds me of a draft horse somewhat. Hes not really that thick but being a little fatty gives that impression.






Pic of him a bit more fit


----------



## lildrummer (Aug 13, 2009)

I agree, I had one of each. My litte mini QH died 3 months ago. He had a bigger than life personality, and could pull anything. He was wonderful. My little mini arab, is so beautiufl, but I miss his personality. She will learn to pull cart this winter.

Lildrummer


----------



## Sue_C. (Aug 13, 2009)

> Let's just put it this way -If I saw a Miniature Horse (38" & under) that looked like a mirror image of a Clydesdale. . . . .I would give anything to have him/her. Would there be any way to breed for the "feathers" that you see on a Clydesdale? How would you go about making "Miniature Clydesdales"?
> 
> I may have found my calling!!!


There is a farm that has been breeding "mini-clydes" for about 20+ years now. They crossed Clydes with Hackney ponies. Now, if you took one of their 12-13hh ponies, and bred it to a drafty, feathered style of miniature, and kept breeding those resultant crosses; you just might have something in a few years.


----------



## Hal & Deb Bryant (Aug 13, 2009)

It's GREAT to hear this conversation about DRAFT minis!

We have been breeding and training mini drafts for 25 years and can't imagine any other style!

We love to drive - singles and multiple hitches. Take a look at our web-site: bryantsminiatures.com

We have many pictures there that should give you some ideas.

Please feel free to give us a call or e-mail us anytime.

We drive year 'round - sleighs in the winter and wagons, carts, etc in the summer.


----------



## spottedminis45107 (Aug 13, 2009)

we have a drafty type mini mare. shes 37" tall and stcoky and she looks like a small draft mare. shes also a great buggy mare.


----------



## Shari (Aug 13, 2009)

Maggie is more of a drafty type. Not want they want now a days but I love her anyway.



I love her face but its not popular. Personally I like something with a more bone to them...suits me more with what I do.


----------



## ruffian (Aug 13, 2009)

I just lost a mare who was built like a Sorrel Belgian. Big platter feet (as it got closer to farrier time) big rear, heavy neck, long face. She was what I call the "Old Style". IMO people stopped breeding that type as they tried to get away from the old style Shetland pony look. She was a sweetheart. Apparently fell into our ditch (which had 8" of water in that particular spot) and drowned. RIP Old Flame


----------



## LAZY J MINIS (Aug 13, 2009)

MY DRIVING HORSE IS BUILT LIKE A DRAFT HORSE. HE HAS AN AWESOME TROTAND IS A PLEASURE TO WATCH. ALL OF HIS FOALS HAVE BEEN LIKE HIM WITH BEAUTIFUL LITTLE HEADS. PEOPLE HAVE WANTED ME TO GELD HIM, I CAN'T IT WOULD RUIN HIM. I HAVE OTHER MORE REFINED STALLIONS BUT HE IS MY LOVE.


----------



## miniwhinny (Aug 13, 2009)

Gizzmoe said:


> In this pic my stallion reminds me of a draft horse somewhat. Pic of him a bit more fit


Okay for fear of being flamed hehehe I don't see any draft style in any of the ponies shown. For example this ponies legs aren't draft...and his butt is totally not draft and his chest in not draft...drafts are totally rear wheel drive beasts with powerful pulling shoulders and have HUGE apple butts. I do see 100% typical pony conformation and cute...I'm not knocking him



. If you've owned drafts you'll know that their heads, necks, chests, leg width and hoof size in comparrison to the leg bone, apple butts and back width isn't like any of the horses shown or web sites advertising draft mini's. What I see truely is 100% typical pony conformation.

Go google drafts and ponies...you"ll see.

I know that we're just calling them that "type" but I still don't see enough traits to see them as that type. Like I said I do see very, very typical pony type as opposed to the araby type that we see a lot of.

I'd still LOVE to see a true draft type mini. Im wondering if we're just using that description for those not of araby refined type...hey...call them pony type lol nothing wrong with that.


----------



## eagles ring farm (Aug 13, 2009)

My gelding *Cozy Corners Just Gone Bananas* I think of as a draft type

He is a Shadow Oaks Top Banana grandson. By Samis Just Bananas Impact

he was our first mini in 2004 and he made us switch from the world of biggies

he taught us the fun a mini could be. He is still my driving gelding and I would not want to part with him. I love both types of minis but I am drawn toward the refined Arab type


----------



## yellerroseintx (Aug 13, 2009)

I always thought Sam...who I sold to a very sweet man, was a perfect miniature Belgian..he was a great little horse that was a pullin fool with the cart..nothing phased him!


----------



## susanne (Aug 13, 2009)

> I don't see any draft style in any of the ponies shown...I do see very, very typical pony type as opposed to the araby type that we see a lot of.


That's okay...the draft type don't look like drafts and the araby type don't look like Arabs, lol!


----------



## Julie/Azariah (Aug 13, 2009)

How bout my VERY TINY 27" (if he is standing on the tips of his little hooves) Mini Gypsy Vanner... Though he is super refined. His build is "stout" and boy can he show off

When I clip him I let his "feathers" on. And he really has some wonderful feathers, better than my friesian's actually.

I have taken him to expos and he is a real hit... lets see if I can get the picture to post:

Meet Mustardseed Legionaires Destiny, my awesome Tiny MAN!

And... he produces some Lovely foals. He LOVES his job, whether it is greeting thousands of people...touching him all day long, at an expo, or lovin his mares!


----------



## Bonny (Aug 13, 2009)

Meet Pocco he is also a drafty type, or pony type if you please

He is a bit of a chunk but has a big bum and wide chest IMO.


----------



## qtrrae (Aug 13, 2009)

WOW!!!!! Julie,

You are right - Mustardseed Legionaires Destiny is indeed awesome!!


----------



## miniwhinny (Aug 13, 2009)

Julie/Azariah said:


>


Now THAT'S a mini draft !!!!!!!!!! He's STUNNNG












A vanner look-a-like any day


----------



## eagles ring farm (Aug 13, 2009)

I love your little Vanner too Julie


----------



## Julie/Azariah (Aug 13, 2009)

And.... Meet our 2009 colt by Mustardseeds Legionaires Destiny... a chip off the old block...

Azariahs Spring Break... on target to mature at a whopping 27"

And... I can't WAIT to see if he makes feathers like his daddy!!!


----------



## Gizzmoe (Aug 13, 2009)

Mini I know he isn't draft type. Was just commenting in the first pic he sort of does remind me of a draft horse, but the second pic is to show his trimmer self that doesn't look drafty.



miniwhinny said:


> Gizzmoe said:
> 
> 
> > In this pic my stallion reminds me of a draft horse somewhat. Pic of him a bit more fit
> ...


----------



## Lucky-C-Acres-Minis (Aug 13, 2009)

This is one of our 'pet' gals, she's about 40" tall (though she's out of and sired by 36" minis!) Anywho, don't think she's the "draft" type you're thinking, she reminds me more of a smaller Quarter Horse, but she's a TANK.. Hope to break her to drive..


