# Ok I have been hashing over asking the LB parents what would you do?



## Maxi'sMinis (Dec 28, 2010)

As of the 26th I told my daughter she had to find another place to stay. She turned 20 today. She has been repeatedly disrespectful to me in the past year and it has come to a head where I cant take it anymore. I seem to always cramp her style except when she wants money or something. Its a long story and don't want to go into depth about it here. I have been paying her to help with my horses for the last 2 years. At times I haven't been sure that she is doing what she says she has, feeding, watering etc. She didn't hesitate to ask for her pay though. She is constantly trying to push her fathers buttons, I think to cause him and I to have a disagreement to take the heat off of her. She is always playing the victim. I have caught her in several lies, one taking our truck that she is not insured to drive. Lying about having people at our house during the day when we are at work. She is staying at a boyfriends house with his parents and I know she is playing them too. I let her come to the house last night to get some clothes. I have locked her out so that she can't enter the house when we are at work. She asked last night for a hug and I hugged her but never said anything to her when she was there. I know this is going to be hard but I need to know I've done the right thing. How much should I continue to support her. My brother says not to support her at all. She has some health issues that she needs our insurance. She still asks me questions about them, I told her to go to the doctor. She will have a rude awakening when she has to pay the co-pay. I have tried to teach her to be independent, but she is very clingy and is now clinging to this new boy friend and his family. I am sure she has filled them with lovely stories of how mean we are.

I need your help, I feel so sad and depressed. I don't want to go to work but have to. I wish I could just stay home with my animals for a month. I need some unconditional love.


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## TheCaseFamily00 (Dec 28, 2010)

I can't really help as my kids are still young. I hope you find the answers you need(hugs).


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## Sonya (Dec 28, 2010)

I am not a parent, but just wanted to say...I think you are doing the right thing, tough love is hard, but will pay off. This is your final lesson to her of being a grown up and being responsible. I would keep tabs on her and stay in contact as much as possible so she knows that you do love her and care. Give her advice and support (support as in you want to know how she is doing, emotional support) Hugs are always good! Good luck.


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## Reble (Dec 28, 2010)

Not sure about the whole situation, but at 20 years old, needs to be working and supporting herself.

Sometimes we have to stop enabling them. Tell her you love her, but has to be changes, maybe right down all the things you expect from her and have her sign it if you want her still under your roof, or if you find you can not have her home anymore than!

Just tell her you will be here for her, if she needs to talk.

Always keep your door open, but not to live in.

Good Luck teens can be so hard at times. Yes, you would not be a mother if you did not have feelings. Do what is best for all.


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## ErikaS. (Dec 28, 2010)

Been there and it sucks, but you did the right thing. Boyfriend's parents will get tired of her; they'll eventually see through her lies.


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## Magic (Dec 28, 2010)

It is super tough to do what you are doing, and I commend you for it. If you didn't, it sounds like she would just never grow up and learn to take responsibility for herself.

It may be a good idea to see if you can talk with the boyfriend's parents so you can let them know why you made her leave, so they don't just feel sorry for her and let her manipulate them into completely supporting her. She needs to get a job.

You DID do the right thing. That's what we have to do, as parents, is get our children funcioning as productive members of society, at least as best we can. Your daughter is now an adult and the rest is up to her. I wish you much luck, and here's big {{{HUGS}}}. I hope you feel better as time goes on!


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## Crabby-Chicken (Dec 28, 2010)

I am so sorry Mary.There is no stress like the stress a family can build up in you. You are doing the right thing. And you may have to lay it out, if she doesn't do her job, and tell her you would know if she is not, then you will get someone else.

Again I am very sorry you have this going on. I think once our kids are old enough, we all have the fighting as they grow up.


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## Camelotcavs (Dec 28, 2010)

I have six daughters aged 17-27 and I have been where you are now.

I have paid them to do chores that they have not done, I have come home to a house smelling of a "party" and I have put locks on things I never thought I would. I have been through the disrespect and the "being nice when they want something" trials with all of my girls. My Husband is an over the road truck driver and the girls are very good at attempting to "play" us against each other and it used to work early on. Hubby is the softy and I am the b*&ch, but I am with them and see what they do whereas he just hears about it from me. Fortunately we have learned through the years to ALWAYS bounce things off of each other when it comes to the kids especially if they ask for money. Don't get me wrong - they are basically good kids but they have had life so much easier then a lot of kids and they "think" they can get away with things just like I did when I was their age(although when I was growing up parents did't have to worry about police being called when we were spanked).

My girls have learned the hard way that there are *always* consequences for their actions. One daughter is going through this now and she is currently not welcome here as she has burned many bridges with many family members. Hopefully she will turn things around - but if not that is *her* choice to make.

