# Clipping question(s)...Why/how did it ever start with body clipping?



## little lady (Feb 20, 2011)

I understand the body clipping since minis fur tends to be thicker and they blow it at a slower rate than their big counterparts but why are these horses clipped to their skin for showing? I am trying to learn this clipping for showing. I have now watched two different CD's and can tell as a beginner I have ALOT to learn before I will be able to clip one good enough for a show.(I have now acquired an admiration for those that can do this and make these horses look soooo good) But coming from the big horse world I didn't body clip. I clipped the ears the face(but not to the skin)and legs. I left the body alone as far as clipping and to get a good body coat it took lots of old fashion brushing and an excellent feeding program. Why or how did it evolve to clip these lil ones naked? Could you show one not clipped so close say with a more natural coat or would you not place? I am not wanting to be flamed




but it seems kind of cruel to take away their natural defense from biting flys, sun etc. Any help understanding this would greatly be appreciated. I am thinking about trying to show at 1-2 local shows this year and just trying to understand all the needs.

Second part of my question. Show halters. I am wanting to show a yearling and only 1-2 shows. So what type, how do I go about finding a halter? More likely than not he will out grow this show halter right? Or is there quite a bit of adjustment with these types of show halters? Again any input is greatly appreciated.


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## ruffian (Feb 20, 2011)

I wish I knew how the body clipping standard started too. But it's been going on for 20+ years.

Yes he will outgrow his halter. You want a halter to compliment his head style. My opinion is that if he has a fine, pretty head, you want less halter. More like a good Morgan or Quarter Horse, we use a wider nose band and less bling. Show halters don't have much adjustment, just at the crown.


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## Jill (Feb 20, 2011)

Well, for one thing, everyone does it and you don't want to make any "personal" statements at a show. You can do that for free at home in your backyard





I think the reason people like to have their minis clipped as close as peeled onions is that it accentuates their muscle tone and lines -- plus, like I eluded to, you do not want to stand out like a sore thumb





While I like the natural look on minis, the first time I had a show mini and saw him clipped and groomed for the ring, that was more than enough to sell me on the concept


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## little lady (Feb 20, 2011)

ruffian said:


> I wish I knew how the body clipping standard started too. But it's been going on for 20+ years.
> 
> Yes he will outgrow his halter. You want a halter to compliment his head style. My opinion is that if he has a fine, pretty head, you want less halter. More like a good Morgan or Quarter Horse, we use a wider nose band and less bling. Show halters don't have much adjustment, just at the crown.



Ok I have seen(only in pictures) the adjustment at the crown so that helps...Thanks! So does the bling factor in here? In the Paint and Quarter horses sometimes one would think they are judging the halter. So if he has a pretty head a simple and fine halter is what I should look for? What brands are out there that I should look for?


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## little lady (Feb 20, 2011)

Jill said:


> Well, for one thing, everyone does it and you don't want to make any "personal" statements at a show. You can do that for free at home in your backyard
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I have been known to make personal statements at shows, one of the reasons I stopped showing Paint horses(among many others). Just because the big name does it(or everybody)doesn't make it right. I believe in any breed a horse should be judged by the horses quality not by how the mane is cut or by the halter it wears. That owner worked just as hard as the others in the ring. A good judge will see a quality horse although that same judge may or may not place accordingly to save grace. The rule book states how horses are to be judged by confirmation and quality representing the breed. OK I'll get off my soapbox



now.


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## disneyhorse (Feb 20, 2011)

Clipping is not "100% necessary" if your horse has a tight coat. I've shown minis plenty of times with tight coats, but they had genetically short coats and it was later-in-the-summer shows. By Nationals though, most are getting furry again. Halter classes, you normally have to clip because your horse is looked at far more closely than it is in performance classes.

Body clipping is not restricted to showing miniatures... LOTS and LOTS of breeds body clip! My friend has a Friesian/Andalusian show barn and most of the client show horses are body clipped at least once in the spring before shows. Arabians, Thoroughbreds, and plenty of other horses are also body clipped. I've even body clipped a few Clydesdales (obviously not below the knee!!!) so don't feel like it's just the miniatures that are routinely clipped.

I think body clipped horses look good!

Andrea


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## minimomNC (Feb 20, 2011)

I have seen horses of different colors that when they are clipped, you can see the muscle tone much better than when they have a natural hair coat. That makes a difference in judging. A judge has just a few seconds to get a first impression of your horse and then only a very few minutes to judge that horse in a line up. I want the judge to see everything great about my horse in those few seconds or minutes, so if clipping him will help that process, you can be sure I will be doing just that. We also only use simple halters, black nosebands, maybe some gold or silver piping, nothing on the side or just small conchos, thats it. I personally do not like colored nosebands. My halters have to work on many horses, some I have been using for almost 7 years now. Purple doesn't look good on sorrel horses so if I used that color I would be limited by what horses could wear it. So simple is always better.

