Trying to keep pleasure horses out of country pleasure classes

[JMS Miniatures]

This year at Nationals it was so bad. So many pleasure horses were going in country pleasure classes because of so many shetlands going in pleasure driving, and the regular mini B size pleasure horses aren't doing so well. People were telling me that they were thinking of entering there top pleasure horse from past years into country but thought that was unfair. I'm about ready to give up on going into country pleasure if judges are just going to pick pleasure horses in a country pleasure driving class. How can we fix this, I don't know, just very frusterating.

Ok just had to vent a little sorry.

 

[Minimor]

I don't think there is any way to stop this; I see it as kind of a natural trend. As the pleasure driving horses become bigger moving/better moving, so too will the country pleasure horses become bigger moving. You can say that judges should stick to the standards and not place those horses that have too much action. The rules even say that excessive knee action shall be penalized.

But, what is excessive knee action? Everyone will define "excessive" differently. There will be some that figure the country pleasure horses should have the daisy cutter action, with almost no knee action at all. Others will say there should be some lift, just not too much. Still others will figure that as long as the horse isn't popping above level then he is a country pleasure horse--while others figure a level trot is too high for country...

I do sympathize with what you're saying, but I just don't see any way too stop it happening.

 

[Jill]

It is crazy but I know it can work the oposite way at least sometimes. A mare I now own is totally country pleasure, however, her previous owner accidently put her in Pleasure vs. Country Pleasure at an AMHR show. She just wrote the number wrong, it was not on purpose and she did go on with a CP horse into the SP ring and she won. :bgrin

 

[jdhand]

I agree that it was rediculous. The horses that placed 1st for sure had excessive knee action. The way to fix this problem is that a horse must declare at the beginning of the year if it will show pleasure or country. It cannot show pleasure all year and then cross over to country at Nationals. Also we have a rule book to go by and the judges need to go by the rules. I love showing all year and have fun at Nationals, but I just don't understand why the biggest and most important show of the year has so many issues. You would think that the stewards, judges and exhibitors would all be on their best behavior and follow the rule book. All I know is to put it in writing and mail it to the board members certified mail. I am thinking about it. I don't know if it will do any good. They are a tight group and will most likely do things the way they want. I have better things to do than fuss and argue with AMHR. I just hate it, because the little horses are the greatest.

 

[Jaxjag2000]

I agree that that would be very frustrating! High action should be penalized in country pleasure. It really bothers me when a pleasure horse places in country over good country horses.

AMHA and AMHR need to release training materials to both judges and exhibitors. I heard they have some good training material out there, but I have not seen how to get ahold of it. It all comes back to the education of their judges. Also, on the judge's evaluation cards, I would make a note on there of the judges that are not placing classes correctly. Eventually, if they get enough bad evaluations, something will be done. (I would hope!)

 

[Irish Hills Farm]

Fill out the judge evaluation forms that are available at the shows. They are available for the National Show as well. If you don't have one, call the office and have one sent to you.

 

[Just Us N Texas]

Also, what about roadster horses going into country pleasure. I thought country pleasure was a nice even gait, as if you were driving out in the country going somewhere. Not fancy knee action, not racing, but a nice even sunday go to meetin' kind of gait. Good luck on finding a solution. It will greatly benefit us as we have some nice country pleasure horses that can't compete with the pleasure horses.

 

[Mnmini]

Good luck JDHand.

I sent letters out to the BOD after last year's Nationals regarding not judging by the rule book. Didn't get even so much as a form letter acknowledging receipt of my letter, and by the sounds of things, nothing has changed a bit.

I'm playing my economic card now..taking my $$ the ADS route, and decided to forego showing at the local R shows and Nationals this year, and quite likely in the future years as well. From the sounds of things, National's entries survived my boycott just fine, lol, so my decision probably doesn't send a message at all.

 

[FairytailGlennMinis]

I am with you Mnmini! There are about a hald dozen of us her in VA/NC that are going ADS only next year!

-Amy

 

[Mnmini]

PocketPonies,

I think there are a number of A and R drivers that end up going the way of ADS as a direct result of the judging in the harness classes at the breed shows, though to me, most of the "offenses" are seen at Nationals, rather than the weekend breed show.

As mentioned in another thread, I wouldn't mind in the slightest if we were showing under ASHA's umbrella. I have a suspicion, that some "stuff" would get cleaned up much faster than the self policing we've been trying unsuccessfully.

It is only a matter of time before some PETA activist (or other group) takes notice of "our" animal welfare issues, and makes a stink. Our rule book seems to give some lip service, with the no shoeing, and weights on the show grounds, but covers little else in regards to humane treatment. I know dumb jockeys are not inherently bad training devices, but do we really need to school with them in warm-up pen at Nationals? If they haven't achieved that desired artificial headset by now, are they really going to "get it" hours before their class? Are we going to start finding ponies with their heads tied down in their stalls, so they enter the ring with a higher headset than they would otherwise have? Do we know if we have soring going on to get higher action than the horse might otherwise have? Will our associations ever take a stand on the tight over checks and side checks before PETA does? Do we have abuse of NSAIDS or other drugs? How in the world do we know, as there is no drug testing!

 

[kuelqhs]

The only way you will get people to quit putting their pleasure horses in a country class is for the judges to quit placing the pleasure horses over the country horses. Untill that happens people will contune to put their pleasure horses in the country classes because that is what is winning. I belive that the judges really need to go to a judging clinc on country pleasure horses to judge as the rule book states.

"Country Pleasure Driving Horses are to enter the ring counterclockwise (to the right) at a country pleasure trot. To be shown both ways of the arena at a walk, country pleasure trot and a extened trot. To stand quietly and to rein back. to be judged 60% on performance, manners and way of going, 30% on the condition, fit and appropriateness of harness and vehicle, and 10% on neatness, appropriateness of attire and overall impression. Overchecks and side checks should be slightly loose, not snug. The head set should appear natural for the horse. Excessive knee action and speed to be penalized"