Our role as parents is to nurture and love our children, but it also is to prepare them to live on their own and provide for their future families. Sometimes it is difficult to move from one to the other but we must or they will always rely on their parents.

There are three things I always tell my children:

- When you first go out on your own reality *will* smack you in the face.

- Life is about choices. If you make a bad one it may take you several good ones to correct it - but that is *your* choice.

- I will always love you. I may not like and/or support things you say or do - but I *will* love you.

It is not easy to push our children out of the nest, but sometimes that is the only way for them to grow up. Doing right by them is not always easy and many times just flat out hurts! But you will get through this and she will be better for it - maybe not right away and she may never thank you for it but you *will* get through it.

Your daughter is an adult and I feel you are doing the right thing. She may have to fall hard but she will find her way.

Let her know you are there if she would like to talk (if that is what you feel) but make it clear to her what is and is not acceptable (lies, disrespect, etc...)

Tell her what the insurance copay is and inform the doctor's office that she is responsible for her own bills.

Do not worry what she tells other people - the truth will come out in the end.

Do what you feel is right - even if it is hard and hurts.

And most importantly - take care of yourself!!!!

I have always said that children are our biggest joy and our biggest heartbreak all wrapped up in a snotty nosed package.


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## Maxi'sMinis (Dec 28, 2010)

Thank you all for your replies and support. I think there was only one other time that things seemed so hard and that was the 26 hours of labor to bring this child into the world. Thank you sooooooo very much Camelotcavs, you have opened my eyes. I feel so much better. I can't say I won't shed anymore tears, she is my only child except for my furry ones.

Its funny how the kids will listen to someone else but not the parents.

I am hoping that I have talked her into seeing a doctor, she has actually self injured herself. Wether it is to get attention or what she needs evaluation and for someone else to help her. She doesn't listen to me, I am the witch.

I have been interviewing for a farm helper, there are so many people willing to work for anything. I know I will find someone that doesn't HATE my horses and also knows the value of hard work and money in the pocket.


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## minih (Dec 28, 2010)

My heart goes out to you, since I have been in your shoes. My son has give me heartbreaks since he was 18, and he is now fixing to turn 30 in March. The whole tough love thing is harder on us as parents than it is in the adult child. We love them, they are our hearts, and they know all the buttons to push. You will find you have good days you can deal with it, and then you will have your what I call guilt days when it is hard not to give in. I don't know if you have drugs involved with yours or not, it just makes it soooo much harder to deal with. PM me if you feel the need to vent, I have been thru it all. Trust me. I more than likely can not help, but just someone to listen at times is all that is needed. It also helps if you and your husband are on the same page and agree about what is going on.


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## Camelotcavs (Dec 28, 2010)

I too had a self mutilater (spelling ?), a "cutter".

She was 15 at the time and there was a popular girls book out called "CUT".

I don't know why she did it, but think it was for attention and boy did she get attention!

Her best friend called and told me what she was doing. I got off the phone and called her downstairs, pulled up her sleeves and told her that I could not help her because I did not have the knowledge to do so - but would find someone who could. She went back upstairs and I started making phone calls. About half an hour later I walked into her room and told her to pack because I had found a hospital that would take her and help her. An hour later we were meeting with a Psychologist and I was signing her into a psychiatric hospital.

I cried all the way home and for days afterwards because I felt I had failed my child. It is such a helpless feeling to not know why a child intentionally hurts themself.

That was the longest month of my life and she hated me for months after she came home.

Today she is 23, went for her GD and has earned her LPN and has almost completed her RN. She has survived a divorce from her cheating ex-husband and is making a wonderful life for herself and I am so very proud of her!

I know I had an advantage over your situation because my daughter was a minor at the time, but there is always hope.

A parent will spend a lifetime shedding tears over their children - just remember a majority of them will be happy tears!!!!


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## Camelotcavs (Dec 28, 2010)

You are very welcome and you are not alone.


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## Ashley (Dec 28, 2010)

I often wonder why people think locking up people who SI is the answer? I never understood this thinking, and why people think this works.......when in reality it doesnt.


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## bfogg (Dec 28, 2010)

I am sorry for all your going through. No one can break your heart like a child can. I shouldn't maybe bring this up but I hope she is on birth control. You sure don't need a grandchild to begin raising. I also think you have done the right thing. Keep strong and make sure your husband and you are a solid united front! Everyone has given such wonderful advice. I love this Forum.

Hugs to you,

Bonnie


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## Maxi'sMinis (Dec 28, 2010)

Ashley said:


> I often wonder why people think locking up people who SI is the answer? I never understood this thinking, and why people think this works.......when in reality it doesnt.