My suggestion for anyone who doesn't want to clip or razor your horses for a show is just don't do it. Its your right to take your horse in the ring in its natural state, its also my right to clip and razor my horses for the show ring. As for it being cruel, well thats anyones opinion. I know how I take care of my show horses and they seem to be of sound mind and body. Showing is to expensive to not give my horses every chance to win.


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## rabbitsfizz (Feb 20, 2011)

I will clip once at the very beginning of the year, to get the winter coat off and tidy the horse up, but I long ago tired of trying to show cold, antsy, youngsters (almost all of our shows are outside, although we _are_ getting there, slowly, with indoor venues) having to put blankets on in the ring because they were shivering, etc, and now I do not clip except to keep the horse "tidy"

I show "in coat" and have never had a problem with it.

As to making a statement at a show....Yes, I am happy to do that, what is the point of making a statement at home?

I thought the whole point of showing _was_ to make a statement.....


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## little lady (Feb 20, 2011)

rabbitsfizz said:


> I will clip once at the very beginning of the year, to get the winter coat off and tidy the horse up, but I long ago tired of trying to show cold, antsy, youngsters (almost all of our shows are outside, although we _are_ getting there, slowly, with indoor venues) having to put blankets on in the ring because they were shivering, etc, and now I do not clip except to keep the horse "tidy"
> 
> I show "in coat" and have never had a problem with it.
> 
> ...






I like the way you think!


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## little lady (Feb 20, 2011)

So since I am not very confident in my ability to show clip what or how do I go about getting a show clip done for a show? (I am going to practice on my very tolerant mares in the mean time...lol.)

I have been to a few miniature shows and really like how they look but I have seen equally stunning full sized horses showing with a nicely cared for coat.


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## Equuisize (Feb 20, 2011)

Coming from showing Arabs I'm not excited about the full body clipping either.

Can only remember one time, for a very early show we clipped a grey Arab.

I rather understand why they have to with the minis as in the cooler climates

they do not shed out as quickly unless you keep them under lights with multiple

blankets.

But I dislike that they do not show their true colors when clipped.

I like red heads. Body clipped they do not show the deep rich copper

penny look that attracts me to them in the beginning. They all look

mousy to me.

There was a gal, came up from California back a few years ago to a show here

and her horse was in a full coat. Slick as could be. Breath taking!

You could tell she spent hours grooming him to get him in that condition.

She did it with purpose .... She did not approve of body clipping and wasn't

going to fall in behind the hordes. She had spunk, that gal and her horse

placed well so can't discount her actions.

If judges can tell the conformation and conditioning of a full size horse

with in a full coat, they should be able to tell the same in a mini.


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## Marsha Cassada (Feb 20, 2011)

I am hoping to show a horse this year. I will clip him, as it is an early show and he will be too furry--plus uncomfortable in the warmer weather. But I am contemplating leaving his whiskers. He is going in a performance class and I understand the close grooming isn't as critical there. I understand that whiskers are not trimmed in Europe; it is an American thing.

Do you think the judge sees that extreme clip as a sign that an exhibtor is taking the show ring more seriously? Showing IS a type of beauty contest. A contestant wouldn't show up with unkempt hair or poorly chosen clothes--the judge woud think the conestant didn't care if he won or not.


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## lucky seven (Feb 20, 2011)

My boy has lots of hair from the cold winter we are still having. I don't want to shave him naked but would like to clip to help remove his winter coat. I have looked at clippers but don't know much about using one. What do you suggest for a brand? I want something durable and won't overheat or pull on him. His legs and neck really need to be done. Also do you clip under the chin?


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## supaspot (Feb 20, 2011)

I too like to see some colour on the horse , in the UK and Ireland we do clip but I think we leave a little more hair on , Ive heard that in some european countries its against the rules to clip inside the ears and removing eyelashes is very frowned upon

the Irish/ UK judges like to see a little more hair than you in the US are used to but our society is bringing over another american judge this summer , my dilema now is do I shave my horses bald as thats what hes used to / expects or can I show with some growth on ?


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## maplegum (Feb 20, 2011)

I have shown both Bailey and Willow with an unclipped coat. Yes, I guess it is kind of frowned upon by others but I'm not out to play by the rules. Bailey and Willow both placed well, in fact, Willow came home with numerous 1st place ribbons.

I didn't cut off their eyelashes or whiskers or even cut a wedge out of their mane for a bridle path. They both looked healthy and shiny and I was proud that I didn't do what everyone else did!


