# What I thought I bought............



## mmmorgans (Sep 22, 2007)

Well - all I can say is buyer beware. I bought a pretty little mare with a fantastic pedigree. This little mare was far away from me so I did not get an opportunity to see her "in person". I was told that she was thin - no problem - at my farm nobody stays thin for long!!!!! She had her first foal this spring and some mares do have a problem with keeping weight on during pregnancy and then afterwards when they are nursing their foal. Actually I bought 3 horses from this same place and one of them was a thin 2 year old that was not to the point of being emaciated - but could have been on her way there. Well - the horses were picked up by another mini person - her husband actually - and started on the long journey to our home. When the husband arrived at his farm that afternoon - his wife was horrified when she saw the horses and contacted me right away. She told me that if she had been on the truck that day - the one mare for sure - would never have been loaded in to the trailer. Now keep in mind - these horses had almost 2000 miles to travel. Well, now the horses were at another breeders farm and were heading out on an 8 or 10 hour journey the next day. Thank heavens that these horses were being transported by other mini breeders and not a commercial transport company. We did not know whether the one mare would even make the trip - she was in such poor shape. But I was not going to send the horses back - and you will see why. I am only going to post pictures of the one horses - that was in deplorable condition - she was actually emaciated. So the first picture is of the horse I thought I was buying and the others are of the poor little horse that got on to a trailer - and is now safely in her new home and doing well.

















I was horrified when I saw this mare - and the last two photos don't even show just terrible she really looked. Not only is she in serious body condition - but her feet were horrendous - she had not been brushed for a long time - she had not had a bridle path clipped for at least a year - I could go on and on. As soon as I got her home - I took her to our veterinarian. Needless to say our vet was shocked at her condition - and she had been on good food for a week by that point in time. Our vet ran some blood tests and she was bordering on being anemic and the one really disturbing result from the blood work indicated that she was breaking down muscle - which is what happens when the body has used up all of its fat - and the body is just trying to stay alive.

We weighted her at the vet - she weighed 161 pounds - around 75 to 100 pounds under weight.

The good news is - she is eating well and doing well - so we know that she is well on her way to recovery. Oh - one other thing - she was running with a stallion - so my vet did an ultrasound and thank heavens she is not pregnant. So everything that she is eating is going to her - which will make recovery much quicker.

Now - would you be upset it you had this poor little thing arrive at your farm?


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## Brandi* (Sep 22, 2007)

: :no: :no: :no: :no: :no: :no: That is AWFUL!!!!

I just bought my filly sight unseen! I can't imagine how I would have felt if this would have happen :no: Poor little baby! Did the breeder think you wouldn't notice or something



: WOW I am so sorry! At least she is in good hands now



:


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## TriggynBluenDaisy Too (Sep 22, 2007)

Oh my I gasped when I saw her second picture :no: What is wrong with people like this to let this happen to her? I'm so glad she is in the hands of someone who will love and care for her properly now. She's going to be beautiful again and I hope you keep us updated on her progress.

By the way she's adorable!


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## countrycharm (Sep 22, 2007)

OMG!!!! She was a beutiful horse, stunning!! how could they let her turn from that gorgeous animal into the poor suffering one!! I couldnt believe it when i seen the photo, i almost wouldnt have belived it had the socks not matched



im soooo glad she is on her way to recovery with you Thank god


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## wiccanz (Sep 22, 2007)

Ouch





So many out there like this, so very sad...


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## outlawridge (Sep 22, 2007)

I am terribly shocked and saddened.....unbelievable. On the other hand, I am very thankful she is now in your care. Have you contacted the person you bought her from yet? I am curious on their response. All of my minis were purchased sight unseen, although I visited one as a baby after pretty much deciding on her from her photos, and am happy to say that each were just like their photos. It's unfortunate that you have experienced this, but very fortunate for this sweet mare. Please give her a kiss on the nose from me. Bless you for being so willing to keep her and bring her back to the health and condition she deserves.


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## Getitia (Sep 22, 2007)

How very sad and thank goodness you now have her. Shame on those Sellers who pull such stunts - unfortunately we too have been the recipient over the years of the same type of dishonesty



- one thing represented and yet another delivered (and even worse - from some very well known and advertised farms!!!!!!) and it just makes you sick to your stomach as to me these tactics are really nothing more than stealing in my humble opinion - these type of Sellers are just using horses and misrepresenting them to take your money. Because I'm positive had you seen photos of her in her true condition, you would [SIZE=14pt]not [/SIZE] have purchased her...........or at least not for the same price. It is like being sent a photo of a shiny new car and you buy it but the delivered car is a rust bucket, that barely runs. This is no different.

Fortunately most Sellers [SIZE=14pt]are[/SIZE] honest. :aktion033: One thing that is key if you are purchasing horses from a distance (even if you KNOW OF the person or farm). Ensure that the Seller includes the wording in their sales agreement that recent clear photos (within the prior 30 days) were used to advertise the horse (leg, bite, both sides, condition,( if a bred mare - vet checked in foal just prior to shipping)) and that the horse will be shipped in the same condition. If they refuse to send NEW photos or include this wording - move on and look for a farm that will do so. Also if you are a Seller, take photos as the horse is loaded onto the trailer of any commercial shipper as things can happen during shipping and these photos will protect your reputation as the Seller should the horse arrive in poor condition.

Another area to never assume is that the horse is halter trained. You would think that would be basic - but surprising - many miniature adults are not halter trained - so don't assume. Also, another area of concern is the exact opposite of this mare - EXCESSIVELY fat - You are sent a show photo to entice you to purchase the horse and then when the horse is delivered it is so obese it can hardly walk (I've had this happen as well) and it can be equally life threatening.

Thank you for sharing your story, it is a warning for all who purchase a horse sight unseen to ALWAYS cover the basics to protect yourself and never assume-always confirm FIRST prior to sending money.

I look forward to seeing photos of your mare in a few months when she returns to her lovely self.


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## Mona (Sep 22, 2007)

OMG!!! THANK GOD you got her!!! I am sure under your loving care she can and will look as good as she did in that first pic, once again. This crap is really making me sick! 3 STARVATION cases in less than a week...how sickening!

Also, I am wondering...just last night while searching my posts for something else, I noticed where you had replied to my post on warts. You mentioned one of your new horses came with warts covering her entire body??? Was this also from the same person???


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## AppyLover2 (Sep 22, 2007)

OMG!!!! I must say those pictures got to me more than any I've seen....and there have been some BAD ones over the years. Did they have other horses? Any idea from your friend whether the ones still on their farm were in such terrible condition?? If so....looks like another rescue mission.


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## lvponies (Sep 22, 2007)

Thank God that poor little mare made it alive to your farm!!! What a beautiful girl she was and I'm sure will be again under your loving care. I just cannot understand how anyone would sell a horse in that condition and not disclose it to the buyer!!!! Just awful!!!


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## ChrystalPaths (Sep 22, 2007)

Well I gasped also. Poor darlin. No excuse for this imho. The seller should be so ashamed for both selling and for allowing her to be in this shape! Are there more there like this? I am so worried for our mini horses this year. Too many pics like this...just breaks my heart. Bless you for caring enough to stick with her, she'll stick with you.


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## Minimor (Sep 22, 2007)

Poor girl, I'm glad you got her (I know you feel like you got took, but with good feed & a bit of time she will look like the top photo again.) She's very pretty.

I don't know--if the seller sent me photos of that thin horse, and if I knew that she had previously looked like the top photo--I'd be inclined to buy her anyway, just to get her out of there. (I do know the lack of a bridle path wouldn't bother me--that's not a sign of neglect!)

Please tell me these were the last 3 horses that seller owns???