----------



## Bonny (Aug 13, 2009)

Lucky-C-Acres-Minis said:


> This is one of our 'pet' gals, she's about 40" tall (though she's out of and sired by 36" minis!) Anywho, don't think she's the "draft" type you're thinking, she reminds me more of a smaller Quarter Horse, but she's a TANK.. Hope to break her to drive..




She is gorgeous!


----------



## maplegum (Aug 13, 2009)

Julie, we need to see some more photos of your mini draft! He is really special.


----------



## SampleMM (Aug 13, 2009)

Julie your boy is really nice and I can see why he's such a big hit.



Is that you in the photo? If so, now I can put a face with your name.





Debbie


----------



## spottedminis45107 (Aug 14, 2009)

Here are some pics of our 37" mini mare that i think is drafty.....i think the pics will show.......just copy and paste into your browser....

C:\Users\julee riddle\Pictures\The Minis\SANY0029.JPG

C:\Users\julee riddle\Pictures\The Minis\SANY0987.JPG


----------



## Kim~Crayonboxminiatures (Aug 14, 2009)

She doesn't have the bone in the leg, but her body and neck sure remind me of a draft! This is Sienna, 2 1/2 months old. This girl has chest!


----------



## markadoodle (Aug 14, 2009)

i love the mustard seeds legionair or something like that i looked and my mini is realated to a LOT of mustardseed horses


----------



## barnbum (Aug 14, 2009)

Oh--I have a few who have been referred to as draft (and beautiful).





Most of you have seen Chloe--who is getting more flea bites every day!




















Chloe had a 30" filly in 2005--Blessing--who is now owned by Julie. Blessing looks just like Chloe, only shorter. Julie gave me permission to post some shots I've had. (Blessing's sire is a tiny refined pinto.)
















And in 2009 she gave me Tucker--my first colt, who looks to be going the draft direction! This boy will be able to go all day!!



Jazz is his sire--who has the nicest apple butt ever.















Oh yes, I LOVE the draft types.


----------



## Sue_C. (Aug 14, 2009)

> Clydesdale breed-type Falabellas...she never wants anyone to forget about the beauty, musculature and style of the Clydesdale Falabellas.


I just don't see any "Clyde" there at all...wrong colour, and no feather...Belgian draft colour though. I think a lot of the old-type of miniatures looked quite drafty, big-bodied-n-short-legged...although todays North American draft breeders puts a lot more leg on their breeds than years ago too.

Lucky-C-Acres-Minis, that mare of yours is one of the reasons we should be able to keep our oversized horses in the breeding pen...that mare has the conformation and substance that this breed is going to need in a few years. (And chances are, she will produce smaller than herself) So many breeders are striving so hard for "refinement" and "Arab-type" that I see so many spindle-legged, narrow chested horses with no butts, "but they have a pretty head and neck...so all is good". As for her size...I have a gelding that just went to 38.75 as a five year old, out of two solidly bred AMHA horses!!!!!!! You think YOU were surprised!


----------



## JWC sr. (Aug 14, 2009)

Looking at everyones pictures is a lot of fun. I have long been a proponet of providing classes for the stockier type Quarter Horse or Draft or whatever you want to call them at the shows. Both in the halter and driving portions of a show.





I think there are a lot of folks out there that like the heavier, stocky type minis and it would encourage the use of these little guys for more than pasture ornaments. The registries are always looking for ways to encourage participation and I think this is a natural.


----------



## barnbum (Aug 14, 2009)

I hadn't read enough replies to see photos--I love so many--Lori, yellowrose, Julie and Cristina!! Nice, nice horses. Cristina--we've had this talk so many times--nice to see a post on it.


----------



## Julie/Azariah (Aug 14, 2009)

SampleMM said:


> Julie your boy is really nice and I can see why he's such a big hit.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yep it is me and my Little Man.


----------



## miniwhinny (Aug 14, 2009)

Gizzmoe said:


> Mini I know he isn't draft type. Was just commenting in the first pic he sort of does remind me of a draft horse, but the second pic is to show his trimmer self that doesn't look drafty.


Oh okay hahah DUH me heheh I'm with you now


----------



## shorthorsemom (Aug 14, 2009)

Kim~Crayonboxminiatures said:


> She doesn't have the bone in the leg, but her body and neck sure remind me of a draft! This is Sienna, 2 1/2 months old. This girl has chest!


Kim, Love your Sienna girl, she does have that apple butt I love so much. Can't see her chest in the photos, but I have seen her in person and admire how wide she is in the front. Just like her momma! I'll take those "4x4 style" miniatures any day!


----------



## Lucky-C-Acres-Minis (Aug 14, 2009)

JWC sr. said:


> Looking at everyones pictures is a lot of fun. I have long been a proponet of providing classes for the stockier type Quarter Horse or Draft or whatever you want to call them at the shows. Both in the halter and driving portions of a show.
> 
> 
> 
> ...






:yeah



:yeah



:yeah



:yeah



:yeah



:yeah

Even in your stock breeds you have MANY different styles, take your AQHA horses, you have the foundation horses that look VERY different from your cow-horse, who look VERY different from your reiners, hunters, jumpers, halter horses and the list goes on.. WHY can't WE have the different styles, giving those of us who love the little guys more options and open up more for others to join in the fun of showing, competitive driving etc.?

Thank you Sue_C... I'm sure many would flame me over this mare, not only because she's not the 'trend' of the breed, but she is a grade (hence why she's a "pet" and the only reason) She was the result of my very first breeding of minis.. Her dam was my 36" mare Star (whom was AMHR registered, though papers were never transferred, I had a copy of her papers and asked AMHR for the last known owner on their records, got her name and city/state, was able to track down an address, sent a letter and NEVER received an answer back



Because I was unable to get ahold of the previous recorded owner I could not get her transferred, therefore she too became "grade") Sire, similar story..



Anywho, ended up with this gal and am quite happy.. She does test my patience at times because she's so big she can be quite pushy (that and family I sold her to as a weanling didn't do a lot with her in the 4 years they had her)


----------



## Kellie in OR (Aug 14, 2009)

Oh MY! I am totally in love with the buckskin mare from Luck C Acres. I want, I want!! I grew up with QH and she looks like a perfect miniature stock horse to me. I hope someone will keep breeding this type so I can have one when I have more time and room.

For now I have my grade 30" mini gelding "Billy" who is fairly stocky & thinks he is 10 feet tall.


----------



## Shari (Aug 14, 2009)

Julie/Azariah said:


> How bout my VERY TINY 27" (if he is standing on the tips of his little hooves) Mini Gypsy Vanner... Though he is super refined. His build is "stout" and boy can he show offWhen I clip him I let his "feathers" on. And he really has some wonderful feathers, better than my friesian's actually.
> 
> I have taken him to expos and he is a real hit... lets see if I can get the picture to post:
> 
> ...


He's stunning!