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## ruffian (Feb 20, 2011)

Marsha Cassada said:


> I am hoping to show a horse this year. I will clip him, as it is an early show and he will be too furry--plus uncomfortable in the warmer weather. But I am contemplating leaving his whiskers. He is going in a performance class and I understand the close grooming isn't as critical there. I understand that whiskers are not trimmed in Europe; it is an American thing.
> 
> Do you think the judge sees that extreme clip as a sign that an exhibtor is taking the show ring more seriously? Showing IS a type of beauty contest. A contestant wouldn't show up with unkempt hair or poorly chosen clothes--the judge woud think the conestant didn't care if he won or not.


I had a judge tell me personally that my horse would have placed higher - he took 3rd - if I had "Bothered" to clip him!


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## Matt73 (Feb 20, 2011)

I used to show hunters and jumpers on the A-Circuit. In the Spring, most horses needed to be clipped (even though they're blanketed all winter). Regular trimming of ears, bridle path, muzzle (although not balded), legs etc. was done throughout the summer/fall. When showing everything has to look better than excellent.


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## Jill (Feb 20, 2011)

little lady said:


> I have been known to make personal statements at shows, one of the reasons I stopped showing Paint horses(among many others). Just because the big name does it(or everybody)doesn't make it right. I believe in any breed a horse should be judged by the horses quality not by how the mane is cut or by the halter it wears. That owner worked just as hard as the others in the ring. A good judge will see a quality horse although that same judge may or may not place accordingly to save grace. The rule book states how horses are to be judged by confirmation and quality representing the breed. OK I'll get off my soapbox
> 
> 
> 
> now.


Oh people are free to do what they want, but I've never gone to a show, or had one of my horses go to a show, when I didn't hope he or she would win some of the good ribbons. Of course good horses should win and I don't think I've seen a horse win BECAUSE the mane was trimmed just right or their body clip was perfection... I think judges appreciate the appearance that you put effort into presenting your horse well. That's my perspective, but I personally don't mind taking one of my horses in the ring against someone who hasn't spent as much time grooming their animal or decided to use a clunky performance halter, etc.

IMO, unless you are a "big time name", you're not going to start a new trend and there's very little good that can happen in terms of ribbons by standing out as different. Sure, a person can show in halter with a western style halter. You can show a (shaggy, unclipped, be-whiskered, unbrushed, ) horse, etc. But should you if you are doing your best to place well? I don't think so. You can do it how you like in your back yard and save time, show fees and gas.

Another thing, too, is that when people don't put the time into grooming and presenting their horse so that it resembles what is expected, it gives the owner a crutch to say "oh the judge didn't like my horse because I didn't clip him," etc., when, really, maybe the horse just isn't well made or of halter type. Part of what a person can learn from showing horses is to look objectively at their own animals (real important if you aspire to breed (again imo)) and you can learn what types of horses the judges typically pin high.

Just because the rule book says you can do this or you can do that doesn't mean you _should_ or that a person who knows what it takes to win _would_.


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## Loess Hills (Feb 20, 2011)

JMO..........if you are going to show yourself be prepared to go though the learning curve, maybe fall on your face at your first show, and practice, practice, practice, and learn. Nobody does it perfect the first time but you will pay your dues and learn from your mistakes. And there are a lot of great people at shows who are willing to help and give advice. Watch, observe, and do........and you will learn. It won't be easy, but then nothing is as easy as it looks!


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## CharlesFamily (Feb 20, 2011)

IMO the body clipping is MUCH easier than the balding of the face! (I still haven't gotten that one down). Last summer, my daughters showed for the first time at a local mini show (not AMHA or AMHR). It was August and I made the decision not to body clip because I like their full coat color (chestnut and buckskin). They were both slick and shiny and so I just tightened up some areas and, of course, did their ears and legs. I did not bald their faces. Both did quite well for their first time out with my daughters. If it is not a breed show, but a local show, I think you will have more flexibility with whether you need to body clip or not.

Here is a picture of Jinx in full coat:






Now this year our first show is in May, so I know I will be body clipping. My suggestion is don't wait until right before your first show. Have a "practice run" and you will notice that if you clip at least a week ahead, their color will return some and any rough patches will have "smoothed out." That way you won't feel as anxious and if you need to do it again, you will have time.

Make sure you have good clippers and extra blades - especially for that first clip!

Good luck!

Barbara


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## ~Lisa~ (Feb 20, 2011)

Showing in natural coat takes MUCH more work then clipping IMO it requires lots of elbow grease and does not look good on all horses.

I have palominos and hate how one of them looks clipped I think he looks pink and icky so try to not clip (for local shows) if I do not have to. That means my shedding out and grooming process has to start pretty early for those horses.