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## mmmorgans (Sep 22, 2007)

Minimor said:


> Poor girl, I'm glad you got her (I know you feel like you got took, but with good feed & a bit of time she will look like the top photo again.) She's very pretty.
> 
> I don't know--if the seller sent me photos of that thin horse, and if I knew that she had previously looked like the top photo--I'd be inclined to buy her anyway, just to get her out of there. (I do know the lack of a bridle path wouldn't bother me--that's not a sign of neglect!)
> 
> Please tell me these were the last 3 horses that seller owns???


No - the seller is keeping some horses for herself. I know that she had at least one fat mare as someone recently posted a picture of a mare that she bought from this lady and that mare was not skinny.

With my 3 mares - this one was by far the worst. The 2 year old was not in good shape - and the other mare had a big belly but her backbone was sticking up. The lady thought she was fat because of the belly. That mare has bounced back nicely and the 2 year old is looking far less gaunt. And little Kristi here is putting on weight - thank heavens.

I do believe that when the lady that I bought these mares from - bought Kristi this spring - she must have been in very bad condition. And since this lady was new to horses she did not realize that Kristi was so bad. Apparently Kristi foaled a few weeks after she got her - although the breeder that she got her from (not the original breeder I must add) was not convinced that she was pregnant as she didn't look it.

I think this lady was just not knowledgeable enough to know that this mare was in serious condition and needed help. Although anyone with two eyes could see that she was in horrible shape especially standing next to the normal mare that she sold to someone else.

Another disturbing thing about this mare is that I required an International Health Certificate to import this horse into Canada - and a vet actually examined her and signed the papers. Can you believe that? I guess since she wasn't "sick" he felt that it was OK. I know my vet wouldn't sign the paperwork on a horse in this condition.

I will post pictures periodically as she puts on weight - and gets her winter coat!!!!


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## Leeana (Sep 22, 2007)

I think with broodmares, its really important to ask for RECENT pictures. My reason being, because generally people just put the broodmares out to pasture untill its foaling time. If they wont give you RECENT pictures, then i'd be worried. FALSE REPRESENTATION!





I am so sorry this happened to you. It deffently makes me more leary. Goodluck with her, i hope to see nice fat pictures of her in the future.


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## Vertical Limit (Sep 22, 2007)

Getitia said:


> if you are purchasing horses from a distance (even if you KNOW OF the person or farm). Ensure that the Seller includes the wording in their sales agreement that recent clear photos (within the prior 30 days) were used to advertise the horse (leg, bite, both sides, condition,( if a bred mare - vet checked in foal just prior to shipping)) and that the horse will be shipped in the same condition. If they refuse to send NEW photos or include this wording - move on and look for a farm that will do so. Also if you are a Seller, take photos as the horse is loaded onto the trailer of any commercial shipper as things can happen during shipping and these photos will protect your reputation as the Seller should the horse arrive in poor condition.


Could not have said it better myself, Getitia. If a seller refuses to do anything (within reason) MOVE ON! There are too many horses out there for sale.

We also always take photos of horses being loaded on the trailer. You never know what will happen with the shipper and it's best to cover your bases.

When buying foals INSIST on photos of the sire and dam as grown ups.

Buying and selling horses can be a risky business, but if you use your common sense it can be fun and exciting. If you don't have the experience to buy or sell, please GET HELP! You will avoid a lot of heartache for yourself.

Good luck with your new mare and I hope all goes well with her.


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## kaykay (Sep 22, 2007)

My heart just breaks for that mare! How could anyone look at her and not know what serious condition she is in?? New or not that just doesnt make sense. Im so glad shes with you now and glad she made the long journey okay.

My circle of people I will buy from is so so small because of things like this. Luckily I have been able to see in person most of the horses I have bought before I purchased them. I always give recent pictures so that people know exactly what they are getting with no suprises.

I have to say while on the subject that Getitia and Laura Tennill are two of the best breeders I have ever bought from. Horses I have bought from these two ladies are always exactly what they told me they were with no suprises. :aktion033:


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## mmmorgans (Sep 22, 2007)

kaykay said:


> I have to say while on the subject that Getitia and Laura Tennill are two of the best breeders I have ever bought from. Horses I have bought from these two ladies are always exactly what they told me they were with no suprises. :aktion033:


I tend to be a very trusting person - I wouldn't do something like this to someone - well actually no horse on our property would ever be in this state - but when she told me that the mare was thin - I envisioned what that would be. Needless to say - shocked was an understatement!!!!

I have a beautiful mare here - that was originally at Getitia's farm (Getitia - that mare is Sunshine)- so I know what Getitia sells!!!! I have also seen many pictures of horses that Laura has sold too.

I have had fantastic luck with horses that we have bought from others - especially from Triple K Miniatures!!!

I have now learned to be very wary - and to not trust people that I don't know. But I am glad that we have this mare as she likely wouldn't have made it through the winter if she had stayed where she was. I feel totally ripped off though - this was kind of like a rescue that I paid for. But the story has a happy ending for this little mare - right?!!!!!

Buyer Beware - the best two words in the English Language!!!!


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## Rocky1 (Sep 22, 2007)

Why why why are you not reporting the seller to the SPCA or Humane Society??????? The person needs to be delt with or at least have a file on. Especially since you stated that this is not the first time you got a skinny horse from her! If he/she's a "breeder" and I use that term loosly, then can you imagine what the rest of the herd looks like? You have their address..do something!!


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## GREENWOODMINIS (Sep 22, 2007)

Good heavens...what is wrong with people - thats just sick



:



: thank goodness for you...poor thing...she has to be so happy to be in a good home now....sending you the best of luck for her speedy healing.

lis


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## RockRiverTiff (Sep 22, 2007)

Sad to say I have been there myself. The people that sold me the horse thought she was fat because of her big belly. I purchased her as open, and one week before she was supposed to ship, SURPRISE she popped out a foal. The only pictures they sent me then were of her peeking around corners or looking through stall bars. When she showed up, her backbone and hips looked like a shovel.

But the mare came out of it incredibly well, and was that much sweeter for the extra care she was given. It breaks my heart to see horses in that condition, and you have every right to be outraged. If her last owner could not see from her dull coat and protruding bones that she was starving, then she shouldn't have horses. Even my non-horsey coworkers gasped at the sight of her. I am sure under your care and supervision she will be beautiful again, though. :no:


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## Dona (Sep 22, 2007)

I'm not one to talk to myself.....but found myself saying "OH MY GOD"! ...outloud, when I saw her second photo. Just made me want to cry!

I, too, feel these people should be reported! And bless you for having a heart & keeping this girl so she can be brought back to health. You can see she was a BEAUTIFUL mare at one time.




:


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## Shari (Sep 22, 2007)

OMG..... I am so glad you are going to keep her.

But the person you bought this horse from....needs to not have any animals. err.. what is wrong with people. ....??

Very supprised her Vet allowed any kind of health Certificate to be issued..or the transport compnay would even haul her.


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## just2minis (Sep 22, 2007)

I am appalled ! That is such cruelty to an innocent animal - makes me so angry. They need to be reported, it is criminal.

You should let people know where she came from.


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## mmmorgans (Sep 22, 2007)

Rocky1 said:


> Why why why are you not reporting the seller to the SPCA or Humane Society??????? The person needs to be delt with or at least have a file on. Especially since you stated that this is not the first time you got a skinny horse from her! If he/she's a "breeder" and I use that term loosly, then can you imagine what the rest of the herd looks like? You have their address..do something!!


Don't worry - I am looking into it!!!! The 3 mares that I got from her were all together so I have only bought from her once. The mare that I really really wanted was supposedly sold - then that sale fell through (yeah whatever) and then the woman decided to keep her for herself. I have not idea what condition that mare is in - but I am obviously very concerned. I'm not sure if being from Canada will be harder to deal with the authorities in the US - Pennsylvania to be exact. If anyone has any ideas on who to contact, please let me know.


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## WeeOkie (Sep 22, 2007)

I have emailed you, and am anxiously awaiting your reply. I am sick about this situation, as I may have a couple of horses involved.