Ashley what are your suggestions for SI then? I know nothing about this so if you are are knowledgeable please share. I have been told that my daughter needs to talk to someone now and the only way you can do that is to admit them. She has actually asked for help and is going to do it herself because she has told me she doesnt understand why she has done this to herself.


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## Camelotcavs (Dec 28, 2010)

Ashley said:


> I often wonder why people think locking up people who SI is the answer? I never understood this thinking, and why people think this works.......when in reality it doesnt.



It sounds like you may be speaking from a bad experience.

In the case of my daughter it did work. She needed the intensive therapy she received in house rather than as an outpatient.


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## Ashley (Dec 28, 2010)

NOpe no bad experiance.

Yes a SIer needs therapy. But you cant force them into it. It has to be something they want and on their terms. When everything else in life is better, the SI will fade away on its own. SI is a way to deal. If they learn the proper way to deal, one that works best for them they will no longer need the SI.

Its just like foceing an addict to quit, the more you try the more they fight back. It has to be on their terms. The more you push the issue the worse they will get, the more they hide it, and sometimes a person may think its done and over but reality is they just got that good at hiding it and covering.


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## Ashley (Dec 28, 2010)

Camelotcavs said:


> It sounds like you may be speaking from a bad experience.
> 
> In the case of my daughter it did work. She needed the intensive therapy she received in house rather than as an outpatient.



Betcha anything she still occasionally does it, but you would/will never see it. Also most are ashamed of it so are not going to let on to it if they can make people beleive it doesnt happen. In cases if cutting it typically only comes into play in times of stress, so its not always an issue. A person can go days, months sometimes years before having a bout with it again.


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## Camelotcavs (Dec 28, 2010)

Ashley said:


> Betcha anything she still occasionally does it, but you would/will never see it. Also most are ashamed of it so are not going to let on to it if they can make people beleive it doesnt happen. In cases if cutting it typically only comes into play in times of stress, so its not always an issue. A person can go days, months sometimes years before having a bout with it again.



And I am sure she does not.

Every si/addiction case is different and no one method will have success in every instance.

MM - Since your daughter has asked for help - ask her which method of treatment she thinks would be best for her.


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## ~Lisa~ (Dec 28, 2010)

I do think treatment is a option and Ashley I do not think that everyone will always continue. That is the whole point of getting some form of therapy and learning tools to deal with stress and disappointemtn. Do I think the thought is there yes.. however intensive therapy and support groups help give them other options to deal with things no different then drugs and alcohol. I firmly believe that many do not go back to old ways once they are able to learn and make healthy choices

While no one likes the idea of locking up someone- sometimes it is the only viable option to protect them even if only for a time period short enough to hope they truly realize they need help.


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## Ashley (Dec 28, 2010)

I didnt say everybody goes back once given the right tools. Its just like any other addiction, some slip some dont. Many know they need help, but fear help and locking them up isnt the way to fix SI. I also think it depends why they person does it. Those that do it for attention are alot easier to get to stop, then those that do it for another reason, that hideing and are not proud of it. Those that do it for attention tend to show it off.

I have plenty experiance, know plenty of people, have done plenty of research and most of all my school work that I have done on it, has been done hand in hand with a therapist and their knowledge/experience on it.


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## AppyLover2 (Dec 28, 2010)

To get back to the original post.....you are definitely not alone. Tough Love is just that. It's without a doubt one of the hardest things we as parents have to do. But, as so many have already said, some times it's the only thing left. I've been there, done that too. I wish I hadn't had to do it but I can't say I regret it because it was the only thing to do that hadn't already been tried. It took time but it worked. It was hard but she's now a responsible adult. If things had continued the way they were there's no doubt in my mind that I wouldn't be able to say those things.

Big {{{{hugs}}}} to you mom. Hang in there. Doing the best thing is all too often the hardest thing to do.


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## Marty (Dec 28, 2010)

Its easy for people to say use tough love when its not their child. Tough love can backfire on you, hurt and do damage and make your child feel unloved and unwanted. Hus tried that tough love stuff once on Michael when he was screwing up against my wishes. He was much too sensitive and it was not the way to handle him at all. Sometimes you cannot play hardball without it coming back to hit you upside your own head.

Only you know your child and what she will respond to the best. If its tough love, so be it. Or it could be a matter of taking her to lunch to have a tearful heart to heart, or writing her a letter. Use your judgement as a mom and do what you feel is the right thing in the best interest of your whole family.

.