I am not against clipping and have and will continue to do so but here is our palomino pinto gelding showing in natural coat and as long as he is showing locally that is how he will continue to show

This one is shown natural







Here is our other palomino gelding he stays very dark even when clipped and we show him freshly clipped


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## little lady (Feb 20, 2011)

~Lisa~ said:


> Showing in natural coat takes MUCH more work then clipping IMO it requires lots of elbow grease and does not look good on all horses.
> 
> I have palominos and hate how one of them looks clipped I think he looks pink and icky so try to not clip (for local shows) if I do not have to. That means my shedding out and grooming process has to start pretty early for those horses.
> 
> ...




Wow! Your gelding in the first pic looks amazing!!!!!!!!






That is what I am talking about!


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## Sue_C. (Feb 20, 2011)

> I think judges appreciate the appearance that _you put effort into presenting your horse _well. That's my perspective, but _I personally don't mind taking one of my horses in the ring against someone who hasn't spent as much time grooming their animal_


Holy Hannah Jill, do you think that keeping a natural coat perfect on a horse, is EASIER than spending an hour body clipping???



:OKinteresting


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## Jill (Feb 20, 2011)

Sue_C. said:


> Holy Hannah Jill, do you think that keeping a natural coat perfect on a horse, is EASIER than spending an hour body clipping???
> 
> 
> 
> :OKinteresting


ha-ha-ha...





Jumping jeepers, Sue_C., that's not what I think





What I think is that I've seen plenty of people show a rough coated miniature horse, especially someone new enough to ask _why_ people body clip, and not realize what they will be up against


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## little lady (Feb 20, 2011)

So if one were to clip what size blades do you use where? Do you use the same clippers and switch out blades or a couple of different clippers?


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## Raine Ranch Minis (Feb 20, 2011)

Here is some clipping help, Little Lady.

http://www.starsminiatures.com/showprep.html

http://www.starsminiatures.com/clippingchart.html


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## little lady (Feb 20, 2011)

Raine Ranch Minis said:


> Here is some clipping help, Little Lady.
> 
> http://www.starsminiatures.com/showprep.html
> 
> http://www.starsminiatures.com/clippingchart.html




Thank You! That is very helpful information and very kind of you.


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## phoebeq (Feb 20, 2011)

I have a question reguarding clipping...the only clippers that I have are dog clippers. Would those work? Or do I have to invest in a set of equine clippers (which I am pretty sure Hubby will veto, lol)?

Sorry to hijack, I just didn't want to start a whole new thread, when there is a perfectly good one open on the subject





Thank!!


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## chandab (Feb 20, 2011)

phoebeq said:


> I have a question reguarding clipping...the only clippers that I have are dog clippers. Would those work? Or do I have to invest in a set of equine clippers (which I am pretty sure Hubby will veto, lol)?
> 
> Sorry to hijack, I just didn't want to start a whole new thread, when there is a perfectly good one open on the subject
> 
> ...


Depends on the dog clippers, how many horses and how much clipping you want to do. You might be able to get by clipping just one mini with dog clippers, but several winter woolie removal clips would be too much for a typical dog clipper. Dog clippers will also work just fine for clean-up cleaning; like bridle path, legs and whisker trimming. My first set of clippers were Wahl KM-2 clippers, and they worked fine for body clipping just one fuzzball; but now that I have 11, I invested in a pair of Oster Clipmasters (bought them used, and they have worked just fine for winter woolie removal). [i don't show, so mostly clip to make them more comfortable. I use the Wahls for just clean-up (bridle paths and "beards"); and the Clipmasters for woolie removal.]


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## phoebeq (Feb 20, 2011)

chandab said:


> Depends on the dog clippers, how many horses and how much clipping you want to do. You might be able to get by clipping just one mini with dog clippers, but several winter woolie removal clips would be too much for a typical dog clipper. Dog clippers will also work just fine for clean-up cleaning; like bridle path, legs and whisker trimming. My first set of clippers were Wahl KM-2 clippers, and they worked fine for body clipping just one fuzzball; but now that I have 11, I invested in a pair of Oster Clipmasters (bought them used, and they have worked just fine for winter woolie removal). [i don't show, so mostly clip to make them more comfortable. I use the Wahls for just clean-up (bridle paths and "beards"); and the Clipmasters for woolie removal.]



I have a set of Andis AGC 2 Speed Clippers. I bought them because I had burned up 3 sets of clippers on my Cocker Spaniel and I was told I needed a heavier duty set. They are awesome, but I have noticed that they can get a little warm.

I only have 2 minis and I would only be clipping for comfort. Thanks!


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## chandab (Feb 20, 2011)

phoebeq said:


> I have a set of Andis AGC 2 Speed Clippers. I bought them because I had burned up 3 sets of clippers on my Cocker Spaniel and I was told I needed a heavier duty set. They are awesome, but I have noticed that they can get a little warm.
> 
> I only have 2 minis and I would only be clipping for comfort. Thanks!