Rita


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## MBhorses (Sep 22, 2007)

: Poor mare. It makes me so sick to see a animal like this. Please keep us posted on her and the others.


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## Minimor (Sep 22, 2007)

I was about to ask how old is this mare, but I guess she is just 4?

I figured out, I think, who she is--and I'd point out to everyone that here's an example of a well bred mare--good pedigree, big name prefix, sold through a prestigious sale a couple years ago--and she still ended up in this condition. Big name prefix, registration papers & a fancy pedigree does not keep a horse from landing in a bad home. However, in this instance I'd say that those same things did save this horse--I'd rather imagine that without registration papers and a nice pedigree she wouldn't be in the good home she's landed in now!

I'd sure be doing my best to report the seller to the authorities. You do wonder what the vet was thinking, to issue health papers for any horse in that poor condition. You'd think instead he would be contacting authorities himself.


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## mininik (Sep 22, 2007)

Have you called the vet who issued the health certificate on that mare to ask what the !#$%^&* s/he was thinking?!


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## Jill (Sep 22, 2007)

Oh my God!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That poor mare!!!!!!!! I'm happy she's in hands that will give her A LOT of TLC and groceries. I just can't imagine any excuse that could make that picture explainable.


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## MiniHoofBeats (Sep 22, 2007)

Oh my GOODNESS....oh this poor mare...she looks very similar to the colt that I just rescued as well and it just horrifies me when I see how they used to look, vs. how they look now...oh my gosh my jaw literally dropped to my desk when I saw your mares before and after pictures...

THANK GOD YOU BOUGHT THIS MARE AND SHE IS NOW IN YOUR HANDS!!!!

And bless you for bringing her home instead of sending her back.


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## twister (Sep 22, 2007)

:no: I cannot understand how this seller let this beautiful mare get into this deplorable condition, I don't thin ignorance is a good enough excuse when non-horsy people can tell she is in bad condition. Thank goodness you have her, she will do you proud when she returns to look like the first photo, she will be beautiful again.

Bless you for saving her.

Yvonne


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## miniwhinny (Sep 22, 2007)

OMG!!!!!! Like everyone else I'm horrified by those pictures. I can't wait for the day that you're posting pics of what she once looked like...fat, healthy and loved again.

I'm so sorry this happened to you and your lovely mare.


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## HGFarm (Sep 22, 2007)

OMG!!! I hope this IS reported, it seems to be the only thing that somewhat makes people think twice about doing it again. The excuse of folks being 'new to horses' or just 'not knowing' is B.S.!!!! I dont know anything about elephants, but could certainly tell you if I saw one that was sick or thin!!

I hope she turns out ok and has no other health issues due to this. I too, would not have guessed that was the same horse if I had not compared the markings. DISGUSTING!!!!


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## Mona (Sep 22, 2007)

HGFarm said:


> The excuse of folks being 'new to horses' or just 'not knowing' is B.S.!!!! I dont know anything about elephants, but could certainly tell you if I saw one that was sick or thin!!


:aktion033: Now isn't THIS the truth!



: I was thinking that exact same thing, almost word for word! I am just so sick of seeing these poor neglected horses in the past week and each and every one has a story just asking for people to be kind to the person responsible for their condition, that maybe things are not as they appear.

I agree with you Laurie, that is TOTAL BS!!! Just because you don't have the knowledge or experience does not mean you are so darned blind or stupid to CLEARLY see when an animal is wasting away and is nothing more than a skeleton wearing hide!!! :no: And quite frankly, I really don't care if all of you tell me I have no right to be judgemental...I have just seen enough of this over the past few days to last me a lifetime! 

As our dear forum friend miniv's signature reads:

** "Speak up for those who cannot speak for themselves. Protect the rights of all who are helpless."

Proverbs 31:8 **

To that, I say AMEN!!


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## Minimor (Sep 22, 2007)

I don't know Mona--I really think STUPID goes a long way in cases like this. I have neighbors who seem to think it's perfectly okay to not feed their animals--usually cats, but there are some horses that aren't faring so well at times either--and I honestly think that these people are so stupid that they think as long as the animal is still up & walking around that it's doing okay.

I've never believed that stupid is a defense for anything, but I do believe some of these people are just plain too stupid to see what's really what with these starving animals. And anyone that stupid really doesn't deserve to have animals.


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## Mona (Sep 22, 2007)

Minimor said:


> I have neighbors who seem to think it's perfectly okay to not feed their animals--usually cats


Well, I can see that happening with farm cats, because a cat is a predator...it naturally hunts for it's food, and it CAN survive without human intervention, IF it is not declawed and IF it is living outside in the country. (No, I personally DON'T agree with not feeding cats!! I feel if you have 'en, FEED 'EM!!)



Minimor said:


> And anyone that stupid really doesn't deserve to have animals.


:aktion033: YES!!!!!!! THAT is what I think too, NO EXCUSES, PERIOD!


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## MInx (Sep 22, 2007)

My question isn't would you have bought the horse now, but what the heck would have happened if you had NOT bought her! Thank God you did, I just wonder what selling price was on her, hope they get turned in by the authorities..THEY should be the one paying! God Bless her.

Maxine


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## sdmini (Sep 23, 2007)

Wow! What can I say except so glad you have her now!


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## TriggynBluenDaisy Too (Sep 23, 2007)

Mona said:


> HGFarm said:
> 
> 
> > *The excuse of folks being 'new to horses' or just 'not knowing' is B.S.!!!! I dont know anything about elephants, but could certainly tell you if I saw one that was sick or thin!! *
> ...


* *

*
Perfectly said! :aktion033: I am so happy this beautiful mare now is on the road to recovery and will soon be back to her her extremely cute self. But I sure feel for the OP having to get her in this awful condition and do all the hard work to make her worth what was paid. What would possess someone to put her for sale in that condition let alone send her to a new owner for such a horrendously long trip? I just don't get it and don't think I want to either. *



*:*


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## bevann (Sep 23, 2007)

TriggynBluenDaisy Too said:


> Mona said:
> 
> 
> > HGFarm said:
> ...


*
It is a sin to let any animal get in that horrible condition. I really hope you tell everyone you know where she came from and have them spread the word.I know you can't print that info here, but word needs to get out regarding a person who neglects an animal.In bad dealings I have had in the past I have NO PROBLEM relating my experiences to others in hopes that they will avoid any future problem by not dealing with the person.Word of mouth-good or bad is the best sales thing.*


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## HGFarm (Sep 23, 2007)

I agree with Mona, I am getting sick of seeing this- with Mini and big horses alike. There are enough Rescues out there or poeple to give them to, or SOMETHING, that to let them stand and starve, or better yet, dump them in the desert, like they seem to do here occasionally, that there is NO excuse for this at all.

As for cats, I have had folks tell me they dont feed them to make them 'hunt better'. That is also BS in my opinion. I have ALWAYS kept food and fresh water out for my cats, whether they were barn cats or whatever.. and they still hunted just fine and were HEALTHY hunters.

We moved onto a small ranch one time that as I was cleaning out the cow stalls in the barn that had not been cleaned since..... ????... dug up SEVERAL cat skeletons in the hay where it appears they laid down and died. We also found several under the house. Probably starved to death, or had no water in winter. I bet there were at least a dozen skeletons.... and they just kept hauling in more cats. There were two when we moved in there, and when we left, I found a good home for one and took the other one with me. I was not going to leave them knowing they would also starve or freeze like the others (they accused me of spoiling them because I made sure they had unfrozen water to drink in the barn in winter- animals cannot live without water!!)

Sorry got off topic, but I just cant stand seeing people not take care of ANY animals, no matter what it is. If you own it, you are responsible!!