----------



## miniwhinny74 (Aug 14, 2009)

Wow! When I started this topic, I didn't expect such a response or to see pictures of such wonderful horses. Julie, your "Vanner" Mustardseed's Legionaire's Destiny" is drop-dead gorgeous! And I absolutely loved the "tank"



from Lucky C Acres. (Since I don't know her name



)

I guess what I wanted to know when I started this topic was if I was alone in my opinion that this type of mini should not be allowed dwindle away. I'm pretty sure I got my answer



so my next question is: how to do it? Is there a way to get our registeries to include draft type classes? (I'm asking this as a newby and an outsider to the show world.) Getting these horses accepted at the shows seems to me to be the only solid way of making sure this type of mini doesn't slowly disappear.

That's the one thing about the miniature horse that constantly amazes me...how many forms they can take, from the oh-so-delicate Arab type to horses like Julie's Vanner-look-alike. And how versatile they are from the halter horse to the performance horse and the family "babysitter" to the therapy horse.

I agree with so many other posts that there should be other types than what's currently winning in the show ring. And please don't get me wrong--I love them, too; I just think that as versatile as our wonderful breed is, I just want to know ALL types of the American Miniature will be there for generations to come.


----------



## lovinglife (Aug 14, 2009)

This is my stocky guy! He is 12 years old 29 inches and the sweetest fellow you would ever want to meet. This is the first time I have posted photos so I hope they work. (Please excuse the grooming. This was right out of the pasture.)


----------



## ~Lisa~ (Aug 14, 2009)

That is why there is a foundation division in ponies to preserve that type of shetland.. Type is so subjective though even on this thread as to what equals drafty and what doesnt (same thing happens in the foundation pony divison as well)


----------



## Marty (Aug 14, 2009)

_Looking at everyones pictures is a lot of fun. I have long been a proponet of providing classes for the stockier type Quarter Horse or Draft or whatever you want to call them at the shows. Both in the halter and driving portions of a show. _

I think there are a lot of folks out there that like the heavier, stocky type minis and it would encourage the use of these little guys for more than pasture ornaments. The registries are always looking for ways to encourage participation and I think this is a natural.

I love John Cherry's comments. I don't have any what I would call drafty types myself but I do have one larger boned horse left in the barn. If she puts on weight, she can easily be dubbed drafty. The icing on the cake is that her conformation is there, long neck with clean throat latch with a hook, great shoulder, nice hip and all, (and she's small) but is shunned as far as "type" in today's grande scheme of things.

The problem is that so many people have these type horses but they will not be accepted in the ring or muchly wanted into today's market as it is now. Especially since more are going over to shetland crosses these horses don't have a chance in a halter class, or do they? Hopefully our estute Mr. Cherry can have some infulence and help bring these horses into the ring as a "type" of their own to be reckened with. Now there would be one heck of a jump in the market if that happened! I do feel and always said I prefer a horse as a "using" horse, one that needs more substance other than to just stick his long neck out and stand there.

Here is Chrissy. She's the whole package in a larger bone. Saddly, she would go no where in today's ring. Daughter of NFC Rowdy's Desperado
















PS: Chrissy just said for me to tell you that she's sorry I posted pictures showing you she's sunbleached. eeeeeeeeksss


----------



## Manyspots (Aug 14, 2009)

This has been a fun thread to read and I would like to share our two mini "Belgians" with you also. I am not any good at posting pics but if you would stop by our website www.hoofweb.com/timberview , on the Misc pics page you will scroll down and see Bud and Joe. They were such fun to drive too! If someone would like to copy them and post here they may do so. Lavonne


----------



## Ouburgia (Aug 14, 2009)

What you call Draft mini's are just normal shetlands here 

You see them everywhere!

My (in loving memory) mare Honey:






And my new mare Abbey


----------



## Dona (Aug 14, 2009)

Julie/Azariah said:


> How bout my VERY TINY 27" (if he is standing on the tips of his little hooves) Mini Gypsy Vanner... Though he is super refined. His build is "stout" and boy can he show offWhen I clip him I let his "feathers" on. And he really has some wonderful feathers, better than my friesian's actually.
> 
> I have taken him to expos and he is a real hit... lets see if I can get the picture to post:
> 
> ...


JULIE!!!! Destiny is looking just fabulous! Thank you for posting that photo of him....I miss the little guy! He always had the most beautiful feathering on his legs, and the way you have him clipped....he DOES look just like a miniature Gypsy Vanner!





Give that boy a big hug & kiss from me!





I am going to our county fair tomorrow to wath the "Miniature Horse Pull". There are some awesome little minis that are built like draft horses in this pull every year....AND pound for pound, they pull more than the big guys!!!!

I WILL be getting photos & will share them here when I get them downloaded.


----------



## Kellie in OR (Aug 14, 2009)

Bud & Joe


----------



## Bianca (Aug 14, 2009)

This is my draft style miniature. Bellmills Toppos Growlithe is a 9 year old stallion, AMHA registred.


----------



## miniwhinny74 (Aug 14, 2009)

Bianca said:


> This is my draft style miniature. Bellmills Toppos Growlithe is a 9 year old stallion, AMHA registred.


I LOVE his color...plus I'm a sucker for dapples.


----------



## Kootenay (Aug 14, 2009)

I wouldn't call my little guy drafty, but he does resemble a haflinger . Personally I think he's just fat and needs to be once again drylotted.

Pics of said boy (Buddy):

Him and his 'girlfriend (SweetPea)'






He thought he was getting more apple slices. Half an apple is enough Buddy



.






Mr fatty:






Another:






And a really bad pic of him looking like the Stay Puff Marshmallow Horse on a downhill slope:






I do plan on getting him driving sooner or later.





Edited to add a mini I used to own many years ago--(A very bad picture. Will have to scan a decent one of him). He was sure a sturdy little guy--very stout. His name is Monashee's Rocky.


----------



## GeorgeandHumble (Aug 14, 2009)

Julie/Azariah said:


> How bout my VERY TINY 27" (if he is standing on the tips of his little hooves) Mini Gypsy Vanner... Though he is super refined. His build is "stout" and boy can he show offWhen I clip him I let his "feathers" on. And he really has some wonderful feathers, better than my friesian's actually.
> 
> I have taken him to expos and he is a real hit... lets see if I can get the picture to post:
> 
> ...


This has got to be the most beautiful miniature horse I've ever seen. I wish I had a barn of mini's that looked like him!

The refined show minis are nice but this guy would stop me in my tracks!


----------



## sassy1 (Aug 14, 2009)

This is Chatterbox. He is 36" at top of wither.












P.S. He is Pure Shetland tracing back to all English studbook (Native) Shetlands.


----------



## ErikaS. (Aug 14, 2009)

If I remember correctly, Billy Bob, one of the CMHR rescues, seemed rather drafty- looking to me and had some cute feathered legs.

Also, I would LOVE a mini Friesian!



Anyone breed those?


----------



## Maple Hollow Farm (Aug 15, 2009)

ErikaS. said:


> If I remember correctly, Billy Bob, one of the CMHR rescues, seemed rather drafty- looking to me and had some cute feathered legs.Also, I would LOVE a mini Friesian!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I would love a mini Friesian too, if you ever find someone who breeds them let me know!!!!