They will probably work, but you will probably need a few extra sets of blades, so you can switch them out when they get too warm. and, its easier to clip a clean horse, bathing when its cooler is difficult, but really good grooming before clipping helps, and if they'll tolerate it a shop vac on blow to blow the dirt out of their coat can be helpful.


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## phoebeq (Feb 20, 2011)

chandab said:


> They will probably work, but you will probably need a few extra sets of blades, so you can switch them out when they get too warm. and, its easier to clip a clean horse, bathing when its cooler is difficult, but really good grooming before clipping helps, and if they'll tolerate it a shop vac on blow to blow the dirt out of their coat can be helpful.


Hmmm...yeah, if I wait till I can wash them, it will be a while, lol. Even if it is warm, that wind stays pretty cold till like July. I wish I had bought a set that had blades that were easier to change out. I have Cool Lube, that works pretty well, but I may end up just waiting to see how long it would take for them to shed out naturally...

Thanks for the tips! I appreciate it


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## [email protected] (Feb 20, 2011)

It really is up to you on the clipping. It does show the muscle tone off better, and when we've shown we clip, but I won't use a 30blade on the body - skinned isn't pretty IMHO. I especially dislike the 'color class' with a sea of beige and grey horses. A couple of years back a few trainers were showing in a more natural coat (you could see the black or red), and I wish that trend caught on. Even a few days-weeks growth would look better IMHO than not. But it depends on the judge and competition who it will be received.

A friend of mine use to show her Mini in a full coat, and he looked wonderful. Hers was an elbow grease and good feeding regime, and it showed. He generally placed highly or won too.

As for halters, he will outgrow it and its hard to get one that will fit over the years as the noseband size is important for a well fitting show halter, not just the adjustment at the crown. There are a number of Mini horse suppliers that have show halters and there are always used ones for sale on the sale board. I'm a Victor fan and we have black and burgundy ones in three sizes, and an assortment of others we've accumulated over the years.


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## little lady (Feb 20, 2011)

[email protected] said:


> It really is up to you on the clipping. It does show the muscle tone off better, and when we've shown we clip, but I won't use a 30blade on the body - skinned isn't pretty IMHO. I especially dislike the 'color class' with a sea of beige and grey horses. A couple of years back a few trainers were showing in a more natural coat (you could see the black or red), and I wish that trend caught on. Even a few days-weeks growth would look better IMHO than not. But it depends on the judge and competition who it will be received.
> 
> A friend of mine use to show her Mini in a full coat, and he looked wonderful. Hers was an elbow grease and good feeding regime, and it showed. He generally placed highly or won too.
> 
> As for halters, he will outgrow it and its hard to get one that will fit over the years as the noseband size is important for a well fitting show halter, not just the adjustment at the crown. There are a number of Mini horse suppliers that have show halters and there are always used ones for sale on the sale board. I'm a Victor fan and we have black and burgundy ones in three sizes, and an assortment of others we've accumulated over the years.



Thanks for your reply.



I was wondering if using a clipper blade that didn't clip so close would work and you answered my question. Also thank you for the advise on the halter and type to look for. I will check out the Victor halters.


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## Raine Ranch Minis (Feb 20, 2011)

little lady said:


> Thank You! That is very helpful information and very kind of you.



You are VERY welcome!!


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## Candi (Feb 20, 2011)

From a judges perspective here. I want to see EFFORT and I don't want anything that *detracts* from your horse- but enhances it. If clipping makes a more muscled and clean appearance than do it.

BUT

The argument that you should do it cause everyone else is -and you don't want to stand out. LOL. I can tell you as a judge that often standing out is a GOOD thing. You have a well-groomed, tight and nicely muscled horse - going up against one that's shaved and razored- with me - you'll win. Hands-down. Able to show off what nature provided your horse with hard work and maintenance can and should be rewarded. Doesn't mean don't do a bridle path, etc..

If all "fads" were meant to stick around and no one had the guts to stand up to them - the stock breed world would be worse off than it really is. Peanut-rolling tropers are "technically" illegal in the WP ring... but it was the "norm" for 20 years, and if you rode a natural mover you "stood out". Thankfully, folks in the "know" realized it was just one more way that showing perversed something that some BNT did and it slowly became the "in" thing. Didn't make it right!


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## little lady (Feb 20, 2011)

Candi said:


> From a judges perspective here. I want to see EFFORT and I don't want anything that *detracts* from your horse- but enhances it. If clipping makes a more muscled and clean appearance than do it.
> 
> BUT
> 
> ...