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## George (Sep 23, 2007)

Wow! At first I thought the first picture was posted to point out what a well cared for horse looked like and the second was of the horse you got and how they aren't supposed to look. I studied the first and second photo and realized that the first horse was the second horse. What a terrible sight in the second photo. I agree, you don't have to know about horses to tell when a horse needs more food and better care. That is just pure neglect.

I have seen this too many times, people buy an animal and for the first week or two are proud of the animal and then one day they wake up and don't want to go out in the cold and feed it. Then they see it did OK the first day so they figure it will be OK over night too. THen they get into the habit of only feeding when they are close enough to the barn that they don't have to make much effort to throw in a handful of hay. They don't stop to think that their trips to the barn went from two or more times a day down to once or twice a week.

I hate going out into the cold and dark too but that is part of animal care; you have to do what you don't want to do because the animal isn't in a position to feed and water itself.

My habit for years has been to get up, get ready for work, go out and take (full) care of the animals, go to work, come home from work and head right back out to take care of the animals. I don't just feed, water and clean, I look them over every single day. If something should be wrong I want to catch it early not when it is too late.

Even my chickens get food and water twice a day even though they free range and there are plenty of bugs and water.

I could never There is absolutely no excuse for such poor care, if a person can't even provide the basic care to keep a horse or any animal healthy then place a free ad to place the animal with someone who can. It's easier to give away a neglected animal than it is to sell a dead animal.

I'm glad you got the horse and hope to see a picture of her when she is as beautiful as she was.


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## RobinRTrueJoy (Sep 23, 2007)

OMG!!! I GASPED when I saw her picture. Thank God You have her now. Those people need to be whipped, and reported!!!


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## wiccanz (Sep 23, 2007)

> As for cats, I have had folks tell me they dont feed them to make them 'hunt better'. That is also BS in my opinion. I have ALWAYS kept food and fresh water out for my cats, whether they were barn cats or whatever.. and they still hunted just fine and were HEALTHY hunters.


You are right. Fat, well-fed cats hunt. I know, I have 2 brilliant hunters, both are fed the best, both are overweight. Hunting in cats is something that some of them like to do more so than others, it has nothing to do with their body condition, or whether or not they are well-fed.


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## Minimor (Sep 23, 2007)

> Well, I can see that happening with farm cats, because a cat is a predator...it naturally hunts for it's food, and it CAN survive without human intervention, IF it is not declawed and IF it is living outside in the country.


 I guess that's what a lot of people figure, but that's just a whole load of BS. ....:new_2gunsfiring_v1: I don't care if it's predator or prey, if it's a little rack of bones it's a pretty stupid person that can't tell that it's a starving animal, even if they don't know anything about the particular species of animal. My cats are mostly fat & all are well fed and they are marvelous hunters. But anyway, this is off topic...even if I'm the one that brought up the subject of cats as an example. sorry!




:


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## StarRidgeAcres (Sep 24, 2007)

What in the heck is wrong with people?? :new_2gunsfiring_v1:


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## Manyspots (Sep 24, 2007)

Have to tell you when I first clicked on your post to see what you had bought out of curiousity, I couldn't believe what I saw. While I am sure you were totally floored, I am thankful the little horse found you. I have sold horses out of state and also out of the country and when people have gotten them they have written and said the horse is just what you said it would be. I guess I am naive, but I just can't believe these type of things happen. These kind of pics make me have less foals each year. I hope that whoever you purchased this horse from will not be someone I have ever sold to. We try so hard to check out where our minis go and what type of homes they will have. Some times, though, I am sure we can be fooled. Lavonne


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## Denise (Sep 24, 2007)

Holy shxx were my exact words! How in the heck can anyone have a horse looking like that and think nothing is wrong?? 

This is where I would love to publicly see the name of this seller, so no one else buys from them. Teach them a lesson!

I am glad you do have her and she is getting the care she needs now.


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## Tony (Sep 24, 2007)

I was doubly appalled because I took the first picture when I owned the mare! She was fat, beautiful, and in foal when she left here. Too many people fall for the myth that you can feed a miniature a "cup" of grain a day and that "a bale of hay will last a month." False! False! False!!! Now I am concerned about another beautiful mare that went with her.


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## ~Palomino~ (Sep 24, 2007)

Tony said:


> I was doubly appalled because I took the first picture when I owned the mare! She was fat, beautiful, and in foal when she left here. Too many people fall for the myth that you can feed a miniature a "cup" of grain a day and that "a bale of hay will last a month." False! False! False!!! Now I am concerned about another beautiful mare that went with her.



I thought you use to own this mare, I was like there is no way Tony would let a mare get like this. I am glad to know its not you!

I feel bad for her but I am glad you got her!

Gage


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## PaintNminis (Sep 25, 2007)

OMG That is Aweful!!!!


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## MiLo Minis (Sep 25, 2007)

The most sickening part is that the camera ADDS weight! I know this mare is even worse looking in actuality after my own experience. Be very careful feeding her back up to weight. I am a little concerned when you say that there was another mare on that farm that was badly overweight? Does this mare have marks on her that make her look as if she may have been bullied away from the food? If not maybe there is an underlying condition that makes her look like this? I would have her carefully vet checked with blood and stool tests and have her teeth looked at. It is going to be a long slow process to get her back to a healthy weight. I am so glad that you have taken her on and she will get the help that she needs.

You KNOW the person who sold her KNEW she was in bad shape because she only sent the old photos that made her look good.


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## CritterCountry (Sep 25, 2007)

If I am buying a horse, I always ask for recent pics..the kind with the dates right on the picture.

What a sickening sight that poor mare is. Glad you got her and hope the seller gets a smack upside the head from the next person she attempts to screw over.

I cannot fathom how not ever owning horses before has anything to do with it whether you know you shoud be feeding it or not. That is common sense and a 4 yr old can grasp that concept, so why not this seller?

Makes you wonder whether she bought some grub for the rest of her horses with the money you gave her or not.



:


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## mmmorgans (Sep 25, 2007)

MiLo Minis said:


> The most sickening part is that the camera ADDS weight! I know this mare is even worse looking in actuality after my own experience. Be very careful feeding her back up to weight. I am a little concerned when you say that there was another mare on that farm that was badly overweight? Does this mare have marks on her that make her look as if she may have been bullied away from the food? If not maybe there is an underlying condition that makes her look like this? I would have her carefully vet checked with blood and stool tests and have her teeth looked at. It is going to be a long slow process to get her back to a healthy weight. I am so glad that you have taken her on and she will get the help that she needs.
> 
> You KNOW the person who sold her KNEW she was in bad shape because she only sent the old photos that made her look good.



You are absolutely right - she looks worse than the picture shows. We are being very careful with her feeding regime. We took her to our vet the very next morning after getting her home. I hated to put her in a trailer again - but felt that she needed veterinary attention above and beyond everything else.

Our vet did blood work, fecal samples and an overall examination. The blood work indicated that she was borderline anemic - which was understandable. It also indicated that she was breaking down muscle - a sign of starvation for sure. The fecal samples did show a moderate level of worm infestation. However, nothing else showed up so there does not appear to be any other underlying problems with this mare. She did not have bite marks on her but she is more submissive than the other two that she came with. I believe that she was chased away from food - but that is still no excuse for her condition.

We can see the weight on her already - which is a great sign. If she is putting weight on so quickly she should recover completely. And thank heavens she is not pregnant. If she had been pregnant we would have terminated the pregnancy if it was safe to do so - simply because she needs time for her body to get well and pregnancy would have complicated the matter.

We have gradually increased her rations so that her body is not given too much - too quickly. What we are doing appears to be working so we will continue. She is getting a balanced pellet with some grain - along with multivitamins - and some canola oil added to the whole mixture. She also has free choice salt and a mineral block. And of course fresh water and grass hay is in abundance.