----------



## lilmiraclesfarm (Aug 15, 2009)

Marty said:


> _Looking at everyones pictures is a lot of fun. I have long been a proponet of providing classes for the stockier type Quarter Horse or Draft or whatever you want to call them at the shows. Both in the halter and driving portions of a show. _
> I think there are a lot of folks out there that like the heavier, stocky type minis and it would encourage the use of these little guys for more than pasture ornaments. The registries are always looking for ways to encourage participation and I think this is a natural.
> 
> I love John Cherry's comments. I don't have any what I would call drafty types myself but I do have one larger boned horse left in the barn. If she puts on weight, she can easily be dubbed drafty. The icing on the cake is that her conformation is there, long neck with clean throat latch with a hook, great shoulder, nice hip and all, (and she's small) but is shunned as far as "type" in today's grande scheme of things.
> ...


Marty I love this mare. I think she is just beautiful. She reminds me very much of my own mare.

I love love love this thread! Its so nice to see so many draft style mini lovers. I currently own 3 draft styled minis. It would be nice if they had classes just for these guys. It would give people more options.

Here is a picture of one of my draft style horses. Sorry the only pictures I could really find of her near her due date.


----------



## CheyAut (Aug 15, 2009)

Well at 13 hands he's def not a mini, but Fells are "close"  My gelding, Harley


----------



## wcr (Aug 15, 2009)

I have always said form follows function. While the trend is to the refined arab types that are pretty to look at, how many are really tough driving horses. Even in the show ring the driving horses wouldn't necessarily win a halter class.

These stockier types are what they are originally bred for-working, driving horses with enough bone and muscle to do the job.


----------



## dgrminis (Aug 15, 2009)

We have several "draft" style miniatures and personally I LOVE them -- sadly they do seem to sell slower than the more refined ones to people that are wanting to show BUT to people that are wanting them for cart horses or for their kids they seem to sell pretty well



This year we have 2 fillies that are offered for sale that have the draft look to them -- they will be mini "powerhouses" by the time they are done growing





Here is a picture of one of our drafty mares... Her name is Bailey.....


----------



## Bianca (Aug 15, 2009)

I agree that most people like the arabian styled mini's more, but my kids could ride on my draft style mini. And he is a great driving horse.


----------



## ~Dan (Aug 15, 2009)

Ruffian, I have a mare just like this. Snow white mane and taik, gorgeous sorrel color, she reminds me of a haflinger, but shes appaloosa, with hoof striping and now shes started roaning out, and she got motteling on the underside of her tail and her female area, shes really pretty, and her son is a bit a more refined, but her clone.



ruffian said:


> I just lost a mare who was built like a Sorrel Belgian. Big platter feet (as it got closer to farrier time) big rear, heavy neck, long face. She was what I call the "Old Style". IMO people stopped breeding that type as they tried to get away from the old style Shetland pony look. She was a sweetheart. Apparently fell into our ditch (which had 8" of water in that particular spot) and drowned. RIP Old Flame


----------



## Jackie (Aug 15, 2009)

Hi All...

I was planning a picture of Cooper (aka Billy Bob - he needed a new name for his new life). Sorry, trimmed off his feathers...he's easier to keep clean this way. Am working on his weight but I think he has lost quite a bit in a year. He needs exercise right now, but I need to go slow because of his bad hips.

Here are pics from last weekend..his halter is too big and needs to be adjusted (I got it when he was thicker and had winter fur), but I hardly use it on him unless I take him outside of the fenced area as he now leads by his mane.

I love this picture...it's not the best (big winds, DH taking it, I was a mess) but I was kissing to him and he actually had his ears forward...a big deal as he just started using them instead of walking around with them back (a sign he was shut down emotionally). He also calls to me whenever he sees me...I think it's a little leftover from when he was a stallion.

Click on the picture to see it better!

Jackie

CHMR Foster Home

Michigan


----------



## Jackie (Aug 15, 2009)

Since I can't figure how to post more than one picture...here's a close up of his face





Jackie


----------



## ErikaS. (Aug 16, 2009)

Jackie, I'm so glad you posted pics of Cooper. He looks great! I always liked the looks of him.


----------



## miniwhinny74 (Aug 16, 2009)

Jackie, I have always wondered what happened to "Billy Bob" (a.k.a. Cooper) and am so glad he has found a wonderful home! Thanks for the pictures! He hardly looks like the same boy!


----------



## Connie P (Aug 16, 2009)

Many beautiful horses on this thread!



Billy Bob aka Cooper is looking FANTASTIC Jackie! You are the perfect adoptive mommy for him!


----------



## JWC sr. (Aug 16, 2009)

What I would love to see for the “Draft” Type Mini’s is as follows. You never know one of Directors might see this and propose it to the registries.





Or some variation of this set up. I think it would encourage folks to use a ton of mini’s not currently being shown and additionally be a lot of fun for a bunch of members.








The main two points also that I think are needed are:

1.	Once you have entered a horse in this division it cannot be shown in any other division ever, in order to keep the type going.

2.	The size breakdowns are imperative for it to be successful.

AMHA Halter Mare, Stallions and Geldings

Sr Division

28” and under

30 and Under

32 “ and under

34” and under

Jr. Division

29” and under

30 and over

Performance

Country pleasure driving

Hunter

Obstacle

Jumping

AMHR Halter Mares Stallions and Geldings

Sr Division

30” and under

32” and under

36” and under

38” and under

AMHR Jr. Division

29” and under

33” and under

35” and under

37” and under

AMHR Performance

Country pleasure driving

Hunter

Obstacle

Jumping

I know there are a ton of classes now, but I think these would be worth it. What is everyones thoughts on this proposal? You folks have posted a ton of nice horses that deserve a place to be and do well in without having to compete against the more refined horses that are currently out there winning, in my opinion. Good for the registries, good for the owners, great for the horses, so why not????


----------



## miniwhinny74 (Aug 16, 2009)

I think the ideas proposed by John are excellent. Would it make a difference if copies of this thread were sent to the AMHA/AMHR or if an on-line petition were started, so the directors could see how strongly people feel about Draft-type minis?


----------



## backwoodsnanny (Aug 16, 2009)

I would love to see this happen but with the mindset currently in place where would judges be found to understand the value of these heavier boned minis and judge them fairly? Perhaps in the big horse (Draft) world.

Surely the standards for this TYPE would need to be more clearly defined than those used for the height registries though height would still be part of that standard. I believe currently these minis are often thought to be course and plain and could not place in a class though,( as evidenced by this thread) there are many owners who find them beautiful they are not trying to market them and even when they do the market is poor because the current trend in the show world is away from this type. As I said my one drafty mini is always a favorite with my big horse friends but he wouldnt place in a mini show even locally if he were judged by a carded judge.


----------



## miniwhinny (Aug 16, 2009)

Honestly...if I went shopping today and had the choice between the types I'd buy of these "just too cute to cuddle" drafty ones



I'd pick these drafty/cob types hands down I think they're gorgeous (especially if we can breed back the feathers like little Vanner boy has lol) Like what was said a few pages ago...form follows function. These guys can do it all and IMO are wayyyy prettier to look at. To me it's tragic that they aren't shown because the "trend" is towards an opposite confortmation/type. Now I know these guys are out there I'll be looking to purchase a nice colt next spring with substance. I'm truely afraid we're breeding away from a conformation that's sound to favor "looks"...that wouldn't happen with these beauties.