THANK YOU for your response. You did an awesome job of answering my question. I was not saying if I were to show that I wasn't going to groom. I am just trying to understand if I would "have" to clip verses hard work or if there were alternatives. With the information recieved here and additional information I am finding I have a plan and will see where it leads. Again thanks for your words of great wisdom. I agree 100% with your thoughts.


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## midnight star stables (Feb 21, 2011)

disneyhorse said:


> Clipping is not "100% necessary" if your horse has a tight coat. I've shown minis plenty of times with tight coats, but they had genetically short coats and it was later-in-the-summer shows. By Nationals though, most are getting furry again. Halter classes, you normally have to clip because your horse is looked at far more closely than it is in performance classes.
> 
> Body clipping is not restricted to showing miniatures... LOTS and LOTS of breeds body clip! My friend has a Friesian/Andalusian show barn and most of the client show horses are body clipped at least once in the spring before shows. Arabians, Thoroughbreds, and plenty of other horses are also body clipped. I've even body clipped a few Clydesdales (obviously not below the knee!!!) so don't feel like it's just the miniatures that are routinely clipped.
> 
> ...


And Road Ponies and Hackneys and Shetlands and even my mom's Warmblood. Lots of breeds clip.





And I also know many that show in a full coat, depending on the time of year. I personally clip but only use a 10-15. To each their own


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## Katiean (Feb 21, 2011)

I had never clipped before I got minis and I have had/shown horses for almost 50 years. I do clip all of my horses in the spring weather they are showing or not. I have gotten pretty good at clipping. I can clip a horse in about an hour and not leave razor marks. I can see the constant clipping for halter horses but, I drive my horses. I like to let them grow out from the first clip and not clip but just clean them up for shows (pasterns, throat, bridal path...etc).

As for a halter. I bought a Royal something (can't remember). It has an interchangeable nose band. It was only about $45 new. That way if you don't keep showing you don't have a ton of $200 halters hanging around. I like an interchangable nose band because if my horse has a longer narrower head (needs an large halter w/ small/shorter nose band) or a shorter wider head (med halter with an exlarge nose band)I can change the nose band to get the proper fit for that horse. Something to think about.


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## Riverrose28 (Feb 21, 2011)

We clip all of our show horses down with a #10, but when I first got into showing minis I had a sorrel and white, bald faced mare that I liked to show in the color class. Two weeks before the show I would bath and clip her with a #7F, that way she could keep some of her color. Then the day before I would touch up her bridle path, eyes, ears and muzzel, would not clip off all of the pretty white hair on her face. She also got first place in color classes, I did use a lot of baby powder and elbow grease to get a good shine and lots of show sheen.


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## kaykay (Feb 21, 2011)

I have never and will never be a fan of extreme clipping or razoring. But then I have never been a follower. My motto is first do no harm. There are certain things I refuse to do for a ribbon. We seem to do well and have wins against stiff competition.

I so remember at a show seeing a horse with its entire head razored to the throat latch. Looked horrible. Thankfully almost everyone at the show also commented it looked horrible so hopefully that is not a fad that is going to start.

I remember standing out once because my mares beautiful white eyelashes were left on. The judge loved them and said he wished more would leave them on. Now thats just one judge but it gives me hope.

I do body clip but never closer than a 15 for solid horses and 10 for a pinto.

I am hoping to get my judges card this year and I can tell you that I would never deduct points because a horse wasnt razored or clipped. I would deduct points for a horse not well groomed.

I totally agree that it is way more work to show a horse in natural coat.

Hey Charles are you going to the BMHC May show?? I think I am going to bring a couple young ones down


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## nnadams (Feb 21, 2011)

little lady said:


> I have been known to make personal statements at shows, one of the reasons I stopped showing Paint horses(among many others). Just because the big name does it(or everybody)doesn't make it right. I believe in any breed a horse should be judged by the horses quality not by how the mane is cut or by the halter it wears. That owner worked just as hard as the others in the ring. A good judge will see a quality horse although that same judge may or may not place accordingly to save grace. The rule book states how horses are to be judged by confirmation and quality representing the breed. OK I'll get off my soapbox
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## Minimor (Feb 21, 2011)

The Victor halters are very nice, and they hold their value well, so if you ever decide to sell one you are likely to get your money back on it. If you buy the yearling size this year it's very likely your horse will outgrow it, but then you buy the adult size for next year and that's it--you'll surely not have to buy one after that. The Victor halters run about $125 each.

The halters with the interchangeable nosebands are nice too; the Showtimes run about the same price as a Victor. You could buy one with a yearling noseband and then next year buy an adult noseband for it, but the noseband alone is about $60 so you don't save a whole lot. I find it a bit of a pain to take the time to change the nosebands over--my first halter was a Showtime with a "Mini adult" headstall and a "yearling" noseband. I used it on my yearlings that year then ordered an adult size noseband for it. I changed the noseband on it and now prefer to leave it as an adult halter, without putting the yearling noseband back on it for anyone. Just easier that way.