She has really been missing her two friends this past week - they have been integrated into the herd. So yesterday I put a sweet yearling filly in with her. She is being dominant over the filly - but not mean. It appears to be taking her mind off of her friends - which is a good thing as she was not eating as well as she had been.

There is no excuse in the world for a healthy horse to get to this state. Things like this are so sad - but for this little mare there is a happy ending - which is more than some other horses have.


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## MBhorses (Sep 25, 2007)

poor mare,

She is a very pretty mare in the first photo. I am so glad she has a good home now. Keep us posted.


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## cdailey (Sep 25, 2007)

mmmorgans said:


> Rocky1 said:
> 
> 
> > Why why why are you not reporting the seller to the SPCA or Humane Society??????? The person needs to be delt with or at least have a file on. Especially since you stated that this is not the first time you got a skinny horse from her! If he/she's a "breeder" and I use that term loosly, then can you imagine what the rest of the herd looks like? You have their address..do something!!
> ...


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## mydaddysjag (Sep 26, 2007)

Please Pm me with who you purchased her from.

Im from PA, and would like to avoid the seller.


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## MeadowRidge Farm (Sep 26, 2007)

What a beautiful mare she was, and I am sure you will get her back to her beauty in no time. I am so glad she found a home with you, thank you so much for caring. I agree with what Mona has said, about all the BS, and if people want horses they need to wake up and take care of them, but I also know there are a few in between exceptions where someone honestly dint know, everything about feeding, but is trying there darndest to help a animal, that otherwise would of been dead by now.. I have also bought horses from 2 big name farms, and they came to me in deplorable condition.. One was covered with lice, and was so thin, you could put fingers between each rib.This lilttle mare also has a very nice pedigree. She got to be in this condition from the owner having about 60 in a pasture, and this mare was low on the pecking order, but obviously the owner never paid much attention to see that everyone was getting there share of food.I bought her thru pictures sent to me, which had been taken a few years before also, day and night difference over what I seen and what I bought! I also had pictures sent to me of a very well known farm, with a very well known stallion, where there were ALOT of yearlings, all very thin, wormy, and long toes ...this breeder was waiting for some of them to die!!!!! My question~~ WHY ARE POEPLE LIKE THIS BREEDING? I don't understand how anyone can do this to a animal, and that is WITH KNOWLEDGE. We all need to do our part to the best we can to educate those willing to learn, and rehab those who need our help, there are so many out there that need us. Corinne


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## mmmorgans (Oct 14, 2007)

OK - here are some updated photos of our little mare - taken today. She is really getting a heavy winter coat now (thank heavens) - but she looks like a brand new horse. These pictures are her just standing naturally - no show poses - but I think you will be amazed at the difference in this poor little girl. She is doing very well - but the sad thing is - she is so afraid of people it isn't funny. When I brush her she just does everything to get away from me. When I try to pickup her tail to brush it she acts like I am going to hit her. She was so weak when we first got her that she didn't have the energy to run away from us. Now that she is feeling stronger and healthier - she is showing how much she doesn't trust people. What a shame!!! I don't know what this mare has been through in her 4 years of life - but I am guessing that it hasn't been all that pleasant. I know that she will eventually trust us - but it will take some time and lots of TLC for us to earn that trust from her.

She is actually looking pretty fat in these photos!!!!!


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## Devon (Oct 14, 2007)

Shes a beautiful mare!!

You got her bounced back nicely and she is actually stunning I love her!


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## Buckskin gal (Oct 14, 2007)

Wow she really is looking good1 She is a real ice looking little gal and with all the love and care you are giving her I would bet you will win her over




: Mary


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## chandab (Oct 14, 2007)

Wow, she looks awesome. Good job.


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## Loren&Rocky (Oct 15, 2007)

She is looking much happier and healthier.

Have you asked the people you bought her from what the deal was with her? Did I miss that part?

I was just wondering what their "excuse" was for the condition she was in when she arrived and her "Don't hit me" attitude she has now.


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## mmmorgans (Oct 15, 2007)

Loren&Rocky said:


> She is looking much happier and healthier.
> 
> Have you asked the people you bought her from what the deal was with her? Did I miss that part?
> 
> I was just wondering what their "excuse" was for the condition she was in when she arrived and her "Don't hit me" attitude she has now.


I have not had any correspondence with the lady I bought her from. She told me that she was thin when she purchased her in April - and she new she was "thin" when she came to me. That is about all I know - the weight has been relatively easy to get back on this little mare (thank heavens) - I have no idea why she is so untrusting of people - this is so unlike a mini. We have another mare that was as wild as a deer when we got her - it took a while but she totally trusts us now. I can clip her, check her bag when she is due to foal, do farrier work, etc. - but it took a while before she understood that I was a friend and not someone to be afraid of.

With this little mare we will just take it slowly - who knows what she has been through - but I do know one thing for sure - at our farm she is safe and will be well loved - and that she totally deserves. Eventually she will realize that we helped her - and maybe once she can go out with the rest of the herd and meet up with her two friends - she will be happier. Of course we have had to keep her separate as we needed to feed her a special diet and needed to make sure that she didn't have to compete for food. She has bounced back quickly - so hopefully her fear of people will gradually change too!!!


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## Mona (Oct 15, 2007)

:new_shocked: WOW, she's really looking GOOD!! CONGRATULATIONS on a job well done! :aktion033:


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## hairicane (Oct 15, 2007)

She is really looking great! She is such a pretty, bright eyed girl now



:


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## Loren&Rocky (Oct 15, 2007)

How many owners has she had?


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## lvponies (Oct 15, 2007)

Oh Wow!!! She is looking 100% better!!! What a pretty girl she is!! :aktion033: Great Job!! :aktion033:


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## Jill (Oct 15, 2007)

Oh my gosh! You have worked a miracle!!!!!!!!

Years ago, I bought a yearling who was very underweight and very wormy and brough him "back" to good pretty quickly, too. But, he was no where near as bad off as your mare was before she met you.

She must feel like she's hit the lottery


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## Sue S (Oct 15, 2007)

Oh my gosh, how terrible, how can anyone let that beautiful horse get like that, didn't know it was the same horse until I looked at the legs, I am so glad you have her.


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## REO (Oct 15, 2007)

She looks wonderful! What a lucky girl to have you! I hope she realizes what a great mom you are and comes around. It's so sad to see ones so not trusting. I'm glad she's with you now!

Seeing how far she's come has made my day! :aktion033:


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## mmmorgans (Oct 15, 2007)

Loren&Rocky said:


> How many owners has she had?



She was sold as a two year old (from her original breeder - who is one of the top breeders - very well known). Then she lived on another farm from the time she was two - she was bred the following year as a 3 year old. Then she was sold as a 4 year old (pregnant at the time) to the person I purchased her from. That person bought her in April/07 and she foaled a few weeks later. I purchased this mare and two others from that person - and they arrived home to our place on August 26/07. The emaciated picture of this mare was taken a week before we got her home. The mares had to stay at a friend's place just across the US/Canada border as the vet paperwork was not ready when the mares left PA - and it took many phone calls and FedEx bills to get the paperwork by the next week. So they had a layover for a week - which was very upsetting because we wanted to get them home and settled and on to a good feeding program with no stress in their lives.

So in less than two months - that little mare put on the weight that will get her through our winter. I was so worried that she wouldn't put enough weight on before the cold weather hit. But she has come back so quickly it is unbelievable. Her coat has grown a lot - in preparation for the winter - and it is shiny instead of dull.


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## GMAMINIS (Oct 15, 2007)

AWESOME JOB MMMORGANS :aktion033: . SHE IS SO LUCKY TO HAVE FOUND YOU. I AM SURE IN TIME SHE WILL COME AROUND, ESPECIALLY WITH ALL THE LOVE AND ATTENTION SHE IS GETTING.



:


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## Becky (Oct 15, 2007)

Congratulations on nursing her back to health so quickly! She looks super! :aktion033: I meant to ask you at World how she was doing and I forgot.