It's time breeders breeding these lil beauties didn't hide them behind the barn (or geld them all) - bring them out up front and show them off guys


----------



## JWC sr. (Aug 16, 2009)

I don't know if it would do any good to send it to the directors or not. But I do think it is time for thinking outside the box when it comes to trying to encourage participation on all levels. Which is a win win for everyone.





I know in ASPC (I know that is a dirty word to some folks LOL) they have the foundation division which is very successful and while not exactly what we are talking about it works well for them, when we were at Congress this year I saw some really beautiful horses in those classes, that could not compete against the more refined horses.





I do however think the judges would have to be schooled on what the "type" was.





All the normal conformation things would have to be considered like straight legs, bites, etc. etc. , but I do not think it would take a lot of thought to write those type things out using our current standard as a guide line with minor tweaks.






Somebody write it up that is more eloquent than I am and post it. Then all of us could send it to our respective directors of both registries. Then see what happens!!!!





I bet on a national level it would mean 100 - 300 horses at the World/National show, people would be excited about it I bet.














I personally like both styles (elegant/refined and "draft") of horses and to each their own so to speak. One does not have to detract or minimize the other. The direction the show ring moves though directly relates to what has a market and what does not which is another consideration.


----------



## miniwhinny74 (Aug 16, 2009)

JWC sr. said:


> Somebody write it up that is more eloquent than I am and post it. Then all of us could send it to our respective directors of both registries. Then see what happens!!!!



I'd try to right something up myself (since I started this thread) but to tell you the truth, I'm intimidated by the prospect. I'm still a newby and there's still so much I don't know about minis and I know NOTHING about the business of showing and breeding. I'm not sure how to word it or even where to start.

John, would you have the time to write something up? I think you are very eloquent and well-spoken. Also, you have the knowledge and experience that I don't.

Or is there anyone else who would be interested in pursuing this idea?


----------



## Julie/Azariah (Aug 16, 2009)

For the most part I have and breed the more refined type,... and my Destiny truly is refined... but STOUT and that is what makes him "drafty" but he sure can put leg on a horse too and refinement depending on the mare he is bred to.

BUT... when I take the horses to the expos or when people visit our farm...LET ME TELL YOU WHO REALLY DRAWS THE CROWD...

Mr. Destiny.

Because he is SO tiny...27", and so correct... an incredible mover...and such a buff man, he demands the crowd to spread when we take him into the ring!!! He has confidence and PRESENCE :O)

I put the other stallions in the stalls in the exhibit hall, but his teeny tininess and his correct proportions (you should SEEEEE his neck LONG!) really get attention.

We call our stalls "THE AWWWWWW FACTOR" because that is what we hear all day long all weekend long. And, it is just amazing to see the smiles that miniatures put on peoples faces...THAT is what it is all about.

I would love to see a foundation branch to our registries, but it does require more classes, more work, more time........ I personally am planning on attending the AMHA meeting since that is where the voting can take place. You can put a proposal in, but, it takes participation to pass a proposal at a meeting

So.. if you are really serious and what to vote it in.... come to the meeting and cast your vote.


----------



## Jackie (Aug 16, 2009)

Thanks...he's getting there. I hope by next year he'll be svelte! I can feel his ribs now, and he has two butt cheeks, not one  Just gotta work on that belly! After I get more muscling on his topline/rump, I'll consider starting him driving... he's got a pretty trot and he reaches well underneath himself! I'll video it and post sometime.

I wish we knew more about his past...someone trained him to lunge at some point, and he knew what a turnout sheet was (I put on one him last spring, totally forgetting he may flip out on me, and he didn't bat an eye). He also knows how to jump, though I am keeping the jumps low until he gets into better shape. I don't know much about mini breeding, but it seems to me he's put together pretty well...his physical issues are not conformation, but human-caused.

I think it would be fun to compete with him...he's very level-headed, and trusts me to do whatever I ask. I wish I had papers on him, or that the different mini shows had classes for unregistered (as long as they met height requirements) like they are now doing for dogs in obedience classes. I've always said that if he had been a full size horse, he'd be considered bombproof !

Well, let's see what next year brings...maybe I'll get lucky and run across a really cheap driving harness to play with!

Jackie


----------



## slv (Aug 16, 2009)

I haven't read all of this post but would just like to say that my husband and I went to Equitana a few years back and we saw the most amazing little horses there. We were so intrigued by them that we inquired only to find out that they were half miniature and half draft horse. They had artificially inseminated the draft mares with miniature sperm and these little draft horses were just amazing. We were in love and I just couldn't take my eyes off of them. I would love to see some of them again. They were probably about 46 - 50 inches tall and a perfect little replica of the draft horse. OMG they were gorgeous.


----------



## Dona (Aug 16, 2009)

I went to the Mini Horse pull last night, at our county fair & took lots of photos. Got to the new thread about the Miniature Horse Pull in the "Photo/Video Gallery" to see the photos!


----------



## HorseMom (Aug 16, 2009)

Maple Hollow Farm said:


> ErikaS. said:
> 
> 
> > If I remember correctly, Billy Bob, one of the CMHR rescues, seemed rather drafty- looking to me and had some cute feathered legs.Also, I would LOVE a mini Friesian!
> ...



I want the same thing. And as long as were talking about baroque breeds in mini form, I want an Andalusian mini. That's what I want to aim for.


----------



## miniwhinny (Aug 16, 2009)

HorseMom said:


> I want the same thing. And as long as were talking about baroque breeds in mini form, I want an Andalusian mini. That's what I want to aim for.


That wouldn't be hard to get. The only thing that may be hard is the sub convex to convex profile but the rounder croup, short back, medium to low set tail, deep thicker set neck, under set hocks etc is alreay there in many mini's. If I was to call my stud a "type" I'd call him Spanish...after owning Spanish horses he has everything I'd expect to see. Only thing he lacks is the convex profile but I had a half Sorraia (Portuguese) colt and his profile was straight.

Soon we'll need LOTS of new classes for shows lol


----------



## Marty (Aug 17, 2009)

Hey Mr. Cherry, you still here?

I have also something to ponder about this?

What about showing these horses with their necks not sticking out? And most definately nothing else stretched. Just a thought..........


----------



## JWC sr. (Aug 17, 2009)

Sorry folks, we are in the middle of a big oil spill in the middle of a plant down here. In any case I agree with you Nathan, there are all kinds of subtleties that would need to be worked out. I think from reading the previous posts Julie has said she is going to the National meeting. She would naturally be the perfect person to present this to the meeting which under the current rules is where everything would have to start. Plus I like Julie LOL

As far as me being able to write it up, my suggestion is that several folks need to be involved so as to get a cross section of opinions. The first step I would think would be to find a director that is sympathetic to the situation and then get guidance from there.


----------



## mizbeth (Aug 17, 2009)

This post was started four days ago, and look at the interest and reponses!