You can get cheaper halters--they run about $50 complete--they look nice when they're new but some of them fade with use and I don't trust them to be as strong as the Showtimes or Victors.

As for clipping--it is definitely more work to show a horse full coated because you have to groom--a lot--beforehand. I know a number of people who don't bother with any grooming at all prior to a show, they will say outright they don't have time for that, they just clip in the week prior to the show, and that's that. If you're showing full coated, you have to put in the grooming time to have the horse slicked out and shiny. Some Minis just never have a coat that is tight enough to show full coated--some will shed out very tight, others never do. Definitely, though, you can clip with a blade that will leave some hair on.

As for doing a good enough job of clipping to show--don't underestimate yourself. The first time I clipped horses to show I thought I had done a poor job because I had some clipper marks here and there. When I got to the show & looked around, my clip job looked pretty good! There were horses--clipped by people who have clipped for years--with major clipper marks. Some had crooked V's above their tails (my V's were short, neat & STRAIGHT!)


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## little lady (Feb 21, 2011)

Minimor said:


> The Victor halters are very nice, and they hold their value well, so if you ever decide to sell one you are likely to get your money back on it. If you buy the yearling size this year it's very likely your horse will outgrow it, but then you buy the adult size for next year and that's it--you'll surely not have to buy one after that. The Victor halters run about $125 each.
> 
> The halters with the interchangeable nosebands are nice too; the Showtimes run about the same price as a Victor. You could buy one with a yearling noseband and then next year buy an adult noseband for it, but the noseband alone is about $60 so you don't save a whole lot. I find it a bit of a pain to take the time to change the nosebands over--my first halter was a Showtime with a "Mini adult" headstall and a "yearling" noseband. I used it on my yearlings that year then ordered an adult size noseband for it. I changed the noseband on it and now prefer to leave it as an adult halter, without putting the yearling noseband back on it for anyone. Just easier that way.
> 
> ...



Thanks for the info.



I found some Victory halters but still looking for the "one". Does silver or gold tone matter? Use what looks best for the color of horse or just personal preference?


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## CharlesFamily (Feb 21, 2011)

kaykay said:


> Hey Charles are you going to the BMHC May show?? I think I am going to bring a couple young ones down


Hi Kay!

Yes, we are planning on the BMHC May show being our first "outing." The girls are really excited as the BMHC August show was their first show ever - so they are really looking forward to it! They are also showing the boys in 4-H this year and we are going to try and get to a couple of the AMHR shows - Urbana and Greenville. I can't wait for warm weather!

Barbara


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## Minimor (Feb 21, 2011)

little lady said:


> Thanks for the info.
> 
> 
> 
> I found some Victory halters but still looking for the "one". Does silver or gold tone matter? Use what looks best for the color of horse or just personal preference?


I find that the black w/silver ones look good on nearly every horse. Some colors are better suited by black w/gold. Most of my patent halters are black w/silver but I bought a black w/gold for my chestnut sabino (lots of white on his face)pony and it really suits him. I have a white faced chestnut mare that looks good in either silver or gold. My buckskin I thought would look best in the gold but I actually like the silver just as well on her. My bar noseband halters are either silver or silver & gold & I find the silvers look great on the blacks while the silver/gold ones look good on the palominos--chestnuts generally look good in either one. Sort of depends on the horse, his particular head, and personal preference.


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## LindaL (Feb 21, 2011)

I showed my 2 horses last year in natural coat at the Area national show. It happened to fall right after we got back from vacation and I did not have time to get them totally body clipped. It was summer, so they had nice smooth hair, but not tight like a body clipped horse would have. I did trim up their ears, around eyes, muzzles, etc. and of course they were bathed and groomed well. BUT, at the show, looking at all the body clipped horses I felt really "novice" (I'm not) and DO feel like it affected our placings. I would not have even bothered to go to this show at all, except I was hoping to show these two at Nationals and needed to qualify them there.

I personally do like a shiny natural summer coat that shows a horse's true color, but that just doesn't usually happen at shows. If I let my dark bay grow out even a little to show his rich natural color, he gets "pig hair", so he has to be freshly clipped.

A MUST for clipping: CLEAN, freshly bathed horse, sharpened blades, decent clippers and extra blades to switch them out when one set gets warm. If your horse is dirty (near the skin), your blades will dull quickly and/or leave clipper marks. vacuuming your horse helps, but a bath is best and highly recommended for a "cleaner" and quicker clip. PRACTICE, but never right before a show!





If you are showing your horses at open shows, I would not be so worried about body clipping.

Good luck!