How is Y Nona doing?


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## Meadowind (Oct 15, 2007)

Unbelieveable on 2 fronts! :no: Firstly unbelievable that someone would sell a horse in that condition - "thin" doesn't go anywhere near describing it.



: Secondly, unbelievable what you have done with this little mare since she arrived at your place. No doubt about it, she is a lucky horse to have you in her life. She will be well cared for, for sure.


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## Irish Hills Farm (Oct 15, 2007)

She looks awesome, great job! :aktion033:


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## Miniv (Oct 15, 2007)

She's looking GREAT!!! You should do a before and after shot next to eachother to show the difference.

Kuddos to you for bringing her back UP! :aktion033:

MA


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## MBhorses (Oct 15, 2007)

: wow

she is looking great. You have a nice looking mare. I am so glad you got her, she was so sad looking when you first got her. She is coming around very nice.


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## Loren&Rocky (Oct 15, 2007)

You have done a great job with her. It is so sad to know where she came from to how she (And the other 2 ) ended up, but great that she is back in good hands again.

I hope the others are doing well and recovering from what ever their terrible experience was. My mini gelding Rocky was an auction horse and although I have owned him for over 2 years, he still harbors fear from who ever beat on him once upon a time. I don't know if he will ever get over it, but we are trying.


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## Sandyboy1 (Oct 15, 2007)

Kudos to you for the wonderful care you've given this mare!

Would you be comfortable sharing information about the feed program you've implemented for her? If so, I think many people and horses could benefit.

Pam


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## Fancy Me (Oct 15, 2007)

Wowza. She sure is a beauty when her bones are not all sticking out like that. Looks like you worked wonders with that girl. Can wait to see how she does later on when she learn to trust you. I once bought a mustang that was probably 100-150 pounds under weight. When we got her she was a mellow ( or so we thought) horse. Then she started to show her true colors when we fattened her up ( didn't take to long...




: ). Boy was that fun! 



: Well she was just a spazzy pony. She was hard to handle, mean, and we really could not ride her. When we bought her the people told us she was five. And we found out she was 20! So as you can imagine, that wasn't a happy little pony. So we gave her to a rescue farm that retrains their horses and is a Kids w/ Cancer place. So that was a nice farm to go to. :bgrin So now we have our mini. And she is just right.


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## Jessica_06 (Oct 15, 2007)

Great work for bringing that mare back to an ideal winter weight! I too was afraid that you living in Canada it would be tough to bring her back just before winter. May I ask why you didn't post this on the main forum? I look at the photo forum once in a while but I know many dont and with whats going on about those Kansas Minis I bet people would like to here your success story of an emancipated horse. Just a thought. Could you tell us what type of food you fed her to bring her back so fast just curious. She looks beutiful and you are lucky to have her, give her time she'll come around quickly. I had a similar situation with a yearling colt that wasn't handeled and was underfed and it takes alot of time to be totally trusting now he's the sweetest horse I own. Good Luck with her! ~Jessica


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## mmmorgans (Oct 16, 2007)

I posted on the photo/video gallery as I thought that was where the "pictures" were to be posted - although this is more than just pictures - it is truly a story of a horse that was closer to death than I care to think about.

Just for everyone's knowledge - this is how we have fed this little mare:

She was 161 pounds when we took her into the vet the morning after she arrived here. We did blood work to make sure she didn't have any underlying disease that would cause her to drop so much weight. The bloodwork indicated that she didn't have any diseases - that she was bordering on anemic and that she was burning the muscle in her body to keep alive.

So - our vet cautioned us on over feeding. These little horses that have had such poor nutrition need a lot of TLC on their road to recovery. Our vet told us that although horses love oats - that she was not to be on oats to put weight on - that wouldn't work. She was put on a fully balanced ration made for horses - and could be switched to a ration made for foals after the first couple of weeks. We were to gradually increase the amount of ration that she was getting - day by day. We also added vegetable oil to the ration to increase the calories - again starting with about a tablespoon and gradually getting her up to a good 1/2 a cup twice a day. She was to have free choice grass hay at all times - absolutely no alfalfa. There were days when she wouldn't eat her ration - but most of the time she was very anxious when she saw the "blue bucket" coming her way. The ration that we feed is made here in Saskatchewan - we do not have access to any "miniature horse feed" like what is available in the US. If anyone would like to know the ingredients and percentages of protein, etc. - I can post that information as well.

Our vet felt that we could easily put 75 pounds on her by November. We don't have a weight scale here so I don't know how much she has put on - but from the pictures I would say that she has put lots of weight on. Our Canadian winters are brutally cold and I am so happy that she is going into winter with some extra weight on her. I have now cut her rations back to more of a maintenance amount - and have now stopped feeding the oil as I don't think that she needs it any more.

She was kept with her two friends for the first few weeks - then I moved one of the mares that was doing well out with the rest of our mares. That left this poor emaciated mare and a two year old thin mare. The two year old was really bossy and I eventually pulled her out of the pen that the two were in - simply because this little mare needed to eat her full ration every day and the two year old seemed to be getting more than her fair share. That was stressful on this mare - she was very upset about her friends leaving her and I felt so badly for her. I did try to bring a younger very laid back filly in - but that didn't make this little mare happy at all and she started to show some attitude towards the younger filly. I was very happy about her "attitude" as I felt that she must be feeling better and stronger - which she was. So - she is back to being by herself - but only a gate away from the other mares - so she can see them and touch noses through the fence with her friends.


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## Sandyboy1 (Oct 16, 2007)

Thank you for sharing the feeding regimen and the vet's precautions for this mare with us. After rereading the thread, I noticed that you had already posted other vet and dietary information on page 6. Thanks again for giving us such a good picture of your thorough care!

Pam


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## HGFarm (Oct 16, 2007)

She looks just fantastic and now the beautiful mare that she was before! I can tell you that her condition was just from lack of food!!!! You have done a great job and I am sure she will settle down and come around in time. :aktion033:


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## RockRiverTiff (Oct 16, 2007)

These are the best kinds of updates! It sure warms my heart and gives me hope for all the Kansas rescues. It's wonderful to see her looking like her old self again--and it must be very gratifying for you also. I am sure just as the weight came back, her trust will too.


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## twister (Oct 18, 2007)

:aktion033: What an awesome job you have done with this mare, thank you for caring so much. I am sure she will come to trust you in time :bgrin

Yvonne


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## TINALEE (Nov 16, 2007)