I would say this post itself shows that their is extreme interest in promoting the heavier boned miniature horses. I hope that you able to succeed in this accomplished.

You would need "breed standard" for heavy boned horses?


----------



## miniwhinny (Aug 17, 2009)

mizbeth said:


> You would need "breed standard" for heavy boned horses?


I often hear people saying there's no standard but height for mini's...setting up a "new division" like this would give us a great opportunity to get things right from the start.





After seeing Little Vanner and the Draft Pull pics...I'm off hunting next spring for one of these beauties.


----------



## HorseMom (Aug 17, 2009)

miniwhinny said:


> HorseMom said:
> 
> 
> > I want the same thing. And as long as were talking about baroque breeds in mini form, I want an Andalusian mini. That's what I want to aim for.
> ...


I have been keeping my eyes open for a mini mare with more of a straight or convex head. Someone posted pictures of some unregistered mares about a year ago and I saw a mare there that would have been prefect. I'll find one eventually that I'll be able to get my hands on. Before I do too much, I want to see what my stud produces. His first baby will be born early April.


----------



## Carolyn R (Aug 17, 2009)

This black mare, now owned by a friend always reminded me af a draft style mini.


----------



## Shari (Aug 17, 2009)

HorseMom said:


> miniwhinny said:
> 
> 
> > HorseMom said:
> ...


Maggie has that kind of head....you can see in one of the earlier posts in this thread. She is not what is in fashion now but I personally love the way her head is.


----------



## JMS Miniatures (Aug 17, 2009)

I have said in the past that their needs to be foundation classes for the minis. I was thinking more on the lines and this goes with AMHR that if you have a mini that has 4 generations back of no ASPC papered horses your horse is qualified for the foundation divison and your papers will have a foundation seal.

You can have halter and driving. I say for only under and overs for now that way its not a huge amount of more classes.

I think their could be some way where we can have it like the foundation shetlands.

I don't know much about AMHA so just talking about AMHR. I would like to see this pass but not sure who to go and how tow word it.


----------



## miniwhinny (Aug 17, 2009)

Shari said:


> Maggie has that kind of head....you can see in one of the earlier posts in this thread. She is not what is in fashion now but I personally love the way her head is.


Yup, just went back and looked .. she does


----------



## EquestraDreams (Aug 18, 2009)

Well, I guess I'm going to go against the grain here and say I would NOT want to see a separate show division for stockier horses.

My stock type miniatures have already competed successfully in color, showmanship, hunter/jumping, halter obstacle and driving. So what if that type doesn't consistently win at halter! There are plenty of classes to enter that don't require a super refined "halter" horse. How many of the top halter mares and stallions are out there winning at jumping or halter obstacle? I'd bet not many.

If you want to win in a halter class buy or breed a horse that fits in with other current winning halter horses, don't try to make a separate division. As several people have mentioned, the stockier type miniature is more of a "using" horse, so let's show them off in classes that promote using.


----------



## miniwhinny74 (Aug 18, 2009)

EquestraDreams said:


> many.
> If you want to win in a halter class buy or breed a horse that fits in with other current winning halter horses, don't try to make a separate division. As several people have mentioned, the stockier type miniature is more of a "using" horse, so let's show them off in classes that promote using.


I do see you point, and I can't speak for anyone else...but I don't think it's about "winning" halter classes, but about improving the marketability of minis that "go against" the current trend.

The reason I started this thread is because I'm afraid that the trend toward the lighter-boned, more refined type of mini will one day leave the heavier boned "draft" style obsolete.

I want to say again I don't have anything against any style, color or usage of ANY mini--I love all miniature horses!


----------



## ~Lisa~ (Aug 18, 2009)

I have to say very few if any of these minis on this thread are what I consider draft style minis- I see them as stocky some coarse- some overweight -( I have a couple like that as well) but not drafty

Over on the photo gallery there are pictures of true draft type minis you can see the difference

That is why I personally would vote against adding a division unless it was clearly spelled out in the rule book the last thing we need is a division that is subjective


----------



## miniwhinny (Aug 18, 2009)

100% agree with Lisa...99% of the mini's shown on this thread aren't draft in type. One is Vanner in type



but I'm not sure if Vanners are truely draft or cob. The thread in the photo section has some real draft looking ones.

My only concern with making a division for true draft types is...well, just how many divisions for type can we have? Because if you have one for Draft types...what about the other HUGE, HUGE percent of mini's out there that aren't draft...aren't Arab but are your "normal, everyday mini like the majority of horses shown in this thread...PONY TYPE. I have two of these...extremely well put together ponies. One is more refined but certainly not araby looking but they both have really great conformation and are very much like the vast majority of mini's shown on this site - very nice miniature ponies. Well put together, very useable conformation, and very nice pony in type just like most of the ponies that people post pictures of here day after day...where do they fit in? How about a new division lol



JK


----------



## ~Lisa~ (Aug 18, 2009)

I will say I love the clip job on the "vanner" mini and I think I might try that with one we have he is colored just like a Clyde sabino big blaze and all I am going to try to clip his legs out in the spring to give him the feathered look as well- cool idea


----------



## miniwhinny74 (Aug 18, 2009)

~Lisa~ said:


> Over on the photo gallery there are pictures of true draft type minis you can see the differenceThat is why I personally would vote against adding a division unless it was clearly spelled out in the rule book the last thing we need is a division that is subjective


----------



## miniwhinny74 (Aug 18, 2009)

Oops...hit the wrong button. Let's try again.



LOL



~Lisa~ said:


> Over on the photo gallery there are pictures of true draft type minis you can see the differenceThat is why I personally would vote against adding a division unless it was clearly spelled out in the rule book the last thing we need is a division that is subjective


Very good point--and it's just that type of "draft" that I saw at my local fair.

And miniwhinny had a great point, also: how many divisions in type can we have? It would be hard to say "yes" to one type and "no" to another when if it came to adding classes. That could get messy in a hurry and cause a lot of hard feelings.


----------



## disneyhorse (Aug 18, 2009)

I was a "draft horse" person before I was a miniature horse person.

I also agree that "draft type" is subjective... 99% of the minis posted here are "old style pony type" minis and NOT "draft type" in my eyes. And although I think the minis on that other "pulling horse" thread are ABSOLUTELY ADORABLE and definitely DO look like the pulling style drafts... those heavy type of draft are NOT what is winning in the show ring. Those burly horses are bred for one thing only... to pull very heavy weights. It is a very small niche (although very very cool to go to see them pull at the fairs) and I don't see many people breeding minis specifically to take them to weight pulls.

As with the minis, the draft horses (all types: Percheron, Belgian, Clydesdale, Shire, etc.) tend towards a more refined, upheaded, leggy horse with lots of springy trot. They call this "hitch type" or "modern" draft horses. So you can see that breeders from small to tall are seeking a flashier horse and leaving the clunkier horses behind. Just sayin' ....

Here are some examples of what is winning in the draft horse today. Put your photos of your "draft type" mini next to them.






