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## wwminis (Dec 28, 2010)

From a father's point of view:

I've been in your shoes with one of my sons! He would stand in front of my and lie straight to my face, and me knowing he was lying! He would tell me he was going one place and go in a totally different direction! I would ask him to help around the house, like mow the yard, and he would tear up the mower on purpose just to get out of work! I gave him a job, he quit!! He would hide and smoke and then lie about it, all though I could smell it on him! Just one thing after another, after another!

But the straw that broke the camels back was when he tried to come between me and Wanalynn! That was it for me, I put him out on his own! That was 20 years ago and he's a better man for it today! You can give them all the love and support they need, but it's up to them to take that help and use it to their best interest! Some children have to learn the hard way! Tough love, yes, but in the long run they learn to be productive citizens and do just fine!

Bill


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## Miniv (Dec 28, 2010)

Not that you need more advice (we've only had a dozen teenage foster daughters.).... But my opinion is - Camelotcavs has given some very good advice overall. I also agree with Bonnie Fogg. Make sure you and your husband are working as a TEAM with all of this.

We have our OWN teenager right now....and a handful. She is already trying to work her parents off of each other. I have told her many times that I love her, but that there are times I do NOT LIKE her behavior. And yes, I occasionally get the "I hate you!" I've learned to reply with, "Good. That means I'm doing my job."


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## wildoak (Dec 29, 2010)

Been down that road too....it's not easy, and I strongly agree with Marty, there's not one approach that works for every child. The fact that your daughter knows she needs help gives you a good starting point. Inpatient treatment doesn't work everytime for every person, but it's a beginning and if nothing else it provides a period of structure and kind of a time out to think things through and start learning to modify behavior. It may work the first time or it may not, there isn't a quick fix to the issues our kids go through. If there is substance abuse as well, AlAnon might help give you someone else to lean on, and I'm sure there are similar support groups for the issue your daughter has. I couldn't do the meetings long term, but when we were in crisis it was a great help. Wishing the best for your family in coping with this, you are as you can see, not alone in in.

Jan


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## hunterridgefarm (Dec 29, 2010)

MM I think you are doing the right thing here.. If she wants the help get it for her..

My mother in law went just got done going thur this her son showed up on her door steps on mothers day of all days. She felt like she could not leave her house. she did not know what to do. thank the lord we live beside her.she has been on her own for 4 years she did not want to have to do but she called us and talk to us we told her it would be hard but if she felt like she need to kick him out then go for it. she asked my husband to come over and be with her as she done it. it was not a pretty site to see. this boy has been married his wife had kick him out and moved him back to my mil house and just drop him off. he was not doing anything to help out. would not buy any food MIL had just had it. My husband kick him out and made sure he would not come back. like she said she had to do what she had to do..

thinking of you

Ashley I hope and pray your daughter was born with a golden spoon. and never gives you any problems because you would not be able to handle it..


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## Ashley (Dec 29, 2010)

As I said in my message to you, you dont have a clue about me, I can handle more than you think. My children are not perfect. My daughter is no angel nor is her 12 year old brother. I am more than able and handle it.

I didnt say the original poster was wrong in what she is doing. I would have done the same thing. I am a tough love kind of person. And I didnt say that the girl asking for help shouldnt get it. I simply said you cant force somebody to do something and think they wont fight back unless they want it. A person cant be "fixed" unless they are ready to be.


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## minih (Dec 29, 2010)

> Ashley I hope and pray your daughter was born with a golden spoon. and never gives you any problems because you would not be able to handle it..


I do think that remark was uncalled for. It was advice given that was asked for. She comes from different experiances with this than you. We all have our own ideas about how to handle it.

She is correct in some of her thinking, from what I have found out. I was not dealing with a cutter, like I mentioned ours was concerning drugs and we did the whole hospital thing and it did not work. Ashley wrote:



> Yes a SIer needs therapy. But you cant force them into it. It has to be something they want and on their terms. When everything else in life is better, the SI will fade away on its own. SI is a way to deal. If they learn the proper way to deal, one that works best for them they will no longer need the SI.
> Its just like foceing an addict to quit, the more you try the more they fight back. It has to be on their terms. The more you push the issue the worse they will get, the more they hide it, and sometimes a person may think its done and over but reality is they just got that good at hiding it and covering


We then went to counseling, insurance did not pay for it, 10 sessions, and do you know what we found out at the end? Exactly what Ashley just said, yes he has a problem, but NOTHING you can do will help until he realizes he has a problem and WANTS to change.


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## SampleMM (Dec 29, 2010)

I don't really have any great words of wisdom but wanted to say how sorry I am that you are going through this. As mothers, we try and do the very best by our kids and then hope and pray that everything works out. Unfortunately, some kids just go down a road that we would never choose for them and sometimes have to hit rock bottom before they change their ways. I pray for peace for you and your husband, while you are going through this.


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