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## kaykay (Feb 21, 2011)

I hope to see you there Barbara! Would be nice to get to meet.

I use gold on bays and silver on blacks and silver dapple horses.

My clipping tip is to always spray the horse liberally with showsheen while they are still wet from the bath. really brush them so it works in. Clip while the horse is a little damp to prevent over heating and hair sticking to you.

I always clip horses that have just ate and have a full belly. I have many fall asleep while I am clipping





I also usually divide it into two parts. Clip the body and neck then let the horse rest a few hours then finish the legs and head.


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## little lady (Feb 21, 2011)

LindaL said:


> I showed my 2 horses last year in natural coat at the Area national show. It happened to fall right after we got back from vacation and I did not have time to get them totally body clipped. It was summer, so they had nice smooth hair, but not tight like a body clipped horse would have. I did trim up their ears, around eyes, muzzles, etc. and of course they were bathed and groomed well. BUT, at the show, looking at all the body clipped horses I felt really "novice" (I'm not) and DO feel like it affected our placings. I would not have even bothered to go to this show at all, except I was hoping to show these two at Nationals and needed to qualify them there.
> 
> I personally do like a shiny natural summer coat that shows a horse's true color, but that just doesn't usually happen at shows. If I let my dark bay grow out even a little to show his rich natural color, he gets "pig hair", so he has to be freshly clipped.
> 
> ...


Thanks Linda! Great tips. I just got my lil man as a weanling last year and he was already wearing his winter woolies so not sure of what is underneath yet. There are a couple AMHR shows I would like to try to take him to so he would need to be at the top of his game so I want to do what is best for him.


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## [email protected] (Feb 21, 2011)

Another tip on halter color for your horse. Pull out the World or Journal and look at the professionally photo'd horses. It's also good to learn where the halter should sit on your horse's head and how to accentuate the good. Concho use or not or placement, noseband size, etc., depending on your horses head.

As for Victor Halters, they do hold their value. The just don't seem to wear out, we have some that are 10 years old and look great.


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## little lady (Feb 21, 2011)

kaykay said:


> I hope to see you there Barbara! Would be nice to get to meet.
> 
> I use gold on bays and silver on blacks and silver dapple horses.
> 
> ...


Thanks KayKay for the showsheen tip!! Never thought of that.


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## RhineStone (Feb 21, 2011)

Candi said:


> The argument that you should do it cause everyone else is -and you don't want to stand out. LOL. I can tell you as a judge that often standing out is a GOOD thing.
> 
> If all "fads" were meant to stick around and no one had the guts to stand up to them - the stock breed world would be worse off than it really is. Peanut-rolling tropers are "technically" illegal in the WP ring... but it was the "norm" for 20 years, and if you rode a natural mover you "stood out".


I see body clipping as a practical necessity that went to the _extreme_ and turned into "over clipping", just like WP QHs didn't want to be seen as English horses, so they decided that the slower and lower the head, the better. No true cowboy is going to ride their horse like that! It went to the extreme, just like mini clipping. Some mini horses needed to be clipped because they don't shed out or have "pig hair" as Linda mentions below, but some minis that have really good coats are being clipped rediculously tight because of fad. Now it needs to go back to "reality".



LindaL said:


> I personally do like a shiny natural summer coat that shows a horse's true color, but that just doesn't usually happen at shows. If I let my dark bay grow out even a little to show his rich natural color, he gets "pig hair", so he has to be freshly clipped.


We have a couple of horses that won't shed out early enough, and when they do, their coats are still "bristly". These horses need to be clipped for every show. Their hair is course and never lays flat. It almost stands on end like a military crew cut!



HOWEVER, we have others with more "normal" hair coats that we may clip for the first show because they haven't shed out yet, but then leave their coat for the rest of the year...maybe unless they start growing winter hair early. People need to do what is best for each individual animal and ignore the fads. Granted, we don't show mini breed shows (over clipping would be ANOTHER reason why



), but we have gone to the largest carriage shows in the country and have never had a judge tell us our horses were "unkept", and have won lots of Turnout classes where best appearances matter. If we over-clipped, like with more than a 10 blade, we would be the freaks ("So _why_ is your horse bald?"



). That's one thing I love about carriage shows. They are so practical.





Myrna


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## Flying minis (Feb 21, 2011)

kaykay said:


> I hope to see you there Barbara! Would be nice to get to meet.
> 
> I use gold on bays and silver on blacks and silver dapple horses.
> 
> ...



I will vouch for those clipping tips - you gave them to me at some point last year when I had first started with my minis - now I've shown and clipped horses for 20 years, but I've never gotten as nice a clip as when I did the show sheen/clip damp thing like you said! Incredible - and I think the dampness kept my blades from getting hot so fast too!


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