Andrea


----------



## disneyhorse (Aug 18, 2009)

To respond to those saying that "really refined halter horses can't really drive":






You have to have LEGS to get a lot of motion for driving classes. Short, thick legs will lack the angles and flexion needed for the animation and extension that is so pretty for driving, as well as a ground-covering trot.

The old-style minis had the "windup toy" action in the driving classes. Their short, thick necks didn't allow for a natural headset. If they are lucky, they can extend with that "stiff legged" soldier action in front which I don't find very attractive.

Again, just my opinion.

Andrea


----------



## Ellen (Aug 18, 2009)

[SIZE=12pt]Hmm. I am not sure about all this, I think it is fun to do all the mane rolling and tail braidng and putting our beloved minis in dress. These calsses are very popular in our area, but Why aren't we all working together to add a Foundation class, recognized by the registries for our little stock guys that started it all. Like we have in ponies. I know I own my fair share![/SIZE]

What do you think?


----------



## disneyhorse (Aug 18, 2009)

Ellen...

Part of the problem is that there IS no "set type" in the miniatures. There is extra stocky and extra refined and everything in-between.

For halter, the judges are just going to pick the most "modern, horse-like" horses they can that still have good solid conformation.

Nothing prevents the old-style minis from showing in Western Pleasure driving, driving/inhand obstacle, hunter, showmanship, liberty, color, costume, and heck MOST classes... and they can and DO win at the National level!

The mini shows are SO well attended and there are already SO many classes that I just can't see adding more. The great thing about minis is that every type of mini has something they can excel in!

Andrea


----------



## ~Lisa~ (Aug 18, 2009)

disneyhorse said:


> For halter, the judges are just going to pick the most "modern, horse-like" horses they can that still have good solid conformation.
> Andrea


I have to disagree a bit. A lot depends on the judges themselves. Judges who breed and show ponies tend to pick the more "pony" type judges that breed and show minis tend to pick the type they breed for. There are in many areas often many different "types" that are correct enough to win the class depending on the "type" the judge is looking for.

I have seen some not so extreme minis do well they are correct and well balanced and some judges do not prefer the extreme type

Showing is a game. Sometimes it is a matter of knowing your judges- knowing what they like and dont like and choosing your shows accordingly


----------



## Shari (Aug 18, 2009)

disneyhorse said:


> .
> As with the minis, the draft horses (all types: Percheron, Belgian, Clydesdale, Shire, etc.) tend towards a more refined, upheaded, leggy horse with lots of springy trot. They call this "hitch type" or "modern" draft horses. So you can see that breeders from small to tall are seeking a flashier horse and leaving the clunkier horses behind. Just sayin' ....
> 
> Here are some examples of what is winning in the draft horse today. Put your photos of your "draft type" mini next to them.
> ...



See now, I don't concider those Draft horses. Pretty show horses yes but not something I would want to work a field with. When I think of Draft horses I think Traditional Draft horse with a conformation and temperament, built to work a day in the field or logging.

Like

http://www.ruralheritage.com/brabant/index.htm

or

http://www.suffolkpunch.com/

Or the photos I took at a local show, will have to dig them up but they look nothing like those photos.

Am more of a traditional type of horse person.


----------



## disneyhorse (Aug 18, 2009)

Shari said:


> See now, I don't concider those Draft horses. Pretty show horses yes but not something I would want to work a field with. When I think of Draft horses I think Traditional Draft horse with a conformation and temperament, built to work a day in the field or logging.
> Or the photos I took at a local show, will have to dig them up but they look nothing like those photos.
> 
> Am more of a traditional type of horse person.


Yes, but see we ARE talking about SHOW HORSES not farm/field horses. You can work your fields with whatever minis you want (but I think most people use the larger halflingers for that ... but SHOW horses should be flashy.

Minis were not necessarily MADE for plowing, and we don't have coal mines around here anymore. We have pretty minis, and we have fancy driving minis. And we have minis of all shapes and sizes that are great for kids and can do showmanship, obstacle, wear silly costumes, and such. I think there are more than enough classes already for the minis...

Andrea


----------



## Shari (Aug 18, 2009)

I loved going to the Draft horse and Ox pulls in NE. Some took their every day working Drafts and showed them on the weekend at the local fairs. There was one guy that would bring his working team down from Canada every year, loved those Drafts and he was a wonder to watch him work with his horses. So there were working Drafts being shown.

The Oregon state fair has classes for work drafts, love going to that one. Wish there were more over here on this side of the country. And I guess depends where in the country where one lives, to what kinds of Drafts you see at shows.

Never saw the Show only Drafts.


----------



## MindyLee (Aug 19, 2009)

~Lisa~ said:


> disneyhorse said:
> 
> 
> > For halter, the judges are just going to pick the most "modern, horse-like" horses they can that still have good solid conformation.
> ...



*THAT'S WHAT IM TALKING ABOUT!!! I SOOOOOO AGREE WITH THIS! *


----------



## StarRidgeAcres (Aug 19, 2009)

I haven't seen a mini, except for that one posted here that looks like a gypsy vanner, that really look like draft horses. But I've also not seen a mini that I thought looked just like an arabian although people are always describing their horses that way.

But on the subject of feather alone, I have a mare that has the longest feather I've seen on a mini. Most of it is 4" long, but in the winter I've measured some at 7". The feather covers her entire hooves and drags the ground in winter. She also has a double mane. The long hairs start right at the bottom of her cannon bone an go down from there. But the rest of her just looks like an average boned mini. She's 34" tall and mostly leg. She's 28 this year.


----------



## Ellen (Aug 19, 2009)

I have to agree with the comment made about the older style minis at the Nationals. Pony judges will not place them. But, I am not faulting them, I am pony person as well. But I still love my Buckeroo son. He is gorgeous, but can he compete with a shetland? No. Could he do well in a class of his own, yes.

All I am saying is we need to find a place for the quality minis that started it all. They still have it, even though there are different types, colors and styles.

But I have to say draft classes are fun, but we have got to class minis as minis not draft, QH, Arab, Morgan........ What do you think?


----------



## JMS Miniatures (Aug 19, 2009)

Yes I think we can't seperate it by types, that would be very subjective and would take a long time, thats why I think we need foundation classes.

I personally haven't see that many draft type minis to add necessary draft classes, perhaps if we want it to seperate by type it would fit more in the lines of stock type. I have only seen 1 true looking draft mini that showed at Nationals last year that we have been told was a belgian that just didn't grow up and he looks like a mini belgian. That horse was awesome.

Like what Lisa has said its what judges like and more and more judges are into the ponys, so something needs to change, either set up a standard on what we need to breed for or change the way we show our minis. Think about it this way their are more pony judges out there, take appaloosas for example, there are no appies in ponys, now do you think a judge that is for ponys will place that appy higher over the ponys if it deserves it, a good judge yes, but most of them won't even in a obstacle class I gurantee it.


----------



## Ellen (Aug 19, 2009)

JMS- This was my original reason for posting. We need a foundation class and standards need to be set. I think that credit needs to be given to the original stockier build that started it all. Lets face it, they don't get looked at like they should. Local shows, yes......But at area shows and nationals I tend to think they get overlooked and they deserve a foundation class. Similar to the pony world.