WELL I WAS INFORMED TODAY THAT I WAS THE TALK OF LIL BEGINNING.I WOULD FIRST LIKE TO SAY YES THE PICTURES ARE AWFUL-I AGREE.I WAS THE OWNER OF THIS MARE KRISTI WHEN CYNDI BOUGHT HER.I AM NOT AFRAID NOR ASHAMED TO ADMIT IT AND I WELCOME ANYONE WANTING TO TURN ME IN TO DO SO,I OWN 7 MINIATURES,IM IN LIGONIER PA AND MY HORSE FARM IS ALLSTAR MINIS.PLEASE DO HAVE THE AUTHORITIES COME TO MY FARM,ID WELCOME THEM AND SHOW THEM MY FAT MINIS!WHEN I GOT KRISTI ON APRIL 21ST TONY OF LITTLE AMERICA HAD TOLD ME THE 2 BRED MARES WERE THIN.HE TOLD ME SILVER WAS EXPECTING AND THAT HE DIDNT BELIEVE THAT KRISTI WAS EXPECTING ALTHOUGH HE HAD HER POSTED AS IN FOAL ,HE GAVE A $500 DISCOUNT ON HER BECAUSE HE DIDNT FEEL SHE WAS IN FOAL BECAUSE SHE WAS SO THIN.(YES TONY I DO HAVE YOUR EMAILS AND I DID FORWARD THEM TO CYNDI WHEN SHE ASKED ABOUT KRISTI)A DAY OR TWO BEFOR THEY WERE PICKED UP TONY EMAILED SAYING KRISTI HAD LOST HER MAIDEN LOOK SO SHE MAY BE IN FOAL BUT WAS STILL THIN.HIS EXACT WORDS COPIED FROM AN EMAIL DATED 4 -17-07 'I am really sorry that Future is so thin. In her winter hair she looked good. If I had known how bad she looked I would not have sold her. If you are unhappy with her, just have Brian bring her back. Of course, her Too Incredible foal may more than make up for her condition.'.WHEN BRIAN DROPPED THEM OFF I ASKED HOW EVERYONE WAS DOING.HE SAID THE FILLIES ARE FINE THE MARES NEED SOME TLC.SILVER FOALED THAT NIGHT EVEN THOUGH SHE WAS VERY THIN BUT NOT NEARLY AS THIN AS KRISTI.THE DAY AFTER I GOT THE GIRLS(I GOT 4 MINIS FROM TONY)I EMAILED ASKING ABOUT KRISTI'S FEEDINGS AND I THOUGHT SHE WAS DEPRESSED BECAUSE SHE DIDNT EAT MUCH AND WAS VERY LAID BACK.HE TOLD ME THAT HE WAS SORRY THE GIRLS WERE THIN AND THAT KRISTI WAS IN WITH A HERD OF 150 MARES AND STOOD BACK AND WAS AT THE BOTTOM OF THE TOTEM POOL.HIS EXACT WORDS COPIED FROM HIS EMAIL ' I am guessing you mean Future(I NAMED HER KRISTI). 'She was so low on the totem pole here in the pasture that she just stood back until everyone ate everything, I think.

Tony'

AND THAT SHE GOT THE 'LEFTOVERS' WHICH WE ALL KNOW THERE ARE NO LEFTOVERS WHEN IT COMES TO GRAIN.I WILL BE MORE THAN HAPPY TO EMAIL ALL EMAILS TO ANYONE WANTING THEM AS I STILL HAVE THEM AND THEY ARE ALL DATED AND I WILL HAVE THEM COPIED AND HANDY FOR THE HUMANE SOCIETY.ALSO I WILL HAVE HANDY THE RECIEPT FROM VALLEYVET SUPPLY FOR HORSE SUPPLIES AND MEDICATIONS WORMERS AND ANYYTHING I THOUGHT MY MINIS WOULD NEED,IT IS OVER $1000 JUST FOR THE ONE RECIEPT ALONE WHERE I ORDERED ALOT OF SUPPLIES(FOALING SUPPLIES,WORMERS,CALCIUM SUPPLIMETS,ETC).I HAVE MANY RECIEPTS FOR WORMERS,HARNESSES AND ANYTHING THAT THEY NEEDED!I DO BELIEVE I SENT CYNDI A COPY OF THIS AS WELL.I WANTED HER TO KNOW THAT I DID AND DO WORM MY HORSES EVEY 2 MONTHS AS DIRECTED BY THE VET AND OTHER MINIS BREEDERS.I HAVE PICTURES OF KRISTI THAT I SENT WITH HER PAPERWORK TO AMHA.IN THE PICTURES SHE IS VERY THIN JUST AS TONY SAID SHE WAS AND HER BONES WERE STICKING OUT SO WE DIDNT REALLY THINK SHE WAS IN FOAL.ON JUNE 8TH KRISTI HAD A COLT IN THE PASTURE.WE WERE SHOCKED BECAUSE SHE DIDNT SHOW AT ALL SHE WAS JUST SO THIN.THAT WAS ONLY 6 WEEKS AFTER WE HAD GOTTEN HER.I ACTUALLY THOUGHT SHE WAS PUTTING ON A LITTLE WEIGHT BECAUSE I FED HER SEPERATELY BUT HERE SHE WAS IN FOAL.AFTER SHE HAD THE FOAL SHE WAS SO VERY THIN.WE HAND FED THE BABY SOME AND LET HIM EAT FROM MOM.SHE WAS JUST SO THIN BUT I KNOW YOU CANT OVERFEED THEM SO NO TONY SHE WASNT GETTING A LOUSY CUP OF FOOD PER DAY.I DIDNT PAY THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS FOR HORSES TO STARVE THEM.SHE WAS FED 3 AND 4 TIMES EACH DAY BECAUSE SHE WAS SO THIN AND I KNEW SHE WAS FEEDING THE BABY OR IN YOUR WORDS TONY AGAIN COPIED FROM AN EMAIL WHEN I ASKED ABOUT HER WEIGHT 'I didn't mean to alarm you. She's not that bad, but timid with the mares and she was in a pasture with over 150 mares! She will pick back up, healthy, just sending her "groceries" to the foal. When she doesn't have to fight for her share of the oats, I am sure that she will put on weight.