----------



## Katiean (Aug 20, 2009)

I don't know about once a horse is shown in that devision (draft) it could never be shown in any other devision. I mean it's like trying a horse in country pleasure and then trying it in single pleasure. I wouldn't want to be locked into a show devision like that. I do have a 34" QH type. She has a wide chest and a butt that can get her and her load up that hill. She is a really cool mare because nothing bugs her when she is driving. I have a buckboard wagon with shafts. I don't have a pole for it. But, I would love to get her a draft harness to go with the wagon and I would love to be able to show her with the wagon.


----------



## JWC sr. (Aug 20, 2009)

My thinking on the aspect of only being able to show in this division and not switch would be that then there would be little if any cross over entries. Maybe the "ever" part would be for a year to year thing or something.





After all the entire reason for the new division would be to create a place where the stockier type horses could and would excel. Personally I like the connotation of Quarter style or something like that as versus "Draft" merely from a marketing standpoint.





But to be honest if this can get done then whatever they want to call it is fine. The main thing is to increase the number of people that are capable of using the horse they love in specific classes catering to what was the norm. several years ago and the breed has been rapidly and increasingly moving away from each year. Facts is that the more people involved the better for each registry and the breed in general.





My feeble thoughts anyway,


----------



## miniblessingsfarm (Aug 20, 2009)

I am so glad to see this thread! I have a barn full of minis that are all beautiful to me! Unfortunately, none of them would do well at halter in an AMHA show because they are not refined enough (not "arab-looking"). I agree with everyone who would like to see separate classes available for the "arab-type" and the "stock horse" type (or "draft" type) miniatures. It would cetainly level the playing field as well as alllow many more horses to be competetive. And can you imagine the extra revenue that would be generated for the clubs/miniature horse organizations by the addition of a whole new division at the mini shows?!? Many of the other breed organizations have divisions available at their respective shows that allow for differences in horse "style." A Hunter horse is different from a Western Pleasure horse is different from a Reining horse, etc. If other breed organizations can make allowances for the differences in their respective breeds, why can't the Miniature Horse breed organizations follow suit? The other breed organizations seem to embrace the differences in horse types. Some mini owners are sometimes made to feel that their horses aren't as good as the more refined or "arab" like minis even though their minis may be well-bred, have correct conformation, have wonderful ability or training.

I also wanted to add that there are fads in everything---including horses. Years ago, the smaller, stockier Quarter Horse was very popular. Now, everyone wants a taller, more elegant looking Quarter Horse that almost looks like a Thoroughbred. The same is true of the Miniature Horse industry. I would imagine that once the "newness" has worn off of the super-refined, "arab-type" minis, the stockier minis will come back into favor, or at least have a legitimate chance in the show ring. (I do NOT mean any disrespect to the "arab type" minis or their breeders!)

I hope that we will all see a day when ANY Miniature Horse of correct conformation, ability, temperment, training and condition will have an equal chance in the show ring.

Debbi


----------



## JMS Miniatures (Aug 20, 2009)

This is for AMHR only, but this is my small idea on what I want foundation classes to be like. I have had mix responses. Those who want to show the R minis like it but those who don't want to see change don't.

AMHR Foundation Miniature Horse:

A miniature horse that does not have any ASPC papered horses in its background going back 4 generations. This does exlcude hardshipped horses. If you miniature horse is eligible for Foundation Certification you can send the papers to AMHR office and receive a foundation seal.

You can choose to show that horse in Open or Foundation classes but you cannot crossenter at shows. However classes that don't offer Foundation ie: halter obstacle, hunter, liberty, etc... you may show in.

Types of classes offered:

Foundation Miniature Halter Stallions, U

Foundation Miniature Halter Stallions, O

Foundation Miniature Halter Geldings, U

Foundation Miniature Halter Geldings, O

Foundation Miniature Halter Mares, U

Foundation Miniature Halter Mares, O

Foundation Miniature Pleasure Driving, U

Foundation Miniature Pleasure Driving, O

Foundation Miniature Country Pleasure Driving, U

Foundation Miniature Country Pleasure Driving, O

Foundation Miniature Western CPD, U

Foundation Miniature Western CPD, O

Foundation Miniature Versatility, U

Foundation Miniature Versatility, O

I have included our 2 main areas of interest halter and driving. I have also included versatility cause IMO this is a important class to show how versatile our minis can be and Foundation should have a versatility class. If you show in Foundation that does not mean you cannot show in the other performance classes you just cannot crossenter into open halter/driving at the same show. I think it should just be divided between under and over until it gains some interest then maybe divide it by different heights. If it does get popular maybe add in more extra classes. I know how Local shows are already stressed out for time so for right now it should not be required but maybe required for Area shows and Nationals.

Anyways this is just my thoughts, I would like to hear comments.


----------



## Julie/Azariah (Aug 20, 2009)

From a show exhibitor standpoint and show organizer standpoint...

The addition of more classes is a a bit scary.

Regionals was SO pleasant this year because a day was added, we were not up all night after showing til midnight, prepping our horses for the next day.

We got a chance to get to know our "neighbors", had some time to relax and socialize a bit, even playing something I never heard of "Corn Bag Ball" ( I think that was from the Kentucky FolK) and you shoulda heard the hooting and hollering going on behind the barns as the competition got pretty intense





If a whole new show division is added, it may put us right back in the same boat we were before. We could be back at a crazy schedule, but now for 4 days... then one+ week of Worlds or Nationals... adds up to a long time being away from the farm and extra money for the trip.

If new divisions were added for foundation stock then it sure would be nice for the exhibitor to have the foundation show classes / performance classes / and "modern" type classes, in that order or flip flopped. That way if you are type specific you can attend 2/3 of the time (if that makes sense)

BUT, THEN the performance people will be going crazy because all of the performance classes (to include both types/divisions) would be together and not interspersed with the halter classes.

And ALL the halter classes would be back to back... INSANE!

THAT would probably not work.

Like I said in a previous post, the addition of another division to be shown would take A LOT of TIME to figure out, and then implement. There would have to be someone TOTALLY dedicated to this concept to run with it. And then you would have to get it passed by the registries, which means you need to attend annual meetings. It will take a LOT of dedication from A LOT of people.

I am not FOR or AGAINST this thought. I have just been tossing it around and around and WOW, it would take a lot to get it rolling.

Miniature horses, modern or foundation, should bring joy to their owners and folks they come in contact with, that is what they are all about. Some of us breed and raise them, some of us show them, some of us use them for therapy purposes and service work, some of us drive them for pleasure and some of us just like to sit on the front porch and watch them out in the field. (And SOME OF US like to do all of it!!!)

I personally am MAXED out between the farm, the family and trying to get out and show. Maybe there is someone out there that has the time and the knowledge to do something like this. Ideas usually come easily to most of us, but getting down and taking care of the nitty gritty... well that is when the numbers thin out.

I certainly am not saying it can't or shouldn't be done, just putting my honest thoughts out. There is much more to it than just "adding a new division"


----------