Tony' I HAD KRISTI VET CHECKED BY A VETERINARIAN THAT HAS BEEN A 'FARM VET' FOR OVER 30 YEARS-WHEN I ASKED ABOUT HER WEIGHT HE WAVED HIS HAND TOWARD HER AND SAID OHHH THEY SOMETIMES GET THAT WAY WHEN THEY FOAL I THOUGHT GRACIOUS THATS AWFULLY SKINNY BUT HE HAS BEEN WORKING WITH FARM ANIMALS FOR OVER 30 YEARS AND I HAVE HAD MINIS FOR ONLY A YEAR SO WHAT DID I KNOW.CYNDI BOUGHT KRISTI IN JULY SO I HAD KRISTI FOR 3 MONTHS.WHEN I TALKED TO CYNDI ON THE PHONE I TOLD HER KRISTI WAS VERY THIN AND THAT I WAS WEANING HER FOAL AT ONLY 1 MONTH OF AGE BECAUSE HE WAS TAKING TO MUCH FROM HER.SHE SAID OH THATS OK ALOT OF MY MARES GET THIN WHEN THEY FOAL.WITH EVERYONE TELLING ME OH THATS NORMAL WHAT ELSE WAS I TO THINK?I GAVE THE WORMERS,FED HER AND I CARED FOR HER AND DID EVERYTHING I WAS TO DO FOR HER.WHEN CYDI CONTACTED ME SAYING SHE WAS VERY UPSET WITH HER WEIGHT I KNEW THEN THAT KRISTI WAS INDEED IN MUCH WORSE SHAPE THAN ANYONE LET ON.OF COURSE I COULD SEE WITH MY OWN 2 EYES THAT SHE WAS VERY THIN BUT WITH THE VET SAYING OH THEY GET THAT WAY AND THIS BEING MY FIRST YEAR FOALING I THOUGHT THAT SOME DID INDEED GET VERY THIN LIKE THIS WHICH YES I THOUGHT WAS TERRIBLE.NOW AS FOR THE OTHER MARE 'STAR' THAT CYNDI GOT. I SENT HER THE EMAILS FROM KEVIN DRAYS WHO I GOT STAR FROM THAT SHE WAS ALSO THIN OR AS KEVIN PUT IT 'CONDITIONED' HE SAID SHE ALWAYS STAYS CONDITIONED.HIS EXACT WORDS FROM HIS EMAIL WHICH WERE COPIED(THANK GOODNESS I HAVE ALL OF THESE EMAILS!)'STARSTRUCK IS 33.25''-SHE IS A HORSE THAT ALWAYS STAY IN SHOW CONDITION-WE HAD THE VET CHECK HER JUST TO MAKE SURE THERE WAS NOTHING WRONG WITH HER-SHE JUST STAYS IS SHAPE ALL THE TIME--WE DID BLOOD WORK AND SHE CAME BACK PERFECT AND NOTHING WRONG THE VET JUST SAID SHE IS A HORSE THAT JUST STAYS IN SHAPE .' STAR WAS ACTUALLY A FEW POUNDS MORE WHEN I SOLD HER THAN SHE WAS WHEN I GOT HER.I DONT FEEL AND KEVIN DIDNT FEEL AND THE VET DIDNT FEEL SHE WAS 'THIN' AT ALL.I OWNED STAR FOR 2 MONTHS....DUTCH THE LAST GIRL THAT CYNDI GOT WAS WITH ME FOR OVER A YEAR AND YES SHE WAS FAT BECAUSE I OWNED HER FOR MORE THAN A FEW MONTHS AND FATTENED HER UP.ALSO MANY OF YOU SAW HER PICTURE ON THIS FORUM AS SHE HAD A FILLY (NAMED HOPE)WHO HAD LUXATING PATELLAS AND I WAS SEARCHING FOR ADVICE IN HELPING HER.MOST VETS SAID TO PUT HER DOWN BUT I FOUND A SPECIALIST WHO DID SURGERY ON HER AND SHE IS NOW WALKING AND RUNNING.NOW DO YOU HONESLTY THINK I WOULD SPEND THOUSANDS ON A NEWBORN FILLY AND ADOPT HER OUT AT NO CHARGE AND NOT SPEND THE TIME AND MONEY IN FEEDING MY HORSES,,,PLEASE!!!!...I UNDERSTAND ALOT OF YOU JUST SAW THE PICTURES AND THOUGHT OH MY GOSH SHE WAS NEGLECTED BY THE CURRENT OWNER WELL LET ME SAY NO SHE MOST CERTAINLY WAS NOT.I DID EVERYTHING I COULD FOR HER AND TOLD CYNDI SHE WAS THIN AND HAD THE VET LOOK AT HER.I KNOW SHE WAS THIN IM NOT BLIND! DID I THINK SHE WAS NEAR DEATH-HONESTLY NO.MAYBE BECAUSE I HAVE NEVER HAD SUCH A THIN ANIMAL AND THE VET SEEMED TO SHRUG IT OFF.IF SHE WERE NEAR DEATH YOU WOULD THINK THE VET WOULD SAY OH MY WE CANT SHIP HER OR OH MY SHE IS SICK OR IN NEED OF SOMETHING...ANY ADVICE WOULD HAVE BEEN HELPFUL BUT EVERYONE SHRUGGED IT OFF AS SHE IS THIN-THEY GET THAT WAY.IT WAS NOT UNTIL AFTER CYNDI GOT HER THAT I REALIZED JUST HOW BAD SHE WAS BECAUSE SHE HAD TOLD ME SHE WAS VERY WORRIED ABOUT KRISTI.CALL ME STUPID I DONT CARE BECAUSE SEEING THE PICTURES I GET SICK AND THINK GOSH I COULD HAVE DONE SO MUCH MORE FOR HER.I SHOULD HAVE TAKEN HER FOAL RIGHT AWAY MAYBE THEN SHE COULD HAVE PICKED UP WEIGHT.I DIDNT WANT THE FOAL TO BE HARMED EITHER THOUGH....WHY DID I PLACE THE HORSES AFTER HAVING THEM SUCH A SHORT TIME?BECAUSE I DIDNT REALIZE THEY ATE ALL DAY LONG AND THE PASTURE WAS GONE IN A WEEK.YES WE HAVE HAY BUT I WANTED THEM TO ENJOY GREEN PASTURES SO I REALIZED I HAD TO MANY(16 OF THEM) AND SOLD A FEW SO MY HERD WAS SMALLER.YES I TOOK A HUGE LOSS,I PAID $7500 ON BROKEN ARROW AND SOLD HIM FOR $3500,I BOUGHT ACE FOR $7500 AND SOLD HIM FOR $2500(RIGHT AROUND THERE-I CANT REMEMBER EXACTLY) WHAT IM SAYING IS I TOOK A HUGE FINANCIAL LOSS AND HATED TO PART WITH THEM BUT I KNEW IT WOULD BE BEST FOR THEM.DO YOU THINK I WOULD PAY $8000 ON HORSES AND NEGLECT THEM....NO.....I ALSO OWN A DOG KENNEL AND I AM INSPECTED BY THE DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE TWICE A YEAR AND BY THE AMERICAN KENNEL CLUB.I HAVE NEVER HAD A COMPLAINT AGAINST ME AND I PASS ALL MY INSPECTIONS WITH FLYING COLORS AND WITH COMPLIMENTS!I WILL POST A PICTURE OS DUTCHESS WHO AS CYDNDI PUT IT HAD A FAT BELLY BUT YOU COULD SEE HER BACK BONES....THIS PICTURE WAS TAKEN JUST AFTER HER FOAL 'HOPE' HAD HER SURGERY WHICH WAS JUST 2-3 WEEKS BEFOR CYNDI GOT THE MARES FROM ME....I HONESTLY DONT SEE 'THIN' HERE.ALL MY HORSES ARE FAT AND HONESTLY COULD ALL STAND TO LOSE ALOT OF WEIGHT.I AM INDEED SO VERY HAPPY AND THANKFUL THAT CYDNI GOT KRISTI AS SHE IS INDEED KRISTIS ANGEL SHE IS VERY EXPERIENCED IN MINIS AND WAS ABLE TO PROVIDE WHAT SHE NEEDED WHICH I WOULD HAVE DONE IF MY VET WOULD HAVE LET ME KNOW THAT SHE NEEDED SOMETHING MORE THAN JUST GRAIN AND WORMERS AND HAY AND TLC.I AM HOWEVER UPSET THAT CYDNI WOULD POST THIS AND ACT AS IF THINGS WERE JUST FINE AND THAT SHE UNDERSTOOD THAT KRISTI WAS IN THIS CONDITION WHEN I GOT HER....OH AS FAR AS A SHAVED BRIDLE PATH OR WHATEVER.....NO I DONT SHAVE MY HORSES OR WEAR HARNESSES ON THEM BECAUSE I WAS ADVISED NOT TO WEAR THEM ON THEM BECAUSE THEY MAY GET CAUGHT UP ON A TREE OR SOMETHING SO NO SHE WAS NOT SHAVED AT ALL,I DIDNT THINK THAT WAS A BIG DEAL BUT I GUESS SOME DO.I DID SHAVE DUTCHESS MANE BECAUSE SHE FOALED IN JUNE WHICH IT WAS VERY HOT HERE!SHAME ON YOU TONY FOR ADDING TO THIS POST AS IF YOU ARE NOW WORRIED ABOUT A MARE THAT YOU SENT TO ME THIN,I DO HAVE A PICTURE POSTED ON MY SALES PAGE ON MY WEBSITE THAT WAS TAKEN TODAY 11-16-2007 SO YOU COULD SEE HER!NOT TO WORRY SHE IS NOW FAT AND NOT AT THE BOTTOM OF ANY TOTEM POLE!!!!! I HAVE SEVERAL PICTURES I POSTED TODAY ON MY SALES PAGE-JUST SO EVERYONE CAN SEE MY HORSES ARE PERFECTLY FINE AND HEALTHY!NOT THAT I NEED TO PROVE MYSELF BUT I WOULDNT WANT ANYONE AND EVERYONE WORRYING ABOUT THE HORSES I GOT FROM THEM.THEY ARE MORE THAN WELCOME TO COME SEE THEM FOR THEMSELVES!HERE IS A PIC OF DUTCHESS AND HER FILLY-CYNDI GOT DUTCHESS ABOUT 3 WEEKS AFTER THIS PIC WAS TAKEN-IT WAS THE DAY HOPE CAME HOME FROM HER SURGERY....CYNDI CLAIMS YOU CAN SEE THIS HORSES BACKBONE?SORRY I DONT SEE IT?http://www.allstarminis.com/HOPEISHOME.jpg


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## heart k ranch (Nov 16, 2007)

I still don't think that mare should look like that at ALL. She was thin and it took some time for her to get that way!


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